Russians help Parler promote violence in America.

tall73

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SoldierOfTheKing

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.
 
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Pommer

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.
Well...I’m nonplussed.
Please inform us that this is hyperbole.
 
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Michael

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.

Poisoning of Alexei Navalny - Wikipedia
Thousands of Russians were arrested in protests supporting Putin critic Alexei Navalny
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2020/08/21/why-poison-is-weapon-choice-putins-russia/

Man, I've heard utter nonsense before but that stream of disinformation and Russian propaganda simply takes the cake. Putin is a *murderer* who poisons and imprisons and tortures everyone who dares to defy him or run against him. He's a thug, a ruthless and immoral dictator, the new tsar of Russia who enriches himself to the tune of billions of dollars on the backs of his own people.

https://nypost.com/2021/01/20/alexei-navalny-reveals-putin-has-billion-dollar-palace/

The Kremlin doesn't 'protect freedom", it tries to snuff out freedom with lies and deception and brute force. Russia isn't "free". Just ask Alexei Navalny how "free" he is?

Washington certainly has it's share of faults, but *nothing* compared the Kremlin and Putin. Here in the US, I'm free to criticize my President without fear of being poisoned or imprisoned or tortured to death.

Your beliefs about Putin and Russia are utter nonsense.
 
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Moral Orel

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I mentioned in a previous thread that there's a downside to ostracizing those with radical beliefs. Sort of like with a cult. The best way to get people out of a cult is to confront them and challenge what they're being told as you're likely going to be able to "de-convert" a lot of them given the time, and not to take the approach of "well, they're weird, so let's just move them over to this walled off area and never interact with them".
That only works when you isolate the person away from their cult to remove the cult's influence. When we're talking about fringe groups on the internet, and only interacting with members through the internet, the brain-washed still have their cult in their ear the whole time. Imagine walking into a Scientology center and trying to talk someone out while you let all the other members chime in as much as they want while you're at it.
 
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Sparagmos

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I am not sure if you read all the posts in this thread, but that is not correct. I will re-post some of the info.

The court filing in the Parler vs. Amazon Web Services case makes the following claims in relation to this:

https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.wawd.294664/gov.uscourts.wawd.294664.21.0_2.pdf

And AWS has confirmed that none of the arrested participants in that unconscionable attack (who had been publicly identified as of the filing of this action) even had a Parler account, much less used it to “incite, organize or coordinate” the attack.

After Twitter banned President Trump on January 8, the increased new users and activity caused Parler to go down for seven hours, resulting in a backlog of 26,000 instances of content that potentially encouraged violence. Peikoff Dec., ¶ 13; Matze Dec., ¶ 9. However, over the next two days,Parler was able to systematically remove almost all of this content, which progress was reported to AWS, and within 48 hours by the end of Sunday—when AWS shut Parler down—Parler had removed all but some 1,000 problematic posts. Peikoff Dec., ¶ 14.Parler also identified additional steps it was taking to quickly identify and remove problematic content. Peikoff Dec., ¶ 15. Indeed, AWS had known since mid-December that Parler would be adopting in 2021 an Artificial Intelligence (“AI”) system that would pre-screen inappropriate content, which had shown promising initial results, and there was discussion of Parler adopting AWS’s own AI system.

The woman killed by law enforcement when she forced her way into the Capitol Building, Ashli Babbitt, did have a Parler account, but it had not been used since November. Id. She also had a Twitter account that was in use the day of the riot, January 6, 2020. Ex. D. Even the government claims that the attack was coordinated in part by Twitter.1 And claims reportedly showing Parler users being involved in the Capitol Riot because the metadata on videos uploaded to Parler reveal the location where they were recorded misunderstandthe evidence: Videos recorded by others, shared, and then uploaded by a separate Parler user will still show the original video location, even if the Parler user wasn’t there and didn’t record the video. MatzeDec., ¶ 4.

They were removing illegal content. They had an influx of such posts when Trump was banned on Twitter. The new memberes surging in took out service for a bit. Then they had to clean up the posts. They cleaned up 25 of the 26k such posts in two days, which is rather fast. They were going to finish the others but were removed.

He also indicates they were employing some AI, and in were discussing with Amazon whether to use Amazon's own AI system.

So they were not refusing to remove content.

Nor were threats of violence allowed in their terms of service. From back in June:

Parler’s new policy: No poop, no inappropriate content, no murder

Another rule communicated via Mr. Matze is, “You cannot threaten to kill anyone in the comment section. Sorry, never ever going to be okay.”

“If ever in doubt, ask yourself if you would say it on the streets of New York or national television,” Mr. Matze added.
I was on Parler, and every single time I logged on I saw violent content. Granted, I was following a lot of Q-cult accounts and white supremacists. But every day there was calls to kill liberals, and execute specific people they thought were part of the “cabal.” There was also explicit antisemetism and nazi /hitler worship. They didn’t just fall behind on their moderation, they weren’t moderating to begin with. And yet, they had the time to shadowban me as they did most liberals. Parlers rules were a joke.
 
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High Fidelity

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.

Yes, killing political opponents and those that expose it. So much freedom...
 
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tall73

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I was on Parler, and every single time I logged on I saw violent content. Granted, I was following a lot of Q-cult accounts and white supremacists. But every day there was calls to kill liberals, and execute specific people they thought were part of the “cabal.” There was also explicit antisemetism and nazi /hitler worship. They didn’t just fall behind on their moderation, they weren’t moderating to begin with. And yet, they had the time to shadowban me as they did most liberals. Parlers rules were a joke.

I find if I look at extreme groups on Twitter I get a steady flow of extreme content as well. And I imagine they don't moderate much on Parler because it sounds like they work on reports, as they do at CF. The Parler users are less likely to report. However, they had just started using Ai, and were in talks to use Amazon's AI, so it sounds like they were going to step that up. But even with AI the other platforms don't remove all such content.

And yes, I have heard that they still have viewpoint discrimination on Parler, which is unfortunate.
 
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tall73

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.


For the First Time, Russia Ranked Among Worst Violators of Religious Freedom

Russia’s ongoing crackdown on religious minorities, foreign missionaries, and evangelists has earned it a spot among the worst countries in the world for religious freedom.


The US Commission on International Religious Freedom (USCIRF), which flags religious freedom violators for the State Department, listed the former Soviet state among six new Tier 1 “countries of particular concern” (CPC) in its latest annual report, released Wednesday.

This is from 2017, but efforts have continued to crackdown on minority religious groups.

 
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Sparagmos

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I find if I look at extreme groups on Twitter I get a steady flow of extreme content as well. And I imagine they don't moderate much on Parler because it sounds like they work on reports, as they do at CF. The Parler users are less likely to report. However, they had just started using Ai, and were in talks to use Amazon's AI, so it sounds like they were going to step that up. But even with AI the other platforms don't remove all such content.

And yes, I have heard that they still have viewpoint discrimination on Parler, which is unfortunate.
No, none of that stuff is allowed on Twitter. We are talking about calls to kill all liberals and full on nazi propaganda, n-words, and “all Jews are evil” kind of posts. If that’s on Twitter please post proof. And like I said this was every day, not just one or two slipping through.
 
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Sparagmos

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.
Can you flesh this out for us? Why do you think the Kremlin “protects freedom?”
 
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MIDutch

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I’ve been saying it for years - Russia and America have switched places geopolitically. The Kremlin protects freedom, Washington pushes repression.

Vladimir Putin is the leader of the free world, and has been for well over a decade.
Wow.

Just ... wow.

I'd be curious to know what other countries you think are in this Putin sphere of "the free world" of which you speak.

Syria? Abkhasia and South Ossetia (the only "countries" Russia has mutual aggression pacts with)? China? Are these the shining beacons of "the free world" that you are talking about?
 
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tall73

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No, none of that stuff is allowed on Twitter. We are talking about calls to kill all liberals and full on nazi propaganda, n-words, and “all Jews are evil” kind of posts. If that’s on Twitter please post proof. And like I said this was every day, not just one or two slipping through.

I posted a number of violent threats in my other thread from just an afternoon's search on Twitter, calling for Jack Dorsey's death, Pelosi's, Biden's, Trumps, etc. Hang Pence was trending there, There were more generic calls to punch a nazi, fry police like bacon. Various posts called for exterminating Trump's supporters. I posted information from Amnesty international on Twitter's poor historical handling of threats of violence. And I posted an article regarding threats against the squad and other politicians. In the case of Kathy Griffin's post with a simulated severed head of Trump, they were aware of it, as it was covered a lot the first time around, and when it was re-posted, and had a sensitive content warning to view it.

You can check out the first few pages of this thread: Should Amazon Web services remove Twitter?

I think there are a couple of distinctions to be made. Both sites have content that they do not allow that remains up because they are not aware of it. However, they do have different measures of what they allow as well. Twitter has more controls on hate speech against race, sexual orientation, gender, etc. And then each site tends to have things it allows to stay up for various reasons, that are otherwise a problem (politician speech, particular viewpoints, etc.)

Personally I don't use either because they tend to be rather toxic, but I will search on them at times if I want to see some newsworthy info or quotes from public figures.

I prefer Christianforums' more heavily moderated approach, though every site strikes a balance of what is allowed based on their user base, principles, etc.
 
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tall73

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The above post links to a number of tweets directed at various people or groups.

Looking at a specific trend, it appears Twitter is not too concerned with wishing death on police officers. These were from a few minutes searching today. There were quite a few more that were redundant. These were searches of people, some older, some newer, but still up on the platform. Some don't have tweets, some do. Others have their tweets in protected mode.

upload_2021-1-26_12-31-51.png
 
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All Englands Skies

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There are a few reason. One is that Russia is led by a proverbial strong man, something the right wing seems to adore. Basically it's a thing that so called alphas like but honestly this is what happens when you are a mentally and/or socially maladjusted person. Another is that Russia is also seen as the last white bastion on earth and not having any of this "multicultural malarkey".

Russia is one of the most multicultural nations on earth, a mix of ethnicities and republics with vastly different cultures.
 
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Michael

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Russia is one of the most multicultural nations on earth, a mix of ethnicities and republics with vastly different cultures.

It's may be multicultural, but it's still a dictatorship that's run by a guy that murders his political opponents. I sure would not want to live there.
 
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Michael

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The above post links to a number of tweets directed at various people or groups.

FYI, our discussion has made me rethink my position a little. I can't really checkout Parler at the moment, but I did checkout Gab a bit. Other than it's overt support of conspiracy theories, it doesn't appear to me to contain any more or any less objectionable (violent or sexual) content than Twitter, but I'd have to assume they're both a bit behind in term of moderating out such content. I found some sexist content on Gap that didn't thrill me, but I guess that falls under their umbrella of 'free speech", and it wasn't violent or sexual in nature.

I guess for now I'll rescind my assumption that Parler was somehow "worse' than any other platform and I'll wait to see what their website actually contains when they come back online.

I will say this much after reading through Gab posts. I think Twitter is simply planting the seeds of it's own demise in terms of alienating large segments of the population. I still support Twitter's decision to terminate Trumps account, but I see no evidence that Twitter is better moderated than Gab, or anyone else for that matter. Thanks for making me do a bit more research and rethinking my position on that issue. I appreciate it.
 
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SoldierOfTheKing

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Man, I've heard utter nonsense before but that stream of disinformation and Russian propaganda simply takes the cake. Putin is a *murderer* who poisons and imprisons and tortures everyone who dares to defy him or run against him.

Russia has an opposition press. Anti-government demonstrations in Russia are not rare, and Putin has never deployed 25,000 troops to stop them from taking place. There are even opposition parties in Parliament...

The Kremlin doesn't 'protect freedom", it tries to snuff out freedom with lies and deception and brute force. Russia isn't "free". Just ask Alexei Navalny how "free" he is?

...and Navalny is an excellent example. For years he practiced in Russia as a lawyer, organized political movements, holding rallies and even running for office. He traveled abroad quite frequently, and even sent his daughter to Stanford. In short, he's lived a privileged life in Russia, far more so than the vast majority of his countrymen.

Of course being a political dissident is one thing - being an agent of Washington is quite another.


Can you flesh this out for us? Why do you think the Kremlin “protects freedom?”

See the title of this thread - my post was on topic.
 
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tall73

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FYI, our discussion has made me rethink my position a little. I can't really checkout Parler at the moment, but I did checkout Gab a bit. Other than it's overt support of conspiracy theories, it doesn't appear to me to contain any more or any less objectionable (violent or sexual) content than Twitter, but I'd have to assume they're both a bit behind in term of moderating out such content. I found some sexist content on Gap that didn't thrill me, but I guess that falls under their umbrella of 'free speech", and it wasn't violent or sexual in nature.

I guess for now I'll rescind my assumption that Parler was somehow "worse' than any other platform and I'll wait to see what their website actually contains when they come back online.

I will say this much after reading through Gab posts. I think Twitter is simply planting the seeds of it's own demise in terms of alienating large segments of the population. I still support Twitter's decision to terminate Trumps account, but I see no evidence that Twitter is better moderated than Gab, or anyone else for that matter. Thanks for making me do a bit more research and rethinking my position on that issue. I appreciate it.

I found in discussing the issues on the other threads on the topic that I had a slight shift in view as well. It is a complex topic. I think the reason Twitter, Amazon, etc. are taking the action they have is partly because of the shift in political power. The previous administration was more concerned about viewpoint discrimination by big tech, but the current may be more concerned about hosting of harmful content.

If they are not perceived as proactively doing something the politicians may alter their section 230 immunity, causing larger issues.

But I do agree, they risk turning off some users if they perception is that they engage in viewpoint moderating.
 
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Michael

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...and Navalny is an excellent example.

Ya, as an example of someone that Putin tried to have killed because he was becoming a real political threat to him.

For years he practiced in Russia as a lawyer, organized political movements, holding rallies and even running for office. He traveled abroad quite frequently, and even sent his daughter to Stanford. In short, he's lived a privileged life in Russia, far more so than the vast majority of his countrymen.

Sure, and once he become an actual threat to Putin and started discussing Putin's wealth, and his methods of attaining Tzar style wealth, Putin tried to have him killed. Crossing Putin is hazardous to one's health.

Of course being a political dissident is one thing - being an agent of Washington is quite another.

That's a great example of using "labels" to justify poisoning someone that's a threat to Putin.

I don't buy it. Putin is the new Tzar of Russia and he will do anything, including murder to hold his grip on power until the day he dies.
 
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