SO MANY CHURCH'S - WHO IS GOD'S TRUE CHURCH (Scripture)?

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Hello LGW.

You stated the following in post #338.
Here is the passage you highlighted.

Hebrews 6:4-8
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened and have tasted of the heavenly gift and have been made partakers of the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they again crucify to themselves the Son of God and put Him to open shame. For ground that drinks the rain which often falls on it and produces vegetation useful to those for whose sake it is also tilled, receives a blessing from God; but if it yields thorns and thistles, it is worthless and close to being cursed, and it ends up being burned.

That passage does not mention 'known unrepentant sin'. It looks as though you are applying an interpretation to the text.

How do you interpret 'thorns and thistles' in Hebrews 6:4-8?

Sure it does. Hebrews 6:4-8 is in reference to those who were once Christians who depart the faith back to sin. What is repentance for? Hebrews 4:6-8 links very nicely to what Paul says in Hebrews 10:26-31 about those who receive a knowledge of God's truth and reject it to receiving God's judgement of punishment of fiery indignation. Our God is a consuming fire to sin.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

klutedavid

Well-Known Member
Dec 7, 2013
9,346
4,381
Sydney, Australia.
✟244,844.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Sure it does. Hebrews 6:4-8 is in reference to those who were once Christians who depart the faith back to sin. What is repentance for? Hebrews 4:6-8 links very nicely to what Paul says in Hebrews 10:26-31 about those who receive a knowledge of God's truth and reject it to receiving God's judgement of punishment of fiery indignation. Our God is a consuming fire to sin.
I asked you how you interpret 'thorns and thistles' in Hebrews 6:4-8?

You said 'who depart the faith back to sin'.

Thorns and thistles are the opposite of the fruit of the Spirit. That's obvious LGW. Where the farmer planted fruit trees only thorns and thistles grew instead.

What is the fruit of the Spirit?

Romans 7:4
Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.

In the context 'repentance' is referring to dead works, the law.

Hebrews 6:1
...not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God.
 
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
I asked you how you interpret 'thorns and thistles' in Hebrews 6:4-8?

You said 'who depart the faith back to sin'.

Thorns and thistles are the opposite of the fruit of the Spirit. That's obvious LGW. Where the farmer planted fruit trees only thorns and thistles grew instead.

What is the fruit of the Spirit?

Romans 7:4
Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.

In the context 'repentance' is referring to dead works, the law.

Hebrews 6:1
...not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God.

Not really David. We are talking about sin which the bible (not me) defines as the transgression of God's law *1 John 3:4 or the breaking of anyone of God's 10 commandments *James 2:10-11 or not believing or following God's Word *Romans 14:23.

Let's look at the detail of Hebrews 6:4-8 and Hebrews 10:26-31...

God's Word says that these people are in all reference to those who were once believers... I have numbered the sections within these scripture passage below and pulled out the sections from the scriptures word for word afterwards to show that these scriptures are a warning to those who were ONCE BELIEVERS that had fallen away and departed the faith to return to unrepentant sin.

Let’s look at the scriptures and see what they are saying…

HEBREWS 6:4-8 [4], For it is impossible for those (1) WHO WERE ONCE ENLIGHTENED, and (2) HAVE TASTED THE HEAVENLY GIFT, and (3) WERE MADE PARTAKERS OF THE HOLY GHOST, [5], And have (4) TASTED THE GOOD WORD OF GOD, and (5) THE POWERS OF THE WORLD TO COME, [6], (6) IF THEY (believers) (7) SHALL FALL AWAY, to renew them again to repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh and put him to an open shame. [7], For the earth which drinks in the rain that comes oft on it, and brings forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receives blessing from God: [8], But that which bears thorns and briers is rejected, and is near to cursing; (8) WHOS END IS TO BE BURNED.

The following are taken from the above scriptures...

1. They were once enlightened; HEBREWS 6:4
2. Having tasted of the Heavenly gift; HEBREWS 6:4
3. They were made partakers of the Holy Ghost; HEBREWS 6:4
4. Having tasted of the good Word of God; HEBREWS 6:5
5. Having tasted of the power of the world to come HEBREWS 6:5
6. THEY (BELIEVERS) FALL AWAY; HEBREWS 6:6
7. THEY (BELIEVERS) renew themselves to repentance; HEBREWS 6:6
8. THEY (BELIEVERS) by their sins crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame; HEBREWS 6:6

Same for HEBREWS 10:26-38

HEBREWS 10:26-31 [26], FOR IF WE (believers) SIN WILLFULLY AFTER THAT WE (believers) HAVE RECEIVED THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE TRUTH THERE REMAINS NO MORE SACRIFICE FOR SINS, [27], But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. [28], He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: [29], OF HOW MUCH SORER PUNISHMENT SUPPOSE YOU SHALL HE BE THOUGHT WORTHY WHO HAS TRODDEN UNDER FOOT THE SON OF GOD AND HAS COUNTED THE BLOOD OF THE COVENANT AN UNHOLY THING AND HAS DONE DESPITE TO THE SPIRIT OF GRACE? [30], For WE (believers) know him that has said, Vengeance belongs to me, I will recompense, said the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people. [31], It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. [32], But call to remembrance the former days, in which, after you were illuminated, you endured a great fight of afflictions; [33], Partly, whilst you were made a spectacle both by reproaches and afflictions; and partly, whilst you became companions of them that were so used. [34], For you had compassion of me in my bonds, and took joyfully the spoiling of your goods, knowing in yourselves that you have in heaven a better and an enduring substance. [35], Cast not away therefore your confidence, which has great recompense of reward. [36], For you have need of patience, that, after you have done the will of God, you might receive the promise.
[37], For yet a little while, and he that shall come will come, and will not tarry. [38], Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him.

The following are taken from the above scriptures...

1. WE (BELIEVERS) return back to a life of known unrepentant SIN; HEBREWS 10:26
2. WE (BELIEVERS) being those who have received a knowledge of the truth; HEBREWS 10:26
3. WE (BELIEVERS) will receive the judgments of God; HEBREWS 10:27
5. WE (BELIEVERS) by returning back to known unrepentant sin after we receive a knowledge of the truth we count the blood of the covenant an UNHOLY thing and do despite to the Spirit of Grace; HEBREWS 10:29

6. WE (BELIEVERS) are warned not to CAST AWAY our confidence which has great reward; HEBREWS 10:35

7. WE (BELIEVERS) receive God's promise after we do God's will; HEBREWS 10:36
8. WE (BELIEVERS) are WARNED NOT TO DRAW BACK INTO UNBELIEF; HEBREWS 10:38

All of the above is God's Word not mine and are written as WARNINGS to BELIEVERS who once believed God's WORD but departed the faith. Do you believe these scriptures dear friend?

Hope this is helpful
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
REVELATION 14:8 [8], And there followed another angel, saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication.

BABYLON is being portrayed here in REVELATION 14:8 as an UNFAITHFUL WOMAN who is the daughter of harlots (fallen Church's).

Similar warnings and scriptures are also found in REVELATIONS 17:1-5 where BABYLON is described as an UNFAITHFUL WOMAN [HARLOT] sitting on the SCARLET COLORED BEAST which is connected to those receiving the MARK OF THE BEAST in REVELATIONS 14:9-10. While REVELATIONS 18:1-10 is a call for God’s people to come out of BABYLON that they do not receive the judgments of God which are connected to the BEASTS MARK.

God has his people in EVERY CHURCH. Not all these Churches are following God or his WORD. Not all these Churches are faithful to God or his WORD. It is not the people in these Churches that God hates and will send judgements to it is the Churches that lead his people away from his WORD to break his commandments. God has his people in all these Churches and is calling his true people out of these Churches to worship him and follow him in Spirit and in truth according to the WORD of GOD. It is because of his great love to us that before the judgments of God fall on these Churches, GOD will call his true followers OUT of these corrupt unfaithful Churches to follow him according to his WORD.

BABYLON represents the Mother Church; the Roman Catholic Church (not the people in it) and the fallen Protestant Churches (not the people). God has his people in every Church and loves them all. He is calling them out to worship him in Spirit and in truth according to his Word. God is calling his people where ever they may be out from following man-made teachings and traditions back to the pure Word of God. God’s Sheep hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who do not hear do not follow *John 10:26-27

God bless...
 
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
Who does the bible describe as God's people?

[1.] God’s people are described as God’s sheep that hear believe and follow Gods Word *John 10:26-27

[2.] God’s people are described as God’s saints that keep the commandments of God and the faith or teachings of Jesus *Revelation 14:12.

[3.] God’s people are described as those who the dragon (devil) is making war with because they keep the commandments of God *Revelation 12:17

[4.] God’s people are described as having the testimony of JESUS which is the Spirit of Prophecy. They know the end day prophecies *Revelation 19:10

[5.] God’s people are described as being blessed because they washed their robes in the blood of the lamb *1 Peter 1:18-19; Revelation 7:14; Revelation 12:11; Revelation 22:14

[6.] God’s people are described as being blessed because they keep Gods commandments and receive eternal life *Revelation 22:14

[7.] God’s people are described as being born again and do not practice sin (breaking Gods’ commandments) *1 John 3:6-9

[8.] The different between the children of God and the children of the devil is that the children of God do not practice sin (breaking God’s commandments) and the children of the devil do *1 John 3:6-10.

……………………….

In summary how do we know we know God and are Gods saints? Well Gods saints are in every Church who are living up to all the light of the knowledge of Gods’ Word that God has revealed to them and in times of ignorance when we do not know any better God winks at but when God gives us a knowledge of His Word he calls all men everywhere to believe and follow it *Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31; James 4:17.

Many do not know that the religious teachers of the world of fallen away from God’s Word in order to follow man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God. BABYLON is described as being fallen. The mother church and her daughters *Revelation 14:8; Revelation 17:1-5. She has changed times and law *Danial 7:25 and supplanted her own day of worship for which there is no scripture in place of God’s 4th commandment which is one of God’s 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4.

God has his people in all of these Church’s and is calling his people out of Babylon from following the traditions and teachings of men back to the pure Word of God. *Revelation 18:1-5. The hour is coming and now is that the true worshippers will worship God in Spirit and in truth. God is a Spirit and those who worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth. *John 10:16; John 4:23-24.

What is the test to know if we know God?

1 John 2:3-4 [3], And HEREBY WE KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.

[4], HE THAT SAITH, I KNOW HIM, AND KEEPETH NOT HIS COMMANDMENTS, IS A LIAR, AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM

In times of ignorance God winks at but when he gives us a knowledge of the truth of his Word calls all men everywhere to believe and follow. God’s sheep hear His voice (the Word) and follow it.

God bless.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

pescador

Wise old man
Supporter
Nov 29, 2011
8,530
4,776
✟498,844.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
Who does the bible describe as God's people?

[1.] God’s people are described as God’s sheep that hear believe and follow Gods Word *John 10:26-27

[2.] God’s people are described as God’s saints that keep the commandments of God and the faith or teachings of Jesus *Revelation 14:12.

[3.] God’s people are described as those who the dragon (devil) is making war with because they keep the commandments of God *Revelation 12:17

[4.] God’s people are described as having the testimony of JESUS which is the Spirit of Prophecy. They know the end day prophecies *Revelation 19:10

[5.] God’s people are described as being blessed because they washed their robes in the blood of the lamb *1 Peter 1:18-19; Revelation 7:14; Revelation 12:11; Revelation 22:14

[6.] God’s people are described as being blessed because they keep Gods commandments and receive eternal life *Revelation 22:14

[7.] God’s people are described as being born again and do not practice sin (breaking Gods’ commandments) *1 John 3:6-9

[8.] The different between the children of God and the children of the devil is that the children of God do not practice sin (breaking God’s commandments) and the children of the devil do *1 John 3:6-10.

……………………….

In summary how do we know we know God and are Gods saints? Well Gods saints are in every Church who are living up to all the light of the knowledge of Gods’ Word that God has revealed to them and in times of ignorance when we do not know any better God winks at but when God gives us a knowledge of His Word he calls all men everywhere to believe and follow it *Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31; James 4:17.

Many do not know that the religious teachers of the world of fallen away from God’s Word in order to follow man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God. BABYLON is described as being fallen. The mother church and her daughters *Revelation 14:8; Revelation 17:1-5. She has changed times and law *Danial 7:25 and supplanted her own day of worship for which there is no scripture in place of God’s 4th commandment which is one of God’s 10 commandments that give us the knowledge of what sin is when broken *Romans 3:20; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4.

God has his people in all of these Church’s and is calling his people out of Babylon from following the traditions and teachings of men back to the pure Word of God. *Revelation 18:1-5. The hour is coming and now is that the true worshippers will worship God in Spirit and in truth. God is a Spirit and those who worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth. *John 10:16; John 4:23-24.

What is the test to know if we know God?

1 John 2:3-4 [3], And HEREBY WE KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS.

[4], HE THAT SAITH, I KNOW HIM, AND KEEPETH NOT HIS COMMANDMENTS, IS A LIAR, AND THE TRUTH IS NOT IN HIM

In times of ignorance God winks at but when he gives us a knowledge of the truth of his Word calls all men everywhere to believe and follow. God’s sheep hear His voice (the Word) and follow it.

(This post is linked in page 1 to the OP question for ease of access)

God bless.

You had me interested in the first part of your post, but when you continued with "Many do not know that the religious teachers of the world of fallen away from God’s Word in order to follow man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God" I stopped reading.

IMHO you're trying to make yourself look like one of the OT prophets but -- you're failing! It is a dangerous thing in God's eyes to set yourself up as the judge of Christ's body, His church. -> Read that sentence again <- By judging the church you're judging Christ; He is the head, we are the rest.
 
Upvote 0

LoveGodsWord

Well-Known Member
Jun 5, 2017
22,242
6,634
Queensland
Visit site
✟252,319.00
Country
Australia
Faith
SDA
Marital Status
Married
You had me interested in the first part of your post, but when you continued with "Many do not know that the religious teachers of the world of fallen away from God’s Word in order to follow man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God" I stopped reading.

IMHO you're trying to make yourself look like one of the OT prophets but -- you're failing! It is a dangerous thing in God's eyes to set yourself up as the judge of Christ's body, His church. -> Read that sentence again <- By judging the church you're judging Christ; He is the head, we are the rest.

Thanks for your thoughts but the scriptures provided are Gods' Word not mine so I cannot really take any credit for them. According to the scriptures BABYLON has fallen and departed Gods' Word. God's people are in every Church who he is calling us out from following man-made traditions and teachings that break the commandments of God back to believing and following the pure Word of God. If I only share God's Word with you what is it dear friend that you do not believe? I am not a prophet of the OT only a voice crying in the wilderness pointing to the Word of God that many have fallen away from. For me, He must increase in the eyes of the world and those who have eyes to see and ears to hear. God's sheep hear His voice and follow him.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0