Family/Friends who know the Gospel but don't believe it?

Jamdoc · Dec 21, 2020

What do you do about those family and friends. They have an academic understanding of what the Gospel is but what the bible says is simply not enough for them. Personal testimonies are not enough for them.
My sister understands the gospel, she just doesn't believe it. She's looking for some life changing personal experience that would actually make her believe. She's not opposed to Christianity or the gospel, but she just doesn't know what she actually believes.
I pray for her, because it's pretty apparent that God actually has to give her faith, because simply teaching her doesn't do it. She's been taught by many people for decades, including myself and her mother in law, but it just doesn't catch her.
My mother... well she's not HOSTILE to Christianity in that she knows I believe it and is fine with that. But she thinks it's just a guidelines for moral living, and "I don't need Jesus to be a good person" I have tried to explain that's not how it works that there ARE no "good persons" and that she needs a savior...
but between catholic teaching from a lot of my family in older generations (no offense to those who are Catholic but actually put their faith in Jesus Christ) for works based salvation and her disliking many prominent false teachers in the world like your Kenneth Copelands and Benny Hinns of the world.. it's like a wall gets put between what she takes in from teaching and her mind. She's blocked it off. She also doesn't like when pastors get passionate in their preaching and say things about being "blood bought" and "covered in the blood of Jesus" or talking about the power of the holy spirit, etc. She agrees with the moral teaching, she believes Jesus was a real person and a good teacher about how to live life morally.. but the most essential parts of the gospel she just refuses. She's stuck on it being her works and she's been led into new age and eastern mysticism and pantheism and universalism by my father when she was younger.. she combines that with the works based salvation of Catholicism to form her core beliefs. It's scary because I believe that is ultimately what the one world religion of the end times will be like, works salvation, combining eastern mysticism and catholicism, seeing Jesus as some sort of Enlightened Zen Buddhist teacher, with an abstract creator rather than a personal creator.
A very vivid dream I had weeks ago, basically set my sister's fate as uncertain and my mother as utterly rejecting Jesus.
So I don't really know what to do. my sister is looking for something that no human can give her, and my mother just rejects it and I'm afraid is on the path to believing the strong delusion (the age of aquarius).
all I can do is pray.
but so far that prayer has been unanswered.

disciple Clint · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
What do you do about those family and friends. They have an academic understanding of what the Gospel is but what the bible says is simply not enough for them. Personal testimonies are not enough for them.
My sister understands the gospel, she just doesn't believe it. She's looking for some life changing personal experience that would actually make her believe. She's not opposed to Christianity or the gospel, but she just doesn't know what she actually believes.
I pray for her, because it's pretty apparent that God actually has to give her faith, because simply teaching her doesn't do it. She's been taught by many people for decades, including myself and her mother in law, but it just doesn't catch her.
My mother... well she's not HOSTILE to Christianity in that she knows I believe it and is fine with that. But she thinks it's just a guidelines for moral living, and "I don't need Jesus to be a good person" I have tried to explain that's not how it works that there ARE no "good persons" and that she needs a savior...
but between catholic teaching from a lot of my family in older generations (no offense to those who are Catholic but actually put their faith in Jesus Christ) for works based salvation and her disliking many prominent false teachers in the world like your Kenneth Copelands and Benny Hinns of the world.. it's like a wall gets put between what she takes in from teaching and her mind. She's blocked it off. She also doesn't like when pastors get passionate in their preaching and say things about being "blood bought" and "covered in the blood of Jesus" or talking about the power of the holy spirit, etc. She agrees with the moral teaching, she believes Jesus was a real person and a good teacher about how to live life morally.. but the most essential parts of the gospel she just refuses. She's stuck on it being her works and she's been led into new age and eastern mysticism and pantheism and universalism by my father when she was younger.. she combines that with the works based salvation of Catholicism to form her core beliefs. It's scary because I believe that is ultimately what the one world religion of the end times will be like, works salvation, combining eastern mysticism and catholicism, seeing Jesus as some sort of Enlightened Zen Buddhist teacher, with an abstract creator rather than a personal creator.
A very vivid dream I had weeks ago, basically set my sister's fate as uncertain and my mother as utterly rejecting Jesus.
So I don't really know what to do. my sister is looking for something that no human can give her, and my mother just rejects it and I'm afraid is on the path to believing the strong delusion (the age of aquarius).
all I can do is pray.
but so far that prayer has been unanswered.

It is up to the Holy Spirit to call on her, you have done what you can do.

Jamdoc · Dec 21, 2020

disciple Clint said:
It is up to the Holy Spirit to call on her, you have done what you can do.

It's rather agonizing, I feel like I'm gonna be an orphan in heaven, no reunions for me.

seeking.IAM · Dec 21, 2020

Just love them. Be family. Let them work out their own path with God. Or not.

disciple Clint · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
It's rather agonizing, I feel like I'm gonna be an orphan in heaven, no reunions for me.

There are things in life as you know that cannot be rushed. When she is ready the Holy Spirit will move within her. Mean while be a friend and an example of Christian life.

Arc F1 · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
It's rather agonizing, I feel like I'm gonna be an orphan in heaven, no reunions for me.

It's definitely tough to deal with. We had our before Christmas family dinner yesterday and my atheist little brother was relentless in his bashing religion. I had to listen to hours of what an ignorant fool I am to believe. Same thing every year.

Jamdoc · Dec 21, 2020

Arc F1 said:
It's definitely tough to deal with. We had our before Christmas family dinner yesterday and my atheist little brother was relentless in his bashing religion. I had to listen to hours of what an ignorant fool I am to believe. Same thing every year.

Well, I can be thankful it's not to that degree. I think people like Kenneth Copeland and Benny Hinn really hinder the gospel because people see that as the "face" of Christianity and judge it by their works, it's sad. Those wolves in sheep's clothing.

UnpopularOpinion · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
What do you do about those family and friends. They have an academic understanding of what the Gospel is but what the bible says is simply not enough for them. Personal testimonies are not enough for them.
My sister understands the gospel, she just doesn't believe it. She's looking for some life changing personal experience that would actually make her believe. She's not opposed to Christianity or the gospel, but she just doesn't know what she actually believes.
I pray for her, because it's pretty apparent that God actually has to give her faith, because simply teaching her doesn't do it. She's been taught by many people for decades, including myself and her mother in law, but it just doesn't catch her.
My mother... well she's not HOSTILE to Christianity in that she knows I believe it and is fine with that. But she thinks it's just a guidelines for moral living, and "I don't need Jesus to be a good person" I have tried to explain that's not how it works that there ARE no "good persons" and that she needs a savior...
but between catholic teaching from a lot of my family in older generations (no offense to those who are Catholic but actually put their faith in Jesus Christ) for works based salvation and her disliking many prominent false teachers in the world like your Kenneth Copelands and Benny Hinns of the world.. it's like a wall gets put between what she takes in from teaching and her mind. She's blocked it off. She also doesn't like when pastors get passionate in their preaching and say things about being "blood bought" and "covered in the blood of Jesus" or talking about the power of the holy spirit, etc. She agrees with the moral teaching, she believes Jesus was a real person and a good teacher about how to live life morally.. but the most essential parts of the gospel she just refuses. She's stuck on it being her works and she's been led into new age and eastern mysticism and pantheism and universalism by my father when she was younger.. she combines that with the works based salvation of Catholicism to form her core beliefs. It's scary because I believe that is ultimately what the one world religion of the end times will be like, works salvation, combining eastern mysticism and catholicism, seeing Jesus as some sort of Enlightened Zen Buddhist teacher, with an abstract creator rather than a personal creator.
A very vivid dream I had weeks ago, basically set my sister's fate as uncertain and my mother as utterly rejecting Jesus.
So I don't really know what to do. my sister is looking for something that no human can give her, and my mother just rejects it and I'm afraid is on the path to believing the strong delusion (the age of aquarius).
all I can do is pray.
but so far that prayer has been unanswered.

Majority of people are / will be not saved , because it's your mother or sister it's hard pill for you to swallow. Some people are such stubborn that they need something horrible to happen to them before they start even questioning thier afterlife ( like cancer ect ).

disciple Clint · Dec 21, 2020

Arc F1 said:
It's definitely tough to deal with. We had our before Christmas family dinner yesterday and my atheist little brother was relentless in his bashing religion. I had to listen to hours of what an ignorant fool I am to believe. Same thing every year.

Well next year or before you see him next do your homework, go to this site and then ask him a few question, when you introduce him to science that supports the existence of God he may be the one at a loss for words. Does God exist? - Credible Catholic

Arc F1 · Dec 21, 2020

disciple Clint said:
Well next year or before you see him next do your homework, go to this site and then ask him a few question, when you introduce him to science that supports the existence of God he may be the one at a loss for words. Does God exist? - Credible Catholic

I've tried. Any attempt just makes him angry and disrupts the whole get together every year. My mother isn't long for this world and I wasn't about to start another argument. She wasn't even able to get out of bed yesterday. Cancer.

seeking.IAM · Dec 21, 2020

Your attempt to prove your faith likely annoys him to the same degree as his attempt to disprove it annoys you. That is something to think about. Family relations might be better if you could talk about something else.

DiscipleHeLovesToo · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
What do you do about those family and friends. They have an academic understanding of what the Gospel is but what the bible says is simply not enough for them. Personal testimonies are not enough for them.
My sister understands the gospel, she just doesn't believe it. She's looking for some life changing personal experience that would actually make her believe. She's not opposed to Christianity or the gospel, but she just doesn't know what she actually believes.
I pray for her, because it's pretty apparent that God actually has to give her faith, because simply teaching her doesn't do it. She's been taught by many people for decades, including myself and her mother in law, but it just doesn't catch her.
My mother... well she's not HOSTILE to Christianity in that she knows I believe it and is fine with that. But she thinks it's just a guidelines for moral living, and "I don't need Jesus to be a good person" I have tried to explain that's not how it works that there ARE no "good persons" and that she needs a savior...
but between catholic teaching from a lot of my family in older generations (no offense to those who are Catholic but actually put their faith in Jesus Christ) for works based salvation and her disliking many prominent false teachers in the world like your Kenneth Copelands and Benny Hinns of the world.. it's like a wall gets put between what she takes in from teaching and her mind. She's blocked it off. She also doesn't like when pastors get passionate in their preaching and say things about being "blood bought" and "covered in the blood of Jesus" or talking about the power of the holy spirit, etc. She agrees with the moral teaching, she believes Jesus was a real person and a good teacher about how to live life morally.. but the most essential parts of the gospel she just refuses. She's stuck on it being her works and she's been led into new age and eastern mysticism and pantheism and universalism by my father when she was younger.. she combines that with the works based salvation of Catholicism to form her core beliefs. It's scary because I believe that is ultimately what the one world religion of the end times will be like, works salvation, combining eastern mysticism and catholicism, seeing Jesus as some sort of Enlightened Zen Buddhist teacher, with an abstract creator rather than a personal creator.
A very vivid dream I had weeks ago, basically set my sister's fate as uncertain and my mother as utterly rejecting Jesus.
So I don't really know what to do. my sister is looking for something that no human can give her, and my mother just rejects it and I'm afraid is on the path to believing the strong delusion (the age of aquarius).
all I can do is pray.
but so far that prayer has been unanswered.

God is fully motivated to bring your family members into His kingdom, and loves them more than you do - so make your prayers to Him (about them) prayers of faith (thanking Him that he's not the holdup and that He's doing all He can to draw them to Him while not overriding their free will).

what do you believe the gospel is? how do you describe it to them?

DiscipleHeLovesToo · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
Well, I can be thankful it's not to that degree. I think people like Kenneth Copeland and Benny Hinn really hinder the gospel because people see that as the "face" of Christianity and judge it by their works, it's sad. Those wolves in sheep's clothing.

(Rom 2:1) Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.

be smart, and do not judge and criticize others who profess to be Christians - if you want mercy for your faults, sow mercy for others' faults - if you want judgment for others, sow that; but if you do, you will bring judgement on yourself as well.

if you're making these kind of judgmental statements around your family, they likely see little difference between those Christians you judge and criticize and you; and you may well be negating your testimony - if they are blinded to the mercy of God, they may see you (as a Christian) in the same light as you reflect in your last two sentences above...

Jamdoc · Dec 21, 2020

DiscipleHeLovesToo said:
(Rom 2:1) Therefore thou art inexcusable, O man, whosoever thou art that judgest: for wherein thou judgest another, thou condemnest thyself; for thou that judgest doest the same things.

be smart, and do not judge and criticize others who profess to be Christians - if you want mercy for your faults, sow mercy for others' faults - if you want judgment for others, sow that; but if you do, you will bring judgement on yourself as well.

if you're making these kind of judgmental statements around your family, they likely see little difference between those Christians you judge and criticize and you; and you may well be negating your testimony - if they are blinded to the mercy of God, they may see you (as a Christian) in the same light as you reflect in your last two sentences above...

Galatians 1

6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.
9 As we said before, so say I now again, if any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

The prosperity gospel is one such gospel that is not the gospel of Jesus Christ.

DiscipleHeLovesToo · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
Galatians 1

The prosperity gospel is one such gospel that is not the gospel of Jesus Christ.

when your lost family members hear you say that, do you think it makes them want to hear more about your God? or do they hear 'his god wants us to be poor'?

(Mar 10:28) Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
(Mar 10:29) And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
(Mar 10:30) But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

how do you understand what Jesus said here? is this the 'prosperity gospel' you're referring to?

Jamdoc · Dec 21, 2020

DiscipleHeLovesToo said:
when your lost family members hear you say that, do you think it makes them want to hear more about your God? or do they hear 'his god wants us to be poor'?

(Mar 10:28) Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
(Mar 10:29) And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
(Mar 10:30) But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

how do you understand what Jesus said here? is this the 'prosperity gospel' you're referring to?

No.
it might be the gospel they try to claim.
But the rewards Jesus was talking about were in heaven, not Earth.
The Gospel is about establishing a relationship with your creator through His son who died to take your punishment for your sins and credit His righteousness to you. It's about eternity, not earth, and it's about Jesus, not us.

Proverbs 30

7 Two things have I required of thee; deny me them not before I die:
8 Remove far from me vanity and lies: give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with food convenient for me:
9 Lest I be full, and deny thee, and say, Who is the Lord? or lest I be poor, and steal, and take the name of my God in vain.

DiscipleHeLovesToo · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
No.
it might be the gospel they try to claim.
But the rewards Jesus was talking about were in heaven, not Earth.
The Gospel is about establishing a relationship with your creator through His son who died to take your punishment for your sins and credit His righteousness to you. It's about eternity, not earth, and it's about Jesus, not us.

Proverbs 30

in Mark 10:30, Jesus said "now in this time" - how do you understand that this means 'in heaven, not Earth'?

can you provide scriptures to support your last sentence?

the reason i'm asking is because the Gospel is GOOD news; and if you want to sway your family members to receive salvation, you need to share it in a way that SOUNDS like good news to them; and it needs to be based on what GOD has said - you are the second witness to His Words to them.

here's a good scripture to share with them about the gospel that Jesus was anointed to preach:

(Luk 4:18) The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
(Luk 4:19) To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

(Pro 30:1) The words of Agur the son of Jakeh, even the prophecy: the man spake unto Ithiel, even unto Ithiel and Ucal,
(Pro 30:2) Surely I am more brutish than any man, and have not the understanding of a man.
(Pro 30:3) I neither learned wisdom, nor have the knowledge of the holy.
(Pro 30:4) Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?
(Pro 30:5) Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.
(Pro 30:6) Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
(Pro 30:7) Two things have I required of thee; deny me them not before I die:
(Pro 30:8) Remove far from me vanity and lies: give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with food convenient for me:
(Pro 30:9) Lest I be full, and deny thee, and say, Who is the LORD? or lest I be poor, and steal, and take the name of my God in vain.

who is speaking, and who is being spoken to in Proverbs 30:8 and 9? Is God telling everyone to be neither rich nor poor?

BNR32FAN · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
What do you do about those family and friends. They have an academic understanding of what the Gospel is but what the bible says is simply not enough for them. Personal testimonies are not enough for them.
My sister understands the gospel, she just doesn't believe it. She's looking for some life changing personal experience that would actually make her believe. She's not opposed to Christianity or the gospel, but she just doesn't know what she actually believes.
I pray for her, because it's pretty apparent that God actually has to give her faith, because simply teaching her doesn't do it. She's been taught by many people for decades, including myself and her mother in law, but it just doesn't catch her.
My mother... well she's not HOSTILE to Christianity in that she knows I believe it and is fine with that. But she thinks it's just a guidelines for moral living, and "I don't need Jesus to be a good person" I have tried to explain that's not how it works that there ARE no "good persons" and that she needs a savior...
but between catholic teaching from a lot of my family in older generations (no offense to those who are Catholic but actually put their faith in Jesus Christ) for works based salvation and her disliking many prominent false teachers in the world like your Kenneth Copelands and Benny Hinns of the world.. it's like a wall gets put between what she takes in from teaching and her mind. She's blocked it off. She also doesn't like when pastors get passionate in their preaching and say things about being "blood bought" and "covered in the blood of Jesus" or talking about the power of the holy spirit, etc. She agrees with the moral teaching, she believes Jesus was a real person and a good teacher about how to live life morally.. but the most essential parts of the gospel she just refuses. She's stuck on it being her works and she's been led into new age and eastern mysticism and pantheism and universalism by my father when she was younger.. she combines that with the works based salvation of Catholicism to form her core beliefs. It's scary because I believe that is ultimately what the one world religion of the end times will be like, works salvation, combining eastern mysticism and catholicism, seeing Jesus as some sort of Enlightened Zen Buddhist teacher, with an abstract creator rather than a personal creator.
A very vivid dream I had weeks ago, basically set my sister's fate as uncertain and my mother as utterly rejecting Jesus.
So I don't really know what to do. my sister is looking for something that no human can give her, and my mother just rejects it and I'm afraid is on the path to believing the strong delusion (the age of aquarius).
all I can do is pray.
but so far that prayer has been unanswered.

Im in a similar situation with my sister and brother in law. They’ve both heard the gospel and refuse to accept it. In their case it’s because they don’t want to submit to God’s will. They want to live their life their way without any interference from God or anyone else. I’ve tried to talk to them but it ended up with my brother in law starting to shout because he was getting frustrated because I was answering all his questions as he tried to refute God’s existence and began asking the whole “if God is real them why would He do this and that” questions. As soon as I saw he was getting angry I just stopped. You know sometimes you just have to plant some seeds and give them time to grow. I’m a firm believer that if we try to push someone too hard towards Christ we can end up pushing them farther away from Him by provoke a defensive position against Him. So I know how you feel but I will say that my father was similar. He wasn’t atheist but he was definitely stubborn but he came to Christ at the age of 75 just two years before he died so there’s always hope.

Hazelelponi · Dec 21, 2020

Jamdoc said:
It's rather agonizing, I feel like I'm gonna be an orphan in heaven, no reunions for me.

You'll be with God... what can be better than that?

Don't get too caught up in trying to save your family, just be there with answers when it's warranted, and pray for those you love.

That's what I do... I try not to be annoying with it, that makes people distrustful... But I am quick with Biblical answers when topics come up..

Jamdoc · Dec 21, 2020

DiscipleHeLovesToo said:
in Mark 10:30, Jesus said "now in this time" - how do you understand that this means 'in heaven, not Earth'?

can you provide scriptures to support your last sentence?

the reason i'm asking is because the Gospel is GOOD news; and if you want to sway your family members to receive salvation, you need to share it in a way that SOUNDS like good news to them; and it needs to be based on what GOD has said - you are the second witness to His Words to them.

here's a good scripture to share with them about the gospel that Jesus was anointed to preach:

(Luk 4:18) The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
(Luk 4:19) To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.

(Pro 30:1) The words of Agur the son of Jakeh, even the prophecy: the man spake unto Ithiel, even unto Ithiel and Ucal,
(Pro 30:2) Surely I am more brutish than any man, and have not the understanding of a man.
(Pro 30:3) I neither learned wisdom, nor have the knowledge of the holy.
(Pro 30:4) Who hath ascended up into heaven, or descended? who hath gathered the wind in his fists? who hath bound the waters in a garment? who hath established all the ends of the earth? what is his name, and what is his son's name, if thou canst tell?
(Pro 30:5) Every word of God is pure: he is a shield unto them that put their trust in him.
(Pro 30:6) Add thou not unto his words, lest he reprove thee, and thou be found a liar.
(Pro 30:7) Two things have I required of thee; deny me them not before I die:
(Pro 30:8) Remove far from me vanity and lies: give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with food convenient for me:
(Pro 30:9) Lest I be full, and deny thee, and say, Who is the LORD? or lest I be poor, and steal, and take the name of my God in vain.

who is speaking, and who is being spoken to in Proverbs 30:8 and 9? Is God telling everyone to be neither rich nor poor?

Matthew 6, basically the whole chapter is about not doing things for earthly rewards but rewards in heaven.
If you're doing things to get rewarded by men on earth, you've received your reward (which may just be praise and admiration/esteem from others) and aren't rewarded in heaven.

Family/Friends who know the Gospel but don't believe it?

Watching and Praying Always

Well-Known Member

Watching and Praying Always

Episcopalian

Well-Known Member

Let the righteous man arise from slumber

Watching and Praying Always

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Let the righteous man arise from slumber

Episcopalian

Regular Member

Regular Member

Watching and Praying Always

Regular Member

Watching and Praying Always

Regular Member

He’s a Way of life

:sighing:

Watching and Praying Always

Similar threads