Can Satan cast out Satan?

grafted branch

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 21, 2019
1,526
246
46
Washington
✟238,025.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
A house is a person's body. Don't think he was talking about the particular person he just freed from demons in 12: 44.
Ok, so in Matthew 12:43 the unclean spirit goes out of the man, goes through dry places, seeks rest and finds none. We know it’s not the man that seeks rest and finds none because Matthew 7:7 says seek and ye shall find; so it’s the unclean spirit that seeks and can’t find.

In Verse 44 the unclean spirit says he’s going to return to the house he came out of; and in verse 45 he takes 7 other spirits along with him.

The last statement in verse 45 is “Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation”. These things happen to “this generation” but the word “also” implies that it happens again. What are your thoughts on this last statement?
 
Upvote 0

The Liturgist

Traditional Liturgical Christian
Supporter
Nov 26, 2019
10,920
5,590
49
The Wild West
✟461,140.00
Country
United States
Faith
Generic Orthodox Christian
Marital Status
Celibate
I’ve been studying this and haven’t come to a complete understanding yet. I see both views as having a high probability of being correct, Satan being referred to as a fallen angel/spirit being and the view that he is being referred to as the Adamic nature.

The Adamic nature view

The Adamic nature is a possibility for the word “air” in Ephesians 2:2, so Satan would be the prince of the power of this nature. Also when looking at 2 Corinthians 4:4 (the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not) I see this as the Adamic nature that has blinded the mind. So when Mark 4:15 says Satan comes immediately and takes it away; I view this as happening through the Adamic nature and Satan being referred to as the Adamic nature.​

The spirit being view

When Satan is viewed as a fallen angel and spirit being that is currently active in this world, it can create the view that we are in the Tartarus when combined with Revelation 18:1-4 and 2 Peter 2:4.

2 Peter 2:4 says the angels that had sinned are cast into hell<5020> (Tartarus), reserved unto judgment, and Revelation 18:2 has Babylon falling and becoming the hold of every foul spirit. Revelation 18:4 says come out of her my people that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

Since every foul spirit would include those in 2 Peter 2:4 and Babylon falls first before “my people” are called out of her, then the conclusion is drawn that we are currently in Tartarus.​

What is the Orthodox view on us currently being in Tartarus?

The Orthodox emphatically reject the idea this is Tartarus, as do I. You do realize Revelation is primarily about the future? Also, Babylon was used as a cipher for paganism and pre-Christian Rome; the Number of the Neast most likely refers to Nero, based on compelling evidence of gematria, and/or refer to some future evil antichrist whose name can also compute to 666.
 
Upvote 0

coronawatching

Active Member
Supporter
Apr 22, 2020
141
102
54
West Palm Beach
✟65,166.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Ok, so in Matthew 12:43 the unclean spirit goes out of the man, goes through dry places, seeks rest and finds none. We know it’s not the man that seeks rest and finds none because Matthew 7:7 says seek and ye shall find; so it’s the unclean spirit that seeks and can’t find.

In Verse 44 the unclean spirit says he’s going to return to the house he came out of; and in verse 45 he takes 7 other spirits along with him.

The last statement in verse 45 is “Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation”. These things happen to “this generation” but the word “also” implies that it happens again. What are your thoughts on this last statement?
Yes, I was pondering on that last statement myself. I wrote something about it in my last post to you then erased it before I sent. Jesus' life, death, burial and resurrection cleansed the temple of God on Earth (The Church). He bound the strongman and spoiled his goods. The first century Church had the most power, signs, wonders, miracles etc. But Satan has crept in over time, and he has came back into the Church seven times (number for perfection) stronger.
 
Upvote 0

grafted branch

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 21, 2019
1,526
246
46
Washington
✟238,025.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Yes, I was pondering on that last statement myself. I wrote something about it in my last post to you then erased it before I sent. Jesus' life, death, burial and resurrection cleansed the temple of God on Earth (The Church). He bound the strongman and spoiled his goods. The first century Church had the most power, signs, wonders, miracles etc. But Satan has crept in over time, and he has came back into the Church seven times (number for perfection) stronger.
Thanks for that explanation, I have a somewhat different view but as with most end time views I tend to look at things as possible but I almost never apply certainty to any view. So my current view is this …

I think the house of the strong man in Matthew 12:29 is referring to the Gentile nations. The Gentiles didn’t have the gospel until after the cross.

I think the house in Matthew 12:44 could defiantly be referring to the same house (Gentiles) because Revelation 20:7-8 Satan is loosed and deceives the nations once again. I’m really not quite sure about the statement “Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation”. I think this most likely has a dual fulfillment.

When I look at Matthew 12:45 it would be Satan then that takes 7 other spirits more wicked than himself and they enter in and dwell there. The seven other spirits being more wicked than Satan could be understood using Matthew 23:15 as something similar happens where the scribes and Pharisees convert someone and he is twofold the child of hell than they are. The strong man’s house would now have Satan and seven other spirits, this then seems to correlate with Revelation 17:11 where the beast is called the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition; and also as I already stated, with Revelation 20:8 where Satan goes out and deceives the nations after the 1,000 years.
 
Upvote 0

grafted branch

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 21, 2019
1,526
246
46
Washington
✟238,025.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
The Orthodox emphatically reject the idea this is Tartarus, as do I. You do realize Revelation is primarily about the future? Also, Babylon was used as a cipher for paganism and pre-Christian Rome; the Number of the Neast most likely refers to Nero, based on compelling evidence of gematria, and/or refer to some future evil antichrist whose name can also compute to 666.
I tend to have a preterits view but I also think there remains the possibility of dual fulfillment in several areas.
 
Upvote 0

coronawatching

Active Member
Supporter
Apr 22, 2020
141
102
54
West Palm Beach
✟65,166.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Thanks for that explanation, I have a somewhat different view but as with most end time views I tend to look at things as possible but I almost never apply certainty to any view. So my current view is this …

I think the house of the strong man in Matthew 12:29 is referring to the Gentile nations. The Gentiles didn’t have the gospel until after the cross.

I think the house in Matthew 12:44 could defiantly be referring to the same house (Gentiles) because Revelation 20:7-8 Satan is loosed and deceives the nations once again. I’m really not quite sure about the statement “Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation”. I think this most likely has a dual fulfillment.

When I look at Matthew 12:45 it would be Satan then that takes 7 other spirits more wicked than himself and they enter in and dwell there. The seven other spirits being more wicked than Satan could be understood using Matthew 23:15 as something similar happens where the scribes and Pharisees convert someone and he is twofold the child of hell than they are. The strong man’s house would now have Satan and seven other spirits, this then seems to correlate with Revelation 17:11 where the beast is called the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition; and also as I already stated, with Revelation 20:8 where Satan goes out and deceives the nations after the 1,000 years.
 
Upvote 0