What About Progressive Sanctification?

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Jesus is YHWH said:
yikes

Still waiting for a response to the rebuttal at post 850. Oh that's right, you haven't got a leg to stand on.

RickReads · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
To summarize my last post, that reading amounts to a strawman caricature of my words.

In my defense, I only glanced at the post in question. It was too silly to read.

RickReads · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
Still waiting for a response to the rebuttal at post 850. Oh that's right, you haven't got a leg to stand on.

I don`t think you really want that.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

RickReads said:
I don`t think you really want that.

LOL. You boasted that you could rip that post to shreds. You would have done so already, if that were true.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

RickReads said:
In my defense, I only glanced at the post in question. It was too silly to read.

As always, the attitude is, "I'm already convinced of my position. Don't confuse me with the facts!"

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Everyone:

Have at it. Read post 850 and see if you can rip it to shreds. RickReads alleges that such is possible.

Jesus is YHWH · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
Still waiting for a response to the rebuttal at post 850. Oh that's right, you haven't got a leg to stand on.

I dismantled your imaginations and manmade doctrine several times in the thread with the Truth from the H.U.

2 Corinthians 10:5
Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

hope this helps !!!

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Jesus is YHWH said:
I dismantled your imaginations and manmade doctrine several times in the thread with the Truth from the H.U.

Stop telling lies. Your copy-and-paste jobs were primarily a regurgitation of orthodox definitions:
(1) The definition of the Trinity
(2) The definition of the hypostatic union.

Regurgitating what is in debate is NOT an argument/defense/apologetic. It is not a rejoinder tailored to my specific charges of contradiction levied against your beliefs.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Also post 851 merits attention as well.

Jesus is YHWH · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
Stop telling lies. Your copy-and-paste jobs were primarily a regurgitation of orthodox definitions:
(1) The definition of the Trinity
(2) The definition of the hypostatic union.

Regurgitating what is in debate is NOT an argument/defense/apologetic. It is not a rejoinder tailored to my specific charges of contradiction levied against your beliefs.

No copy/paste as I put the H.U. together myself from my personal studies over several decades.

RickReads · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
LOL. You boasted that you could rip that post to shreds. You would have done so already, if that were true.

You misunderstand my sense of fair play. Since you refuse to answer my post that I invested my good time into you don`t get to find out the particulars that lead me to consider your contention weak sauce.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

RickReads said:
You misunderstand my sense of fair play. Since you refuse to answer my post that I invested my good time into you don`t get to find out the particulars that lead me to consider your contention weak sauce.

All of your negative comments to me are unsubstantiated.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Everyone:

See what RickReads has done? He boasted he could rip post 850 to shreds and then, at every opportunity, has copped out with one excuse or another. Gee. What a surprise.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Jesus is YHWH said:
No copy/paste as I put the H.U. together myself from my personal studies over several decades.

Right. Sit here and try to tell me that post 956, for example, wasn't a big copy-and-paste.

RickReads · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
Everyone:

See what RickReads has done? He boasted he could rip post 850 to shreds and then, at every opportunity, has copped out with one excuse or another. Gee. What a surprise.

No, I have given you just one reason for not answering it.

I draw the line when people start lying about me so don`t expect me to put up with that.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

RickReads said:
No, I have given you just one reason for not answering it..

Right. You said I first needed to respond to your post which I missed, and when I begged you to tell me the number of that post, you refused. So you refuse to answer my post until I answer the "mystery post" that nobody can find!

Jesus is YHWH · Nov 17, 2020

Jesus is YHWH said:
No copy/paste as I put the H.U. together myself from my personal studies over several decades.

This is my work accuser of the brethren

Hypostatic Union

1. Jesus is a person. (1 Tim 2:5)

2. Jesus, the Person, has two natures- Divine and human (John 1:1, 14, 1 Timothy 3:16): Divine and human. This is the Hypostatic Union.( Col 2:9, Heb 1:3,2:16)

3. The Communicatio Idiomatum (Communication of the Properties) states that the attributes of His Divine nature and human nature are both ascribed to the one Person of Jesus. So Jesus can exhibit attributes of Divinity (Omnipresence, Omniscience, Omnipotence, . John 2:23, 3:13, 8:58, He was prayed to in Acts 7:59, John 14:13, He was is worshiped Matt 2:2:11, Rev 5:13-14) and at the same time exhibit attributes of His humanity( He was tempted, ate, prayed,wept, grew in wisdom and stature,was anointed,was baptized, the Father was greater, didn’t know the day or the hour of His Return, He cried My God my God why has Thou forsaken Me, He died etc.). The communicatio idiomatum does not mean that any part of the Divine nature was communicated to the human nature.

4. The Man(anthropos) Jesus is what we perceive (if we were there 2000 years ago in Israel) and through the Man we encounter the Divine nature (Jesus knowing all things, is on earth while in heaven, answers prayer, forgiving sins, etc.).

5. The Person of Jesus will always be both Divine and human. (John 1:1,14,20:28, 1 John 5:20, 1 Timothy 2:5) Those who deny this fact are the spirit of antichrist. (1 John 4:1-4,2 John 7)

6. The Divine Nature is within the Trinity.(Father, Son and Holy Spirit)

7. Since the Person of Jesus claims the attributes of Divinity(John 3:13,8:58,Matthew 9:2,12:8), then the Person of Jesus is a member of the Trinity.( John 14-16, Math 28:19)

Anything said of either of Christ's two natures applies to the one Person of Christ, so that is how it is said that Christ died on the cross. The term "hypostatic union" refers to the two natures united in the one Person, so anything said of those two natures in the one Person applies to the whole Person. So we see that the Person of Christ is both God and man. The phrase hypostatic union was adopted by the fifth general council at Constantinople, 533 AD. That council declared that the union of two natures is real (against Arius), not a mere indwelling of God in a man (against Nestorius), with a rational soul (against Apollinaris), and that in Christ’s Divine nature remains unchanged (against Eutyches).

We need to look to the Monothelite Controversy which had to deal with whether there was one or two wills/minds in the person of Christ. The outcome was that there were two; one human and one divine with the human subjected to the divine. The eternal Son of God did not assume a part of a human nature without a mind, without a will, without human activity, but He assumed all the things that were planted in our nature by God.

Now then, to act (or in this case, speak) is the work of a person, but the form or nature is the cause of this action; for each person acts in accord with the form or nature which it has. A difference in causes (natures) produces a difference in effects (actions). Therefore, where there are different natures, there are also different activities. So in the one Person of Christ there are two natural actions, the divine and the human, each of which has its own essential attributes, functions, and actions. Jesus was thirty years old according to His human nature (Luke 3:23); according to His divine nature He could say: "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58). The question is did both natures know this and communicate it to the Person. The answer is yes because the divine nature with its corresponding divine will willed the human nature to respond in such a fashion in keeping with Christ's office and ministry. In the text regarding Mark 13:32, we have a slightly different situation here. Christ is acting (speaking) from His human nature, but, this time, the divine will does not allow the human will access to this knowledge. For this information is not to be published on earth. Therefore, as man, Christ cannot answer the question.

RickReads · Nov 17, 2020

JAL said:
Right. You said I first needed to respond to your post which I missed, and when I begged you to tell me the number of that post, you refused. So you refuse to answer my post until I answer the "mystery post" that nobody can find!

As I already told you I don`t know the post number. It was one of several answers I gave you on the night of 14th that you avoided.

Your gnostic beliefs aren`t a challenge they are just time-consuming because you don`t make sense a lot of the time.

People get bored with it and stop talking to you and you chalk it off as a win

RickReads · Nov 17, 2020

Jesus is YHWH said:
This is my work accuser of the brethren

Hypostatic Union

1. Jesus is a person. (1 Tim 2:5)

2. Jesus, the Person, has two natures- Divine and human (John 1:1, 14, 1 Timothy 3:16): Divine and human. This is the Hypostatic Union.( Col 2:9, Heb 1:3,2:16)

3. The Communicatio Idiomatum (Communication of the Properties) states that the attributes of His Divine nature and human nature are both ascribed to the one Person of Jesus. So Jesus can exhibit attributes of Divinity (Omnipresence, Omniscience, Omnipotence, . John 2:23, 3:13, 8:58, He was prayed to in Acts 7:59, John 14:13, He was is worshiped Matt 2:2:11, Rev 5:13-14) and at the same time exhibit attributes of His humanity( He was tempted, ate, prayed,wept, grew in wisdom and stature,was anointed,was baptized, the Father was greater, didn’t know the day or the hour of His Return, He cried My God my God why has Thou forsaken Me, He died etc.). The communicatio idiomatum does not mean that any part of the Divine nature was communicated to the human nature.

4. The Man(anthropos) Jesus is what we perceive (if we were there 2000 years ago in Israel) and through the Man we encounter the Divine nature (Jesus knowing all things, is on earth while in heaven, answers prayer, forgiving sins, etc.).

5. The Person of Jesus will always be both Divine and human. (John 1:1,14,20:28, 1 John 5:20, 1 Timothy 2:5) Those who deny this fact are the spirit of antichrist. (1 John 4:1-4,2 John 7)

6. The Divine Nature is within the Trinity.(Father, Son and Holy Spirit)

7. Since the Person of Jesus claims the attributes of Divinity(John 3:13,8:58,Matthew 9:2,12:8), then the Person of Jesus is a member of the Trinity.( John 14-16, Math 28:19)

Anything said of either of Christ's two natures applies to the one Person of Christ, so that is how it is said that Christ died on the cross. The term "hypostatic union" refers to the two natures united in the one Person, so anything said of those two natures in the one Person applies to the whole Person. So we see that the Person of Christ is both God and man. The phrase hypostatic union was adopted by the fifth general council at Constantinople, 533 AD. That council declared that the union of two natures is real (against Arius), not a mere indwelling of God in a man (against Nestorius), with a rational soul (against Apollinaris), and that in Christ’s Divine nature remains unchanged (against Eutyches).

We need to look to the Monothelite Controversy which had to deal with whether there was one or two wills/minds in the person of Christ. The outcome was that there were two; one human and one divine with the human subjected to the divine. The eternal Son of God did not assume a part of a human nature without a mind, without a will, without human activity, but He assumed all the things that were planted in our nature by God.

Now then, to act (or in this case, speak) is the work of a person, but the form or nature is the cause of this action; for each person acts in accord with the form or nature which it has. A difference in causes (natures) produces a difference in effects (actions). Therefore, where there are different natures, there are also different activities. So in the one Person of Christ there are two natural actions, the divine and the human, each of which has its own essential attributes, functions, and actions. Jesus was thirty years old according to His human nature (Luke 3:23); according to His divine nature He could say: "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58). The question is did both natures know this and communicate it to the Person. The answer is yes because the divine nature with its corresponding divine will willed the human nature to respond in such a fashion in keeping with Christ's office and ministry. In the text regarding Mark 13:32, we have a slightly different situation here. Christ is acting (speaking) from His human nature, but, this time, the divine will does not allow the human will access to this knowledge. For this information is not to be published on earth. Therefore, as man, Christ cannot answer the question.

I think you plagiarized some of that from the Bible.

JAL · Nov 17, 2020

Jesus is YHWH said:
This is my work accuser of the brethren

Hypostatic Union

1. Jesus is a person. (1 Tim 2:5)

2. Jesus, the Person, has two natures- Divine and human (John 1:1, 14, 1 Timothy 3:16): Divine and human. This is the Hypostatic Union.( Col 2:9, Heb 1:3,2:16)

3. The Communicatio Idiomatum (Communication of the Properties) states that the attributes of His Divine nature and human nature are both ascribed to the one Person of Jesus. So Jesus can exhibit attributes of Divinity (Omnipresence, Omniscience, Omnipotence, . John 2:23, 3:13, 8:58, He was prayed to in Acts 7:59, John 14:13, He was is worshiped Matt 2:2:11, Rev 5:13-14) and at the same time exhibit attributes of His humanity( He was tempted, ate, prayed,wept, grew in wisdom and stature,was anointed,was baptized, the Father was greater, didn’t know the day or the hour of His Return, He cried My God my God why has Thou forsaken Me, He died etc.). The communicatio idiomatum does not mean that any part of the Divine nature was communicated to the human nature.

4. The Man(anthropos) Jesus is what we perceive (if we were there 2000 years ago in Israel) and through the Man we encounter the Divine nature (Jesus knowing all things, is on earth while in heaven, answers prayer, forgiving sins, etc.).

5. The Person of Jesus will always be both Divine and human. (John 1:1,14,20:28, 1 John 5:20, 1 Timothy 2:5) Those who deny this fact are the spirit of antichrist. (1 John 4:1-4,2 John 7)

6. The Divine Nature is within the Trinity.(Father, Son and Holy Spirit)

7. Since the Person of Jesus claims the attributes of Divinity(John 3:13,8:58,Matthew 9:2,12:8), then the Person of Jesus is a member of the Trinity.( John 14-16, Math 28:19)

Anything said of either of Christ's two natures applies to the one Person of Christ, so that is how it is said that Christ died on the cross. The term "hypostatic union" refers to the two natures united in the one Person, so anything said of those two natures in the one Person applies to the whole Person. So we see that the Person of Christ is both God and man. The phrase hypostatic union was adopted by the fifth general council at Constantinople, 533 AD. That council declared that the union of two natures is real (against Arius), not a mere indwelling of God in a man (against Nestorius), with a rational soul (against Apollinaris), and that in Christ’s Divine nature remains unchanged (against Eutyches).

We need to look to the Monothelite Controversy which had to deal with whether there was one or two wills/minds in the person of Christ. The outcome was that there were two; one human and one divine with the human subjected to the divine. The eternal Son of God did not assume a part of a human nature without a mind, without a will, without human activity, but He assumed all the things that were planted in our nature by God.

Now then, to act (or in this case, speak) is the work of a person, but the form or nature is the cause of this action; for each person acts in accord with the form or nature which it has. A difference in causes (natures) produces a difference in effects (actions). Therefore, where there are different natures, there are also different activities. So in the one Person of Christ there are two natural actions, the divine and the human, each of which has its own essential attributes, functions, and actions. Jesus was thirty years old according to His human nature (Luke 3:23); according to His divine nature He could say: "Before Abraham was born, I am" (John 8:58). The question is did both natures know this and communicate it to the Person. The answer is yes because the divine nature with its corresponding divine will willed the human nature to respond in such a fashion in keeping with Christ's office and ministry. In the text regarding Mark 13:32, we have a slightly different situation here. Christ is acting (speaking) from His human nature, but, this time, the divine will does not allow the human will access to this knowledge. For this information is not to be published on earth. Therefore, as man, Christ cannot answer the question.

I'm just correcting what you said. Your posts had PLENTY of copy and pastes, and the above post is equally inappropriate because, as a copy-and-paste from your own personal notebook, it isn't tailored to my specific objections. Which you continue to ignore, such as post 850 and many others.

What About Progressive Sanctification?

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my Lord and my God !

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my Lord and my God !

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my Lord and my God !

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