Mindfulness

Akita Suggagaki · Jan 15, 2021

How and why did we let Buddhism secular methods claim Mindfulness?
When I say "we" I mean Christianity.

Vigilance, wait for the Lord, Keep watch, our Christian lives have an inner dimension as well as outer active dimension. We begin with scripture, Lectio or even just gazing at the beauty of nature. Psalm 62:5-6 "My soul, wait in silence for God only, For my hope is from Him. He only is my rock and my salvation, My stronghold; I shall not be shaken."

Perhaps Mindfulness is incompatible with Christian spirituality in that it calls for nonjudgmental acceptance of the thoughts and feelings that come and go. One just sits there observing until stillness comes.

Brain scientists tell us that the brain has 2 modes: Self referential and other referential. Self referential involves our default Mode Network with its ruminations and thoughts of past and future. Other referential is a more attentive to what is happening. Self referential can result in all our worry and sadness. Other referential brings relief. If our "Other" is the ineffable presence of God it can also be prayer.

But we seem skeptical and wary of anything that is associated with non-Christian tradition.

I think mindfulness is within the Judeo-Christian tradition but is alike a stepchild we feel free to ignore. But it seems to me that awareness of God's presence requires attentiveness without the distraction of our own ruminations.

I claim "Mindfulness" Christian requirement.

Tigger45 · Jan 15, 2021

The mindful Catholic: Finding God one moment at a time.

Coincidentally our study group is currently studying this book.

Akita Suggagaki · Jan 15, 2021

Tigger45 said:
The mindful Catholic: Finding God one moment at a time.

Coincidentally our study group is currently studying this book.

I recently heard of it. How is it going?

Pavel Mosko · Jan 15, 2021

Akita Suggagaki said:
But we seem skeptical and wary of anything that is associated with non-Christian tradition.

Yeah I notice a lot and was guilty of that in decades past. There is a notion out there that since we see Christ is the only way to salvation etc. that you can't give any other religion or philosophy credit when it discovers similar truths etc. because some how you are under mining Christianity's exclusive claims to the Truth etc.

This I think is more of a Protestant problem, especially from Fundamentalism etc. While you could see that kind of thinking in Earlier Christianity, some of the Early Church Fathers, Christian Stoics etc. realized that other people being created in the image of God could also learn some things about the Logos etc. And in my earlier life, I ran across that kind of insight early, going to Christian parochial schools that were run poorly at times, etc. I found helpful stuff in Taoism, Zen that helped me in my day to day life more than the advice that I got from some of my Christian authority figures.

It is interesting that "spiritual exercises" that Father's of confession might ask for someone seeing them often came from the practices of the stoics to practice their philosophy. Which is one strong point at learning some of this stuff, you can know the vague theory of something, but it helps to have a way to actually do the thing in real life.

Tigger45 · Jan 15, 2021

Akita Suggagaki said:
I recently heard of it. How is it going?

I like it. Missed the first week but caught the second class last week and we’ll be studying chapters 3 & 4 this coming Sunday.

zippy2006 · Jan 15, 2021

Tigger45 said:
The mindful Catholic: Finding God one moment at a time.

Coincidentally our study group is currently studying this book.

What does the author say in Appendix I: Mindfulness: Buddhist or Catholic?

zippy2006 · Jan 15, 2021

Akita Suggagaki said:
How and why did we let Buddhism secular methods claim Mindfulness?
When I say "we" I mean Christianity.

...

I claim "Mindfulness" Christian requirement.

It is present in our tradition but it isn't as central as it is in Buddhism. It really isn't a Christian requirement, as a large number of people seem to be perfectly Christian without it. There are all sorts of Christians who have found God interiorly in stillness. There are also lots who find him elsewhere. That's not true for Buddhists. Meditation really is a requirement of Buddhism.

I think the renewal of contemplative prayer is a great thing, but I can also see why the practice of "meditation" is more associated with Buddhism than Christianity.

Akita Suggagaki · Jan 16, 2021

zippy2006 said:
It is present in our tradition but it isn't as central as it is in Buddhism. It really isn't a Christian requirement, as a large number of people seem to be perfectly Christian without it. There are all sorts of Christians who have found God interiorly in stillness. There are also lots who find him elsewhere. That's not true for Buddhists. Meditation really is a requirement of Buddhism.

I think the renewal of contemplative prayer is a great thing, but I can also see why the practice of "meditation" is more associated with Buddhism than Christianity.

I agree. Christianity requires a personal commitment and then a life that alignes with the commitment. But does that imply a personal inner relationship with Christ? I think so but that can be nurtures in may ways.

For the deepest relationship it seems to me, contemplation is needed. Something that takes us beyond our own inner words to a place where we listen attentively. A place where it is n longer about us but about God.

JimR-OCDS · Jan 16, 2021

St John of the Cross wrote about detachment from our "appetites," back in the 16th century as there wasn't a word for ego in his day, but it's what he was referring to.

Later, Archbishop Fulton Sheen wrote about detachment from the ego in order to be your true self rather than the false self the ego creates.

Mindfulness is nothing more than being aware of the erroneous thoughts which come into your mind and not reacting to them. It's really nothing new and is part of Christian Spirituality and was taught in the 4th Century by mystics like Abba Isaac and St John Cassian.

There is nothing unchristian about learning to be in the present where God is. God is here in the now, for time only matters to us mortals in this life. God is timeless.

Mindfulness is part of living a contemplative life and it was lost over the centuries as the Church became more focused on being right and pointing at others who are wrong.

Be mindful of being in the presence of God, who dwells within. It's nothing new and even in the Psalms in the Bible.

Tigger45 · Jan 16, 2021

zippy2006 said:
What does the author say in Appendix I: Mindfulness: Buddhist or Catholic?

I’ll let the author speak for himself.

Akita Suggagaki · Jan 16, 2021

Very good. We need more of this kind of explanation.

JimR-OCDS · Jan 17, 2021

Tigger45 said:
I’ll let the author speak for himself.

He explains Catholic Mindfulness and Buddhist Mindfulness well.

I'm not a Buddhist but some of what he says about what Buddhist believe doesn't line up with what I've read other Buddhist say.

However, it doesn't matter. He got the Catholic part of mindfulness correct.

aiki · Jan 17, 2021

Akita Suggagaki said:
How and why did we let Buddhism secular methods claim Mindfulness?
When I say "we" I mean Christianity.

I'm not sure it has. Try not being mindful when you use a chainsaw or drive a car and you'll quickly end up in serious trouble.

The work I do requires extremely high mindfulness. It's impossible, in fact, to do what I do without being mindful.

Akita Suggagaki said:
Vigilance, wait for the Lord, Keep watch, our Christian lives have an inner dimension as well as outer active dimension. We begin with scripture, Lectio or even just gazing at the beauty of nature. Psalm 62:5-6 "My soul, wait in silence for God only, For my hope is from Him. He only is my rock and my salvation, My stronghold; I shall not be shaken."

As far as I'm aware, the Bible never urges us to fix our attention regularly and meditatively upon Nature, but upon Christ (Hebrews 12:2-3; 2 Corinthians 3:18) and upon God's word (Psalm 1; Psalm 119:11; Proverbs 3:1-4). All created things are necessarily lower, inferior to, their Creator; they are not Him, though created by Him, and cannot therefore reveal God in a full, detailed and precise way. We only see the vaguest outlines of God in Creation which is why, I suspect, we are never urged in Scripture to spend a lot of time contemplating mountains, trees, valleys, etc.

Akita Suggagaki said:
Perhaps Mindfulness is incompatible with Christian spirituality in that it calls for nonjudgmental acceptance of the thoughts and feelings that come and go. One just sits there observing until stillness comes.

This doesn't appear to be what Paul the apostle recommended concerning one's thought-life:

2 Corinthians 10:3-5
3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:
4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds
5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Akita Suggagaki said:
But we seem skeptical and wary of anything that is associated with non-Christian tradition.

In my case, I'm only wary of those things outside my Christian faith that run contrary to Scripture, as "mindfulness" (Buddhist or otherwise) seems to do, or detracts from my fellowship with God.

Akita Suggagaki said:
I think mindfulness is within the Judeo-Christian tradition but is alike a stepchild we feel free to ignore. But it seems to me that awareness of God's presence requires attentiveness without the distraction of our own ruminations.

I contemplate God in the special revelation of Him in Scripture - the revelation that God Himself has indicated in His word is sufficient for me as His child to possess and dwell upon. I try to be as mindful as possible as I do so, but I don't think in this I am mindful in the way you are thinking of it. The meditation recommended to me in the Bible seems to be a very active thing, filling, cleansing, informing and transforming my mind and heart.

Akita Suggagaki · Jan 17, 2021

aiki said:
The meditation recommended to me in the Bible seems to be a very active thing, filling, cleansing, informing and transforming my mind and heart.

Yes, and that can also be part of mindfulness. As you said, we need to be mindful in a lot of things that we do daily. I like your quote from Corinthians, 5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalts itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

Mindfulness 'letting go of" maybe can be viewed as casting down and bringing into captivity because we do not get entangled in them. I have been reading about the brain. In our more reflective other centered moments we can be simply aware of what is without as much ego involvement.

The video does a nice job of distinguishing the practice from the prayer. A lot of the Buddhist disciplines and view is good mental hygiene but, for me, too empty. When I come to some inner stillness it is for me an intimacy with God rather than "emptiness".

From time to time I like to read St Bonaventure's Itinerarium:

"So it follows that, by the act of observing, the mind transcends and passes beyond not only the perceivable world, but equally its own self: and Christ is the way and the gate through which this transcendence is achieved, Christ is the ladder and the vehicle...

"If this transcendence is to be perfect, all intellectual activity should be relinquished and the entire apex of affection be transferred to and transformed into God.
http://faculty.uml.edu/rinnis/45.304 God and Philosophy/ITINERARIUM.pdf

You ill note that this is the last step n a longer process.
This for me is refreshing. Some of us need the inner silence, inner stillness to just observe, rest and let Christ do what he will do. And sometimes that seems to be nothing...boring.

Another thing that has been helping me lately in any ways is the reminder that I am here to serve. I am a servant. Life is not bout being a perfect world for me. It is not all about me. My life in time is the unfolding of God's will and plan. My ego may not always like it. That is another way I find meditation helpful, my ego takes a break.

bèlla · Jan 17, 2021

I learned mindfulness and stillness through Buddhist teachings. I explored the Benedictine Rule, the desert fathers, and contemplation. But it doesn’t speak to my heart. So I scrapped it.

I asked myself three questions:

What feeds my spirit?
What ignites my passion?
What makes me feel closest to God?

I gave myself permission to shift and take an unchartered path. To do things differently while honoring my heart and the Lord.

I view mindfulness as a way of being and consider it an integral part of intentional living. It’s daily attentiveness to our thoughts, feelings, and experiences. I can approach everything mindfully if I’m willing to do so. Even this site.

Yours in His Service,

~bella

Jesse Dornfeld · Jan 17, 2021

This is the only place in the Bible that I know of that might be considered this kind of meditation the OP is talking about and it is still completely ambiguous as scholars just do not know what this word means.

Genesis 24:63 And Isaac went out to meditate in the field toward evening. And he lifted up his eyes and saw, and behold, there were camels coming.

Tigger45 · Jan 17, 2021

Here’s another biblical reference alluding to mindfulness meditation. There were both Jewish and early church practices of mindfulness meditation. It’s not until modern times do we see a ‘segment’ of Christianity haveing problems with it, often being confused with eastern meditative practices.

Psalm 46:

10 “Be still, and know that I am God.

I will be exalted among the nations,

I will be exalted in the earth!”

Jesse Dornfeld · Jan 17, 2021

Tigger45 said:
Here’s another biblical reference alluding to mindfulness meditation. There were both Jewish and early church practices of mindfulness meditation. It’s not until modern times do we see a ‘segment’ of Christianity haveing problems with it, often being confused with eastern meditative practices.

Psalm 46:

10 “Be still, and know that I am God.

I will be exalted among the nations,

I will be exalted in the earth!”

With all respect, I feel this is directing your orientation towards God, not your environment.

Tigger45 · Jan 17, 2021

True Counterphobia said:
With all respect, I feel this is directing your orientation towards God, not your environment.

My friend it’s because Catholic mindfulness naturally encompasses sacramental theology.

Jesse Dornfeld · Jan 17, 2021

Tigger45 said:
My friend it’s because Catholic mindfulness natural encompasses sacramental theology.

Perhaps, but things either lead you to God or something else. This is true of everything, nature included.

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