Is the Lord God still hiding His face from the House of Israel?

DavidPT

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Ezekiel 39:23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword.

Ezekiel 39:24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.

Ezekiel 39:29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord GOD.


If we start with verse 23, we at least know from the text that the Lord God had been hiding His face from the house of Israel up until this point in time. We then need to backup in Ch 39 a bit in order to see what events have to be fulfilled before the Lord God is no longer hiding His face from the house of Israel.

Ezekiel 39:17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.
18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.
19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.
20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.
21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.

According to this block of text, it is not this Judgment that the Lord God executes, being when He is no longer hiding His face from them. Has He already executed this judgment? If the answer is yes, and that one can prove it, this indicates He is no longer hiding His face from them, obviously. But, if He is yet to execute this judgment, this indicates He is still hiding His face from them, even today, obviously.

Ezekiel 39:17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.
18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.
19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.
20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.

Can this block of text be compared to any Scriptures in the NT? What about the following?

Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.


In both accounts, every feathered fowl is being spoken to, to gather to His sacrifice He sacrifices for them, and in both accounts it is men of war who are being sacrificed. Obviously, both accounts are referring to the same events, and that Revelation 19 proves Ezekiel 39:17-20 is future still, which then means the Lord God is still hiding His face from the House of Israel to this day. To argue otherwise is to deny that Ezekiel 39:17-20 and Revelation 19:17-18 are referring to the same events. Which then means you need to prove what past event Ezekiel 39:17-20 is referring to. And finally, to argue otherwise is to deny that when the Lord God is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel, it is meaning once He has executed the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20.
 
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BABerean2

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Ezekiel 39:23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword.

Ezekiel 39:24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.

Ezekiel 39:29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord GOD.


If we start with verse 23, we at least know from the text that the Lord God had been hiding His face from the house of Israel up until this point in time. We then need to backup in Ch 39 a bit in order to see what events have to be fulfilled before the Lord God is no longer hiding His face from the house of Israel.

Ezekiel 39:17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.
18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.
19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.
20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.
21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.

According to this block of text, it is not this Judgment that the Lord God executes, being when He is no longer hiding His face from them. Has He already executed this judgment? If the answer is yes, and that one can prove it, this indicates He is no longer hiding His face from them, obviously. But, if He is yet to execute this judgment, this indicates He is still hiding His face from them, even today, obviously.

Ezekiel 39:17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.
18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.
19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.
20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.

Can this block of text be compared to any Scriptures in the NT? What about the following?

Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.


In both accounts, every feathered fowl is being spoken to, to gather to His sacrifice He sacrifices for them, and in both accounts it is men of war who are being sacrificed. Obviously, both accounts are referring to the same events, and that Revelation 19 proves Ezekiel 39:17-20 is future still, which then means the Lord God is still hiding His face from the House of Israel to this day. To argue otherwise is to deny that Ezekiel 39:17-20 and Revelation 19:17-18 are referring to the same events. Which then means you need to prove what past event Ezekiel 39:17-20 is referring to. And finally, to argue otherwise is to deny that when the Lord God is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel, it is meaning once He has executed the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20.


Did He hide His face from about 3,000 from "all the house of Israel" on the Day of Pentecost in the passage below?

Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Act 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Act 2:40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Act 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.


Have you read Hebrews 8:6-13 lately, which reveals the fulfillment of the New Covenant promised to the house of Israel, and the house of Judah?


Have you read how James addressed his letter? Who was James talking to?

Jas 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
Jas 1:2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
Jas 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.

.
 
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Davy

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Ezekiel 39:23 And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword.

Ezekiel 39:24 According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.

Ezekiel 39:29 Neither will I hide my face any more from them: for I have poured out my spirit upon the house of Israel, saith the Lord GOD.


If we start with verse 23, we at least know from the text that the Lord God had been hiding His face from the house of Israel up until this point in time. We then need to backup in Ch 39 a bit in order to see what events have to be fulfilled before the Lord God is no longer hiding His face from the house of Israel.

Ezekiel 39:17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.
18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.
19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.
20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.
21 And I will set my glory among the heathen, and all the heathen shall see my judgment that I have executed, and my hand that I have laid upon them.

According to this block of text, it is not this Judgment that the Lord God executes, being when He is no longer hiding His face from them. Has He already executed this judgment? If the answer is yes, and that one can prove it, this indicates He is no longer hiding His face from them, obviously. But, if He is yet to execute this judgment, this indicates He is still hiding His face from them, even today, obviously.

Ezekiel 39:17 And, thou son of man, thus saith the Lord GOD; Speak unto every feathered fowl, and to every beast of the field, Assemble yourselves, and come; gather yourselves on every side to my sacrifice that I do sacrifice for you, even a great sacrifice upon the mountains of Israel, that ye may eat flesh, and drink blood.
18 Ye shall eat the flesh of the mighty, and drink the blood of the princes of the earth, of rams, of lambs, and of goats, of bullocks, all of them fatlings of Bashan.
19 And ye shall eat fat till ye be full, and drink blood till ye be drunken, of my sacrifice which I have sacrificed for you.
20 Thus ye shall be filled at my table with horses and chariots, with mighty men, and with all men of war, saith the Lord GOD.

Can this block of text be compared to any Scriptures in the NT? What about the following?

Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.


In both accounts, every feathered fowl is being spoken to, to gather to His sacrifice He sacrifices for them, and in both accounts it is men of war who are being sacrificed. Obviously, both accounts are referring to the same events, and that Revelation 19 proves Ezekiel 39:17-20 is future still, which then means the Lord God is still hiding His face from the House of Israel to this day. To argue otherwise is to deny that Ezekiel 39:17-20 and Revelation 19:17-18 are referring to the same events. Which then means you need to prove what past event Ezekiel 39:17-20 is referring to. And finally, to argue otherwise is to deny that when the Lord God is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel, it is meaning once He has executed the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20.

Well, you're kind of doing the 'absolutism' thing, not seeing how God preserved a remnant that would know the Truth, like what God said about a remnant of the house of Israel in Ezekiel 6.

That time in Ezekiel 38 & 39 about that destruction upon Israel's enemies, i.e., Armageddon on the "day of the Lord" when Jesus comes, is when the 'majority' of the ten lost tribe remnant will wake up and discover their heritage as part of old Israel. But a small remnant has already know when scattered through the countries (not Jews either, but ten lost tribe Israelites). On that day of destruction of the armies out of the northern quarters that come upon Jerusalem, some of them we are told in Zechariah 14 will be left, and will be required to come up to Jerusalem from year to year to worship The LORD of hosts and keep the feast of tabernacles.

So has God completely... hid Himself from the ten tribe "house of Israel"? Not to all of them, but for the majority of them, and from the Jews (Judah) and the world? Yes.

However, that still does not mean He didn't work His Plan He had for them, even though they forgot their heritage as part of old Israel, which that Plan is about their acceptance as a majority in The Gospel of Jesus Christ, and being the majority of the ones chosen to spread it to the rest of the nations.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Most of the house of Israel were "afar off" and "scattered" in Jesus day. It was to them that the disciples were sent. The Christian ministry to this day is still mainly for the descendants of the house of Israel; the Anglo-European peoples. "Ye shall not have gone over (all of) the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come."
 
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DavidPT

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Did He hide His face from about 3,000 from "all the house of Israel" on the Day of Pentecost in the passage below?

Act 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
Act 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Act 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.
Act 2:40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.
Act 2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.


Have you read Hebrews 8:6-13 lately, which reveals the fulfillment of the New Covenant promised to the house of Israel, and the house of Judah?


Have you read how James addressed his letter? Who was James talking to?

Jas 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
Jas 1:2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
Jas 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.

.


Do you disagree that Ezekiel 39:17-20 and Revelation 19:17-18 are referring to the same events? If you disagree, can you prove what past event Ezekiel 39:17-20 is referring to? Do you disagree, that according to the text, when God is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel meant in that chapter, that it is meaning once He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20?

As to what you submitted from Acts, we have to keep something in mind, in regards to Israel.

Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.


Romans 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

The ones of the house of Israel you submitted via Acts 2 apparently would be meaning these once they were converted---the election hath obtained it. But what about the rest that were blinded, thus cut off from the good olive tree? Why would this not be meaning the house of Israel meant in Ezekiel 39? Someone has to be meaning them, and it has to be someone from the house of Israel that has not converted to Christianity by the time God executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20. Who do you see that fitting, if not the ones that were blinded?
 
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DavidPT

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Well, you're kind of doing the 'absolutism' thing, not seeing how God preserved a remnant that would know the Truth, like what God said about a remnant of the house of Israel in Ezekiel 6.

That time in Ezekiel 38 & 39 about that destruction upon Israel's enemies, i.e., Armageddon on the "day of the Lord" when Jesus comes, is when the 'majority' of the ten lost tribe remnant will wake up and discover their heritage as part of old Israel. But a small remnant has already know when scattered through the countries (not Jews either, but ten lost tribe Israelites). On that day of destruction of the armies out of the northern quarters that come upon Jerusalem, some of them we are told in Zechariah 14 will be left, and will be required to come up to Jerusalem from year to year to worship The LORD of hosts and keep the feast of tabernacles.

So has God completely... hid Himself from the ten tribe "house of Israel"? Not to all of them, but for the majority of them, and from the Jews (Judah) and the world? Yes.

However, that still does not mean He didn't work His Plan He had for them, even though they forgot their heritage as part of old Israel, which that Plan is about their acceptance as a majority in The Gospel of Jesus Christ, and being the majority of the ones chosen to spread it to the rest of the nations.


Maybe my last post makes things a bit clearer?
 
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Davy

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Most of the house of Israel were "afar off" and "scattered" in Jesus day. It was to them that the disciples were sent. The Christian ministry to this day is still mainly for the descendants of the house of Israel; the Anglo-European peoples. "Ye shall not have gone over (all of) the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come."

Oh... Christ's enemies that come here aren't gonna' like that Anglo-European peoples idea (even though you are correct, partially. It was documented by professor Leroy Waterman in the 1930s what the ancient Assyrians called Omri, king of the house of Israel, and the translation of the Assyrian tablets description for the ten tribes. Its connection was to the word Cimmerian. Anthropology understands about the migrations of the Cimmerian and Scythian tribes into Asia Minor and Europe from the east, but they can't figure out where in the east the Cimmerians and Scythians originated. They became the European Celts, Norsk, Franks, Normans, Gauls, Jutes, Angles, Saxon, peoples.) In the Scottish Declaration of Independence, the writers mentioned their nation's mirgrations originally from old Israel.
 
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Davy

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Maybe my last post makes things a bit clearer?

Not really, because apparently you're not 'seeing' that it was the majority of the "house of Judah" that was cut off from The Gospel of Jesus Christ, which is who Paul was pointing to in Romans 11 that God blinded. Paul pretty much showed he was pointing to his brethren the Jews, the "house of Judah"...

Rom 11:28
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

KJV

Recall that Jesus said He was not sent but unto the lost sheep of the "house of Israel" (ten tribes). The Jews of the "house of Judah" (majority) rejected Jesus and The Gospel, even to this day.

If you look at the Hosea prophecies very closely, which was originally God rebuking the ten tribe "house of Israel" of how He was getting ready to end their northern kingdom, and scatter them among the Gentiles, you will discover how He would also use them to settle The Gospel among the Gentiles. This is why Apostle Paul quoted from Hosea in Romans 9 when speaking to Roman Gentile believers on Christ, showing how the ten tribes would be joined 'in The Gospel' with the Gentiles, i.e., Christ's Church.
 
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BABerean2

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Do you disagree that Ezekiel 39:17-20 and Revelation 19:17-18 are referring to the same events? If you disagree, can you prove what past event Ezekiel 39:17-20 is referring to? Do you disagree, that according to the text, when God is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel meant in that chapter, that it is meaning once He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20?

As to what you submitted from Acts, we have to keep something in mind, in regards to Israel.

Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.


Romans 11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded

The ones of the house of Israel you submitted via Acts 2 apparently would be meaning these once they were converted---the election hath obtained it. But what about the rest that were blinded, thus cut off from the good olive tree? Why would this not be meaning the house of Israel meant in Ezekiel 39? Someone has to be meaning them, and it has to be someone from the house of Israel that has not converted to Christianity by the time God executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20. Who do you see that fitting, if not the ones that were blinded?

Paul reveals two different groups of Israelites in Romans 11:1-5.
There were the Baal worshippers who turned away from the plan of God, and there was the faithful "remnant" like Paul.

There is only one way to be grafted back into the Olive Tree Church found in the passage.

Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Rom 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
Rom 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?


Based on 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, there is no Plan B of salvation based on race on the day of His Second Coming.

They must be ready before the Bridegroom comes "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know Him.


.
 
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BABerean2

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This is why Apostle Paul quoted from Hosea in Romans 9 when speaking to Roman Gentile believers on Christ, showing how the ten tribes would be joined 'in The Gospel' with the Gentiles, i.e., Christ's Church.


Was James confused when he addressed his letter to all of the tribes, who were his "brethren" in the "faith"?

Jas 1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes which are scattered abroad, greeting.
Jas 1:2 My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations;
Jas 1:3 Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.


Paul warned us to avoid genealogies in Titus 3:9, but you are ignoring his warning.



.
 
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DavidPT

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Not really, because apparently you're not 'seeing' that it was the majority of the "house of Judah" that was cut off from The Gospel of Jesus Christ, which is who Paul was pointing to in Romans 11 that God blinded. Paul pretty much showed he was pointing to his brethren the Jews, the "house of Judah"...

Rom 11:28
28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.

KJV

Recall that Jesus said He was not sent but unto the lost sheep of the "house of Israel" (ten tribes). The Jews of the "house of Judah" (majority) rejected Jesus and The Gospel, even to this day.

If you look at the Hosea prophecies very closely, which was originally God rebuking the ten tribe "house of Israel" of how He was getting ready to end their northern kingdom, and scatter them among the Gentiles, you will discover how He would also use them to settle The Gospel among the Gentiles. This is why Apostle Paul quoted from Hosea in Romans 9 when speaking to Roman Gentile believers on Christ, showing how the ten tribes would be joined 'in The Gospel' with the Gentiles, i.e., Christ's Church.

As to Ezekiel 39, whoever is meant by the house of Israel, the texts indicate God has been hiding His face from them until He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20. Has He already executed that judgment? If He has, that solves everything. That would indicate He is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel meant in Ezekiel 39. But if He hasn't already executed that judgment, how can that not mean He is still hiding His face from them to this day? How can that not mean that when He is no longer hiding His face from them, that this involves the 2nd coming of Christ?
 
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DavidPT

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Paul reveals two different groups of Israelites in Romans 11:1-5.
There were the Baal worshippers who turned away from the plan of God, and there was the faithful "remnant" like Paul.

There is only one way to be grafted back into the Olive Tree Church found in the passage.

Rom 11:20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:
Rom 11:21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.
Rom 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.
Rom 11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.
Rom 11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?


Based on 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10, there is no Plan B of salvation based on race on the day of His Second Coming.

They must be ready before the Bridegroom comes "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know Him.


.


What do we do with Ezekiel 39 then? Does it not indicate that God is hiding His face from the house of Israel meant, until He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20? Is not that judgment meaning the judgment recorded in Revelation 19:17-18? Does not the judgment recorded in Revelation 19:17-18 involve the 2nd coming?
 
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What do we do with Ezekiel 39 then?


You could ignore what is written in the New Testament to make your interpretation of Ezekiel 39 work, or you could do the opposite.

Many on this forum choose the former.

The rest of us would rather take the more clearly revealed scripture found in the New Testament as the final authority.

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Spiritual Jew

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As to Ezekiel 39, whoever is meant by the house of Israel, the texts indicate God has been hiding His face from them until He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20. Has He already executed that judgment? If He has, that solves everything. That would indicate He is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel meant in Ezekiel 39. But if He hasn't already executed that judgment, how can that not mean He is still hiding His face from them to this day? How can that not mean that when He is no longer hiding His face from them, that this involves the 2nd coming of Christ?
If you compare the following two passages, it looks to me that He is no longer hiding His face from them:

Ezekiel 39:25 “Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: I will now restore the fortunes of Jacob and will have compassion on all the people of Israel, and I will be zealous for my holy name. 26 They will forget their shame and all the unfaithfulness they showed toward me when they lived in safety in their land with no one to make them afraid. 27 When I have brought them back from the nations and have gathered them from the countries of their enemies, I will be proved holy through them in the sight of many nations. 28 Then they will know that I am the Lord their God, for though I sent them into exile among the nations, I will gather them to their own land, not leaving any behind. 29 I will no longer hide my face from them, for I will pour out my Spirit on the people of Israel, declares the Sovereign Lord.

Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. 2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. 5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. 7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans? 8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? 9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, 10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, 11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God. 12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

I don't know about you, but I see striking similarities between these 2 passages. Both talk about Jews being brought back to their homeland from many other countries. Both talk about the Holy Spirit being poured out on the people of Israel. To me, the day of Pentecost was the fulfillment of Ezekiel 39:25-29 just as it was the fulfillment of Joel 2:28-32 (see Acts 2:16-21).
 
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Davy

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As to Ezekiel 39, whoever is meant by the house of Israel, the texts indicate God has been hiding His face from them until He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20. Has He already executed that judgment? If He has, that solves everything. That would indicate He is no longer hiding His face from the House of Israel meant in Ezekiel 39. But if He hasn't already executed that judgment, how can that not mean He is still hiding His face from them to this day? How can that not mean that when He is no longer hiding His face from them, that this involves the 2nd coming of Christ?

That day of judgment is not yet. It is pointing to the "day of the Lord" when Jesus returns. That is the day of battle Zechariah 14 shows, also Rev.19, and Rev.16:15-17 on the 7th Vial. It is about the day of God's cup of wrath poured out in final.

God has still yet to open the eyes of the majority of the scattered ten tribes. The "house of Judah" (Jews) kept their heritage as Israel, even when their majority were scattered, because God said it wouldn't happen to them, so they still have knowledge of His laws and old feast days, sabbaths, etc. But the ten tribes lost that when they went into Baalism and God scattered them among the Gentiles.

You should go through the Book of Hosea about this, especially Hosea 2. And then compare it to Apostle Paul's reference of Hosea in Romans 9 when speaking to Roman Gentile believers of the Church.
 
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Davy

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What do we do with Ezekiel 39 then? Does it not indicate that God is hiding His face from the house of Israel meant, until He executes the judgment recorded in Ezekiel 39:17-20? Is not that judgment meaning the judgment recorded in Revelation 19:17-18? Does not the judgment recorded in Revelation 19:17-18 involve the 2nd coming?

Here is what you're missing. And I suggest you don't listen to those on the Forum that are out to try and hide this. It's pretty plain today for those who understand the history of what happened to the two houses in Bible prophecy and in regard to The Gospel of Jesus Christ...

Hos 2
2:1 Say ye unto your brethren, Ammi; and to your sisters, Ru-hamah.

These names refer back to the meanings given in Hoses 1. God told Hosea to take a harlot wife, and He named Hosea's children. One of the sons God said call Lo-ammi (not my people) to represent how God would cast away the ten tribe house of Israel out of His sight. A daughter born to Hosea God said name Ru-hamah (not pitied) to represent how God would not have mercy upon the ten tribe house of Israel, and would utterly take them away (captive out of the land by the kings of Assyria it would be). In Hosea 1:7, God said this punishment would not be upon the house of Judah, and thus when God brought the kings of Assyria upon the northern kingdom of Israel to remove all the ten tribes captive to Assyria, only the Jews of the house of Judah in the southern kingdom remained in the holy land.

2 Plead with your mother, plead: for she is not My wife, neither am I her husband: let her therefore put away her whoredoms out of her sight, and her adulteries from between her breasts;
3 Lest I strip her naked, and set her as in the day that she was born, and make her as a wilderness, and set her like a dry land, and slay her with thirst.
4 And I will not have mercy upon her children; for they be the children of whoredoms.

God is speaking that to the ten tribe northern kingdom of Israel, the northern kingdom He established back in 1 Kings 11 under Jeroboam of the tribe of Ephraim. In Jeremiah 3, God said He gave her (northern kingdom of Israel) a bill of divorce because of what she had done against Him, using metaphors of women's names to apply to the two kingdoms, i.e., the kingdom of Israel and the kingdom of Judah (see Ezekiel 23).


5 For their mother hath played the harlot: she that conceived them hath done shamefully: for she said, "I will go after my lovers, that give me my bread and my water, my wool and my flax, mine oil and my drink."

And thus the reason for God doing this ending of the northern kingdom of Israel, i.e., worship of her lovers (idols) of Baal. Israel deemed her wealth and support came from Baal, and not from our Heavenly Father.



6 Therefore, behold, I will hedge up thy way with thorns, and make a wall, that she shall not find her paths.

That refers to God ending the northern ten tribe kingdom of Israel, and scattering them out of the land. He would then hedge up her way of being cast out of the holy land, and she would not find her way back. Thus the ten tribes of the northern kingdom of Israel were taken captive by the Assyrians to Assyria and the lands of the Medes, and further scattered through the countries, never to return to the holy lands as a people of God. The kings of Assyria instead took peoples from five pagan province in Babylon, each with their own false god and idol, and placed them in the northern lands where the ten tribes of Israel were. These became the Samaritans, strangers not born of Israel.


7 And she shall follow after her lovers, but she shall not overtake them; and she shall seek them, but shall not find them: then shall she say, "I will go and return to my first husband; for then was it better with me than now."
8 For she did not know that I gave her corn, and wine, and oil, and multiplied her silver and gold, which they prepared for Baal.
9 Therefore will I return, and take away My corn in the time thereof, and My wine in the season thereof, and will recover My wool and My flax given to cover her nakedness.

The ten tribes being scattered among pagan idolaters, went totally into Baalism, worship of false gods and idols. The seed of all false pagan worship originates with the worship of ancient Baal. Other forms of Baal worship just have different names in different countries and languages. God's blessings left them at the same time.


10 And now will I discover her lewdness in the sight of her lovers, and none shall deliver her out of Mine hand.
11 I will also cause all her mirth to cease, her feast days, her new moons, and her sabbaths, and all her solemn feasts.
12 And I will destroy her vines and her fig trees, whereof she hath said, "These are my rewards that my lovers have given me: and I will make them a forest, and the beasts of the field shall eat them."
13 And I will visit upon her the days of Baalim, wherein she burned incense to them, and she decked herself with her earrings and her jewels, and she went after her lovers, and forgat Me, saith the LORD.

Because of that scattering of the ten tribes, and going into Baal worship, they would lose knowledge of their heritage as part of old Israel, and thus would forget God's feast days, the new moons, sabbaths, etc. She would become as a pagan Gentile people. God had actually forewarned in Deuteronomy 4 and 28 that He would do this to His people if they fell away from Him to false gods.


14 Therefore, behold, I will allure her, and bring her into the wilderness, and speak comfortably unto her.
15 And I will give her her vineyards from thence, and the valley of Achor for a door of hope: and she shall sing there, as in the days of her youth, and as in the day when she came up out of the land of Egypt.
16 And it shall be at that day, saith the LORD, that thou shalt call Me Ishi; and shalt call Me no more Baali.
17 For I will take away the names of Baalim out of her mouth, and they shall no more be remembered by their name.

That... is when God began to turn the ten tribes back to Himself, through His Son Jesus Christ. He caused the ten tribes to be scattered to new lands (mostly to the West), and after the house of Judah at Jerusalem rejected Christ Jesus, The Gospel went to the ten tribe house of Israel that was scattered among the Gentiles, and they, thinking themselves as Gentiles, received The Gospel along with Gentiles, and both together, (along with some remnants of believing Jews that were also scattered), became Christ's Church.

This is why and how the lands in Asia Minor and Europe which were sunken totally into the worship of many Baal style false idols suddenly began accepting The Gospel of Jesus Christ on national scales! This fulfilled God's prophecy to Jacob that his seed would become "a company of nations" (Gen.35:11). It happened in the Christian west, and this is what the battle of later generations against Satan's servants has been about (even with some of Satan's host right here on this forum too).


18 And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.
19 And I will betroth thee unto Me for ever; yea, I will betroth thee unto Me in righteousness, and in judgment, and in lovingkindness, and in mercies.
20 I will even betroth thee unto Me in faithfulness: and thou shalt know the LORD.
21 And it shall come to pass in that day, I will hear, saith the LORD, I will hear the heavens, and they shall hear the earth;
22 And the earth shall hear the corn, and the wine, and the oil; and they shall hear Jezreel.
23 And I will sow her unto Me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

KJV

That part in red above is what Apostle Paul quoted in Romans 9 to Roman Gentile believers on Christ Jesus, speaking of Christ's Church. It is to all believers of the 12 scattered tribes of Israel, and to Gentiles, which together make up Christ's Church today. Believers in 'all' nations on Jesus Christ are part of that.
 
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BABerean2

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Here is what you're missing. And I suggest you don't listen to those on the Forum that are out to try and hide this. It's pretty plain today for those who understand the history of what happened to the two houses in Bible prophecy and in regard to The Gospel of Jesus Christ...

Hos 2
2:1 Say ye unto your brethren, Ammi; and to your sisters, Ru-hamah.

These names refer back to the meanings given in Hoses 1. God told Hosea to take a harlot wife, and He named Hosea's children. One of the sons God said call Lo-ammi (not my people) to represent how God would cast away the ten tribe house of Israel out of His sight. A daughter born to Hosea God said name Ru-hamah (not pitied) to represent how God would not have mercy upon the ten tribe house of Israel, and would utterly take them away (captive out of the land by the kings of Assyria it would be). In Hosea 1:7, God said this punishment would not be upon the house of Judah, and thus when God brought the kings of Assyria upon the northern kingdom of Israel to remove all the ten tribes captive to Assyria, only the Jews of the house of Judah in the southern kingdom remained in the holy land.

2 Plead with your mother, plead: for she is not My wife, neither am I her husband: let her therefore put away her whoredoms out of her sight, and her adulteries from between her breasts;
3 Lest I strip her naked, and set her as in the day that she was born, and make her as a wilderness, and set her like a dry land, and slay her with thirst.
4 And I will not have mercy upon her children; for they be the children of whoredoms.

God is speaking that to the ten tribe northern kingdom of Israel, the northern kingdom He established back in 1 Kings 11 under Jeroboam of the tribe of Ephraim. In Jeremiah 3, God said He gave her (northern kingdom of Israel) a bill of divorce because of what she had done against Him, using metaphors of women's names to apply to the two kingdoms, i.e., the kingdom of Israel and the kingdom of Judah (see Ezekiel 23).


5 For their mother hath played the harlot: she that conceived them hath done shamefully: for she said, "I will go after my lovers, that give me my bread and my water, my wool and my flax, mine oil and my drink."

And thus the reason for God doing this ending of the northern kingdom of Israel, i.e., worship of her lovers (idols) of Baal. Israel deemed her wealth and support came from Baal, and not from our Heavenly Father.



6 Therefore, behold, I will hedge up thy way with thorns, and make a wall, that she shall not find her paths.

That refers to God ending the northern ten tribe kingdom of Israel, and scattering them out of the land. He would then hedge up her way of being cast out of the holy land, and she would not find her way back. Thus the ten tribes of the northern kingdom of Israel were taken captive by the Assyrians to Assyria and the lands of the Medes, and further scattered through the countries, never to return to the holy lands as a people of God. The kings of Assyria instead took peoples from five pagan province in Babylon, each with their own false god and idol, and placed them in the northern lands where the ten tribes of Israel were. These became the Samaritans, strangers not born of Israel.


7 And she shall follow after her lovers, but she shall not overtake them; and she shall seek them, but shall not find them: then shall she say, "I will go and return to my first husband; for then was it better with me than now."
8 For she did not know that I gave her corn, and wine, and oil, and multiplied her silver and gold, which they prepared for Baal.
9 Therefore will I return, and take away My corn in the time thereof, and My wine in the season thereof, and will recover My wool and My flax given to cover her nakedness.

The ten tribes being scattered among pagan idolaters, went totally into Baalism, worship of false gods and idols. The seed of all false pagan worship originates with the worship of ancient Baal. Other forms of Baal worship just have different names in different countries and languages. God's blessings left them at the same time.


10 And now will I discover her lewdness in the sight of her lovers, and none shall deliver her out of Mine hand.
11 I will also cause all her mirth to cease, her feast days, her new moons, and her sabbaths, and all her solemn feasts.
12 And I will destroy her vines and her fig trees, whereof she hath said, "These are my rewards that my lovers have given me: and I will make them a forest, and the beasts of the field shall eat them."
13 And I will visit upon her the days of Baalim, wherein she burned incense to them, and she decked herself with her earrings and her jewels, and she went after her lovers, and forgat Me, saith the LORD.

Because of that scattering of the ten tribes, and going into Baal worship, they would lose knowledge of their heritage as part of old Israel, and thus would forget God's feast days, the new moons, sabbaths, etc. She would become as a pagan Gentile people. God had actually forewarned in Deuteronomy 4 and 28 that He would do this to His people if they fell away from Him to false gods.


14 Therefore, behold, I will allure her, and bring her into the wilderness, and speak comfortably unto her.
15 And I will give her her vineyards from thence, and the valley of Achor for a door of hope: and she shall sing there, as in the days of her youth, and as in the day when she came up out of the land of Egypt.
16 And it shall be at that day, saith the LORD, that thou shalt call Me Ishi; and shalt call Me no more Baali.
17 For I will take away the names of Baalim out of her mouth, and they shall no more be remembered by their name.

That... is when God began to turn the ten tribes back to Himself, through His Son Jesus Christ. He caused the ten tribes to be scattered to new lands (mostly to the West), and after the house of Judah at Jerusalem rejected Christ Jesus, The Gospel went to the ten tribe house of Israel that was scattered among the Gentiles, and they, thinking themselves as Gentiles, received The Gospel along with Gentiles, and both together, (along with some remnants of believing Jews that were also scattered), became Christ's Church.

This is why and how the lands in Asia Minor and Europe which were sunken totally into the worship of many Baal style false idols suddenly began accepting The Gospel of Jesus Christ on national scales! This fulfilled God's prophecy to Jacob that his seed would become "a company of nations" (Gen.35:11). It happened in the Christian west, and this is what the battle of later generations against Satan's servants has been about (even with some of Satan's host right here on this forum too).


18 And in that day will I make a covenant for them with the beasts of the field, and with the fowls of heaven, and with the creeping things of the ground: and I will break the bow and the sword and the battle out of the earth, and will make them to lie down safely.
19 And I will betroth thee unto Me for ever; yea, I will betroth thee unto Me in righteousness, and in judgment, and in lovingkindness, and in mercies.
20 I will even betroth thee unto Me in faithfulness: and thou shalt know the LORD.
21 And it shall come to pass in that day, I will hear, saith the LORD, I will hear the heavens, and they shall hear the earth;
22 And the earth shall hear the corn, and the wine, and the oil; and they shall hear Jezreel.
23 And I will sow her unto Me in the earth; and I will have mercy upon her that had not obtained mercy; and I will say to them which were not my people, Thou art my people; and they shall say, Thou art my God.

KJV

That part in red above is what Apostle Paul quoted in Romans 9 to Roman Gentile believers on Christ Jesus, speaking of Christ's Church. It is to all believers of the 12 scattered tribes of Israel, and to Gentiles, which together make up Christ's Church today. Believers in 'all' nations on Jesus Christ are part of that.


Mat 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not:
Mat 10:6 But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Mat 10:7 And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand.


Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.


Gal 1:14 And profited in the Jews' religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.
Gal 1:15 But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,
Gal 1:16 To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
Gal 1:17 Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
Gal 1:18 Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.



Tit 3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.

.
 
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DavidPT

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If you compare the following two passages, it looks to me that He is no longer hiding His face from them:

Ezekiel 39:25 “Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: I will now restore the fortunes of Jacob and will have compassion on all the people of Israel, and I will be zealous for my holy name. 26 They will forget their shame and all the unfaithfulness they showed toward me when they lived in safety in their land with no one to make them afraid. 27 When I have brought them back from the nations and have gathered them from the countries of their enemies, I will be proved holy through them in the sight of many nations. 28 Then they will know that I am the Lord their God, for though I sent them into exile among the nations, I will gather them to their own land, not leaving any behind. 29 I will no longer hide my face from them, for I will pour out my Spirit on the people of Israel, declares the Sovereign Lord.

Acts 2:1 And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. 2 And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting. 3 And there appeared unto them cloven tongues like as of fire, and it sat upon each of them. 4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance. 5 And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven. 6 Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language. 7 And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans? 8 And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born? 9 Parthians, and Medes, and Elamites, and the dwellers in Mesopotamia, and in Judaea, and Cappadocia, in Pontus, and Asia, 10 Phrygia, and Pamphylia, in Egypt, and in the parts of Libya about Cyrene, and strangers of Rome, Jews and proselytes, 11 Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God. 12 And they were all amazed, and were in doubt, saying one to another, What meaneth this?

I don't know about you, but I see striking similarities between these 2 passages. Both talk about Jews being brought back to their homeland from many other countries. Both talk about the Holy Spirit being poured out on the people of Israel. To me, the day of Pentecost was the fulfillment of Ezekiel 39:25-29 just as it was the fulfillment of Joel 2:28-32 (see Acts 2:16-21).


The following is some of what I have determined from the texts, right or wrong, that I don't know.

Ezekiel 38:3-9---compare with---Ezekiel 39:2

Ezekiel 38:15-22---compare with---Ezekiel 39:2-6----Ezekiel 39:17-20

Ezekiel 38:23---compare with---Ezekiel 39:7-8---Ezekiel 39:21-23

Ezekiel 39:26---compare with---Ezekiel 38:11---Ezekiel 38:14

Ezekiel 39:23---compare to---Luke 21:20---Luke 21:24


As to the point you raise.

Luke 21:24 And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations: and Jerusalem shall be trodden down of the Gentiles, until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Is not---And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations---meaning because of what took place in 70 AD?

Why would this----because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword(Ezekiel 39:23)---not be referring to the same events as this----And they shall fall by the edge of the sword, and shall be led away captive into all nations(Luke 21:24)?


Assuming this might be correct, would this not mean Ezekiel 39:25-29 is speaking of a time post 70 AD, not a time prior to it instead? What you bring up in Acts 2 speaks of a time prior to 70 AD. Yet, it was not until 70 AD that they were given into their enemies hands, and that some of them fell by the sword, and that some of them led away captive into all nations.

Doesn't it stand to reason that if some of them are led away captive into all nations, that captivity has to come to an end at some point? Does not Ezekiel 39 prophesy the end of this captivity, such as here, below in verses 25-28?

Ezekiel 39:25 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Now will I bring again the captivity of Jacob, and have mercy upon the whole house of Israel, and will be jealous for my holy name;
26 After that they have borne their shame, and all their trespasses whereby they have trespassed against me, when they dwelt safely in their land, and none made them afraid.
27 When I have brought them again from the people, and gathered them out of their enemies' lands, and am sanctified in them in the sight of many nations;
28 Then shall they know that I am the LORD their God, which caused them to be led into captivity among the heathen: but I have gathered them unto their own land, and have left none of them any more there.


Getting back to some of the things I raised in the OP, let's start with verse 22 in Ezekiel 39---So the house of Israel shall know that I am the LORD their God from that day and forward. Is not that because of the judgment God executes per verses 17-20?

Verse 23 and 24 says---And the heathen shall know that the house of Israel went into captivity for their iniquity: because they trespassed against me, therefore hid I my face from them, and gave them into the hand of their enemies: so fell they all by the sword. According to their uncleanness and according to their transgressions have I done unto them, and hid my face from them.

When shall the heathen know that? Is it not because of the judgment God executes per verses 17-20?

Has that judgment recorded in verses 17-20 already happened?
 
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DavidPT

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You could ignore what is written in the New Testament to make your interpretation of Ezekiel 39 work, or you could do the opposite.

Many on this forum choose the former.

The rest of us would rather take the more clearly revealed scripture found in the New Testament as the final authority.

.


So, IOW, even though God was the speaker in many of the prophecies recorded in the OT, such as Ezekiel 39, the NT trumps what God said in those prophecies, therefore God was confused at the time, then got His act together and did much better in the NT than He did in the OT?
 
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BABerean2

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So, IOW, even though God was the speaker in many of the prophecies recorded in the OT, such as Ezekiel 39, the NT trumps what God said in those prophecies, therefore God was confused at the time, then got His act together and did much better in the NT than He did in the OT?


If you think the Old Testament does not agree with the New Testament, you are clearly the one who is confused.


Luk 24:25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken:
Luk 24:26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory?
Luk 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.


.
 
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