Answer me this question.

Mark Quayle

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The elect are born into this world totally depraved, and without hope. Sometime in their life God quickens them to a spiritual life with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit while they are yet dead, spiritually, in their sins, Eph 2.
So you are agreeing with the OP?
 
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BobRyan

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As a Particular Baptist, I am a strong monergist ... believing that God saves whom He chooses, when He chooses and how He chooses and God does all of the work in saving men.

"God is not willing for ANY to perish but for ALL to come to repentance" 2 Peter 3
"He is the atoning sacrifice for OUR sins and NOT for our sins only but for the sins of the WHOLE WORLD" 1 John 2:2
God supernaturally "Convicts the WORLD of sin and righteousness and judgment" John 16
"God sent his Son to be the savior of the WORLD" 1 John 4:14
"God so loved the WORLD that He gave.." John 3:16
"I will draw ALL mankind unto Me" John 12:32
"I stand at the door and knock if ANYONE hears My voice AND opens the door I WILL come in" Rev 3

Matt 7 - the FEW vs the many
"HE came to HIS OWN and His OWN received Him not" John 1:11
"What MORE could I have done than that which I have already done?" Isaiah 5:4
 
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atpollard

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The ark is mentioned once more...Revelation 11:19..Then the temple of God was opened in heaven, and the ark of His covenant was seen in His temple. And there were lightnings, noises, thunderings, an earthquake, and great hail.
Thank you for making my point that it never reappeared in the Earthly Temple prior to it’s destruction in AD 70.
 
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Eilat

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So what do you think Jesus meant in Matthew 15:24?

Jesus, on earth, is a Jewish Man, and He fulfilled what He was sent to do, according to the Old Testament.

And your point, and your verse is an interesting one, as it shows that Jesus, while on earth, had a specific situation.......ISRAEL.

One of the reasons that the body of Christ is a huge confused theological mess, is because there are not a lot of good Teachers left. So thats a problem.

And without a good teacher,..... believers will be misled, conned, lied to, and Faith subverted, all the time.

There are some keys you have to know to "rightly divided the word" and if don't know them...if a good Teacher has not shown you them, then you will wrongly divide the word and that is why you see so many denominations.
Its the Theologically confused, leading the confused around in the dark.
 
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atpollard

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Yes, but common sense tells you that "whosoever" is the same idea as "all".
Im sure you see that.
Respectfully, no.

“whoever believes” is very different from “all the people in the world”.

All the people in the world need a savior, but only the ones who believe (whosoever believes) will spend eternity in heaven.

It may not be God’s will that any should perish, but that in no way translates to all people will be saved.
 
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Loaves and Fishes

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Thank you for making my point that it never reappeared in the Earthly Temple prior to it’s destruction in AD 70.
You said..."The Ark and the Glory are not mentioned again in Scripture after the destruction of the temple and the exile."
 
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Eilat

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Respectfully, no.

“whoever believes” is very different from “all the people in the world”.

Consider this..

what is the context of John 3:16?

The context is that God has come to the WORLD, for a reason.

Now ,who is the World?

Its ALL of us.
So, that is the UNIVERSAL OFFER of Jesus's Blood, as Redemption.
Its offered to the WORLD...... "all".

BUT.

This offer to ALL, is not activated, unless EACH of us, Believes.

So, the context of the verse is that the WORLD is OFFERED JESUS.

But the Context, has a stipulation.........= "BELIEVE".

So, God Grace is for ALL.
God came here as Jesus to die for ALL.
But to get what God has offered the WORLD...(All), is, the "whosoever".......or those that BELIEVE.

Salvation is an eternal offer, that began with Jesus's Blood, and it ends, with Jesus's Blood.
This offer, is EXTANT.....its ALWAYS BEING OFFERED TO ALL, who are in the WORLD....currently.
But you can't receive the offer to ALL, unless you are the "whosoever", that BELIEVE in Jesus, and become born again.
 
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Loaves and Fishes

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Consider this..

what is the context of John 3:16?

The context is that God has come to the WORLD, for a reason.

Now ,who is the World?

Its ALL of us.
So, that is the UNIVERSAL OFFER of Jesus's Blood, as Redemption.
Its offered to the WORLD...... "all".

BUT.

This offer to ALL, is not activated, unless EACH of us, Believes.

So, the context of the verse is that the WORLD is OFFERED JESUS.

But the Context, has a stipulation.........= "BELIEVE".

So, God Grace is for ALL.
God came here as Jesus to die for ALL.
But to get what God has offered the WORLD...(All), is, the "whosoever".......or those that BELIEVE.

Salvation is an eternal offer, that began with Jesus's Blood, and it ends, with Jesus's Blood.
This offer, is EXTANT.....its ALWAYS BEING OFFERED TO ALL, who are in the WORLD....currently.
But you can't receive the offer to ALL, unless you are the "whosoever", that BELIEVE in Jesus, and become born again.

John 6:44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.
 
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Eilat

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John 6:44 “No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.

Notice the "one"..
That is EVERY ONE :)

ALL who call on the name of the Lord.
Yet, "whosoever" BELIEVES, is the condition.
"for as many as believe".
 
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atpollard

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Consider this..

what is the context of John 3:16?

The context is that God has come to the WORLD, for a reason.
I consider instead what John 3:16 actually says rather than what I would like it to say, and it says:

[John 3:16]
  • [NASB] "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
  • [KJV] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
  • [YLT] for God did so love the world, that His Son -- the only begotten -- He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during.
 
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Eilat

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I consider instead what John 3:16 actually says rather than what I would like it to say, and it says:

[John 3:16]
  • [NASB] "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.
  • [KJV] For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
  • [YLT] for God did so love the world, that His Son -- the only begotten -- He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during.


Correct.
God gave to ALL.
Thats the context.
He didnt just give to the white people or the black people, or the jewish people, or the pretty people.
He Came to die for ALL People.
Just like your verses teach.
 
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atpollard

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So, that is the UNIVERSAL OFFER of Jesus's Blood, as Redemption.
Its offered to the WORLD...... "all".

BUT.

This offer to ALL, is not activated, unless EACH of us, Believes.
Not in John 1:13 where it states that they are “born of God” (no man activation mentioned).

Not in John 3:8 where it states that the new birth is a work of the Spirit (not of human activation).

And not in John 3:16 which cannot contradict the foundation already laid by John.
 
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atpollard

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Correct.
God gave to ALL.
Thats the context.
He didnt just give to the white people or the black people, or the jewish people, or the pretty people.
He Came to die for ALL People.
Just like your verses teach.
“Whosoever believes” is not “all” no matter how many times you deny it because ALL DO NOT BELIEVE!
 
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Eilat

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Not in John 1:13 where it states that they are “born of God” (no man activation mentioned).

Not in John 3:8 where it states that the new birth is a work of the Spirit (not of human activation).

And not in John 3:16 which cannot contradict the foundation already laid by John.

Ok, you are not making any sense.

Let start at the top, in the beginning..

God came as a man, to die for the Sin of the world.
What is the sin of the world? Its the SINNERS, its ALL THE PEOPLE.
So, that is John 3:16. John 3:16 is the GOSPEL.

Now, the new birth is a spiritual bi-product or result OF = hearing the GOSPEL, and by faith BELIEVING.

"faith is counted as righteousness"..."Justification BY Faith"...God accepts your faith to then give you "the gift of Righteousness" which occurs in sync with your new birth as a new creation in Christ.
 
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Eilat

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“Whosoever believes” is not “all” no matter how many times you deny it because ALL DO NOT BELIEVE!

I have not said that God saves all.
You have said that..
I have not.

I said that the OFFER = of Christ's Blood is given freely to ALL the world., to all the people, for the last 2000+ yrs John 3:16.

But only those who are the "whosoever believes", are saved.......even tho ALL are offered salvation.

God's offer of salvation is UNIVERSAL.....but not everyone will TAKE the offer.
Those who take it, who BELIEVE, are the "whosoever" in John 3:16
 
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Guojing

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Jesus, on earth, is a Jewish Man, and He fulfilled what He was sent to do, according to the Old Testament.

And your point, and your verse is an interesting one, as it shows that Jesus, while on earth, had a specific situation.......ISRAEL.

One of the reasons that the body of Christ is a huge confused theological mess, is because there are not a lot of good Teachers left. So thats a problem.

And without a good teacher,..... believers will be misled, conned, lied to, and Faith subverted, all the time.

There are some keys you have to know to "rightly divided the word" and if don't know them...if a good Teacher has not shown you them, then you will wrongly divide the word and that is why you see so many denominations.
Its the Theologically confused, leading the confused around in the dark.

So there is no All in John 3:16 right?
 
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