This is freaking me out .

Desk trauma · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
Decline in murder rates? where

The United States for the past four decades. Along with all other violent crime.

pitabread · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
The result is that our prisons are full to overflowing and our
societyis inundated in violent crime.

The overflowing prison problem is a uniquely American issue that stems from a whole host of issues. Suffice to say, with better laws and social programs in place, plus an elimination of for-profit prisons, you probably wouldn't have that problem.

As for violent crime, U.S. violent crime is generally down compared to decades past. It could certainly be improved, but assuming that harsh punishments is the solution is just archaic.

It sounds like you'd be at home with some of the more ruthless regimes that enact such forms of law and punishment.

Correction is the God-given means to prevent crime and other
problems. Using strong correction FORCES CHANGE in criminals
convicted of lesser offenses and eliminates entirely the threat of
those convicted of violent crimes such as murder.

[citation needed]

Semper-Fi · Nov 28, 2020

pitabread said:
[citation needed]

The pages in the bible.

ximmix · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
A swift death penalty was intended by our Creator to deter or restrain additional people from committing the sin of murder.

Didn't God intend the death penalty for a whole lot of things? It would help the poor overcrowded COMMERCIAL prisons a lot...

Semper-Fi · Nov 28, 2020

ximmix said:
Didn't God intend the death penalty for a whole lot of things? It would help the poor overcrowded COMMERCIAL prisons a lot...

We are talking about capital punishment for murder on thread.

Semper-Fi · Nov 28, 2020

[citation needed]

The Old Testament of the Bible speaks with perfect plainness
on the issue of capital punishment: “He that smiteth a man,
so that he die, shall be surely put to death” (Exodus 21:12).

Genesis 9:6 and Leviticus 24:17 also give full authority
to those sitting in judgment to execute a murderer.

Deuteronomy 19:11-13 commands unsparing punishment for such
a killer: “…deliver him into the hand of the AVENGER OF BLOOD,
that he may die. Thine eye SHALL NOT PITY HIM, but thou shalt
PUT AWAY THE GUILT of innocent blood from Israel, that it may
go well with thee.”

The God of the Old Testament clearly favored the death penalty.
Scriptures show that Jesus Christ was the God of the Old Testament.

In the New Testament book of Romans,
God REAFFIRMS that authority:

“Let every soul be subject unto the governing authorities.
For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities
that exist [speaking of man’s governments and courts] are
appointed by God.… For he [a government or court official]
is God’s minister to you for good.

But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword
in vain; for he is God’s minister, an AVENGER TO EXECUTE WRATH
on him who practices evil” (Romans 13:1-4).

Hebrews 12:5-6 that for our own good those who commit wrong
must be corrected. Correction is the God-given means to prevent
crime and other problems.

In Proverbs 19:18, God gives us the principle that applies to
disobedient children, juvenile delinquents or hardened criminals.

We are told, “Chasten thy son while there is hope, and let not
thy soul spare for his crying” (Proverbs 19:18).

Punishment, when meted out in the proper manner, and at the proper
time, is one of the greatest blessings a human being—at any age—can
receive. If we do not receive correction, we will proceed on a course
to our own destruction (Proverbs 14:12)

OldWiseGuy · Nov 28, 2020

ximmix said:
Of course, but in this forum you can speak freely (hmm), and you stated that it's ok that some innocent people die.

It's another regrettable fact of life.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 28, 2020

pitabread said:
You do understand what a wrongful conviction means, yes?

The leader of my church was wrongly convicted.

ximmix · Nov 28, 2020

OldWiseGuy said:
It's another regrettable fact of life.

Only if there is death penalty.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 28, 2020

ximmix said:
Didn't God intend the death penalty for a whole lot of things? It would help the poor overcrowded COMMERCIAL prisons a lot...

There were no prisons in ancient Israel...think about that.

OldWiseGuy · Nov 28, 2020

ximmix said:
Only if there is death penalty.

People incur the 'death penalty' for a variety of reasons...like overeating, drinking, driving too fast, mountain climbing, swimming, etc. In fact it seems that many people have a death wish.

ximmix · Nov 28, 2020

OldWiseGuy said:
People incur the 'death penalty' for a variety of reasons...like overeating, drinking, driving too fast, mountain climbing, swimming, etc. In fact it seems that many people have a death wish.

Ok. You justify the death penalty with "well they are propably going to die anyway because they are so irresponsible". Nice.

pitabread · Nov 28, 2020

OldWiseGuy said:
The leader of my church was wrongly convicted.

Were they executed?

pitabread · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
The pages in the bible.

Which is not a source on social policy and crime prevention re: modern society.

If you've all you've got is "but the Bible says..." then I'd say we're done here.

NBB · Nov 28, 2020

For me killing defenseless babies is more barbaric than killing serial killers by firing squad.

Robban · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
[citation needed]

The Old Testament of the Bible speaks with perfect plainness
on the issue of capital punishment: “He that smiteth a man,
so that he die, shall be surely put to death” (Exodus 21:12).

Genesis 9:6 and Leviticus 24:17 also give full authority
to those sitting in judgment to execute a murderer.

Deuteronomy 19:11-13 commands unsparing punishment for such
a killer: “…deliver him into the hand of the AVENGER OF BLOOD,
that he may die. Thine eye SHALL NOT PITY HIM, but thou shalt
PUT AWAY THE GUILT of innocent blood from Israel, that it may
go well with thee.”

The God of the Old Testament clearly favored the death penalty.
Scriptures show that Jesus Christ was the God of the Old Testament.

In the New Testament book of Romans,
God REAFFIRMS that authority:

“Let every soul be subject unto the governing authorities.
For there is no authority except from God, and the authorities
that exist [speaking of man’s governments and courts] are
appointed by God.… For he [a government or court official]
is God’s minister to you for good.

But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword
in vain; for he is God’s minister, an AVENGER TO EXECUTE WRATH
on him who practices evil” (Romans 13:1-4).

Hebrews 12:5-6 that for our own good those who commit wrong
must be corrected. Correction is the God-given means to prevent
crime and other problems.

In Proverbs 19:18, God gives us the principle that applies to
disobedient children, juvenile delinquents or hardened criminals.

We are told, “Chasten thy son while there is hope, and let not
thy soul spare for his crying” (Proverbs 19:18).

Punishment, when meted out in the proper manner, and at the proper
time, is one of the greatest blessings a human being—at any age—can
receive. If we do not receive correction, we will proceed on a course
to our own destruction (Proverbs 14:12)

Depends who is accusing who.

1 Corinthians 6:1-8

Semper-Fi · Nov 28, 2020

Robban said:
Depends who is accusing who.

1 Corinthians 6:1-8

There is a difference between [the church] here,
and instructions to a gential [government] body.

Robban · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
There is a difference between [the church] here,
and instructions to a gential [government] body.

The law of the land varies from country to country.

And from what I have heard from state to state in the same country.(USA)

Nithavela · Nov 28, 2020

Semper-Fi said:
Flawed humans will make mistakes. But that must not stop us
from following God’s plain commands!

A swift death penalty was intended by our Creator to deter or
restrain additional people from committing the sin of murder.

To stop or delay the death penalty because the courts are afraid
of making a mistake is direct disobedience to God and His laws!
-

The book of Proverbs states, “When the scorner is punished,
the simple is made wise,” and “Smite a scorner, and the simple
will beware” (Proverbs 21:11; 19:25).

People can learn vicariously from the experiences of others!

The deterrent effect of the death penalty is muted because of current
practices. But even basic understanding of human nature tells us that,
if administered properly, the death penalty would have a significant
deterrent effect!

Science says differently. But common sense has always prevailed over truth.

loveofourlord · Nov 28, 2020

here is the problem with ameican justice, it's not about punishment, or rehabilitation or improvement, it's about revenge. You hurt us so we will hurt you. That doesn't make a better society, nor does it help with resitivitsm rates. Most people don't think about, "Oh no I kill this guy I'm going to be executed." it's in the heat of the moment. remove the reasons why people kill like poverty and such and you can reduce them.

This is freaking me out .

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