What in theology prevent Protestant, Catholic and Orthodox from being simply "Christians"?

Jeshu

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And baptism and the church?

Sure, but why should we let religion hijack that?

Wherever you fit best no need to argue about that. i have learned to understand that Jesus lovers always get on no matter what denomination they are from.
 
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The Liturgist

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There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 1:18 & Jn 10:16 one fold

The promise (sacred oath or sacrament) of the father acts 2:38-39 with reference to ez 36:25-27

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. Based on Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

A promise is a sacred oath or sacrament!
Baptismal regeneration is the promise of the Father for union in the new covenant!

The church and the seven sacraments are necessary for salvation

Better covenant on better promises

An oath to sacramental life

Promise of the Father acts 2:23-39
Promise is an oath and an oath is a sacrament! This promise of the sacrament of baptism refers to ez. 36:25-27

1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)

Jn 1:5-5 abide in Him, apart from Him you can do nothing.

God provides for everything:
John 14:6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

He is the way we must follow!
He is the truth we must believe!
He is the life, life of grace thru the sacraments of the church in which we must live!

Abide in Christ and His church with grace and life provided by God thru the sacraments!

Sacramental life: Jn 1:16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. Jn 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

Baptism: (initiation into the covenant)
Mk 16:16 Jn 3:5
1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

The Eucharist: (holy communion)
Mt 26:26-39 Jn 6:51-58 1 Cor 11:23-25

Confession of sins:
Jn 20:23

Confirmation
Mt 17:27 Lk 22:32 acts 8:14-17
acts 14:22

Marriage:
Matt 19:4-6

Holy orders: (priesthood)
Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru His priesthood in Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 10:1-8 Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13
Jn 20:21-22 acts 1:17 acts 6:4 acts 8:26
2 Cor 5:18 1 Tim 4:14 Eph 2:20

Extreme unction: (anointing with oil)
1 Tim 4:14 James 5:14

The one, holy, catholic, (universal) and apostolic church founded by Jesus Christ on Peter and the apostles!

———

A sacrament is an outward efficacious sign instituted by Christ to give grace. Jesus Christ himself is the sacrament, as he gave his life to save mankind. His humanity is the outward sign or the instrument of his Divinity. It is through his humanity that the life of the Trinity comes to us as grace through the sacraments. It is Jesus Christ alone who mediates the sacraments to allow grace to flow to mankind.

Christ sent the Holy Spirit at Pentecost to inspire his Apostles and his Church to shepherd his flock after his Ascension into heaven. "As the Father has sent me, even so I send you" (John 17:18, 20:21). Jesus is the Head of his Body the Church (Colossians 1:18). The Church itself is a sacrament instituted by Christ to give grace. Jesus gave us his Body the Church to continue the works he performed during his earthly life. Grace given to us through the sacraments will help us lead a good life in this world and help save us for the Kingdom of Heaven.

The sacraments were instituted by Christ! The Church celebrates in her liturgy the Paschal mystery of Christ, his Passion, Sacrifice on the Cross, Resurrection, and Glorious Ascension. The Greek word μυστήριον or mystery in the Greek New Testament is translated into sacramentum in the Latin Vulgate Bible, from which we derive our English word sacrament (examples: Ephesians 1:9, Ephesians 3:9, Colossians 1:27). The saving effects of Christ's Redemption on the Cross are communicated through the sacraments, especially in the liturgical celebration of the Eucharist.

What you say is true, except it is equally applicable to the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox, the Assyrian and Ancient Churches of the East, and Anglicanism and liturgical Protestantism where a sacramental life, in some cases even including monasticism, is practiced (the Anglicans have several monastic orders, the Lutherans have a handful of monasteries, and the Methodists have the Order of St. Luke; there is also Taize).
 
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The Liturgist

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Jesus calls us to have faith in Him which then brings us the Holy Spirit of God in our hearts who teaches us to love God and neighbour which translates to God the son and God the Father making their dwelling in us, as we do the loving.

When we have Jesus in our hearts then we can have a personal relationship with The Living Word dwelling in us. Jesus is my Hero and teaches me every day to love God and neighbour and cleanses my heart from sin. i don't need to serve tradition to get to Him but can love and serve Jesus everyday through the Holy Spirit who knows Jesus and makes Him known.

John 14:15-17
"If you love me, keep my commands. And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you."

John 14:23
"Jesus replied, “Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them."

Please kindly read the Statement of Purpose for this forum.
 
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Ephfourfive

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What you say is true, except it is equally applicable to the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox, the Assyrian and Ancient Churches of the East, and Anglicanism and liturgical Protestantism where a sacramental life, in some cases even including monasticism, is practiced (the Anglicans have several monastic orders, the Lutherans have a handful of monasteries, and the Methodists have the Order of St. Luke; there is also Taize).

Nope Jews heretics schismatics and apostates are outside the one true church the ark of salvation
There is only one peter and Jis successors Matt 16:18
 
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All4Christ

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Nope Jews heretics schismatics and apostates are outside the one true church the ark of salvation
There is only one peter and Jis successors Matt 16:18
Which ones in the quoted posts are Jews? All of them are Christian, not Jewish. Consider doing some research on what Orthodox Christianity is. We are Christian, not Jewish.
 
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The Liturgist

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Nope Jews heretics schismatics and apostates are outside the one true church the ark of salvation
There is only one peter and Jis successors Matt 16:18

Actually that contradicts what your own Church has said about the Eastern churches (EO, OO, Assyrian), that they have valid sacraments and are simply in a state of “impaired communion.” Under the Code of Canon Law of the Eastern Catholic Churches, Catholics unable to find a Catholic priest may receive the sacraments from an EO, OO and Assyrian* priest, and likewise members of those churches away from their own parishes and properly inclined may partake at EO, OO, and Assyrian parishes.

Practically, the Eastern Orthodox generally do not allow this intercommunion, except in the Middle East in extremis, but the Syriac Orthodox do, and I met a Syriac Orthodox priest who encourages his faithful to go to Catholic churches when there is no Syriac Orthodox church in range. The Assyrians allow anyone who believes that the bread and wine truly become the body and blood of our Lord to receive Communion.

*Presumably this applies to both the Assyrian Church of the East and the Ancient Church of the East, as the only difference between the two is the Ancient Church of the East uses the Julian calendar for fixed feasts. In ecumenical discussions under Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, later Pope Benedict XVI, Rome also reversed its position on the Assyrian Liturgy of Addai and Mari and no longer considers it defective for its lack of an explicit institution narrative (which Rome added to the Chaldean Catholic and Syro-Malabar Catholic versions of the liturgy), although the Roman statement on the validity of the original Assyrian version of the Liturgy of Addai and Mari “respectfully invites” the Assyrian church to add the Institution Narrative whenever Roman Catholics are present.

The other two Assyrian liturgies, and the disused East Syriac liturgy of Peter (Sharar) have the institution narrative, one being an East Syriac arrangement of the Divine Liturgy of St. Basil, and the other being the work of St. John Chrysostom’s close friend Theodore of Mopsuestia, whose anathematization by Justinian caused a schism in the Western Church, and who still has supporters among the ranks of Roman Catholic theologians.
 
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The Liturgist

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Which ones in the quoted posts are Jews? All of them are Christian, not Jewish. Consider doing some research on what Orthodox Christianity is. We are Christian, not Jewish.

It hadn’t even occurred to me he thought Eastern and Oriental Orthodoxy was Jewish and not Christian; in my experience all Roman Catholics and liturgical Protestants (Anglicans, Lutherans, Methodists, Moravians and liturgical Reformed) one is likely to encounter online, and most one might meet in person, know what Orthodox Christianity is.
 
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All4Christ

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It hadn’t even occurred to me he thought Eastern and Oriental Orthodoxy was Jewish and not Christian; in my experience all Roman Catholics and liturgical Protestants (Anglicans, Lutherans, Methodists, Moravians and liturgical Reformed) one is likely to encounter online, and most one might meet in person, know what Orthodox Christianity is.
I had a suspicion that there was some confusion on the matter, especially with a previous poster. (The person I quoted said schismatics, so it’s possible that that meant us, though as you said, even the RCC itself has exceptions for Orthodoxy). Otherwise, I don’t know what Judaism and Islam would be discussed. It’s amazing how many people think Orthodox means Orthodox Judaism, even when we say Eastern Orthodox (Christianity). Sometimes it seems like people don’t even know we exist. :)
 
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The Liturgist

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I had a suspicion that there was some confusion on the matter, especially with a previous poster. (The person I quoted said schismatics, so it’s possible that that meant us, though as you said, even the RCC itself has exceptions for Orthodoxy). Otherwise, I don’t know what Judaism and Islam would be discussed. It’s amazing how many people think Orthodox means Orthodox Judaism, even when we say Eastern Orthodox (Christianity). Sometimes it seems like people don’t even know we exist. :)

Many do not. Non-denominational Christians, aliturgical Calvinists and Calvinist Baptists, and members of churches like the SDA and the Calvary Chapel usually are not familiar with Orthodoxy, and when they encounter it, their initial contact is often shocking and they find themselves disturbed by the false perception of idolatry, derived from the extreme iconoclasm of their own churches. In the 90s I had an equally unpleasant experience when I visited some Sabbatarian churches of a prominent denomination known for anti-Roman Catholic polemics, that lacked any cross in the nave. This was distressing to me given that even older Unitarian Universalist churches have crosses (King’s Chapel in Boston) and stained glass windows depicting our Lord (Arlington Street Church, again in Boston).
 
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Ephfourfive

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Actually that contradicts what your own Church has said about the Eastern churches (EO, OO, Assyrian), that they have valid sacraments and are simply in a state of “impaired communion.” Under the Code of Canon Law of the Eastern Catholic Churches, Catholics unable to find a Catholic priest may receive the sacraments from an EO, OO and Assyrian* priest, and likewise members of those churches away from their own parishes and properly inclined may partake at EO, OO, and Assyrian parishes.

Practically, the Eastern Orthodox generally do not allow this intercommunion, except in the Middle East in extremis, but the Syriac Orthodox do, and I met a Syriac Orthodox priest who encourages his faithful to go to Catholic churches when there is no Syriac Orthodox church in range. The Assyrians allow anyone who believes that the bread and wine truly become the body and blood of our Lord to receive Communion.

*Presumably this applies to both the Assyrian Church of the East and the Ancient Church of the East, as the only difference between the two is the Ancient Church of the East uses the Julian calendar for fixed feasts. In ecumenical discussions under Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, later Pope Benedict XVI, Rome also reversed its position on the Assyrian Liturgy of Addai and Mari and no longer considers it defective for its lack of an explicit institution narrative (which Rome added to the Chaldean Catholic and Syro-Malabar Catholic versions of the liturgy), although the Roman statement on the validity of the original Assyrian version of the Liturgy of Addai and Mari “respectfully invites” the Assyrian church to add the Institution Narrative whenever Roman Catholics are present.

The other two Assyrian liturgies, and the disused East Syriac liturgy of Peter (Sharar) have the institution narrative, one being an East Syriac arrangement of the Divine Liturgy of St. Basil, and the other being the work of St. John Chrysostom’s close friend Theodore of Mopsuestia, whose anathematization by Justinian caused a schism in the Western Church, and who still has supporters among the ranks of Roman Catholic theologians.

Under modernism maybe but not traditional
 
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GodsGrace101

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I've been growing up in Northern Europe, so as I was faced with conversion from Buddhism into Christianity I eventually met other Christians that told me of Christianity in a distinct Protestant flavor, but I didn't ever feel I was met with a God that first demanded of me to choose between one of 3 different Jesus. And I honestly think it is the same Jesus we all believe in. However tradition and theological disagreement have isolated us all into different pockets of belief, even if this is clearly against Christian tradition itself. I think we are unable to let go of a history where our forefathers have killed other people and themselves been killed for holding onto the distinct theological ideas we've inherited

I've found myself very drawn to "original" Christianity, and I think this is what everyone long for. A source of unpolluted truth. So I've seen Orthodox Christianity as a natural choice, but when I've tried to explore what it mean to be Orthodox I find myself confused because one does not simply say "I am Orthodox" and that's it, but there's various things that is needed to do to be part of this tradition, just like there seem to be ideas that I should for example re-baptize myself to be a uncontroversial Protestant and to be totally safe I should pray to get the gift of talking in tongues, and have seen that among Catholic and Orthodox is a very simple thing that caused a schism and these two are much more open in their longing to become one again.

But before I blunder into something that might break some kind of rules here, are there any single point in history we can track down where Protestantism was inevitable? And likewise in the east-west schism? And please, try to think carefully before writing answers here.

Try to explain in a way a child could understand, if that's possible.
Hi AV,,,
Just got here and I'm probably repeating.

The point in history when Protestantism became inevitable was in the 1,500's when Luther thought it was time for the CC to change and it would not. At that time the church was into receiving payment for the forgiveness of sins and for the release of loved ones in purgatory. Also, the church had gone through the persecution of its own during the inquisition.

So some change was necessary.

In the year 1,000 the east - west schism happened because some believed the Pope had too much power and wanted to go back to how the CC was run in the beginning when each "AREA" had its own Bishop. This is when the Orthodox church began and the question has been raging on as to which church is the original church...the CC or the OC.

In my opinion, the church was as pure as it could be until about the year 325 at the council of Nicea.
That would be the CC, as it was called because it was the one, universal church.

I'm Protestant, and we h ave our own problems.

Every denomination has its problems.
Seeking God honestly and doing our best to serve Him and to love His Son
is what I believe to be what is necessary.
 
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GreekOrthodox

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It’s amazing how many people think Orthodox means Orthodox Judaism, even when we say Eastern Orthodox (Christianity). Sometimes it seems like people don’t even know we exist. :)

My favorite questions AFTER giving a tour of our church during a festival:

Are you Jewish? Is that picture of Zeus? (pointing to an icon of St. Nicholas)

Although I did get a chuckle from a Jewish guy after looking at the icon of Mary in the back of the church with her hands raised in the Orans position and then trying to make out the MP OV. "Must be Jewish, she's saying "OY VEY" " (bah dum tssss)
s-l300.jpg
 
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GodsGrace101

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My favorite questions AFTER giving a tour of our church during a festival:

Are you Jewish? Is that picture of Zeus? (pointing to an icon of St. Nicholas)

Although I did get a chuckle from a Jewish guy after looking at the icon of Mary in the back of the church with her hands raised in the Orans position and then trying to make out the MP OV. "Must be Jewish, she's saying "OY VEY" " (bah dum tssss)
s-l300.jpg
And I'll bet she says Oy Vey a lot these days!!
 
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GreekOrthodox

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And I'll bet she says Oy Vey a lot these days!!

I know I do! I've lived and worked in Jewish areas and companies over the years so I've picked up smatterings of Jewish sayings and customs along the way. I've had to relight pilot lights on Saturdays, and eaten a lot of good Jewish food so it's worked out both ways :)
 
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GodsGrace101

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I know I do! I've lived and worked in Jewish areas and companies over the years so I've picked up smatterings of Jewish sayings and customs along the way. I've had to relight pilot lights on Saturdays, and eaten a lot of good Jewish food so it's worked out both ways :)
Right. No electricity on the Sabbath!
I grew up in NYC, with plenty of different types of Jewish persons,
So yeah...Oy Vey! Another pilot light to relight....

Shalom
 
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rturner76

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I see this like ice cream...........

We all love ice cream but each of us has a favorite flavor. It's all ice cream but we like different flavors for what they bring to our lives. One may need the discipline of a monastery in order to give their will and life to God. Some just need a Televangelist to pray with. Truth is, I have been moved to tears by Joseph Prince but he is a little to OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) for me to commit to that flavor. But I can taste that flavor now and then and get something from it I like.

The Christ God is revealed in all of our flavors. It's just some are attracted to one flavor or another for what it does for them.
 
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chevyontheriver

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I see this like ice cream...........

We all love ice cream but each of us has a favorite flavor. It's all ice cream but we like different flavors for what they bring to our lives. One may need the discipline of a monastery in order to give their will and life to God. Some just need a Televangelist to pray with. Truth is, I have been moved to tears by Joseph Prince but he is a little to OSAS (Once Saved Always Saved) for me to commit to that flavor. But I can taste that flavor now and then and get something from it I like.

The Christ God is revealed in all of our flavors. It's just some are attracted to one flavor or another for what it does for them.
That would work except for some of the ingredients used to achieve some of the flavors. I'm thinking of the 'Bitter Almond' flavored ice cream that some people might find appealing. You understand then that I can't endorse your flavor theory wholeheartedly.

Otherwise I like Rum Cherry and Maple Nut and Strawberry and even Vanilla and I think it's great if you like Chocolate. I think it's great that the Maronites can coexist with the Ambrosian Rite.
 
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concretecamper

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What you say is true, except it is equally applicable to the Eastern and Oriental Orthodox, the Assyrian and Ancient Churches of the East, and Anglicanism and liturgical Protestantism where a sacramental life, in some cases even including monasticism, is practiced (the Anglicans have several monastic orders, the Lutherans have a handful of monasteries, and the Methodists have the Order of St. Luke; there is also Taize).
wrong.

There is only One Church. There may be more than one that claim they are the One, but there IS only one.
 
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The Liturgist

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wrong.

There is only One Church. There may be more than one that claim they are the One, but there IS only one.

Of course there’s only one, that’s in the Nicene Creed. My point was merely that that church has been separated administratively, and in my experience only administratively, by uncanonical schisms.
 
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