GOD'S DIETARY LAWS AND BAT SOUP STEW - COVID 19

HIM · Dec 24, 2020

section9+1 said:
Did I ever say anywhere that Jesus was a sinner? According to John 5, you are the one who is claiming that. I have just pointed out what John 5 says and you are the one who cannot fit it into your theology.

What physical work did Jesus do?

section9+1 · Dec 24, 2020

HIM said:
What physical work did Jesus do?

That's your problem.

HIM · Dec 24, 2020

section9+1 said:
That's your problem.

I am sorry I thought you were here out of love

section9+1 · Dec 24, 2020

I am not here to explain John 5. People should understand it on their own and come to terms with it on their own. It doesn't need to be filtered through me.

HIM · Dec 24, 2020

section9+1 said:
I am not here to explain John 5. People should understand it on their own and come to terms with it on their own. It doesn't need to be filtered through me.

You are funny. Actually the issue is you think as the Pharisees that Spiritual work through God is actual work that was not to be done

section9+1 · Dec 24, 2020

I am not providing any interpretations so how can you say what I think? Your problem is with John 5 and not with any explanations I have offered up since I haven't offered any. Deal with John 5 yourself and don't try to fault me for it.

HIM · Dec 24, 2020

section9+1 said:
I am not providing any interpretations so how can you say what I think? Your problem is with John 5 and not with any explanations I have offered up since I haven't offered any. Deal with John 5 yourself and don't try to fault me for it.

Then you are in agreement with the text and the Holy Spirit. That Jesus did not do physical work but Spiritual through God. And that the Pharisees falsely accused God. In that He broke the Sabbath.

Good thanks for clearing that up.

section9+1 · Dec 24, 2020

HIM said:
Then you are in agreement with the text and the Holy Spirit. That Jesus did not do physical work but Spiritual through God. And that the Pharisees falsely accused God. In that He broke the Sabbath.

Good thanks for clearing that up.

If John 5 said that then I'd be in agreement with it. Instead it says Jesus broke the Sabbath and also claimed to be equal with God. It offended the Pharisees. I agree with that. Does it offend you too?

HIM · Dec 24, 2020

section9+1 said:
If John 5 said that then I'd be in agreement with it. Instead it says Jesus broke the Sabbath and also claimed to be equal with God. It offended the Pharisees. I agree with that. Does it offend you too?

So you and the Pharisees think God should not of healed the man through Christ therefore God broke the Sabbath. And you as the Pharisees believe that God is not Jesus' Father.

I thought we already covered that.

Take care

section9+1 · Dec 24, 2020

You're grabbing straws. Try not to make this about me.

LoveGodsWord · Feb 8, 2021

There is some pretty scary stuff in this thread. Are all things really now clean to eat?

Fried rat and potato anyone?

Then we read just before the second coming...

Isaiah 66:17, They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the middle, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, said the LORD.

nolidad · Feb 9, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
There is some pretty scary stuff in this thread. Are all things really now clean to eat?

View attachment 294695

Fried rat and potato anyone?

Then we read just before the second coming...

Isaiah 66:17, They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the middle, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, said the LORD.

Clean medically? NO! Clean ceremonially and spiritually? Absolutely!

Mark 7:15-23
King James Version

15 There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man.

16 If any man have ears to hear, let him hear.

17 And when he was entered into the house from the people, his disciples asked him concerning the parable.

18 And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him;

19 Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats?

20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man.

21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders,

22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness:

23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

1 Corinthians 10:25-28
King James Version

25 Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:

26 For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof.

27 If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake.

28 But if any man say unto you, this is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof:

Romans 14
King James Version

14 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations.

2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

LoveGodsWord · Feb 9, 2021

nolidad said:
Clean medically? NO! Clean ceremonially and spiritually? Absolutely!

If it is not clean medically how can it be clean ceremonially and spiritually?

nolidad said:
Mark 7:15-23 15 There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him: but the things which come out of him, those are they that defile the man. 16 If any man have ears to hear, let him hear. 17 And when he was entered into the house from the people, his disciples asked him concerning the parable. 18 And he saith unto them, Are ye so without understanding also? Do ye not perceive, that whatsoever thing from without entereth into the man, it cannot defile him; 19 Because it entereth not into his heart, but into the belly, and goeth out into the draught, purging all meats? 20 And he said, That which cometh out of the man, that defileth the man. 21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 Thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lasciviousness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness: 23 All these evil things come from within, and defile the man.

No where in the scriptures does it say in Mark 7 that Jesus is saying all foods are now clean as the context is to washing of pots and cups.

It also does not make any difference to me which translations are used in MARK 7:15-23 for the Greek word καθαρίζον used for clean means to purify ("declared" is not in the Greek it was added by the translators) the application of either Greek word meanings of course is chapter context and subject matter which determines the correct interpretation of the scriptures. JESUS is not saying all unclean foods are now clean as that is not the context and subject matter of both the scripture *MARK 7:15-23 and of the chapter context shown in MARK 7:2-23.

Using a single Greek word καθαρίζον which means "purify; cleanse make clean" (declared being added by the translators that is not in the Greek) is in context in the scripture to the word ἐκπορεύομαι which means to go out of the body or purge and after of course πάντα βρώματα (all food). The chapter context of course is to the washing of cups and pots and hands making someone κοινόω unclean or defiled not "unclean foods" *MARK 7:2-5 not to eating unclean foods prohibited in God's dietary laws of Leviticus 11.

The point of the scripture being to the chapter context and subject matter, is not the "washing of pots and cups and not washing of the hands that makes a man unclean a man (defiled)" (Mark 7:8) but breaking God's commandments and what comes out of the heart and mouth of the man that defiles (makes unclean) a man.

The context of making all meats clean is to the "purging out of the body" of impurities from not washing cups and pots and it is following man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God over the Word of God that defile (makes unclean) the man, not what one eats which passes out of the man *Mark 7:2-23. The chapter subject matter is not to eating unclean foods as they were all JEWS who followed the food laws of Leviticus 11 but the subject matter was to eating food with unwashed hands, pots and cups *Mark 7:2-5.

To make clean, to cleanse; a. from physical stains and dirt. You can see that the application here is to the context of "purging out or cleansing all food from the system by passing out that which is impure or unclean" from the body. That is, the nutritious part of the food remains while that which is defiled or unclean passes out of the man.

The above post I hope demonstrated the context of MARK 7:2-23 and context supersedes word definitions for scripture and chapter interpretations in the Hebrew and the Greek.

The context of Mark 7:2-23 is to pots and cups not clean and unclean foods prohibited from the old testament dietary laws of Leviticus 11.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
NT 2511: καθαρίζω καθαρίζω (Hellenistic for καθαίρω, which classic writings use); Attic future (cf. Buttmann, 37 (32); Winers Grammar, § 13, 1 c.; WH's Appendix, p. 163) καθαριῶ (Hebrews 9:14); 1 aorist ἐκαθάρισα (see below); present passive καθαρίζομαι; 1 aorist passive ἐκαθαρίσθην; perfect passive participle κεκαθαρισμενος (Hebrews 10:2 T Tr WH; on the forms ἐκαθερισθη, T WH in Matthew 8:3; Mark 1:42 (ἐκαθερισεν, Tr in Acts 10:15; Acts 11:9) and κεκαθερισμενος Lachmann in Hebrews 10:2, cf. (Tdf. Proleg., p. 82; WH's Appendix, p. 150); Sturz, De dial. Maced. etc., p. 118; Delitzsch on Hebrews 10:2; Krüger, Part ii. § 2, 2, 6, p. 4; (Buttmann, 29 (25f); Winer's Grammar, 43)); (καθαρός; the Sept. mostly for טִהַר;

1. to make clean, to cleanse; a. from physical stains and dirt: e. g. utensils, Matthew 23:25 (figuratively, Matthew 23:26); Luke 11:39; food, Mark 7:19; τινα, a leper, to cleanse by curing, Matthew 8:2; Matthew 10:8; Matthew 11:5; Mark 1:40-42; Luke 4:27; Luke 5:12; Luke 7:22; Luke 17:14, 17 (Leviticus 14:8); to remove by cleansing: ἡ λέπρα ἐκαθαρίσθη, Matthew 8:3 (καθαριεῖς τό αἷμα τό ἀναίτιον ἐξ Ἰσραήλ, Deuteronomy 19:13; ἐκαθαριζε τήν περί ταῦτα συνήθειαν, the custom of marrying heathen women, Josephus, Antiquities 11, 5, 4; καθαιρεῖν αἷμα, Homer, Iliad 16, 667; cf. ἐκκαθαίρω).

nolidad said:
1 Corinthians 10:25-28 King James Version 25 Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake: 26 For the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof. 27 If any of them that believe not bid you to a feast, and ye be disposed to go; whatsoever is set before you, eat, asking no question for conscience sake. 28 But if any man say unto you, this is offered in sacrifice unto idols, eat not for his sake that shewed it, and for conscience sake: for the earth is the Lord's, and the fulness thereof:

This is not talking about clean and unclean foods but foods offered to Idols (see v28).

nolidad said:
Romans 14 King James Version 14 Him that is weak in the faith receive ye, but not to doubtful disputations. 2 For one believeth that he may eat all things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs. 3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him. 4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

Once again nothing to do with eating unclean foods. Romans 14 is in regards to eating and not eating foods (fasting) on days that men esteem over other day and judging others in this regards and foods offered to idols.

Clare73 · Feb 9, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi all,

thought this might be a good topic as I believe God as our creator knows what is good for our health and what is not good for us and that the health and dietary laws of the old covenant are written for our admonition and well being today. The question should also be considered can something that is clean yesterday be unclean today?

I have looked at most of the arguments here against God's dietary and health laws in relation to clean and unclean foods so this will be a thread to discuss these scriptures in details with application to context to see if they can really be used or not used to support or not support a for or against view of God's health and dietary laws.

God's pre-Moses dietary laws: "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, now I give you everything." (Ge 9:3)

God's Mosaic Covenant dietary laws: Lev, chp 11.

God's New Covenant dietary laws: food laws have been set aside, there is no unclean food in the NT.

"As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food (nothing) is unclean in itself. . .For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men. . .All food is clean. . ." (Ro 14:14, 17, 20)

"They. . .order them to abstain from certain foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer." (1Tim 4:3-5)

"They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings--external regulations applying until the time of the new order."
(Heb 9:10)

"Eat everything sold in the meat market without raising questions of conscience, for "The earth is the Lord's and everything in it." (1Co 10:25)

See Mk 7:19; Lk 11:41. Is God confused?

The food laws of the Mosaic Covenant were not health regulations, they were holiness regulations (Lev 11:44-45).
Ceremonial uncleanness (food, persons, garments, houses) was a type (picture, foreshadow) of sin and defilement, showing that every aspect of our lives must be according to the will of God (1Co 10:31)--holy, for "without holiness, no one will see the Lord." (Heb 12:14)

The temporary regulations of the temporary Mosaic Covenant (Heb 8:13) administered by the temporary Levitical priesthood (Heb 7:12) are replaced in the NT with the eternal priesthood (Heb 7:17, 21) and the eternal New Covenant (Lk 22:20) of Christ Jesus.

]For me I think COVID-19 is a good example why we cannot eat anything. Bats of course being UNCLEAN in the food laws given by God in Leviticus 11:13-19. The dietary laws for clean and unclean meats can be found in Leviticus 11 and Deuteronomy 14 for those interested.

For me, I cannot see any scripture in both the old and new testament that says that God's health and dietary laws have been abolished.

How hard did you look?

God made us and knows what is good for our health and well being and if we break God's law and disobey His Word there are consequences like in the case of those eating their bat soup or stew giving us COVID-19 the started in China.

Some scriptures...

2 Corinthians 6:16, And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? FOR YOU ARE THE TEMPLE OF GOD; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

19, What? KNOW YOU NOT THAT YOUR BODY IS THE TEMPLE OF THE HOLY GHOST which is in you, which ye have of God, and YOU ARE NOT YOUR OWN?

the health laws were given to God's people because we are the temple of God and he is the live in us.........

1 Corinthians 3:16, KNOW YOU NOT THAT YOU ARE THE TEMPLE OF GOD, and that the SPIRIT OF GOD DWELLS IN YOU? 17, IF ANY MAN DEFILES THE TEMPLE OF GOD, HIM SHALL GOD DESTROY; FOR THE TEMPLE OF GOD IS HOLY, WHICH TEMPLE YOU ARE.

This includes sin from the heart (Matthew 15:18).

These are some of the dietary laws God has given his people...

Genesis 9:4 But flesh with the life thereof, which is the blood thereof, shall ye not eat.

Deuteronomy 15:23 Only THOU SHALT NOT EAT THE BLOOD thereof; thou shalt pour it upon the ground as water.

Leviticus 19:26 Ye shall not eat anything with the blood: neither shall ye use enchantment, nor observe times.

1 Samuel 14:34 And Saul said, Disperse yourselves among the people, and say unto them, Bring me hither every man his ox, and every man his sheep, and slay them here, and eat; and SIN NOT AGAINST THE LORD IN EATING WITH THE BLOOD. And all the people brought every man his ox with him that night, and slew them there.

most meats unless kosher have the blood in it...

Leviticus 11:47 TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE CLEAN AND THE UNCLEAN, and between the beast that may be eaten and the beast that may not be eaten.

We are not to eat unclean foods...

Deuteronomy 14:3-21
3, THOU SHALT NOT EAT ANY ABOMINABLE THING.
4, These are the beasts which ye shall eat: the ox, the sheep, and the goat,
5, The hart, and the roebuck, and the fallow deer, and the wild goat, and the pygarg, and the wild ox, and the chamois.
6, And every beast that parteth the hoof, and cleaveth the cleft into two claws, and cheweth the cud among the beasts, that ye shall eat.
7, Nevertheless these ye shall not eat of them that chew the cud, or of them that divide the cloven hoof; as the camel, and the hare, and the coney: for they chew the cud, but divide not the hoof; therefore they are unclean unto you.
8, And the swine, because it divideth the hoof, yet cheweth not the cud, it is unclean unto you: ye shall not eat of their flesh, nor touch their dead carcase.
9, These ye shall eat of all that are in the waters: all that have fins and scales shall ye eat:
10, And whatsoever hath not fins and scales ye may not eat; it is unclean unto you.
11, Of all clean birds ye shall eat.
12, But these are they of which ye shall not eat: the eagle, and the ossifrage, and the ospray,
13, And the glede, and the kite, and the vulture after his kind,
14, And every raven after his kind,
15, And the owl, and the night hawk, and the cuckow, and the hawk after his kind,
16, The little owl, and the great owl, and the swan,
17, And the pelican, and the gier eagle, and the cormorant,
18, And the stork, and the heron after her kind, and the lapwing, and the bat.
19, And every creeping thing that flieth is unclean unto you: they shall not be eaten.
20, But of all clean fowls ye may eat.
21, Ye shall not eat of any thing that dieth of itself: thou shalt give it unto the stranger that is in thy gates, that he may eat it; or thou mayest sell it unto an alien: for thou art an holy people unto the LORD thy God. Thou shalt not seethe a kid in his mother's milk.

Isaiah 65:2-8
2, I have spread out my hands all the day unto a rebellious people, which walked in a way that was not good, after their own thoughts; 3, A people that provoked me to anger continually to my face; that sacrifices in gardens, and burns incense upon altars of brick;

4, Which remain among the graves, and lodge in the monuments, WHICH EATS SWINES FLESH, and BROTH OF ABOMINABLE THINGS ARE IN THEIR VESSELS; 5, Which say, Stand by thyself, come not near to me; for I am holier than thou. These are a smoke in my nose, a fire that burns all the day. 6, Behold, it is written before me: I will not keep silence, but will recompense, even recompense into their bosom, 7, Your iniquities, and the iniquities of your fathers together, saith the LORD, which have burned incense upon the mountains, and blasphemed me upon the hills: therefore will I measure their former work into their bosom.

8, Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sake, that I may not destroy them all.

Isaiah 66:4-18
4, I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not. 5, Hear the word of the LORD, ye that tremble at his word; Your brethren that hated you, that cast you out for my name's sake, said, Let the LORD be glorified: but he shall appear to your joy, and they shall be ashamed. 6, A voice of noise from the city, a voice from the temple, a voice of the LORD that rendersrecompence to his enemies.7, Before she travailed, she brought forth; before her pain came, she was delivered of a man child. 8, Who hath heard such a thing? who hath seen such things? Shall the earth be made to bring forth in one day? or shall a nation be born at once? for as soon as Zion travailed, she brought forth her children. 9, Shall I bring to the birth, and not cause to bring forth? saith the LORD: shall I cause to bring forth, and shut the womb? saith thy God. 10, Rejoice ye with Jerusalem, and be glad with her, all ye that love her: rejoice for joy with her, all ye that mourn for her:11, That ye may suck, and be satisfied with the breasts of her consolations; that ye may milk out, and be delighted with the abundance of her glory. 12, For thus saith the LORD, Behold, I will extend peace to her like a river, and the glory of the Gentiles like a flowing stream: then shall ye suck, ye shall be borne upon her sides, and be dandled upon her knees.13, As one whom his mother comforts, so will I comfort you; and ye shall be comforted in Jerusalem. 14, And when ye see this, your heart shall rejoice, and your bones shall flourish like an herb: and the hand of the LORD shall be known toward his servants, and his indignation toward his enemies. 15, For, behold, the LORD will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire. 16, For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many. 17, They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, EATING SWINES FLESH, and THE ABOMINATION, AND THE MOUSE, SHALL BE CONSUMED TOGETHER, SAYS THE LORD. 18, For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory....

22, For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain. 23, And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD. 24, And they shall go forth, and look upon the carcasses of the men that have transgressed against me: for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched; and they shall be an abhorring unto all flesh.

Ezekiel 22:26 Her priests have violated my law, and have profaned mine holy things: they have put no difference between the holy and profane, NEITHER HAVE THEY MADE A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE CLEAN AND THE UNCLEAN <see Leviticus 11:47>, and have hid their eyes from my SABBATHS, and I am profaned among them.

Those who have professed to follow God's laws in the past have always been in trouble for breaking God's laws.

What are your thoughts (please support your view by scripture and let's discuss)?

......................

Q1. Are Gods' health and dietary laws important for us today?
Q2. Is COVID-19 Gods' judgement for breaking His dietary laws?
Q3. Can a "CLEAN MEAT" become "UNCLEAN MEAT" today if so how?

Friendly discussion please.

God bless

LoveGodsWord · Feb 9, 2021

Clare73 said:
God's pre-Moses dietary laws: "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, now I give you everything."

God's Mosaic Covenant dietary laws: Lev, chp 11.

God's New Covenant dietary laws: food laws have been set aside, there is no unclean food in the NT.
"They. . .order them to abstain from certain foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer." (1Tim 4:3-5)

"As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I a fully convinced that no food (nothing) is unclean in itself. . .For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men. . .All food is clean. . ." (Ro 14:14, 17, 20)

"They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings--external regulations applying until the time of the new order."
(Heb 9:10)

"Eat everything sold in the meat market without raising questions of conscience, for "The earth is the Lord's and everything in it." (1Co 10:25)

See Mk 7:19; Lk 11:41. Is God confused?

The food laws of the Mosaic Covenant were not health regulations, they were holiness regulations (Lev 11:44-45).
Ceremonial uncleanness (food, persons, garments, houses) was a type (picture, foreshadow) of sin and defilement, showing that every aspect of our lives must be according to the will of God (1Co 10:31).

The temporary regulations of the temporary Mosaic Covenant (Heb 8:13) administered by the temporary Levitical priesthood (Heb 7:12) are replaced in the NT with the eternal priesthood (Heb 7:17, 21) and the eternal New Covenant (Lk 22:20) of Christ Jesus.
How hard did you look?

Seems like a lot of twisting of scripture going on there Clare to try and make God's Word say things it does not say or teach, how did you do that? You have God Word contradicting itself. There is no scriptures in the new testament that says Gods' dietary laws have been set aside.

Clare73 · Feb 9, 2021

Clare73 said:
"As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food (nothing) is unclean in itself. . .For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men. . .All food is clean. . ." (Ro 14:14, 17, 20)

LoveGodsWord said:
Seems like a lot of twisting of scripture going on there Clare to try and make God's Word say things it does not say or teach, how did you do that? You have God Word contradicting itself.
There is no scriptures in the new testament that says Gods' dietary laws have been set aside.

Likewise, there are no Scriptures in the NT that say God is sovereign. . .nevertheless, it is presented throughout the NT (Da 4:35;
Ac 2:23, 4:28, 13:48; Lk 22:22; Ro 8:29-30, 9:14-29, 11:25-34; Eph 1:4-12; 2Th 2:13; 1Pe:1:2).

No Scriptures? . . .I dunno'. . .Jesus seems pretty clear on what is clean and unclean:

" 'Are you so dull? Don't you know that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'? For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body.' In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean." (Mk 7:18-19)

SabbathBlessings · Feb 9, 2021

Clare73 said:
There are no Scriptures in the NT that say God is sovereign. . .nevertheless, it is presented throughout the NT (Da 4:35; Ac 2:23, 4:28, 13:48; Lk 22:22; Ro 8:29-30, 9:14-29, 11:25-34; Eph 1:4-12; 2Th 2:13; 1Pe:1:2).

I dunno'. . .Jesus seems pretty clear on the subject:

" 'Are you so dull? Don't you know that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'? For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body.' In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean." (Mk 17:18-19)

This was already address is this thread, this was a parable, a parable is an illustration of a deeper meaning. It's has nothing to do with food.

SabbathBlessings · Feb 9, 2021

LoveGodsWord said:
There is some pretty scary stuff in this thread. Are all things really now clean to eat?

View attachment 294695

Fried rat and potato anyone?

Then we read just before the second coming...

Isaiah 66:17, They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the middle, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together, said the LORD.

I can't believe people eat these types of animals.

Clare73 · Feb 9, 2021

Clare73 said:
" 'Are you so dull? Don't you know that nothing that enters a man from the outside can make him 'unclean'? For it doesn't go into his heart but into his stomach, and then out of his body.' In saying this, Jesus declared all foods clean." (Mk 7:18-19)

imge said:
This was already address is this thread, this was a parable, a parable is an illustration of a deeper meaning.
It's has nothing to do with food.

I dunno'. . .the apostle Mark disagrees with you, those are his words in black.

There is some serious misreading of the NT going on here.

LoveGodsWord · Feb 9, 2021

Here Clare lets' add all the contexts back in...

Clare73 said:
God's pre-Moses dietary laws: "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, now I give you everything." (Ge 9:3) God's Mosaic Covenant dietary laws: Lev, chp 11.

Pre-flood and Moses, man made in God's image (original diet)

Genesis 1:29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is on the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat (food).

Post-flood and Pre-Moses with no food to eat after the flood...

Genesis 9:3-4 [3] Everything that lives and moves will be food for you. Just as I gave you the green plants, I now give you everything.[4] "But you must not eat meat that has its lifeblood still in it.

Post Moses and written law of God's diet for mankind listing all the clean animals safe to eat and the unclean animals that are not safe to eat and cannot be eaten
Leviticus 11:1-47
Deuteronomy 14:1-29

Clare73 said:
God's New Covenant dietary laws: food laws have been set aside, there is no unclean food in the NT. "They. . .order them to abstain from certain foods which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and know the truth. For everything God created is good, and nothing is to be rejected if it is received with thanksgiving, because it is consecrated by the word of God and prayer." (1Tim 4:3-5)

There is nothing in these scriptures that say Gods dietary laws have been abolished.

1 Timothy 4:3-5 [3], Forbidding to marry, and commanding to abstain from meats, which God has created to be received with thanksgiving OF THEM THAT BELIEVE AND KNOW THE TRUTH. [4], For every creature of God is good, and nothing to be refused, if it be received with thanksgiving: [5], FOR IT IS SANCTIFIED BY THE WORD OF GOD AND PRAYER.

This scripture links to...

John 17:17 SANCTIFY THEM THROUGH THE TRUTH THY WORD IS TRUTH...

So it is through the Word of God that we are told in 1 Timothy 4:3-5 that all food created by God is to be received in thanks giving to those who know the truth for it is sanctified by the Word of God. That is, God has told us what foods are clean to eat and unclean to eat through the Word of God! (see Leviticus 11:1-47 and Deuteronomy 14:1-29 where God tells us what foods he has created to be received with thanks giving and those that are not to be eaten).

Clare73 said:
"As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food (nothing) is unclean in itself. . .For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit, because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men. . .All food is clean. . ." (Ro 14:14, 17, 20)

None of those scripture teach all foods are now clean. Romans 14 is to eating and not eating on days that men esteem over other days and not judging anyone in that regards and eating of foods offered to idols.

Clare73 said:
"They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings--external regulations applying until the time of the new order."
(Heb 9:10)

Once again nothing to do with clean and unclean food laws. Hebrews 10 is in regards to meat and drink offerings and ordinances.

Clare73 said:
"Eat everything sold in the meat market without raising questions of conscience, for "The earth is the Lord's and everything in it." (1Co 10:25)

Once again nothing to do with clean and unclean food laws 1 Corinthians 10 is in regards to food offered to idols.

Clare73 said:
See Mk 7:19; Lk 11:41. Is God confused

No of course God is not confused, but it seems many are when it comes to God's dietary laws. Nowhere in the scriptures does it say in Mark 7 or the other gospels that Jesus is saying all unclean foods are now clean as the context is to the washing of pots and cups and hands not eating clean and unclean foods.

It also does not make any difference to me which translations are used in Mark 7:19 for the Greek word καθαρίζον used for clean means to purify ("declared" is not in the Greek it was added by the translators) the application of either Greek words meanings of course is chapter context and subject matter which determines the correct interpretation of the scriptures. They do not fit your interpretation that JESUS is saying all unclean foods are now clean as that is not the context and subject matter of both the scripture *Mark 7:19 and of the chapter context shown in Mark 7:2-23.

Using a single Greek word καθαρίζον which means "purify; cleanse make clean" (declared being added by the translators that is not in the Greek) is in context in the scripture to the word ἐκπορεύομαι which means to go out of the body or purge and after of course πάντα βρώματα (all food). The chapter context of course is to the washing of cups and pots and hands making someone κοινόω unclean or defiled not "unclean foods" *Mark 7:2-5 not to eating unclean foods prohibited in God's dietary laws of Leviticus 11.

The point of the scripture being to the chapter context and subject matter, is not the "washing of pots and cups and not washing of the hands that makes a man unclean a man (defiled)" (Mark 7:8) but breaking God's commandments and what comes out of the heart and mouth of the man that defiles (makes unclean) a man.

The context of making all meats clean is to the "purging out of the body" of impurities from not washing cups and pots and it is following man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God over the Word of God that defile (makes unclean) the man, not what one eats which passes out of the man *Mark 7:2-23. The chapter subject matter is not to eating unclean foods as they were all JEWS who followed the food laws of Leviticus 11 but the subject matter was to eating food with unwashed hands, pots and cups *Mark 7:2-5.

To make clean, to cleanse; a. from physical stains and dirt. You can see that the application here is to the context of "purging out or cleansing all food from the system by passing out that which is impure or unclean" from the body. That is, the nutritious part of the food remains while that which is defiled or unclean passes out of the man.

The above post I hope demonstrated the context of MARK 7:2-23 and context supersedes word definitions for scripture and chapter interpretations in the Hebrew and the Greek.

The context of Mark 7:2-23 is to pots and cups not clean and unclean foods prohibited from the old testament dietary laws of Leviticus 11.

Thayer's Greek Lexicon
NT 2511: καθαρίζω
καθαρίζω (Hellenistic for καθαίρω, which classic writings use); Attic future (cf. Buttmann, 37 (32); Winers Grammar, § 13, 1 c.; WH's Appendix, p. 163) καθαριῶ (Hebrews 9:14); 1 aorist ἐκαθάρισα (see below); present passive καθαρίζομαι; 1 aorist passive ἐκαθαρίσθην; perfect passive participle κεκαθαρισμενος (Hebrews 10:2 T Tr WH; on the forms ἐκαθερισθη, T WH in Matthew 8:3; Mark 1:42 (ἐκαθερισεν, Tr in Acts 10:15; Acts 11:9) and κεκαθερισμενος Lachmann in Hebrews 10:2, cf. (Tdf. Proleg., p. 82; WH's Appendix, p. 150); Sturz, De dial. Maced. etc., p. 118; Delitzsch on Hebrews 10:2; Krüger, Part ii. § 2, 2, 6, p. 4; (Buttmann, 29 (25f); Winer's Grammar, 43)); (καθαρός; the Sept. mostly for טִהַר;

1. to make clean, to cleanse;
a. from physical stains and dirt: e. g. utensils, Matthew 23:25 (figuratively, Matthew 23:26); Luke 11:39; food, Mark 7:19; τινα, a leper, to cleanse by curing, Matthew 8:2; Matthew 10:8; Matthew 11:5; Mark 1:40-42; Luke 4:27; Luke 5:12; Luke 7:22; Luke 17:14, 17 (Leviticus 14:8); to remove by cleansing: ἡ λέπρα ἐκαθαρίσθη, Matthew 8:3 (καθαριεῖς τό αἷμα τό ἀναίτιον ἐξ Ἰσραήλ, Deuteronomy 19:13; ἐκαθαριζε τήν περί ταῦτα συνήθειαν, the custom of marrying heathen women, Josephus, Antiquities 11, 5, 4; καθαιρεῖν αἷμα, Homer, Iliad 16, 667; cf. ἐκκαθαίρω).

.................

First lesson from the above section of Mark 7 is that context matters in regards to interpretation of the scriptures

Clare73 said:
The food laws of the Mosaic Covenant were not health regulations, they were holiness regulations (Lev 11:44-45). Ceremonial uncleanness (food, persons, garments, houses) was a type (picture, foreshadow) of sin and defilement, showing that every aspect of our lives must be according to the will of God (1Co 10:31)--holy, for "without holiness, no one will see the Lord." (Heb 12:14)

Nonsense! Of course the dietary laws were health laws otherwise there would be no reason to give them. Leviticus 11:44-45 does not say that Gods' food laws are not health laws it says that our holiness comes from believing and following God's Word.

Leviticus 11:44-45 For I am the LORD your God: you shall therefore sanctify yourselves, and you shall be holy; for I am holy: neither shall you defile yourselves with any manner of creeping thing that creeps on the earth. [45], For I am the LORD that brings you up out of the land of Egypt, to be your God: you shall therefore be holy, for I am holy.

We become holy by believing and following what God says is the message of Leviticus 11:44-45 (see John 17:17 in the new testament scriptures)

Clare73 said:
The temporary regulations of the temporary Mosaic Covenant (Heb 8:13) administered by the temporary Levitical priesthood (Heb 7:12) are replaced in the NT with the eternal priesthood (Heb 7:17, 21) and the eternal New Covenant (Lk 22:20) of Christ Jesus. How hard did you look?

The Levitical Priesthood has nothing to do with clean and unclean foods. Seems it is you that needs to look a little harder.

Hope this helps.

GOD'S DIETARY LAWS AND BAT SOUP STEW - COVID 19

Friend

Well-Known Member

Friend

Well-Known Member

Friend

Well-Known Member

Friend

Well-Known Member

Friend

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Blood-bought

Well-Known Member

Blood-bought

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Blood-bought

Well-Known Member

Similar threads