Ezekiel's prophecy (and the different perspectives)

mkgal1 said:

I've only recently begun to study Ezekiel. I'm kinda of surprised at the broad disparity of interpretations....but I wanted to try to discuss those variations.

To get us started.....here's one overview interpretation:

Ezekiel 37:5 seems to undeniably be about when God poured out His Spirit on Old Covenant Israel (recorded in Acts 2). To me....that offers us insight into the entire prophecy and its timing. Why is this ignored or denied?

Ezekiel 37:5 ~ This is what the Lord GOD says to these bones: I will cause breath to enter you, and you will come to life.

Acts 2:16-24 ~
No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:

‘In the last days, God says,

I will pour out My Spirit on all people.

Your sons and daughters will prophesy,

your young men will see visions,

your old men will dream dreams.18Even on My menservants and maidservants

I will pour out My Spirit in those days,

and they will prophesy.19I will show wonders in the heavens above

and signs on the earth below,

blood and fire and billows of smoke.20The sun will be turned to darkness,

and the moon to blood,

before the coming of the great and glorious Day of the Lord.21And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord

will be saved.’(e)​

Men of Israel, listen to this message: Jesus of Nazareth was a man certified by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know. He was delivered up by God’s set plan and foreknowledge, and you, by the hands of the lawless, put Him to death by nailing Him to the cross. But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches.​

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I see that the video is basically saying what I've also noticed before, albeit the video says it in a very different way and I don't know if or how much validity there is in these images below, but whoever disagrees with them hopefully will say why:

Fullness of the Gentiles said:

I see that the video is basically saying what I've also noticed before, albeit the video says it in a very different way and I don't know if or how much validity there is in these images below, but whoever disagrees with them hopefully will say why:

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About the only thing I might disagree with in the images you provided, is that Ezekiel 38-39 is connected with Revelation 20:7-8, the fact that would not prove Premil since Ezekiel 38 only involves things in this age before the 2nd coming, and not after the 2nd coming instead.

Ezekiel 38:23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD.

I don't see this making sense if this is supposed to be meaning a thousand years after Christ, who, Himself is God, that it is not until then that He is finally known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that He is the LORD. Why didn't they already figure that out once the 2nd coming occurs?


Plus there is this as well.

Isaiah 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

Ezekiel 38:21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother.

How can Ezekiel 38:21 be meaning after the fulfillment of Isaiah 2:4 without it causing a contradiction?

DavidPT said:

About the only thing I might disagree with in the images you provided, is that Ezekiel 38-39 is connected with Revelation 20:7-8, the fact that would not prove Premil since Ezekiel 38 only involves things in this age before the 2nd coming, and not after the 2nd coming instead.

Ezekiel 38:23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD.

I don't see this making sense if this is supposed to be meaning a thousand years after Christ, who, Himself is God, that it is not until then that He is finally known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that He is the LORD. Why didn't they already figure that out once the 2nd coming occurs?


Plus there is this as well.

Isaiah 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more.

Ezekiel 38:21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord GOD: every man's sword shall be against his brother.

How can Ezekiel 38:21 be meaning after the fulfillment of Isaiah 2:4 without it causing a contradiction?

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Not sure which question to answer first. But let me first say that I have no "engraved in concrete" view on Ezekiel - I only noticed the similarity in language, compared Ezekiel and Revelation for myself in a table, and took screen-shots of it. I don't even care if people disagree that the things don't fit, because Ezekiel is one of the toughest (if not the toughest) prophetic books for me, and I'm not even close to claiming that I understand it. Not even close.

In Ezekiel Gog does come against people who had been dwelling for a long time in peace, safety and prosperity in unwalled villages. This we read about after we read in Ezekiel 36 that God says He will bring the house of Israel back to their own country, sprinkle clean water on them, and they shall be clean, and that He will do this for His name's sake, and the nations will know that He is the LORD when He does this:

Ezekiel 36 (it appears to me this is not prophesying to the house of Judah - the Jews - but to the house of Israel, and it's prophesying about what will come after the 10 Northern tribes - the house of Israel or Ephraim - had been scattered):
Ezekiel 36
16 And the word of the LORD came to me, saying.
17 Son of man, when the house of Israel lived in their own land, they defiled it by their own way and by their doings, even as the defilement of woman's impurity, their way was before Me.
18 So I poured My fury on them, because of the blood that they had shed on the land, and for their idols by which they defiled it.
19 And I scattered them among the nations, and they were scattered through the lands. I judged them according to their way and according to their doings.
20 And when they entered the nations where they went, they even profaned My holy name by saying to them, These are the people of the Jehovah, and they are gone out of His land.
21 But I had pity for My holy name, which the house of Israel had profaned among the nations where they went.
22 Therefore say to the house of Israel, So says the Lord Jehovah: I do not do this for your sake, O house of Israel, but for My holy name's sake, which you have profaned among the nations where you went.
23 And I will sanctify My great name, which was profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst. And the nations shall know that I am the LORD, says the Lord Jehovah, when I shall be sanctified in you before their eyes.
24 For I will take you from among the nations and gather you out of all lands, and will gather you into your own land.
25 And I will sprinkle clean waters on you, and you shall be clean. I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from your idols.
26 And I will give you a new heart, and I will put a new spirit within you. And I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you a heart of flesh.
27 And I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you shall keep My judgments and do them.
28 And you shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers. And you shall be My people, and I will be your God.
29 I will also save you from all your defilements, and I will call for the grain, and will increase it, and will lay no famine on you.
30 And I will multiply the fruits of the tree and the increase of the field, so that you shall never again receive the curse of famine among the nations.
31 And you shall remember your own evil ways, and your doings that were not good, and shall despise yourselves in your own sight for your iniquities and for your abominations.
32 I do not do this for your sake, says the Lord Jehovah, be it known to you. Be ashamed and confounded for your ways, O house of Israel.
33 So says the Lord Jehovah: In the day that I cleanse you from all your iniquities, I will also cause you to dwell in the cities, and the wastes shall be built.
34 And the waste land shall be tilled, instead of being a ruin before all passing by.
35 And they shall say, This land that was wasted has become like the garden of Eden. And the wasted, deserted and ruined cities now are fortified and inhabited.
36 And the nations that are left all around you shall know that I the LORD build the ruined places and plant that which was wasted. I the LORD have spoken it, and I will do it.
37 So says the Lord Jehovah: I will yet for this be inquired by the house of Israel to act for them. I will increase them with men like a flock.
38 As a holy flock, as the flock of Jerusalem in her appointed feasts, so shall the waste cities be filled with flocks of men. And they shall know that I am the LORD."

Gog/Magog only come against the people after they had experienced a prolonged period of peace, safety and prosperity.

mkgal1 said:

ISTM that conclusion is only rejected based on it not aligning with a pre-mill framework, though, correct? IOW.....it's like saying, "but that can't be right.....because that destroys the premill belief system". Isn't it better to let Scripture guide us into a framework instead of the other way around?

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Saying you're funny is easier than admitting you are correct in what you say (I'm Premil).

mkgal1 said:

ISTM that conclusion is only rejected based on it not aligning with a pre-mill framework, though, correct? IOW.....it's like saying, "but that can't be right.....because that destroys the premill belief system". Isn't it better to let Scripture guide us into a framework instead of the other way around?

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You don't understand my argument then. Both of us are Premil, yet I see zero connection with Ezekiel 38-39 and that of Revelation 20:7-8. But, since he does see a connection, and the fact he is Premil, Ezekiel 38-39 is not proving Premil if those events recorded in Ezekiel 38-39 are referring to events in this age prior to the 2nd coming. I was basically pointing out that since he is Premil, he might be better off not associating Ezekiel 39-39 with Revelation 20:7-8, since Revelation 20:7-8 is meaning post the 2nd coming(per Premil), and that Ezekiel 38-39 is meaning prior to the 2nd coming(that according to the texts involved, plus some of the reasons I indicated that it doesn't make sense to apply any of the events recorded in Ezekiel 38-39 some thousand years after Christ has returned).

mkgal1 said:

Correct, I didn't.

It's very common to link the two as he did because of the language and the common reference to Gog/Magog.


But Ezekiel mentions Gog/Magog....so how do you reconcile that commonality?

Revelation 20:7-8
7When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, 8and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore.

Ezekiel 38:2
Son of man, set your face against Gog of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. Prophesy against him​

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According to Ezekiel 39, Gog and his multitude end up dead and buried, as the result of God's judgment that he executes on them, and that this happens in this age, not the next age. And if Revelation 20:7-8 is meaning in the next age post the 2nd coming, how did Gog resurface if Ezekiel 39 has him already dead and buried?

The only thing I can figure out, is that maybe the following offers a clue.

Ezekiel 39:1 Therefore, thou son of man, prophesy against Gog, and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:
2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:


What is meant by this----and leave but the sixth part of thee? Does this mean there could be a remnant remaining in order to fight another day? I don't know. Even scholars and Commentators seem to be divided as to the meaning of---and leave but the sixth part of thee.

mkgal1 said:

I'm still very wobbly when it comes to understanding the different millennial views....but, with the understanding that this was fulfilled in the first century, this shouldn't conflict with the premil framework....right (or does it)? If so.....can you share at what point there's a conflict?

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The only conflict is the imagery used in Ezekiel 39 when referring to the judgment of Gog/Magog: birds being gathered to eat the flesh of kings etc. That same imagery is used at the end of Revelation 19 when Christ returns and defeats the beast. Revelation 20 talks about a thousand years of peace which closes with Gog/Magog coming against the camp of the saints and being destroyed by fire coming down from God out of heaven.

mkgal1 said:

Correct, I didn't.

It's very common to link the two as he did because of the language and the common reference to Gog/Magog.


But Ezekiel mentions Gog/Magog....so how do you reconcile that commonality?

Revelation 20:7-8
7When the thousand years are complete, Satan will be released from his prison, 8and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to assemble them for battle. Their number is like the sand of the seashore.

Ezekiel 38:2
Son of man, set your face against Gog of the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal. Prophesy against him​

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In Ezekiel 38-39 it is those that God is hiding His face from that is being surrounded by enemies, thus the unsaved are being surrounded by enemies, basically the same thing we see in the first few verses of Zechariah 14. In Revelation 20:7-8 it is the camp of the saints being surrounded by enemies, thus the saved are being surrounded. IOW, both accounts don't have the same ones being surrounded by enemies, therefore they are not speaking of the same events.

DavidPT said:

According to Ezekiel 39, Gog and his multitude end up dead and buried, as the result of God's judgment that he executes on them, and that this happens in this age, not the next age. And if Revelation 20:7-8 is meaning in the next age post the 2nd coming, how did Gog resurface if Ezekiel 39 has him already dead and buried?

The only thing I can figure out, is that maybe the following offers a clue.

Ezekiel 39:1 Therefore, thou son of man, prophesy against Gog, and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:
2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:


What is meant by this----and leave but the sixth part of thee? Does this mean there could be a remnant remaining in order to fight another day? I don't know. Even scholars and Commentators seem to be divided as to the meaning of---and leave but the sixth part of thee.

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It the Strong's Dictionary it seems to suggest the sixth part part of the verse is an error.

Eze 39:6 And I will send a fire on Magog, and on the secure inhabitants of the coasts. And they shall know that I am the LORD.

Rev 20:9 And they went up over the breadth of the earth and circled around the camp of the saints, and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of Heaven and devoured them.

Eze 38:8-9 After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you shall come into the land turned back from the sword, gathered out of many peoples, on the mountains of Israel, which have always been waste. (But he has been brought out of the peoples, and they shall dwell securely, all of them.)
And you shall go up, coming like a storm. You shall be like a cloud to cover the land, you and all your bands, and many peoples with you.

Similar language. Only taking place after Israel and Judah had been gathered back into the land and become one nation under one King, and after they had dwelt in the land for a long time in peace, safety and prosperity.

@DavidPT

'Nother thing: The New Heavens and New Earth is a resurrected earth in a resurrected cosmos:

Romans 8:19-25
19 For the earnest expectation of the creation waits for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creation was not willingly subjected to vanity, but because of Him who subjected it on hope
21 that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 And we know that the whole creation groans and travails in pain together until now.
23 And not only so, but ourselves also, who have the firstfruit of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, awaiting adoption, the redemption of our body.
24 For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen is not hope; for what anyone sees, why does he also hope for it?
25 But if we hope for that which we do not see, then we wait for it with patience.

There are nations mentioned in the NHNE:

Revelation 21:24-27
24 And the nations of those who are saved will walk in the light of it; and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.
25 And its gates may not be shut at all by day, for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honor of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no way enter into it anything that defiles, or any making an abomination or a lie; but only those who are written in the Lamb's Book of Life.

There is a lot of confusion because we have not been given everything (or at least, it has not been spelled out to us and we are as confused as the apostles who asked the Lord if He was at this time going to restore the Kingdom to Israel - just a few moments before He ascended into heaven).

So to me, there is nothing to say that the dead bodies of the Gog-Magog armies won't be buried over a period of 7 "months" in the NHNE.

DavidPT said:

In Ezekiel 38-39 it is those that God is hiding His face from that is being surrounded by enemies, thus the unsaved are being surrounded by enemies, basically the same thing we see in the first few verses of Zechariah 14. In Revelation 20:7-8 it is the camp of the saints being surrounded by enemies, thus the saved are being surrounded. IOW, both accounts don't have the same ones being surrounded by enemies, therefore they are not speaking of the same events.

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No. In Ezekiel 38-39 it is those who had already been gathered back into their own land, cleansed of their sin, become one nation in the land under one King, that Gog is coming against.

@DavidPT

Ezekiel 38
8 After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you shall come into the land turned back from the sword, gathered out of many peoples, on the mountains of Israel, which have always been waste. (But he has been brought out of the peoples, and they shall dwell securely, all of them.)
9 And you shall go up, coming like a storm. You shall be like a cloud to cover the land, you and all your bands, and many peoples with you.
10 So says the Lord Jehovah: And it shall be in that day that things shall come into your heart, and you shall devise an evil plan.
11 And you shall say, I will go up to the land of open spaces. I will go to those at rest, who dwell securely, all of them dwelling without walls, and there are no bars nor gates to them,
12 in order to take a spoil, and to steal a prize; to turn your hand on the inhabited waste places, and on the people gathered out of the nations, who have gotten cattle and goods, who dwell in the midst of the land.

Fullness of the Gentiles said:

It the Strong's Dictionary it seems to suggest the sixth part part of the verse is an error.

Eze 39:6 And I will send a fire on Magog, and on the secure inhabitants of the coasts. And they shall know that I am the LORD.

Rev 20:9 And they went up over the breadth of the earth and circled around the camp of the saints, and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of Heaven and devoured them.

Eze 38:8-9 After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you shall come into the land turned back from the sword, gathered out of many peoples, on the mountains of Israel, which have always been waste. (But he has been brought out of the peoples, and they shall dwell securely, all of them.)
And you shall go up, coming like a storm. You shall be like a cloud to cover the land, you and all your bands, and many peoples with you.

Similar language. Only taking place after Israel and Judah had been gathered back into the land and become one nation under one King, and after they had dwelt in the land for a long time in peace, safety and prosperity.

@DavidPT

'Nother thing: The New Heavens and New Earth is a resurrected earth in a resurrected cosmos:

Romans 8:19-25
19 For the earnest expectation of the creation waits for the manifestation of the sons of God.
20 For the creation was not willingly subjected to vanity, but because of Him who subjected it on hope
21 that the creation itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
22 And we know that the whole creation groans and travails in pain together until now.
23 And not only so, but ourselves also, who have the firstfruit of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, awaiting adoption, the redemption of our body.
24 For we are saved by hope. But hope that is seen is not hope; for what anyone sees, why does he also hope for it?
25 But if we hope for that which we do not see, then we wait for it with patience.

There are nations mentioned in the NHNE:

Revelation 21:24-27
24 And the nations of those who are saved will walk in the light of it; and the kings of the earth bring their glory and honor into it.
25 And its gates may not be shut at all by day, for there shall be no night there.
26 And they shall bring the glory and honor of the nations into it.
27 And there shall in no way enter into it anything that defiles, or any making an abomination or a lie; but only those who are written in the Lamb's Book of Life.

There is a lot of confusion because we have not been given everything (or at least, it has not been spelled out to us and we are as confused as the apostles who asked the Lord if He was at this time going to restore the Kingdom to Israel - just a few moments before He ascended into heaven).

So to me, there is nothing to say that the dead bodies of the Gog-Magog armies won't be buried over a period of 7 "months" in the NHNE.

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I'm not certain how to address your point about the NHNE at this time, since it is not entirely clear to me as to what you are meaning here.

There was a time when I entertained the possibilty that Ezekiel 38 speaks of events after the thousand years, and that Ezekiel 39 speaks of events prior to the thousand years. But I never did end up adopting that position since I'm convinced that what is recorded in Ezekiel 38, we see the fulfillment of some of that in Ezekiel 39, therefore only one battle, and not 2 different battles occurring a thousand years apart. Ezekiel 39:17-20 appears to match Revelation 19:17-18, therefore proving to me that these events in Ezekiel 39 are fulfilled in the end of this age.

Getting back to my initial point when I entertained the possibility that Ezekiel 38 speaks of events after the thousand years, and that Ezekiel 39 speaks of events prior to the thousand years, some of my thinking is as follows.

Ezekiel 38:15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:
16 And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.


Compare with---


Ezekiel 39:2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:
3 And I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.
4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.


Both passages show Gog coming up from the north parts, and that he is coming with a vast army coming against His ppl Israel.

---------------
and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes(Ezekiel 38:16).

Ezekiel 38:23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD.
--------------

Compare with---

----------
Ezekiel 39:21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.
22 So the house of Israel shall know that I am the LORD their God from that day and forward.


Ezekiel 39:27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations;
------------

IOW, these passages in Ezekiel 39 show the passages submitted from ch 38 to be involving only one battle, not two different battles at different times.

mkgal1 said:

I've only recently begun to study Ezekiel. I'm kinda of surprised at the broad disparity of interpretations....but I wanted to try to discuss those variations.

To get us started.....here's one overview interpretation:

Ezekiel 37:5 seems to undeniably be about when God poured out His Spirit on Old Covenant Israel (recorded in Acts 2). To me....that offers us insight into the entire prophecy and its timing. Why is this ignored or denied?

Ezekiel 37:5 ~ This is what the Lord GOD says to these bones: I will cause breath to enter you, and you will come to life.

Acts 2:16-24 ~
No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:

‘In the last days, God says,

I will pour out My Spirit on all people.

Your sons and daughters will prophesy,

your young men will see visions,

your old men will dream dreams.18Even on My menservants and maidservants

I will pour out My Spirit in those days,

and they will prophesy.19I will show wonders in the heavens above

and signs on the earth below,

blood and fire and billows of smoke.20The sun will be turned to darkness,

and the moon to blood,

before the coming of the great and glorious Day of the Lord.21And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord

will be saved.’(e)​

Men of Israel, listen to this message: Jesus of Nazareth was a man certified by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know. He was delivered up by God’s set plan and foreknowledge, and you, by the hands of the lawless, put Him to death by nailing Him to the cross. But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches.​

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The dead bought-brought to Life are all of us, really. Chapter 37 is like a preview. I like you're reading Ezekiel.

DavidPT said:

I'm not certain how to address your point about the NHNE at this time, since it is not entirely clear to me as to what you are meaning here.

There was a time when I entertained the possibilty that Ezekiel 38 speaks of events after the thousand years, and that Ezekiel 39 speaks of events prior to the thousand years. But I never did end up adopting that position since I'm convinced that what is recorded in Ezekiel 38, we see the fulfillment of some of that in Ezekiel 39, therefore only one battle, and not 2 different battles occurring a thousand years apart. Ezekiel 39:17-20 appears to match Revelation 19:17-18, therefore proving to me that these events in Ezekiel 39 are fulfilled in the end of this age.

Getting back to my initial point when I entertained the possibility that Ezekiel 38 speaks of events after the thousand years, and that Ezekiel 39 speaks of events prior to the thousand years, some of my thinking is as follows.

Ezekiel 38:15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:
16 And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.


Compare with---


Ezekiel 39:2 And I will turn thee back, and leave but the sixth part of thee, and will cause thee to come up from the north parts, and will bring thee upon the mountains of Israel:
3 And I will smite thy bow out of thy left hand, and will cause thine arrows to fall out of thy right hand.
4 Thou shalt fall upon the mountains of Israel, thou, and all thy bands, and the people that is with thee: I will give thee unto the ravenous birds of every sort, and to the beasts of the field to be devoured.


Both passages show Gog coming up from the north parts, and that he is coming with a vast army coming against His ppl Israel.

---------------
and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes(Ezekiel 38:16).

Ezekiel 38:23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the LORD.
--------------

Compare with---

----------
Ezekiel 39:21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.
22 So the house of Israel shall know that I am the LORD their God from that day and forward.


Ezekiel 39:27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations;
------------

IOW, these passages in Ezekiel 39 show the passages submitted from ch 38 to be involving only one battle, not two different battles at different times.

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I'm getting the idea that you're interpreting in terms of the chapter divisions. You must remember that there were no chapter and verse divisions in the Bible until over 1,400 years after the time of Christ. They were placed into the Bible by scholars for obvious reasons.

But you should not expect Ezekiel's mention of Gog in chapter 38 to be different to the mention of Gog in chapter 39. Those divisions in the narrative are man-made, like the borders between Texas and Oklahoma and between all the U.S states. You guys shifted it into the narrative a couple of hundred years back. They are man-made. Very democratic, but man-made.

Take the chapter and verse divisions out of Ezekiel chapters 36-39. You will find that it's talking about:

(a) the land of Israel and how other nations took possession of it because its own people had been exiled from the land (36:1-15); and
(b) the history of the house of Israel, how it was scattered among the nations, and the promise to the house of Israel of restoration to God and regathering into the land for His name's sake, and not for anything they did.

This narrative begins with Eze.36:16 and continues through to Eze.37:14 - it's one and the same narrative, which was introduced by God's statements to the land of Israel in 36:1-15; and
( c ) the re-uniting (for the first time since they were split into two kingdoms following the days of Solomon) of the tribes of the house of Israel (the Northern Kingdom) and of the house of Judah (the Southern Kingdom) - in the time when both Ephraim (the house of Israel) and Judah (the house of Judah) have been gathered back into the land; and
(d) the promise that the two become one nation again in the land. This is seen in Eze.37:1-25; and
(e) the promise that God will set His sanctuary in their midst, and His temple will remain in their midst forever (Eze.37:26-28) *

* For the first time, as in (d) this causes us to question whether this is the same as the promise of the Temple of God being in the midst of the people which we read about in the NHNE in the Revelation - BUT we also should remember that the promise states that "David my servant shall be King over them" (Eze.37:24); and Jesus is the tabernacle of God:

19 Jesus answered and said to them, Destroy this temple and in three days I will raise it up.
20 Then the Jews said, This temple was forty-six years building, and will you rear it up in three days?
21 But He spoke of the temple of His body." John 2:19-21

(f) God talking to Gog, saying that Gog would come against the people after the house of Israel and the house of Judah had been brought out of the nations and gathered back into their own land, had become one nation again, and were now dwelling securely.:

Eze 38:8
"After many days you will be visited. In the latter years you shall come into the land turned back from the sword, gathered out of many peoples, on the mountains of Israel, which have always been waste. (But he has been brought out of the peoples, and they shall dwell securely, all of them.)

The part in red is not talking about Gog- it's talking about the people who had been brought out of the nations and gathered back into their own land, who were now dwelling securely. The part in blue is a reiteration of what God said to the mountains of Israel in chapter 36:1-15 - how the land had been waste while the people had been scattered among the nations, but this period had been brought to an end when God gathered the people back into the land.

Te rest of Ezekiel chapters 38 right up until 39:22 is talking about the same thing - Gog coming against the people dwelling securely in the land after they had been gathered back into the land from all the nations to which they had been scattered, and becoming one nation in the land, and had been experiencing a prolonged period of peace, safety and Prosperity in the land following their regathering.

Remember that the prophecy is all one and the same prophecy from chapter 36 to the end of chapter 39. It's not different prophecies just because of the chapter divisions.

(g) The prophecy closes by God reiterating in Eze.39:23-29 what He had already said in Eze.36:16-38.

The prophecy is all about the restoration of Israel (ALL Israel - both the house of Israel AND the house of Judah) to God, and them being gathered back into the land and blessed there under the New Covenant, where they experience a prolonged period of peace, safety & prosperity which is ended when Gog comes against them - but Gog's efforts do not succeed because Gog is utterly destroyed.

This leaves us with confusion because within this one and the same prophecy which begins in Ezekiel 36 and closes with Ezekiel 39, there are verses which, if taken literally, support Amil, but the overall picture supports Premil.

IMO:

Don't get bogged down with the details in the prophecy regarding birds gathering to eat the flesh of kings etc because that's when we stop seeing the wood for all the trees.

PS: I don't understand it because as you can see from the above, I too have lots of unanswered questions.

mkgal1 said:

I've only recently begun to study Ezekiel. I'm kinda of surprised at the broad disparity of interpretations....but I wanted to try to discuss those variations.

To get us started.....here's one overview interpretation:

Ezekiel 37:5 seems to undeniably be about when God poured out His Spirit on Old Covenant Israel (recorded in Acts 2). To me....that offers us insight into the entire prophecy and its timing. Why is this ignored or denied?

Ezekiel 37:5 ~ This is what the Lord GOD says to these bones: I will cause breath to enter you, and you will come to life.

Acts 2:16-24 ~
No, this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:

‘In the last days, God says,

I will pour out My Spirit on all people.

Your sons and daughters will prophesy,

your young men will see visions,

your old men will dream dreams.18Even on My menservants and maidservants

I will pour out My Spirit in those days,

and they will prophesy.19I will show wonders in the heavens above

and signs on the earth below,

blood and fire and billows of smoke.20The sun will be turned to darkness,

and the moon to blood,

before the coming of the great and glorious Day of the Lord.21And everyone who calls on the name of the Lord

will be saved.’(e)​

Men of Israel, listen to this message: Jesus of Nazareth was a man certified by God to you by miracles, wonders, and signs, which God did among you through Him, as you yourselves know. He was delivered up by God’s set plan and foreknowledge, and you, by the hands of the lawless, put Him to death by nailing Him to the cross. But God raised Him from the dead, releasing Him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for Him to be held in its clutches.​

Click to expand...

Good idea