Day of The Lord - Day of Jesus' Future Return

mlepfitjw · Nov 22, 2020

Who pierced Jesus? The nation of Israel?

Timtofly · Nov 22, 2020

Davy said:
The 6th Seal does point to the time of God's cup of wrath poured out upon the wicked on the day of Christ's 2nd coming:

Rev 6:14-17
14 And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, "Fall on us, and hide us from the face of Him That sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of His wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
KJV

That "great day of His wrath" is about God's cup of wrath poured out upon the wicked on the 7th Vial, and 7th Trumpet:

7th Trumpet:
Rev 11:18
18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that Thou shouldest give reward unto Thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear Thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.
KJV

7th Vial:
Rev 16:19-21
19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of His wrath.
20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.
21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.
KJV

And that's not even taking in account those references to the end of this world about "every island fled away, and the mountains were not found" which is written in the 6th Seal example also.

I would think most people in my daily sphere of activity would definitely know something big is about to happen when they see God on the throne and the Lamb by His side appear in the air above them. Adam and Eve tried to hide from God in the nakedness of their sin. All humanity will want to do the same, even some "church folk", the moment heaven disappears and God Himself appears.

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Matt5 said:
The beast will reign for 42 months (Rev 13:5) and then Jesus returns. So no surprise when Jesus returns. We can count the days.

Maybe the "day of the lord" is not about the return of Jesus.

86 Bible verses about Day Of The Lord 86 Bible verses about Day Of The Lord

There is something else He said to consider about that timeline for the end.

Matt 24:21-22
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
KJV

That's not about some pre-trib rapture theory of man either. Lord Jesus says there the actual tribulation period will shortened for His elect's sake. He points to the timing in His Revelation, but I've found very few brethren that can stay away from men's doctrines long enough to grasp it, but its there, like an anchor, and in heavy metaphor with it in other Scriptures.

Timtofly · Nov 22, 2020

Davy said:
I have to say it; that neither of you understand God's Word about the world to come when Jesus appears from Heaven on the "day of the Lord", and man's works are burned up.

In 1 Thess.4, what did Apostle Paul preach as to Christ's coming to gather His Church? Paul showed Jesus will gather two groups of saints on that day, the asleep saints that have already died that He brings with Him (from Heaven), and then the alive saints on earth. Paul showed those asleep saints will be resurrected first, and those us still alive will in no way precede them (to the heavenly). Those of us still alive will be caught up with them with Jesus. And Zechariah 14 shows Christ's destination when He descends from Heaven on that day. It is to the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem where He ascended to Heaven from per Acts 1.

So will the still alive saints be "caught up" (raptured) in their flesh bodies??

No! This is why what Paul taught about the resurrection in 1 Corinthians 15 goes with that 1 Thess.4 event. Paul said we shall not all 'sleep' (pointing directly to those asleep saints in 1 Thess.4). But we shall ALL be changed, at the twinkling of an eye. Changed to what?

Changed to the "spiritual body" type that he taught in that 1 Cor.15 chapter. He was actually also teaching that change will happen upon ALL PEOPLES still alive on earth on that "day of the Lord" when Jesus returns. Paul when he spoke of death being swallowed up in victory, he was pulling directly from the Isaiah 25 Scripture which hints about God removing the veil that is cast over all peoples on that day. The world to come is not going to be a world where we have new flesh bodies. We all will be in a "spiritual body" type, including those still subject to the "second death" of perishing in the lake of fire.

This is WHY... God's consuming fire burning man's works off the surface of the earth is not going to literally destroy one's spirit/soul. Those still alive on that day will simply put off their flesh body, not die, but their flesh will suddenly be changed, and their spiritual body will be manifest. This is why the "second death" is the death to be worried about, because it means death to both spirit and soul.

That is the 6th Seal. The Lamb stays for the Trumpets and Thunders to gather the sheep and the wheat as well. It is the final harvest of all the living on earth. All humanity will be dead by the end of the battle of Armageddon.

The church is the first to leave, then the sheep and then the wheat. All the rest end up in Death. The Church goes to Paradise. The sheep and wheat are resurrected in Revelation 20:4.

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Agallagher said:
Who pierced Jesus? The nation of Israel?

Yes and no. It is traditionally thought that He was pointing to those who had Him crucified, with that blame upon the unbelieving Jews. But on a deeper Bible study note, the ones who followed Him around trying to trap Him all the time were the ones He said all the righteous blood of the prophets would be upon (Matthew 23). Those are the ones who deceived the rest of the people to agree to His crucifixion, and had their agents placed in the crowds to stir them up at His trial...

Matt 27:20
20 But the chief priests and elders persuaded the multitude that they should ask Barabbas, and destroy Jesus.
KJV

Mark 15:9-11
9 But Pilate answered them, saying, "Will ye that I release unto you the King of the Jews?"
10 For he knew that the chief priests had delivered Him for envy.
11 But the chief priests moved the people, that he should rather release Barabbas unto them.
KJV

Timtofly · Nov 22, 2020

sovereigngrace said:
This is the end. No one survives this.

The church survives, and the rest are resurrected in Revelation 20.

Saying "no one survives" sounds like annihilation to me. What are we not surviving? Death?

Timtofly · Nov 22, 2020

Spiritual Jew said:
I hope everyone can read this. This tells us all we need to know about how much discernment you have.

So, you get your understanding of scripture from Einstein, do you?

And you seem to throw slander around quite well. Einstein read the Bible. Einstein got his info from God's Word. You can call me crazy all you like. I answer to God, not posters on the internet. I have always been honest in my points on God's Word.

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Timtofly said:
I would think most people in my daily sphere of activity would definitely know something big is about to happen when they see God on the throne and the Lamb by His side appear in the air above them. Adam and Eve tried to hide from God in the nakedness of their sin. All humanity will want to do the same, even some "church folk", the moment heaven disappears and God Himself appears.

Yep! When the wicked see The Father sitting on His throne, that means their flesh has been cast off, and they are in the world to come, which involves the manifesting of the spiritual body type. That is how all eyes will see Jesus coming in the clouds, even those who pierced Him (Revelation 1:7).

mlepfitjw · Nov 22, 2020

Today I had a mental breakthrough of understanding the infinite ability of God to be able to save people even without ever touching the word of God, or even knowing the name of Jesus.

And people live freely their lives they have in this world, people who read scripture also have this freedom to that comes by and through the Lord and the spirit given to us by God it just amazes me to understand that no matter what someone believes personally in the end they have to answer to God, not to others, no one will answer for me when I die.

God gave me life to live freely by the spirit which is to love God and to love neighbor as self.

@Davy that cool if you believe the way you do though I will disagree, and thanks for answering me one more time, I realize that sometimes this place can be enthralling and enticing because of that little notification bar up there to and it is about time for me to stop using this site at least for a little while, cause I realized how people on the internet can be to much to handle.

real life is more leisure life ahhh take it one day at at a time.

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Timtofly said:
That is the 6th Seal. The Lamb stays for the Trumpets and Thunders to gather the sheep and the wheat as well. It is the final harvest of all the living on earth. All humanity will be dead by the end of the battle of Armageddon.

The church is the first to leave, then the sheep and then the wheat. All the rest end up in Death. The Church goes to Paradise. The sheep and wheat are resurrected in Revelation 20:4.

No, that's not the way God's Word declares it will happen. The "day of the Lord" is about a number of events that happen on the last day of this present world, and they happen very quickly, probably taking no more than an hour to complete.

1. Christ's 2nd coming with the "asleep" saints from the Heavenly that are resurrected.
2. Then Christ and those descend from Heaven to the earth.
3. On their way to earth, Jesus changes the alive saints on earth to their spiritual body and gathers them to Him and His resurrected saints.
4. Jesus with ALL His saints go to Jerusalem where His feet touch down upon the Mount of Olives where He ascended to Heaven from.
5. God's consuming fire burns mans works up, and the flesh of the wicked, but not their spirit with soul.
6. The Heavenly dimension is revealed to 'all' on earth, and they will see Jesus coming in the clouds with His saints.
7. The "resurrection of damnation" about the wicked are raised on that day too.
8. Then Christ's future "thousand years" reign with His elect over all peoples on earth will begin, here, not up in the sky.

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Agallagher said:
Today I had a mental breakthrough of understanding the infinite ability of God to be able to save people even without ever touching the word of God, or even knowing the name of Jesus.

And people live freely their lives they have in this world, people who read scripture also have this freedom to that comes by and through the Lord and the spirit given to us by God it just amazes me to understand that no matter what someone believes personally in the end they have to answer to God, not to others, no one will answer for me when I die.

God gave me life to live freely by the spirit which is to love God and to love neighbor as self.

@Davy that cool if you believe the way you do though I will disagree, and thanks for answering me one more time, I realize that sometimes this place can be enthralling and enticing because of that little notification bar up there to and it is about time for me to stop using this site at least for a little while, cause I realized how people on the internet can be to much to handle.

real life is more leisure life ahhh take it one day at at a time.

Peace to you in Christ Jesus brother.

Timtofly · Nov 22, 2020

Davy said:
Yep! When the wicked see The Father sitting on His throne, that means their flesh has been cast off, and they are in the world to come, which involves the manifesting of the spiritual body type. That is how all eyes will see Jesus coming in the clouds, even those who pierced Him (Revelation 1:7).

Except these are those alive today. They have not died physically but over the course of a few years all will die. The last to die, being those same people in seal 6, who asked who can save us, will be destroyed at the battle of Armageddon. The answer is no one. They rejected God's Atonement and tried to save themselves, but it did not work out for them.

Timtofly · Nov 22, 2020

Davy said:
No, that's not the way God's Word declares it will happen. The "day of the Lord" is about a number of events that happen on the last day of this present world, and they happen very quickly, probably taking no more than an hour to complete.

1. Christ's 2nd coming with the "asleep" saints from the Heavenly that are resurrected.
2. Then Christ and those descend from Heaven to the earth.
3. On their way to earth, Jesus changes the alive saints on earth to their spiritual body and gathers them to Him and His resurrected saints.
4. Jesus with ALL His saints go to Jerusalem where His feet touch down upon the Mount of Olives where He ascended to Heaven from.
5. God's consuming fire burns mans works up, and the flesh of the wicked, but not their spirit with soul.
6. The Heavenly dimension is revealed to 'all' on earth, and they will see Jesus coming in the clouds with His saints.
7. The "resurrection of damnation" about the wicked are raised on that day too.
8. Then Christ's future "thousand years" reign with His elect over all peoples on earth will begin, here, not up in the sky.

You are skipping over most of Revelation including the Trumpets, the Thunders, and Satan's 42 months.

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Timtofly said:
Except these are those alive today. They have not died physically but over the course of a few years all will die. The last to die, being those same people in seal 6, who asked who can save us, will be destroyed at the battle of Armageddon. The answer is no one. They rejected God's Atonement and tried to save themselves, but it did not work out for them.

Those who say that, the wicked, on the 6th Seal, also include the unbelieving Jews in Jerusalem, for those are who Jesus showed will wish for the hills and mountains to fall upon them...

Luke 23:26-31
26 And as they led Him away, they laid hold upon one Simon, a Cyrenian, coming out of the country, and on him they laid the cross, that he might bear it after Jesus.

27 And there followed Him a great company of people, and of women, which also bewailed and lamented Him.

28 But Jesus turning unto them said, "Daughters of Jerusalem, weep not for Me, but weep for yourselves, and for your children.

29 For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, 'Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.'

30 Then shall they begin to say to the mountains, "Fall on us"; and to the hills, "Cover us."

31 For if they do these things in a green tree, what shall be done in the dry?
KJV

Yet I do not consider that sudden destruction on the day of the Lord meaning a destruction of their spirit/soul, but only their flesh, like the Zechariah 14 Scripture reveals. The nations deceived by the Antichrist at the end of this world are going to be present for Christ's future "thousand years" reign, and they won't have flesh bodies.

Men's traditions in the Church have cause many to miss this, but this is where Paul was pulling from about the idea of death being swallowed up in victory in regards to the day of Christ's return. It's not just for the Church, it is for all peoples. But Rev.20 stipulates not all then will have put on immortality in Christ Jesus. Those wicked will still be subject to the "second death", i.e., the death of their spirit with soul in the lake of fire.

Isa 25:5-9
5 Thou shalt bring down the noise of strangers, as the heat in a dry place; even the heat with the shadow of a cloud: the branch of the terrible ones shall be brought low.

6 And in this mountain shall the LORD of hosts make unto all people a feast of fat things, a feast of wines on the lees, of fat things full of marrow, of wines on the lees well refined.

7 And He will destroy in this mountain the face of the covering cast over all people, and the vail that is spread over all nations.
8 He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of His people shall He take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it.

9 And it shall be said in that day, "Lo, this is our God; we have waited for Him, and He will save us: this is the LORD; we have waited for Him, we will be glad and rejoice in His salvation."
KJV

Davy · Nov 22, 2020

Timtofly said:
You are skipping over most of Revelation including the Trumpets, the Thunders, and Satan's 42 months.

Impossible for me to cover every word of Scripture in Revelation here. That is against the rules of this forum if you didn't know that. So your accusation really doesn't have any merit.

Douggg · Nov 22, 2020

Agallagher said:
Who pierced Jesus? The nation of Israel?

It was the Romans. When Jesus returns, among those armies that assemble to make war on Jesus - the EU army, the end times version of the Roman Empire.

The Roman Empire at the first century covered Europe, North Africa, the Middle East. In Revelation 13, the beast coming out of the sea, made up of the components of the 3 other empires in Daniel 7, is the end times Roman Empire, that will have gained control of the oil rich nations in the middle east and north africa (libya) - essentially replicating the first century Roman Empire.

Matt5 · Nov 22, 2020

Davy said:
But that "day of the Lord" is about Jesus' return.

In 2 Thessalonians 2, the "day of Christ" is actually the "day of the Lord" phrase, because the KJV "Christ" there is actually the Greek word 'kurios' which means 'lord':

I guess the 86 verses didn't impress you.

Why are the accumulated references to the return of Jesus in the Bible so weird?

If a reference to the return of Jesus is actually about the return of Jesus then we are pretty much left with no insight. You know you need to watch for his return but don't understand why. You can't fully understand what it means to watch and be ready. You have to guess but can never be sure.

Something else is going on.

lsume · Nov 22, 2020

Davy said:
Just in case, since some abuse that Hebrews 9:28 Scripture to wrongly point to a rapture prior to the tribulation, there is only one more coming (Greek parousia) of our Lord Jesus Christ, and it will be after the tribulation to end this present world, on the "day of the Lord". That timing specifically is what my OP here is about, that "day of the Lord" timing per God's Word.

This is why He showed us in Revelation 1:7 through His servant John that every eye shall see His coming in the clouds, even those who pierced Him...

Rev 1:5-7
5 And from Jesus Christ, Who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto Him That loved us, and washed us from our sins in His own blood,
6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and His Father; to Him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
7 Behold, He cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see Him, and they also which pierced Him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.
KJV

So Christ's coming, His only time of return, will be seen also... by the wicked on earth. It will NOT be some secret rapture, an idea dreamed up by those abuse that "to those who look for Him" phrase.

I do not currently believe in the standard description of rapture theology . The meek shall inherit the earth. There are numerous Scriptures that Speak of the evil being removed.

mlepfitjw · Nov 22, 2020

Davy is there any scripture that allows us as believers to have authority in the Bible? It was a question brought up by my teacher last night when I was listening to him speak about Anarchy.

Spiritual Jew · Nov 22, 2020

Timtofly said:
And you seem to throw slander around quite well. Einstein read the Bible. Einstein got his info from God's Word. You can call me crazy all you like. I answer to God, not posters on the internet. I have always been honest in my points on God's Word.

How did I slander you? You said you believe the earth is flat and you get understanding from Einstein. It would be slander if I said that you said those things but you actually didn't. But, I was just repeating what you said, so that is not slander.

Day of The Lord - Day of Jesus' Future Return

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