Do stance for abortion is legal or illegal makes a person right before God ?

SANTOSO

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Have we not heard this :
ALL WE LIKE SHEEP HAVE GONE ASTRAY; we have turned'every one'to his own way; and the LORD has laid on Him ( Christ ) the iniquity of us all. -Isaiah 53:6

Why are we not concerned ourselves about God who gave Christ who bear our iniquities?

how shall we escape if we IGNORE such a deliverance ? This deliverance which was first declared by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him ( Christ ), -Hebrews 2:3 CJB

How do we free our feet from this net regarding abortion ?

This is what we have heard:
My eyes are ever toward the LORD, for He will PLUCK my feet OUT of the net. -Psalms 25:15

Though anyone may have a complaint against someone else regarding abortion, indeed we are told to bear with one another or forgive him/her.

As we have heard:
bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive. -Colossians 3:13

Why hold grudges or be annoyed or being mean at those who support legalism of abortion or not ?

Is this not that we are told:
But now, put them all away: ANGER, exasperation or ANNOYANCE, MEANNESS, SLANDER, and obscene talk. -Colossians 3:8 CJB

Why continue to live in the dark and hate our brothers and sisters regarding abortion is legal or not?

Remember what the Lord have said :
A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another. -John 13:34

By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another." -John 13:35

Are not many whether male or female, felt alone and oppressed after abortion? Whether abortion is the result of self indulgence or whether it is because of unintended actions ! Are not many still bearing guilt on their consciences and reminded year after year ?

What do then sin confronts us all the time ? Can we not come before God like David, to be washed completely from these guilt and be cleansed from our sins ?

Are we saying that we are righteous from the moment our mother conceived us ?

Why is this written:
Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me. -Psalms 51:5

Are we also to judge those who do not go for abortion? Let us not do that.

Are we not needed to be rescued and cry like David to God :

Deliver me from bloodguiltiness,
O God, O God of my salvation,
and my tongue will sing aloud of Your righteousness. -Psalms 51:14

Yes, we should lean to God’s righteousness not on our own in regard to this abortion issue !

Even if abortion is made legal, our righteousness of our own should not be based on legalism, but we should be found in Christ and having righteousness which comes through Christ’s faithfulness, the righteousness from God based on trust, as we have heard in Philippians 3:9.

Is love about indulging ourselves with sensuality ? Should we be advocating this ? Should this be called sex education that we train our children and call this: the way of the Lord ? Are we to profane the way of the Lord and excuse ourselves with so called prevention?

It may be necessary to wear condom for helpful prevention but we should not neglect the weightier matter of justice, mercy and faithfulness, spoken by the Lord in Matthew 23:23.

Do we not hate our life in this world ? Do we not hate our disgusting practices of self indulgence or self love ? Do we not hate to be ashamed for we suffer what we have done wrong?

Do we not hate to be always condemned in this world ?

This is what our Lord have spoken:
Whoever loves his life loses it, and whoever hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life. -John 12:25

That is why we hate our life in this world and we no longer love the life that was full of indulgence and self love.

And we love the new life that the Lord gives that we died to sin, and live for His righteousness and by His wounds, our hearts are healed.

In this new life, we should serve the Lord in the way of the Spirit.

As we have heard:
and he died for all, that those who live might no longer live for themselves but for Him ( Christ ) who for their sake died and was raised. -2 Corinthians 5:15

Yes, the Lord Jesus Christ died for our sake and was raised again.

For we heard about circumcision:
For neither circumcision counts for anything, nor uncircumcision, but a new creation. -Galatians 6:15

For neither circumcision counts for anything nor uncircumcision, but keeping the commandments of God. -1 Corinthians 7:19

Likewise, for neither abortion counts for anything, nor not having abortion but keeping the commandments of God and being a new creation is of essence.

The Lord Jesus Christ bears our iniquities of abortion or not having abortion. It is of importance that we should repent in true contrition and wholeheartedly like David.

After we have been washed by Christ’s blood, we will be whiter than snow. Let us hear the sound of joy and gladness so that the bones God crushed can rejoice.

We should be glad that the Lord turn His face from all our sins and blot out our crimes.

Humbled, we should ask the Lord :

Create in me a clean heart, God; renew in me a resolute spirit. -Psalms 51:10 CJB

Remember what the Lord has spoken:
But you will receive POWER when the Holy Spirit has COME UPON you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth." -Acts 1:8

Likewise, we have heard:
until the Spirit is poured upon us from on high, and the wilderness becomes a fruitful field, and the fruitful field is deemed a forest. -Isaiah 32:15

Then justice will dwell in the wilderness, and righteousness abide in the fruitful field. -Isaiah 32:16

And the effect of righteousness will be peace, and the result of righteousness, quietness and trust forever. -Isaiah 32:17

My people will abide in a peaceful habitation, in secure dwellings, and in quiet resting places. -Isaiah 32:18

Let not those along the path who hear the message of Christ; then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved.

Let not those who hear the message receive it with joy but those people have no root; they believe for a while, and in time of testing fall away.

Let not those who hear the message of Christ as they go on their way they are choked by the cares and riches and pleasures of life, and their fruit does not mature.

But let those who are hearing the message of Christ, hold it fast in an honest and good heart, and bear fruit with patience. These people are the ones receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon them and have considered the days are evil and understand the will of the Lord to be continuously filled with the Spirit.

Then that wilderness of our hearts will become a fertile field then we are justified by God’s righteousness, that is, our Lord Jesus Christ. The Lord Jesus Christ will dwell in our heart, as spoken in Ephesians 3:17.

And in union with Christ, the field of our hearts will be fruitful. The effects of Christ’s righteousness will be peace and the result of Christ’s righteousness will be quietness and trust forever.

And we will be Christ’s people that will abide in a peaceful habitation, in secure dwellings, and in quiet resting places. And this is what we have heard:

"You have led in Your steadfast love the people whom You have redeemed; You have guided them by Your strength to Your holy abode. -Exodus 15:13

Yes, the Holy Spirit will guide us by His power to His Holy abode.

Let us serve God in the way of the Spirit and takes hold of His gracious promise, that is,

You shall serve the LORD your God, and He will bless your bread and your water, and I will take sickness away from among you. -Exodus 23:25

NONE SHALL MISCARRY or BE BARREN in your land; I will fulfill the number of your days. -Exodus 23:26

How about the law of abortion?
If you are still reminded about the law, remember this :

Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us'for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who is hanged on a tree"' -Galatians 3:13

SO THAT in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might COME TO the Gentiles, so that we might RECEIVE THE PROMISED SPIRIT through faith. -Galatians 3:14

If we live by the Holy Spirit, we will put to death the practice of the body, we will live.

Let us not forget this, too:
submitting to one another out of reverence for Christ. -Ephesians 5:21

Let us not contend one another with abortion legality but let us understand the fear of the Lord that can turn us away from evil of abortion.

By steadfast love and faithfulness iniquity is atoned for, and by THE FEAR OF THE LORD one turns away from evil. -Proverbs 16:6

Heed what our Heavenly Father has said in Proverbs 2:1-5; For He gives wisdom, that is, Christ and from His mouth will come knowledge of Christ and understanding of living to be set apart for Christ.

What should we do when many still contend with their tongues about abortion legality ?

Meditate this:
Oh, how abundant is your goodness, which you have stored up FOR THOSE WHO FEAR YOU and worked FOR THOSE WHO TAKE REFUGE IN YOU, in the sight of the children of mankind! -Psalms 31:19

IN THE COVER OF YOUR PRESENCE you hide them from the plots of men; you store them IN YOUR SHELTER from the strife of tongues. -Psalms 31:20

Receive the Lord’s goodness which God has prepared to those who walk in the fear of Him.
Take refuge under His wings.
Hide yourself in the presence of God.
Take shelter in the shadow of the Almighty God.

In Christ’s righteousness, He will bring you out of distress.
For He will consider your affliction, suffering and take all your sins away.

Cry out to God like David:
Consider how many are my foes, and with what violent hatred they hate me. -Psalms 25:19

Oh, guard my soul, and deliver me! Let me not be put to shame, for I take refuge in you. -Psalms 25:20

May integrity and uprightness preserve me, for I wait for you. -Psalms 25:21

God will redeem us from all our troubles including troubles of abortion, as He has promised in Psalms 25:22
 

Melody Suttles

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I see a very tragic thing happening to our unsuspecting and uninformed young girls; our smart but indoctrinated women, and many beautiful babies. I would encourage Christians that I know, to pray for God's wisdom concerning this matter of abortion and that He would let us see every girl, doctor, nurse, and lawmaker through the eyes of Christ. Yes, everyone whose ever lived has failed God - everyone is lost and in need of a Savior.

BUT that said; there is a truth many believers don't know - very few to none of our pulpits have ever taught or preached about it. That being the abortions done as child sacrifice in ancient Canaan.
There is archaeological proof as well as documented eye-witness accounts, and several mentions in the Old Testament. The OT parents, much like parents today, sacrificed their infants - burned them alive in the fires of the god Molech in exchange for an an increase in personal monies/crops/work/lands. Today, mothers don't want the added expense and responsibility. They want their freedom and their 'rights'. Their babies are burned alive also, but with chemicals instead of coals.

Evidence confirms that there were tens of thousands of babies and children sacrificed to Molech. Yet, since 1978, the US has sacrificed more than 60 million.

I was one of those lost young women - 37 years ago - before I came to know Christ. I was unwed and just a teenager. But to this day I feel a loss for what I did. I wept bitterly when I woke from the procedure. Many women walk out of there having no more baby - but having their world crack wide open - their hearts torn in two - and no one to confide in. That was me. So I understand so much about this issue.

I understand how lost a woman can find herself and not realize she has choices. But at the same time, I've seen too many Christians become desensitized over the years - by keeping their heads low and avoiding addressing the issue, we have removed the obstacle to these laws getting passed. I suppose I have downplayed the gravity of abortion when a young friend of my boys was making her choice. She wasn't mine to instruct. So I prayed alone. In the eyes of the Lord, how must we appear - avoiding conflict - avoiding the enemy. Becoming lukewarm...??? God help me, I don't want to go down that road.

Dear Lord Jesus, by the power of your Holy Spirit, shake us out of the stupor and the cloud of doubt which the enemy, Satan has placed upon the eyes and ears of all your people who did not choose to stand and stay rooted and grounded in the Word. But Lord, you are merciful and forgiving. Set me upright again and give me boldness in grace. In Jesus' name Amen.



Here are some useful links to fact-check me. God bless and lots 'a love.

At the Altar of Moloch

New York’s new abortion law and child sacrifice


Leviticus 18:21
You shall not give any of your children to offer them to Molech, and so profane the name of your God: I am the Lord.

Deuteronomy 12:31
You shall not worship the Lord your God in that way, for every abominable thing that the Lord hates they have done for their gods, for they even burn their sons and their daughters in the fire to their gods.

Ezekiel 16:20-21
And you took your sons and your daughters, whom you had borne to me, and these you sacrificed to them to be devoured. Were your whorings so small a matter that you slaughtered my children and delivered them up as an offering by fire to them?

Leviticus 20:1-5
The Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Say to the people of Israel, Any one of the people of Israel or of the strangers who sojourn in Israel who gives any of his children to Molech shall surely be put to death. The people of the land shall stone him with stones. I myself will set my face against that man and will cut him off from among his people, because he has given one of his children to Molech, to make my sanctuary unclean and to profane my holy name. And if the people of the land do at all close their eyes to that man when he gives one of his children to Molech, and do not put him to death, then I will set my face against that man and against his clan and will cut them off from among their people, him and all who follow him in whoring after Molech.

Jeremiah 7:31
And they have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, which I did not command, nor did it come into my mind.

Psalm 106:37-38
They sacrificed their sons and their daughters to the demons; they poured out innocent blood, the blood of their sons and daughters, whom they sacrificed to the idols of Canaan, and the land was polluted with blood.
 
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Sabertooth

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Do stance for abortion is legal or illegal makes a person right before God?
One's politics does not prove or disprove one's standing with God.

Once a Christian understands that aborting a baby (outside of a threat to the mother's safety) is murder, it should be unconscionable to them. If a Christian KNOWS that it is murder, but still doesn't object, that is plenty grounds for questioning his/her Christianity.

Not all Christians have that revelation. And there are Fetal Rights' Democrats & pro-abortion Republicans, too.
 
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SANTOSO

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I see a very tragic thing happening to our unsuspecting and uninformed young girls; our smart but indoctrinated women, and many beautiful babies. I would encourage Christians that I know, to pray for God's wisdom concerning this matter of abortion and that He would let us see every girl, doctor, nurse, and lawmaker through the eyes of Christ. Yes, everyone whose ever lived has failed God - everyone is lost and in need of a Savior.

BUT that said; there is a truth many believers don't know - very few to none of our pulpits have ever taught or preached about it. That being the abortions done as child sacrifice in ancient Canaan.
There is archaeological proof as well as documented eye-witness accounts, and several mentions in the Old Testament. The OT parents, much like parents today, sacrificed their infants - burned them alive in the fires of the god Molech in exchange for an an increase in personal monies/crops/work/lands. Today, mothers don't want the added expense and responsibility. They want their freedom and their 'rights'. Their babies are burned alive also, but with chemicals instead of coals.

Evidence confirms that there were tens of thousands of babies and children sacrificed to Molech. Yet, since 1978, the US has sacrificed more than 60 million.

I was one of those lost young women - 37 years ago - before I came to know Christ. I was unwed and just a teenager. But to this day I feel a loss for what I did. I wept bitterly when I woke from the procedure. Many women walk out of there having no more baby - but having their world crack wide open - their hearts torn in two - and no one to confide in. That was me. So I understand so much about this issue.

I understand how lost a woman can find herself and not realize she has choices. But at the same time, I've seen too many Christians become desensitized over the years - by keeping their heads low and avoiding addressing the issue, we have removed the obstacle to these laws getting passed. I suppose I have downplayed the gravity of abortion when a young friend of my boys was making her choice. She wasn't mine to instruct. So I prayed alone. In the eyes of the Lord, how must we appear - avoiding conflict - avoiding the enemy. Becoming lukewarm...??? God help me, I don't want to go down that road.

Dear Lord Jesus, by the power of your Holy Spirit, shake us out of the stupor and the cloud of doubt which the enemy, Satan has placed upon the eyes and ears of all your people who did not choose to stand and stay rooted and grounded in the Word. But Lord, you are merciful and forgiving. Set me upright again and give me boldness in grace. In Jesus' name Amen.



Here are some useful links to fact-check me. God bless and lots 'a love.

At the Altar of Moloch

New York’s new abortion law and child sacrifice


Leviticus 18:21
You shall not give any of your children to offer them to Molech, and so profane the name of your God: I am the Lord.

Deuteronomy 12:31
You shall not worship the Lord your God in that way, for every abominable thing that the Lord hates they have done for their gods, for they even burn their sons and their daughters in the fire to their gods.

Ezekiel 16:20-21
And you took your sons and your daughters, whom you had borne to me, and these you sacrificed to them to be devoured. Were your whorings so small a matter that you slaughtered my children and delivered them up as an offering by fire to them?

Leviticus 20:1-5
The Lord spoke to Moses, saying, “Say to the people of Israel, Any one of the people of Israel or of the strangers who sojourn in Israel who gives any of his children to Molech shall surely be put to death. The people of the land shall stone him with stones. I myself will set my face against that man and will cut him off from among his people, because he has given one of his children to Molech, to make my sanctuary unclean and to profane my holy name. And if the people of the land do at all close their eyes to that man when he gives one of his children to Molech, and do not put him to death, then I will set my face against that man and against his clan and will cut them off from among their people, him and all who follow him in whoring after Molech.

Jeremiah 7:31
And they have built the high places of Topheth, which is in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire, which I did not command, nor did it come into my mind.

Psalm 106:37-38
They sacrificed their sons and their daughters to the demons; they poured out innocent blood, the blood of their sons and daughters, whom they sacrificed to the idols of Canaan, and the land was polluted with blood.

Dear Melody,
in today’s culture, many are deceived by the passions of the old nature and have obeyed the wishes of the old nature and their own thoughts — these abusers and victims of abortion, we long that the Lord rescue them all.

Let us hold to this promise as we pray for them:
Consequently, He ( Christ) is able to save to the uttermost those who draw near to God through Him ( Christ), since He ( Christ) always lives to make intercession for them. -Hebrews 7:25

Interceding means that pleading on behalf of the offenders or sinners, yes, that is what our Lord Jesus Christ in the heavens as the Great and High priest doing for us, now; that we may receive this grace of repentance and be redeemed from all condemnation, guilt and shame. As we have heard:

Therefore, there is no longer condemnation awaiting those who are in union with Christ Jesus. -Romans 8:1 CJB

Many abusers and victims of abortion are called murders or manslayers ! True enough, we were in ignorance despite being told and were lured and enticed by our own desires, and gives birth to sin. Thereafter, whether male and or female unable to accept the reality of shame and responsibility, made dreadful decisions of abortion and bearing on conscience this guilt.

Despite that, we have heard this :

Then the LORD said to Joshua, -Joshua 20:1

"Say to the people of Israel, 'Appoint the cities of refuge, of which I spoke to you through Moses, -Joshua 20:2

that the manslayer who strikes any person without intent or unknowingly may flee there. They shall be for you a refuge from the avenger of blood. -Joshua 20:3

He shall flee to one of these cities and shall stand at the entrance of the gate of the city and explain his case to the elders of that city. Then they shall take him into the city and give him a place, and he shall remain with them. -Joshua 20:4

And if the avenger of blood pursues him, they shall not give up the manslayer into his hand, because he struck his neighbor unknowingly, and did not hate him in the past. -Joshua 20:5

And he shall remain in that city until he has stood before the congregation for judgment, until the death of him who is high priest at the time. Then the manslayer may return to his own town and his own home, to the town from which he fled.'" -Joshua 20:6

Where is the city of refuge?

This is what we have heard:
"You have led in your steadfast love the people whom you have redeemed; you have guided them by your strength to your holy abode. -Exodus 15:13

I was glad when they said to me, "Let us go to the house of the LORD!" -Psalms 122:1
Our feet have been standing within your gates, O Jerusalem! -Psalms 122:2

But I, through the abundance of your steadfast love, will enter your house. I will bow down toward your holy temple in the fear of you. -Psalms 5:7

The Holy Spirit will guide us to His holy abode, that is, the house of the Lord and that our feet may stand within the gates of Jerusalem, the city of the great King Jesus Christ.

who may enter the new Jerusalem? This is what we have heard the Lord have said :

So Jesus again said to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, I am the door of the sheep. -John 10:7
All who came before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not listen to them. -John 10:8
I am the door. If anyone enters by me, he will be saved and will go in and out and find pasture. -John 10:9

Let us enter by Christ Jesus, we will be saved and go in and out and find pasture.

We must learn what the Lord has done for us :
In the days of his flesh, Jesus offered up prayers and supplications, with loud cries and tears, to him who was able to save him from death, and he was heard because of his reverence. -Hebrews 5:7
Although he was a son, he learned obedience through what he suffered. -Hebrews 5:8
And being made perfect, he became the source of eternal salvation to all who obey him, -Hebrews 5:9
being designated by God a high priest after the order of Melchizedek. -Hebrews 5:10

Likewise, as the sheep of the Lord Jesus Christ, being adopted as son of the living God through Christ, we must learn obedience through what we suffer.

That means if we suffer for what is wrong, we repent, get back to the Lord‘s side and that we may be found in His grace and righteousness.

If you suffer for what is right, that means after, we repent, and people still hate us and prosecute us — we suffer for what is right or for righteousness’ sake or Christ’s sake.

If you felt this suffering too much or this cross too heavy, remember this:
Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me, for I am gentle and lowly in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. -Matthew 11:29

when we take the Lord’s yoke and learn from Him, we find rest for our souls or minds.

It is true that it is better that no one pursue the passions of the youth but pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace.

And that many don’t involve themselves with abortion controversy that breed quarrel. Rather we should be kind to everyone, have the ability to teach, patiently enduring being said evil by our opponents,
and correcting our opponents with gentleness.

That we may receive this:
God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth, -2 Timothy 2:25
and they may come to their senses and escape from the snare of the devil, after being captured by him to do his will. -2 Timothy 2:26

I understand that many abusers and victims of abortion especially long to have children but some were reported unable to have children.

After repentance, they may perhaps have questions whether the Lord would allow them.

This is what the psalmist have said in faith:
Remember your word to your servant, in which you have made me hope. -Psalms 119:49
This is my comfort in my affliction, that your promise gives me life. -Psalms 119:50

When I think of your rules from of old, I take comfort, O LORD. -Psalms 119:52

What is the promise of God that give life ?
This is what we have heard:

You shall serve the LORD your God, and he will bless your bread and your water, and I will take sickness away from among you. -Exodus 23:25
 
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SANTOSO

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-Continue from previous

None shall miscarry or be barren in your land; I will fulfill the number of your days. -Exodus 23:26

I would suggest married couples to give to orphan children.
When you give the Lord, the Lord know what you are doing.

Likewise, I would suggest when they meet baby or children from Christian families, they should humble themselves and ask the parents of the children to bless their womb.
Though you may cry, continue to humble before the Lord and others, that you may find God’s grace.

Every act or deed do in honor and rightly, I believe the Lord know the heart and He will answer prayers.
 
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SANTOSO

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One's politics does not prove or disprove one's standing with God.

Once a Christian understands that aborting a baby (outside of a threat to the mother's safety) is murder, it should be unconscionable to them. If a Christian KNOWS that it is murder, but still doesn't object, that is plenty grounds for questioning his/her Christianity.

Not all Christians have that revelation. And there are Fetal Rights' Democrats & pro-abortion Republicans, too.

The politicians may draft fetal rights and pro abortion policy.

What would the Lord have said :

But let the politicians who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at these people caught in abortion.
 
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Sabertooth

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But let the politicians who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at these people caught in abortion.
There is a big difference between "casting the first stone" (which we are not qualified to do) and knowingly ENDORSING it.

Your argument is against capital punishment generally. However murder is to be punished, it must be understood that feticide is homicide. It is only justified when his/her mother's safety is threatened.

Do YOU understand that it is homicide and when not medically necessary, it is therefore murder?
 
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Melody Suttles

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This is what the psalmist have said in faith:
Remember your word to your servant, in which you have made me hope. -Psalms 119:49
This is my comfort in my affliction, that your promise gives me life. -Psalms 119:50

When I think of your rules from of old, I take comfort, O LORD. -Psalms 119:52

What is the promise of God that give life ?
This is what we have heard:

You shall serve the LORD your God, and he will bless your bread and your water, and I will take sickness away from among you. -Exodus 23:25[/QUOTE]


Santoso, thank you for that. I agree with all my heart. Yes, intercession is so important. We who are grafted into the vine seek with all our hearts to serve the Lord and in time, we follow little rabbit holes... find ourselves following our old slave-master - until we hear that sweet Holy Spirit and are able to cry out to God for his mercies and salvation... to set our feet back onto his road. He is so kind and gracious and loving and forgiving.

Yes, we intercede for these poor girls and women, Lord, who have been so deceived that they find themselves in a dark place. But Lord, I am waiting for that revival. Lord, I ask that you open the eyes of this generation of women that has been so deceived. Lord, expose the enemy and his lies. Expose corruption and reach down and touch these precious girls - for they don't know how to see that you are right there. Make the church and the world aware of the truth - make it clear, Lord so that your kingdom will increase. Abba, I am so excited to see the greatest, broadest, and most powerful revival this nation has ever known - the world wild will watch and be amazed because millennials will be swept up in the power of the holy ghost and the anointing that breaks every yoke of bondage. Gender confusion will dissipate in an instant. Thousands will weep and dance for joy because they know you have touched them and healed them. Deliver those tormented by demons. Make this generation of millennials that was so confused and angry, an army of disciples - walking and living out grace - spreading your Word; making believers out of non-believers; healing the sick; making blind eyes see; raising the dead. And Lord, nothing shall by any means harm them. They will be the foolish things of this world which confound the wise. And you will get all the glory! In Jesus name, Amen.
 
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There is a big difference between "casting the first stone" (which we are not qualified to do) and knowingly ENDORSING it.

Your argument is against capital punishment generally. However murder is to be punished, it must be understood that feticide is homicide. It is only justified when his/her mother's safety is threatened.

Do YOU understand that it is homicide and when not medically necessary, it is therefore murder?

When we heard the Lord have said this :
And as they continued to ask him, he stood up and said to them, "Let him who is without sin among you be the first to throw a stone at her." -John 8:7

The Lord neither endorse adultery or abortion this matter that we discuss.

That is why the Lord have said :
Go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.' For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners." -Matthew 9:13

True enough, many have practiced abortion in the way that they once lived.
If many whether male or female have truly repented like the woman who was caught in the act of adultery and brought to Jesus as mentioned in John 8:1-11, Jesus do not condemn her as He do not condemn them; why you continue to condemn them?

Are you now casting the first stone to call these persons murderers ? Are you just justifying only to those mother’s life are threatened? Are you saying that Jesus only justifies the woman caught in the adultery because she was threatened ?

Have you not understood that the Lord desire mercy and not sacrifice ? Are you now sacrificing all who commit abortions for your personal righteousness?

Do God not desire sinners to come to repentance? For the Lord Jesus Christ have called all sinners including those who commit abortions with His grace of repentance.

Remember the Lord’s caution :
And he cautioned them, saying, "Watch out; beware of the leaven of the Pharisees and the leaven of Herod." -Mark 8:15

Who are the Pharisee and Herod in today’s world ? Are they not those who hold onto the office of religion and politics.

Are you seeking righteousness for those unnamed fetus or babies ? We only come to know the righteousness that come from God, that is, the Lord Jesus Christ.

This is what we have heard :

God chose what is low and despised in the world, even things that are not, to bring to nothing things that are, -1 Corinthians 1:28
so that no human being might boast in the presence of God. -1 Corinthians 1:29

What is low and despised in the world ? Are they not those unnamed fetus and babies ?
If God has chosen, it means that He has predestined.
This is what we have heard:
For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. -Romans 8:29
And those whom He predestined He also called, and those whom He called He also justified, and those whom He justified He also glorified. -Romans 8:30

It is because of God that these babies are in Christ Jesus, who has become for them wisdom from God–that is, their righteousness, holiness and redemption.
 
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Sabertooth

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Your last post still challenges the nature of judicial punishment, not the fact that feticide should be recognized as homicide (and should be discouraged).

You end up offering more compassion to the killer than to the person being killed. Is that what God wants you to do?

We may not qualify to throw the first stone, but neither does the doctor (when not medically justified).

The woman caught in adultery was guilty of sexual impropriety, but everybody involved got to walk away. That is not the case in wanton, medically unnecessary feticide. Apples & oranges.

Do you feel the same disconnect with the victims of school shootings (of any age)?
(Were those shooters qualified to "cast the first stone?")
 
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SANTOSO

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This is what the psalmist have said in faith:
Remember your word to your servant, in which you have made me hope. -Psalms 119:49
This is my comfort in my affliction, that your promise gives me life. -Psalms 119:50

When I think of your rules from of old, I take comfort, O LORD. -Psalms 119:52

What is the promise of God that give life ?
This is what we have heard:

You shall serve the LORD your God, and he will bless your bread and your water, and I will take sickness away from among you. -Exodus 23:25


Santoso, thank you for that. I agree with all my heart. Yes, intercession is so important. We who are grafted into the vine seek with all our hearts to serve the Lord and in time, we follow little rabbit holes... find ourselves following our old slave-master - until we hear that sweet Holy Spirit and are able to cry out to God for his mercies and salvation... to set our feet back onto his road. He is so kind and gracious and loving and forgiving.

Yes, we intercede for these poor girls and women, Lord, who have been so deceived that they find themselves in a dark place. But Lord, I am waiting for that revival. Lord, I ask that you open the eyes of this generation of women that has been so deceived. Lord, expose the enemy and his lies. Expose corruption and reach down and touch these precious girls - for they don't know how to see that you are right there. Make the church and the world aware of the truth - make it clear, Lord so that your kingdom will increase. Abba, I am so excited to see the greatest, broadest, and most powerful revival this nation has ever known - the world wild will watch and be amazed because millennials will be swept up in the power of the holy ghost and the anointing that breaks every yoke of bondage. Gender confusion will dissipate in an instant. Thousands will weep and dance for joy because they know you have touched them and healed them. Deliver those tormented by demons. Make this generation of millennials that was so confused and angry, an army of disciples - walking and living out grace - spreading your Word; making believers out of non-believers; healing the sick; making blind eyes see; raising the dead. And Lord, nothing shall by any means harm them. They will be the foolish things of this world which confound the wise. And you will get all the glory! In Jesus name, Amen.[/QUOTE]


Let us be continuously submerged in His River of Love.
Let our love for God begets love of others toward God.
 
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SANTOSO

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Your last post still challenges the nature of judicial punishment, not the fact that feticide should be recognized as homicide (and should be discouraged).

You end up offering more compassion to the killer than to the person being killed. Is that what God wants you to do?

We may not qualify to throw the first stone, but neither does the doctor (when not medically justified).

The woman caught in adultery was guilty of sexual impropriety, but everybody involved got to walk away. That is not the case in wanton, medically unnecessary feticide. Apples & oranges.

Do you feel the same disconnect with the victims of school shootings (of any age)?
(Were those shooters qualified to "cast the first stone?")

This is what we have heard:

Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, -1 Corinthians 6:9
nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. -1 Corinthians 6:10

And SUCH WERE SOME OF you. BUT YOU WERE washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God. -1 Corinthians 6:11


you have heard as well, that there are those SOME who repent in true contrition and seek the Lord wholeheartedly ; indeed, these people were washed,sanctified, justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

Now, are you going to condemn or curse those whom God have redeemed the precious blood of His Son and called them murderers ?

Even if these people are condemned under judicial punishment, they have to suffer for what they have done wrong in the past but now they are already living a life of repentance that the Lord have called for.

Are you now judging them whom the Lord have redeemed and ordained for eternal life ?

Have you not heard this :
Jesus said to them, "Truly, I say to you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes go into the kingdom of God before you. -Matthew 21:31

For John came to you in the way of righteousness, and you did not believe him, but the tax collectors and the prostitutes BELIEVED him. And even when you saw it, you did not afterward change your minds and believe him. -Matthew 21:32

Do God only show compassion to those who are killed and not the killer ? Are not the killer sinners whom the Lord also calls ?

As the Lord have said :
Go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.' For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners." -Matthew 9:13
 
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SANTOSO

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This is what the psalmist have said in faith:
Remember your word to your servant, in which you have made me hope. -Psalms 119:49
This is my comfort in my affliction, that your promise gives me life. -Psalms 119:50

When I think of your rules from of old, I take comfort, O LORD. -Psalms 119:52

What is the promise of God that give life ?
This is what we have heard:

You shall serve the LORD your God, and he will bless your bread and your water, and I will take sickness away from among you. -Exodus 23:25


Santoso, thank you for that. I agree with all my heart. Yes, intercession is so important. We who are grafted into the vine seek with all our hearts to serve the Lord and in time, we follow little rabbit holes... find ourselves following our old slave-master - until we hear that sweet Holy Spirit and are able to cry out to God for his mercies and salvation... to set our feet back onto his road. He is so kind and gracious and loving and forgiving.

Yes, we intercede for these poor girls and women, Lord, who have been so deceived that they find themselves in a dark place. But Lord, I am waiting for that revival. Lord, I ask that you open the eyes of this generation of women that has been so deceived. Lord, expose the enemy and his lies. Expose corruption and reach down and touch these precious girls - for they don't know how to see that you are right there. Make the church and the world aware of the truth - make it clear, Lord so that your kingdom will increase. Abba, I am so excited to see the greatest, broadest, and most powerful revival this nation has ever known - the world wild will watch and be amazed because millennials will be swept up in the power of the holy ghost and the anointing that breaks every yoke of bondage. Gender confusion will dissipate in an instant. Thousands will weep and dance for joy because they know you have touched them and healed them. Deliver those tormented by demons. Make this generation of millennials that was so confused and angry, an army of disciples - walking and living out grace - spreading your Word; making believers out of non-believers; healing the sick; making blind eyes see; raising the dead. And Lord, nothing shall by any means harm them. They will be the foolish things of this world which confound the wise. And you will get all the glory! In Jesus name, Amen.[/QUOTE]

Dear Melody,
Many who have realized that they have been deceived by their old self with its ways and truly want to follow the way of the Lord — they were looking for a place of refuge that many church or the country have not provided.

True enough, many are ashamed of their ways of abortion and neglect their responsibilities whether male or female.
Many do want to leave the practice of their old nature with its ways and repent wholeheartedly.

If there are places that could offer them temporary shelters in regards to the needs of the female, male and the baby. The shelter where they are not shamed continuously with
guilt of their sin and the shelter where they find a safe haven to grow in the new nature of their faith in the Lord. How wonderful it would be to witness the fruits of repentance that bring the Lord delights.

I understand in some instances that the youth of hearts who has not fled from their passions — whether male or female may not be ready to shoulder the marriage and raising children then. The place of refuge or shelter like this can accommodate adoption for those who long children and have not have yet or to the original parents who would later accept.
How wonderful it is for us to witness that the Lord binds the broken-hearted whether they are children or parents.

This place of refugee can be orphanage for children who have not yet found their parents or adopted parents — in the least they can be a testimony that they are children who do not undergo abortion and find grace to be named and understand that they can find themselves acceptance as children of God through Christ Jesus.
How glorious they grow in faith and be testimony to others.

This place of refuge could facilitate the needs for female who need to wait for the child to be born; There, this girls or women's emotional and spiritual needs are met. How wonderful they could taste and see the grace of the Lord through those who serve them without reproach and gently guide them, even if some of them are not ready for marriage and parenting.

Likewise, in this place of refuge, the male who have not learned to bear the responsibility of marriage and parenting; they find this place of refuge where they are not continually condemned with the guilt of their shame. There, they can sort their thoughts and find a space to learn not to react with violence and anger but learn to respond appropriately for their situation in the way of the Lord. Even though some may not come through to accept marriage and parenting, in the least they find a place and people who meet them not with reprimand but meet people and place where they find grace of God through those who serve them as they serve the Lord. How wonderful to be counted as one who serve the Lord is called faithful.

If the male or and female, willing to bear the responsibility of parenting, this place of refuge can a place where they can find suitable work with enough income to support the new family. How wonderful that we can witness the hearts that are healed in the Lord.

If the male and female, willing to go through marriage and parenting, this place of refuge could be place of reconciliation. How wonderful that we can deliver the message of the Lord’s reconciliation.

Even if there are people who are not the abusers or victims, and they may be related or unrelated to abuser or victims of abortion, and could offer assistance in the way that they could serve the Lord when they support these broken family. May the Lord bless them from Zion.

Here, melody, I just want to point to others that there are ways that we can respond appropriately to those who have or have not gone through abortion.

These ways, I hope the law of the country would not hinder the manner of true love in Christ.
 
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