THE CHANGING OF GOD'S SABBATH TO SUNDAY WORSHIP?

LoveGodsWord said:

Folks it would be good if we can get back on topic now to the OP which is...

THE CHANGING OF GOD'S SABBATH TO SUNDAY WORSHIP?

Thanks all.

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The Sabbath is still Saturday and binding upon all Jews as per the everlasting Covenant God made with that nation. Gentiles are not bound to teh Sabbath. It is not found anywhere in the bible.

nolidad said:

Well I never said I am not under any law, just not under the Mosaic Law with its 613 commands. And our obedience does not save us, keep us saved, make us just, or righteous before God. It shows that we just, and saved and righteous already because of Jesus!

All teh rest of your post is irrelevant because you assumed a false answer.

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God's law has 10 commandments not 613 clearly stated both written and verbal by God

Deuteronomy 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

Exodus 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Maybe you can tell us what laws are you under?

If obedience is not important than what does this verses mean to you? It's one of the last few verses in the Bible.

Revelations 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Revelations22: 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

nolidad said:

The Sabbath is still Saturday and binding upon all Jews as per the everlasting Covenant God made with that nation. Gentiles are not bound to teh Sabbath. It is not found anywhere in the bible.

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Well you can't cherry pick what you like. You are either under the law and the promises of the Covenant or you're not. The Sabbath was established at creation before there was any Jews Genesis 2:3 Jesus said the Sabbath was made for Jews, oh He did not say that....

Jesus said: And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27

I really don't understand how this can be interpreted any other way than how it plainly reads.

I pray this helps.

LoveGodsWord said:

It is true that all of Gods Israel will be saved according to the scriptures but as proven in earlier posts through the scriptures God's ISRAEL in the new covenant are simply all those who believe and follow Gods' Word. I have never said that unbelieving Jews cannot be grafted back in if they choose to believe and follow God's Word so your point here is a mute one.

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No it is not Scripture but the Word of "lovesGodsword " that calls all who believe "Gods Israel"

So you believe that right now "blindness in part" has happened to some of those who believe then. That is what is written in Romans 11:

"
25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:"

So let us translate this according to yuor definitions.

For I would not have you be ignorant of this mystery, lest you be wise in your own conceits, that blindness in part is happened to those who believe and follow Gods Word, until the fulness of the Gentiles (who are they?) be come in. and so all those who believe and follow Gods word shall be saved.

Shouldd we retranslate the rest of this chapter and substitute "those who believe and follow Gods Word" with all the personal pronouns that refer to Israel?

LoveGodsWord said:

The new covenant was not in effect until after the death and resurrection of JESUS. The scriptures you provide here are pre death and resurrection therefore old covenant settings. According to the scriptures the new covenant does not take effect until after the death of JESUS.

Hebrews 9:16 For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator.

So you really have not provided any scripture to support your belief.

Hope this is helpful.

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So you believe the new covenant is in effect then.

Let us look at the new Covenant God said He would make.

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

So according to you:

All the house of Israel and Judah no wwhave the following:

1. the law of god is written in the hearts of the whole house of Israel and Judah.
2. god is their God and they are His people,
3. Everyone in the house of Judah and Israel knows the Lord from the least to the greatest.
4. God no longer remembers the sins of the whole house of Israel and Judah.

Glad to know you r belief then.

LoveGodsWord said:

A multitude or nation in the Greek for ethnos simply means a multitude which is in reference to the promise given by God to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. It does not define who God's ISRAEL are according to the scriptures which have already been provided to you that show Gods' ISRAEL according to God's Word (not mine) in the new covenant are all those who believe and follow Gods' Word. If we are not a part of God's ISRAEL in the new covenant we have no part in God's new covenant promise which is to God's ISRAEL *Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Ezekiel 36:24-27. Gentile believers are now grafted in *Romans 11:13-27.

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You will find out differently to your shame and sorrow. But for the record :

Galatians 6:16
And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

Paul is asking a blessing upon two groups of believers here:

Thise who walk according to this rule and also to the Israel of God. The Israel of God has been, is and always will be the faithful remnant of Jews in all ages as Paul unambiguously declared in Romans 11.

Have a mwerry Christmas I will be vack on the 31st.

imge said:

God's law has 10 commandments not 613 clearly stated both written and verbal by God

Deuteronomy 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

Exodus 34:28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.

Maybe you can tell us what laws are you under?

If obedience is not important than what does this verses mean to you? It's one of the last few verses in the Bible.

Revelations 14:12 12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus.

Revelations22: 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.

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Too bad you do not know th emeaning of Words.

Teh Mosaic covenant has 613 commands that is without dispute.

And the Ten Commandments? They are a ministry of death and not life.

So follow them if you wish- call me when you die spiritually, and I will tell you how to live joyfully.

Have a nice Christmas. I will be back the 31st.

imge said:

Well you can't cherry pick what you like. You are either under the law and the promises of the Covenant or you're not. The Sabbath was established at creation before there was any Jews Genesis 2:3 Jesus said the Sabbath was made for Jews, oh He did not say that....

Jesus said: And He said to them, “The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27

I really don't understand how this can be interpreted any other way than how it plainly reads.

I pray this helps.

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That is right we can't cherry pick. But as you fail to understand teh context of why Jesus said that, you still think with in a legalistic mindset that the Sabbath is a bound duty for man to keep.

Besied Pauls said the law a school master until faith came. Now that we have faith we are no longer under a schoolmaster-the Law!

Also those ten bifgones written in stone? God said they are a ministry of death! Not life! If you wish to be under them- knock youself out! Enjoy being killed by th elaw!

I choose to live under Jesus and know life and not death.

Have a nice Christmas I am off till the 31st.

nolidad said:

That is right we can't cherry pick. But as you fail to understand teh context of why Jesus said that, you still think with in a legalistic mindset that the Sabbath is a bound duty for man to keep.

Besied Pauls said the law a school master until faith came. Now that we have faith we are no longer under a schoolmaster-the Law!

Also those ten bifgones written in stone? God said they are a ministry of death! Not life! If you wish to be under them- knock youself out! Enjoy being killed by th elaw!

I choose to live under Jesus and know life and not death.

Have a nice Christmas I am off till the 31st.

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Maybe you didn't read this carefully:

Deuteronomy 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

His covenant has 10 commandments, not 613. Are you saying it is okay to murder, lie, cheat, covet, vain His name and doing these things according to what you wrote is going to bring you death? That seems like an oxymoron since the definition of sin is breaking the laws of God. 1 John 3:4 Everyone who sins is breaking God’s law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. Also the wages of sin is death, Romans 6:23 but you're saying we should sin to not have death? So murder will bring happiness to God? I will pray for you my friend.

imge said:

Maybe you didn't read this carefully:

Deuteronomy 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

His covenant has 10 commandments, not 613. Are you saying it is okay to murder, lie, cheat, covet, vain His name and doing these things according to what you wrote is going to bring you death? That seems like an oxymoron since the definition of sin is breaking the laws of God. 1 John 3:4 Everyone who sins is breaking God’s law, for all sin is contrary to the law of God. Also the wages of sin is death, but you're saying we should sin to not have death? So murder will bring happiness to God? I will pray for you my friend.

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No I am not/ We do not do those based on teh Covenant God made with the nation of Israel! Just like we do not obey the dietary and clothing laws based on the commands god gave to Israel.

nolidad said:

No I am not/ We do not do those based on teh Covenant God made with the nation of Israel! Just like we do not obey the dietary and clothing laws based on the commands god gave to Israel.

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So again, what laws are you under?

imge said:

So again, what laws are you under?

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Not the Mosaic with teh ten written in stone which minister death, but as Paul called it the Law of Christ. Those are the ones I obey to show that Jesus made me righteous! It is the 1008 commands of the New I boey!

( of the ten written in stone have been carried over. but the Sabbath was not! as Paul said:

Romans 14:4-7
King James Version

4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.


If soemone wishes to follow th esabbath and make Saturday a day of rest (not church services BRTW) God bless them. If someone observes it differently or not at all? God bless them! Do it or don't do it unto the Lord!

nolidad said:

Not the Mosaic with teh ten written in stone which minister death, but as Paul called it the Law of Christ. Those are the ones I obey to show that Jesus made me righteous! It is the 1008 commands of the New I boey!

( of the ten written in stone have been carried over. but the Sabbath was not! as Paul said:

Romans 14:4-7
King James Version

4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.

6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day, to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks; and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself.


If soemone wishes to follow th esabbath and make Saturday a day of rest (not church services BRTW) God bless them. If someone observes it differently or not at all? God bless them! Do it or don't do it unto the Lord!

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So again, what laws do you feel you are under? I am not sure why you can't answer this simple question? You're argument here has nothing to do with the eternal laws of God. So if we are free to sin, what are the laws in your opinion or none? Previously you said you were under laws but have yet to clarify them. You say you're not under the first covenant, God only made one other covenant, are you under the second one? If so what laws are those specifically?

imge said:

So again, what laws do you feel you are under? I am not sure why you can't answer this simple question? You're argument here has nothing to do with the eternal laws of God. So if we are free to sin, what are the laws in your opinion or none? Previously you said you were under laws but have yet to clarify them. You say you're not under the first covenant, God only made one other covenant, are you under the second one? If so what laws are those specifically?

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Paul in Romans 8 called it teh law of the Spirit.

But in reality I am under Christ for salvation and righteousness and perfection. I guess I cannot answer specifically because I am not sure you mean by being under. I am not under th elaw for anything.

I obey the commands of teh New Testament as proof I am righteous and saved and holy etc.etc.etc. but I do not know what you mean by being under the law.

LoveGodsWord said:

You means like Romans 8:4 where it says; [4], That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. So if God's righteousness is being fulfilled in us who walk after the Spirit, whose spirit do those have who are breaking God's law *1 John 2:3-4; 1 John 3:6-10? The new covenant is not a covenant of law breaking it establishes Gods law in the lives of those who believe and follow Gods' Word by faith. Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yes, we establish the law. - Romans 3:31. You may want to read a bit more about what exactly is God's new covenant in Hebrews 8:10-12 from Jeremiah 31:31-34; Ezekiel 36:24-27; Romans 13:8-10; James 2:8-12; Matthew 22:36-40; Hebrews 7:1-28; Hebrews 8:1-13; Hebrews 9:1-28 and Hebrews 10:1-17.

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As mentioned, the Catholic Church teaches that the ten commandments are still obligatory for believers, but now to be fulfilled the right way, God’s way, by the Spirit, by love of God and neighbor. Love, by its nature, fulfills moral laws without even needing to hear the law. And at some point beginning 1850 or so years before your church came on the scene the Christian church had made this change, still believing that sabbath was observed but in a new way while not constrained by laws that did not directly impact morality in the way that the other nine commandments do. That’s just the way it is. Jesus didn’t dance to the Pharisee’s tune nor does He dance to ours but to His own, to God’s alone, IOW. I know you prefer the role of dragon slayer, equipped with the sword of truth, but you end up more kin to Saul the Persecutor, truth be told.

LoveGodsWord said:

There is no scripture that says Gods' 4th commandment which is one of God's 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7 has been abolished and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day of rest. This is simply a man-made teaching and tradition that has led many away from God and His Word handed down from the same people that gave us Christmas and Easter which have their origins in paganism and sun-worship.

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The sunworshipper charge is particularly inane. Nowhere is sun worship to be found in Catholic teachings, and then, at the 2nd Council of Orange some two centuries after the Edict of Milan legitimized Christianity along with other religions, these same “sunworshippers” managed to come up with the canons that laid down the Christian understanding of the role of grace in such wise and eloquent and solid terms that the Sun must’ve been quite angry and jealous about how they’d abandoned she/he/it to this other religion.

And Christmas and Easter are matters of taking over and Christianizing pagan holidays at most, even though Christmas may or may not be originally tied to any pagan feast days/celebrations. Either way the meaning of the season certainly gets lost for many with the popular secular ways they’re also celebrated. The Easter bunny, for example, is a later Protestant European invention.

And there's not a single reason why Scripture must document and give exhaustive support, or even any support, for everything the church believes, teaches, and practices. God's church received the gospel before a word of the New Testament was even written.

nolidad said:

Also those ten bifgones written in stone? God said they are a ministry of death! Not life! If you wish to be under them- knock youself out! Enjoy being killed by th elaw!

I choose to live under Jesus and know life and not death.

Have a nice Christmas I am off till the 31st.

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Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

He that hath my commandments, and keeps them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Do you think His commandments are different than His Father's??? A divided house can NOT stand...

Yeshua HaDerekh said:

Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

He that hath my commandments, and keeps them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

If ye love me, keep my commandments.

Do you think His commandments are different than His Father's??? A divided house can NOT stand...

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So do you not eat shellfish and animals that do not chew the cud or have split hooves?

Do you not mix fabric?

Do you keep all 7 feasts?

Thiose are commands from the Father so do you keepo them or have found your own dance to by pass them but yet tell others they need to kepp the fathers commands?

nolidad said:

So do you not eat shellfish and animals that do not chew the cud or have split hooves?

Do you not mix fabric?

Do you keep all 7 feasts?

Thiose are commands from the Father so do you keepo them or have found your own dance to by pass them but yet tell others they need to kepp the fathers commands?

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Proverbs 3
1 My son, do not forget my law. But let your heart keep my commands.

5 Trust in the Lord with all your hear. Lean not on your own understanding.

imge said:

Proverbs 3
1 My son, do not forget my law. But let your heart keep my commands.
5 Trust in the Lord with all your hear. Lean not on your own understanding.

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Hi
Can you explain in simple English what the SDA church defines as the correct way to keep the sabbath and obey the 4th commandment please list all relevant scriptures