70 weeks

mkgal1 said:

Demonstrate for us how you "parse out teh Hebrew" for it to mean for "Daniel's people to stop sinning ".

Click to expand...

Go to Blue letter Bible and type in the verse.

Then for more Go to Bible Hub, type in Hebrew, and then the verse and you can see for yourself. These are the online tools that are excellent as far as they go!

But so you may learn a little here:

תָּמַם
Transliteration
tamam
Pronunciation
tä·mam' consume (26x), end (9x), finished (4x), clean (3x), upright (3x), spent (3x), perfect (2x), done (2x), failed (2x), accomplish (2x), miscellaneous (8x).

1. (Qal)
   
   1. to be finished, be completed
      
      1. completely, wholly, entirely (as auxiliary with verb)
         
   2. to be finished, come to an end, cease
      
      
   3. to be complete (of number)
      
      
   4. to be consumed, be exhausted, be spent
      
      
   5. to be finished, be consumed, be destroyed
      
      
   6. to be complete, be sound, be unimpaired, be upright (ethically)
      
      
   7. to complete, finish
      
      
   8. to be completely crossed over
      
2. (Niphal) to be consumed
   
   
3. (Hiphil)
   
   1. to finish, complete, perfect
      
      
   2. to finish, cease doing, leave off doing
      
      
   3. to complete, sum up, make whole
      
      
   4. to destroy (uncleanness)
      
      
   5. to make sound
      
4. (Hithpael) to deal in integrity, act uprightly
   

And to make an end is a conj. with the verb in the hithpael infinitve perfect and it means to finish doing!

mkgal1 said:

No, it's not a redefinition.

Quoting Adam Maarschalk:
In Revelation 11:1-2 John was told about a 3.5 year period of tragedy that was about to come upon them:

“Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the angel stood, saying, ‘Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar, and those who worship there. But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles, and they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months.’”​

The Greek word used here for “Gentiles” is “ethnos,” the counterpart of the Hebrew word “goy” in the Old Testament. In the past, I simply assumed that this must be a reference to the Romans who helped destroy Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD. I marked out 3.5 years from the time that Nero dispatched Vespasian as his war general (early 67 AD) until Vespasian’s son, Titus, oversaw the burning of the temple in August 70 AD.

However, the Romans did not trample the city of Jerusalem for 42 months. They only trampled Jerusalem during the 5-month siege of Titus in 70 AD.

In what sense were they “Gentiles,” though? Consider what [1] The Universal Jewish Encyclopedia and [2] The Jewish Encyclopedia say about the use of the word “goy” in Scripture:

1. “The Hebrew word goy (plural goyim) means ‘nation.’ In Biblical usage it is applied also to Israel: ‘Ye shall be unto Me a kingdom of priests, and a holy nation’ (goy kadosh; Ex. 19:6).”

Source: “Gentiles,” The Universal Jewish Encyclopedia (New York, NY: The Universal Jewish Encyclopedia, Inc., 1941); Volume 4, p. 533.

1. “In the Hebrew of the Bible ‘goi’ and its plural ‘goyyim’ originally meant ‘nation,’ and were applied both to Israelites and to non-Israelites (Gen. xii. 2, xvii. 20; Ex. xiii. 3, xxxii. 10; Deut. iv. 7; viii. 9, 14; Num. xiv. 12; Isa. i. 4, ix. 22; Jer. vii. 28).”

Source: “Gentile,” The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York, NY: Funk and Wagnalls Company, 1905); Volume 5, p. 615.

"The Gentiles Trampled Jerusalem for 42 Months (Revelation 11:1-2) | Pursuing Truth" The Gentiles Trampled Jerusalem for 42 Months (Revelation 11:1-2)

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and what you fail to have learned in all this searching is that goy or goyim is anyone who is not a Jew.

In teh Jewish mindset and Gods mindset there have always only been two ethnos. Jew and Gentile. Now Gentiles have been subdivided by nations (starting at Babel) But throughout the entire New TEstament if one is not Jewish they are Gentile! or ethnos.

Spiritual Jew said:

Will their offspring not be Israelites? How can the prophecy already be fulfilled in the way you understand it (literally no more sinning) if there will still be Israelites sinning after the time you say it will be fulfilled?

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Well maybe they won't sin. I just know what teh Covenant says and that what God will accomplish "after those days" in Jeremiah 312 and that the prophecy of Daniel involves just the 70 weeks. I will not speculate what happens to the Israelites born in the Millenial kingdom after the 70 weeks. I can make guesses, but how right or wrong I would be I just don't know.

nolidad said:

Well maybe they won't sin. I just know what teh Covenant says and that what God will accomplish "after those days" in Jeremiah 312 and that the prophecy of Daniel involves just the 70 weeks. I will not speculate what happens to the Israelites born in the Millenial kingdom after the 70 weeks. I can make guesses, but how right or wrong I would be I just don't know.

Click to expand...

My point is that if you're going to take the "making an end of sins" literally then it doesn't make sense to see its fulfillment before no Israelite sins anymore, including the offspring you mentioned. Your solution to that is to say that "maybe they won't sin". I don't find that argument to be very convincing.

nolidad said:

and what you fail to have learned in all this searching is that goy or goyim is anyone who is not a Jew.

Click to expand...

Perhaps you missed this part of my post:

1. “In the Hebrew of the Bible ‘goi’ and its plural ‘goyyim’ originally meant ‘nation,’ and were applied both to Israelites and to non-Israelites (Gen. xii. 2, xvii. 20; Ex. xiii. 3, xxxii. 10; Deut. iv. 7; viii. 9, 14; Num. xiv. 12; Isa. i. 4, ix. 22; Jer. vii. 28).”

Source: “Gentile,” The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York, NY: Funk and Wagnalls Company, 1905); Volume 5, p. 615.

nolidad said:

And we are not arguing genealogies, but a specific promise God made with specific commitments on His part and your allegation that that copvenant has already been fulfilled.

YOu did dance poorly oin this reply. I give you just a 3 for effort.

End this conversation by simply showing that God fulfilled this promise we call teh New Covenant and stop your silly dance around this question (28th request now)

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


When did god :
1. Write His laws in teh hearts of the house of Israel and Judah.
2. Become their God and they became His people
3. That all Israelis know th eLord from teh least to teh greatest!

God said He SHALL do these things. YOu say He has already did it because the covenant is fulfilled, so when did these things come to pass.????????????????????????????????????????????

Click to expand...

Jer_31:31 "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—

Mat_26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Mar_14:24 And He said to them, "This is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many.

Luk_22:20 Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.

1Co_11:25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me."

2Co_3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Heb_8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says: "BEHOLD, THE DAYS ARE COMING, SAYS THE LORD, WHEN I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AND WITH THE HOUSE OF JUDAH—
(Quoted from Jeremiah 31:31)

Heb_8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Heb_9:15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

Heb_12:24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.


David H.J. Gay on the fulfillment of the New Covenant:
(3) New-Covenant Theology Made Simple 'It is finished' - YouTube


.

Spiritual Jew said:

My point is that if you're going to take the "making an end of sins" literally then it doesn't make sense to see its fulfillment before no Israelite sins anymore, including the offspring you mentioned. Your solution to that is to say that "maybe they won't sin". I don't find that argument to be very convincing.

Click to expand...

Well God doesn't write things to insure they make sense to our puny brains! Nor does He seek our counsel or approval!

I cannot tell you what it means as pertaining to the Millennial Kingdom, just until Jesus returns. whether or not the offspring of Israelis born in the Millenial kingdom sin or not, Can't say for sure. It could be implied in the making an end of sins in the Daniel prophecy, but I try to avoid making doctrine from things just implied.

BABerean2 said:

Jer_31:31 "Behold, the days are coming, says the LORD, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—

Mat_26:28 For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Mar_14:24 And He said to them, "This is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many.

Luk_22:20 Likewise He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.

1Co_11:25 In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me."

2Co_3:6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Heb_8:8 Because finding fault with them, He says: "BEHOLD, THE DAYS ARE COMING, SAYS THE LORD, WHEN I WILL MAKE A NEW COVENANT WITH THE HOUSE OF ISRAEL AND WITH THE HOUSE OF JUDAH—
(Quoted from Jeremiah 31:31)

Heb_8:13 In that He says, "A NEW COVENANT," He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Heb_9:15 And for this reason He is the Mediator of the new covenant, by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions under the first covenant, that those who are called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance.

Heb_12:24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel.


David H.J. Gay on the fulfillment of the New Covenant:
(3) New-Covenant Theology Made Simple 'It is finished' - YouTube


.

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and I agree with each and every one of those verses! But point out teh verse that says teh New covenant is fulfilled and complete?

Are you saying that every Jew from now on is automatically saved because they are of the house of Israel or House of Judah? After all that is what teh New Covenant of God says!

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


You did a more complicated dance this time so I will give you a 6 for effort. But for the 29th time, please show me in any of the verses you have voluminously posted where and when the New covenant as God decreed and not a mans reinterpretation

Will you dance again or just answer the question?

mkgal1 said:

Perhaps you missed this part of my post:

1. “In the Hebrew of the Bible ‘goi’ and its plural ‘goyyim’ originally meant ‘nation,’ and were applied both to Israelites and to non-Israelites (Gen. xii. 2, xvii. 20; Ex. xiii. 3, xxxii. 10; Deut. iv. 7; viii. 9, 14; Num. xiv. 12; Isa. i. 4, ix. 22; Jer. vii. 28).”

Source: “Gentile,” The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York, NY: Funk and Wagnalls Company, 1905); Volume 5, p. 615.

Click to expand...

True goi means nation specifically. but when used in like numbers 14- it refers to the Israeli nation. when it refers to the rest of teh world it meant the gentiles.

nolidad said:

and I agree with each and every one of those verses! But point out teh verse that says teh New covenant is fulfilled and complete?

Are you saying that every Jew from now on is automatically saved because they are of the house of Israel or House of Judah? After all that is what teh New Covenant of God says!

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.


You did a more complicated dance this time so I will give you a 6 for effort. But for the 29th time, please show me in any of the verses you have voluminously posted where and when the New covenant as God decreed and not a mans reinterpretation

Will you dance again or just answer the question?

Click to expand...

Quoting from your dispenbible:

Matthew 26
28 for this is my unfulfilling blood of the unfulfilled new covenant, that for many is being poured out -- to no remission of sins;

So Christ extended the unfulfilling blood of an unfulfilled new covenant to His disciples.

Blood with no power to remit sins.

Speaking of dancing...

nolidad said:

True goi means nation specifically. but when used in like numbers 14- it refers to the Israeli nation. when it refers to the rest of teh world it meant the gentiles.

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But.....as you quoted from my post.....it was used to describe Israelites and non-Israelites in these verses (like you seem to be agreeing with - although the ancient biblical Israelites weren't identified by where they lived, but who they belonged to...i.e. God):
(Gen. xii. 2, xvii. 20; Ex. xiii. 3, xxxii. 10; Deut. iv. 7; viii. 9, 14; Num. xiv. 12; Isa. i. 4, ix. 22; Jer. vii. 28).”

~ Source: “Gentile,” The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York, NY: Funk and Wagnalls Company, 1905); Volume 5, p. 615.

nolidad said:

Go to Blue letter Bible and type in the verse.

Then for more Go to Bible Hub, type in Hebrew, and then the verse and you can see for yourself. These are the online tools that are excellent as far as they go!

But so you may learn a little here:

תָּמַם
Transliteration
tamam
Pronunciation
tä·mam' consume (26x), end (9x), finished (4x), clean (3x), upright (3x), spent (3x), perfect (2x), done (2x), failed (2x), accomplish (2x), miscellaneous (8x).

1. (Qal)
   1. to be finished, be completed
      1. completely, wholly, entirely (as auxiliary with verb)
   2. to be finished, come to an end, cease
      
      
   3. to be complete (of number)
      
      
   4. to be consumed, be exhausted, be spent
      
      
   5. to be finished, be consumed, be destroyed
      
      
   6. to be complete, be sound, be unimpaired, be upright (ethically)
      
      
   7. to complete, finish
      
      
   8. to be completely crossed over
2. (Niphal) to be consumed
   
   
3. (Hiphil)
   1. to finish, complete, perfect
      
      
   2. to finish, cease doing, leave off doing
      
      
   3. to complete, sum up, make whole
      
      
   4. to destroy (uncleanness)
      
      
   5. to make sound
4. (Hithpael) to deal in integrity, act uprightly

And to make an end is a conj. with the verb in the hithpael infinitve perfect and it means to finish doing!

Click to expand...

The trouble with exclusively relying on word for word translation to interpret Scripture is that is misses the specific language of the Bible.

I know you're not a fan of these videos (you've called them "silly little videos" in the past) but, in my opinion, they do an excellent job of parsing out the story of Daniel's prophecy well - in a way that word-for-word definitions don't address.

nolidad said:

Are you saying that every Jew from now on is automatically saved because they are of the house of Israel or House of Judah? After all that is what teh New Covenant of God says!

Click to expand...

Your definition of the New Covenant assumes people are saved because of their bloodline, by ignoring Romans 2:28-29, Romans 9:8, and Romans 9:27, and Romans 11:1-5.

Therefore, your definition of the New Covenant's fulfillment can never agree with the Bible.

Based on Hebrews 9:15, the New Covenant was fulfilled at Calvary through the death of Christ.
Do you expect Christ to die again?
Do you believe Christ did not tell the truth in John 19:30?


If you die are you going to tell Christ He did not fulfill the New Covenant, because some Jews have rejected Him.

.

mkgal1 said:

I'm sorry you don't recognize what a revolutionary change Jesus made at His first advent. To say that nothing has changed since Adam is to completely disregard the Cross, His resurrection, and ascension.

1 Corinthians 15:45
So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being;” the last Adam a life-giving spirit.​

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I am talking about the reality of sin, not the solution. What are you taking about? If sin was eradicated, there would be no sin period.

jeffweedaman said:

To put an end to sin , iniquity and transgression .., means that satan no longer has any power over those who do such things..., which is all of us.
Jesus has in his possession the keys of death thanks to his cross.
So those who believe, know that their sins and its consequences have indeed come to an end.
So as far as I am concerned I gratefully acknowledge that sin has come to an end and Jesus everlasting righteousness will forever shine upon me.
Amazing Grace how sweet the sound.

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Isn't Jesus wonderful? Now here is the heart of all this, which affects us personally: By fulfilling the ‘times’ Jesus of Nazareth is revealed as the Anointed One who completed the atonement, purchasing eternal redemption for all who believe.

• He finished the transgression.
• He made an end of sins.
• He made reconciliation for iniquity.
• He brought in everlasting righteousness.
• He sealed up the prophecy.
• And anointed the most Holy.

"Behold, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!" There remains but one
thing that we can do, and that is to make him our God.

mkgal1 said:

But.....as you quoted from my post.....it was used to describe Israelites and non-Israelites in these verses (like you seem to be agreeing with - although the ancient biblical Israelites weren't identified by where they lived, but who they belonged to...i.e. God):
(Gen. xii. 2, xvii. 20; Ex. xiii. 3, xxxii. 10; Deut. iv. 7; viii. 9, 14; Num. xiv. 12; Isa. i. 4, ix. 22; Jer. vii. 28).”

~ Source: “Gentile,” The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York, NY: Funk and Wagnalls Company, 1905); Volume 5, p. 615.

Something interesting from Adam Maarschalk's article:
Galilee
Galilee was home to many Jews, but it was also associated with “the Gentiles.” When Jesus departed to Galilee after John the Baptist was put in prison, Matthew said that this prophecy from Isaiah was fulfilled:

“The land of Zebulun and the land of Naphtali, the way of the sea, beyond the Jordan, Galilee of the Gentiles: The people who sat in darkness saw a great light, and upon those who sat in the region and shadow of death Light has dawned” (Matthew 4:15-16).
​

The three main Zealot leaders (Eleazar ben Simon, John Levi, and Simon Bar Giora) who orchestrated so much bloodshed in Jerusalem were not from Judea. John was from Gischala (Galilee) and Simon was from Gerasa (Wars 4.9.3), which at the time was one of the cities of the Roman Decapolis and today is in Jordan. By the time that Simon “got possession of Jerusalem” in April 69 AD (Wars 4.9.12), he had an army of more than 40,000 people, including Idumeans, who he had gathered from the countryside.

Eleazar took possession of Jerusalem even earlier, in late 66 AD. According to Wikipedia, he was likely from Galilee
The Gentiles Trampled Jerusalem for 42 Months (Revelation 11:1-2)​

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Being Jewish does not mean you had to live in Judah! There were Jews or Israelis scatterd throughout the middle east! Babylon had a large group as well as Persia, modern iraq, Lebanon, Syria etc. These three were not gentiles but Jews even if they lived in a gentile land!

Gentile, person who is not Jewish. ... The word stems from the Hebrew term goy, which means a “nation,” and was applied both to the Hebrews and to any other nation. The plural, goyim, especially with the definite article, ha-goyim, “the nations,” meant nations of the world that were not Hebrew.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Ge...person who is not,world that were not Hebrew.
Gentile | History & Definition | Britannica

Technically, in the OT teh other nations that were not Israel were called by their name or collectively as "THE nations" or more commonly Gentile. In the OT ha goyim is translated gentiles 29X times

And the NT uses it exclusively of the nations (ethnos) when Israel is not referred to.

Go ask a Jew- anyone who is not a Jew is goyuim or in English a gentile!

mkgal1 said:

The trouble with exclusively relying on word for word translation to interpret Scripture is that is misses the specific language of the Bible.

I know you're not a fan of these videos (you've called them "silly little videos" in the past) but, in my opinion, they do an excellent job of parsing out the story of Daniel's prophecy well - in a way that word-for-word definitions don't address.

Click to expand...

YOu should use interpret instead of parsing then. To get Daniel 9 24-27 to match the timeline these folks offer, they have to re-interpret meanings of words- that is just blatant dishonesty.

For example I forget who but one has claimed that "make an end of sins actually means " end the problem or consequences of sins and it refers to Jesus death! That is a whole new meaning that does not match what was written.

the church has become so used to subtly rewriting Scripture that many don't even see the danger of doing it anymore!

I prefer the golden rule of biblical "interpretation".



RULES OF INTERPRETATION

Dr. David L. Cooper


*
PART THREE: RULES OF INTERPRETATION PROPER

"The knowledge of certain rules of interpretation and the observance of these rules when studying the Scriptures is very important and helpful in arriving at a clear understanding of God's Word."


RULE 3: THE GOLDEN RULE OF INTERPRETATION

III. The third rule of interpretation is as follows:



WHEN THE PLAIN SENSE OF SCRIPTURE MAKES COMMON SENSE, SEEK NO OTHER SENSE; THEREFORE, TAKE EVERY WORD AT ITS PRIMARY, ORDINARY, USUAL, LITERAL MEANING UNLESS THE FACTS OF THE IMMEDIATE CONTEXT, STUDIED IN THE LIGHT OF RELATED PASSAGES AND AXIOMATIC AND FUNDAMENTAL TRUTHS INDICATE CLEARLY OTHERWISE.


A. SEEK THE PLAIN, LITERAL MEANING OF THE SCRIPTURES

1. The sum and substance of this most important rule is that one should take every statement of the Scriptures at its face value, if possible.
2. The following is an analysis of the adjectives "primary," "ordinary," and "usual."
3. "Primary" emphasizes the original, inherent idea in the term.
4. "Ordinary" and "usual" are practically synonyms, especially in this definition, "usual" being employed for the sake of emphasis.
5. "Literal" is used to emphasize the thought that every word must first be taken literally as expressing the exact thought of the author at the time when it was used; and one is not to go beyond the literal meaning of the Scriptures unless the facts of the context indicate a deeper, hidden or symbolic meaning.

B. SEEK THE FIGURATIVE MEANING ONLY WHEN THE FACTS
DEMAND SUCH AN INTERPRETATION

1. Modernism and rationalism are the logical outgrowth of forcing a figurative meaning upon a passage that is clearly literal, or vice versa.

C. STUDY EVERY STATEMENT OF THE SCRIPTURES IN CONTEXT
("A TEXT APART FROM ITS CONTEXT IS A PRETEXT")

Then study the facts of the context in the light of related passages and axiomatic fundamental truths. No prophecy of scripture is of private (special) interpretation (II Peter 1:20); The sum of thy word is truth (Psalm 119:160).

these little to no room for personal bias, cultural whims, and the wiles of men.

BABerean2 said:

Your definition of the New Covenant assumes people are saved because of their bloodline, by ignoring Romans 2:28-29, Romans 9:8, and Romans 9:27, and Romans 11:1-5.

Therefore, your definition of the New Covenant's fulfillment can never agree with the Bible.

Based on Hebrews 9:15, the New Covenant was fulfilled at Calvary through the death of Christ.
Do you expect Christ to die again?
Do you believe Christ did not tell the truth in John 19:30?


If you die are you going to tell Christ He did not fulfill the New Covenant, because some Jews have rejected Him.

.

Click to expand...

All of this is irrelavent! If you can show there were "addendums" added to teh New Covenant that SCripture itself and not opinion say are addendums, I am all eyes and ears!

Hebrews 9:15
King James Version

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Please show me in this verse you claim Jesus fulfilled the New Covenant by His death.

Remember this is the only Scripture that lists the terms of the New Covenant, and so for the 30th time please explain how Jesus fulfilled the terms God set forth in the New Covenant:

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

BABerean2 said:

Your definition of the New Covenant assumes people are saved because of their bloodline, by ignoring Romans 2:28-29, Romans 9:8, and Romans 9:27, and Romans 11:1-5.

Therefore, your definition of the New Covenant's fulfillment can never agree with the Bible.

Click to expand...

I am flattered you think that I wrote this, but I didn't. It was written long before my birth!

My definition of the New Covenant is the only one the bible openly and unambiguously declares:

Jeremiah 31:31-34
King James Version

31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:

32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:

33 But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the Lord, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

34 And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the Lord: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

It is too bad you don't read all of Hebrews. for Paul who wrote it specifically links the new covenant to when ALL Israel gets saved!

25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the father's sakes.

29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

nolidad said:

Gentile. ... The word stems from the Hebrew term goy, which means a “nation,” and was applied both to the Hebrews and to any other nation.

Click to expand...

I agree. I posted the same thing.

That's partly why I believe the Gentiles that trampled Jerusalem for 42 months (Revelation 11:1-2) were the Zealots.