Election fraud

Arc F1 said:

The wheels of justice move slowly. We can still see what's going on and voice our views before it's old news and forgotten. At least I think we still can

Click to expand...

The wheels move way too slowly & are greatly compromised & prejudicial.

How many major accusations have ended up in condemnations? This has all become entertainment with no ending to the stories. Politics is now 24/7 with no calm between elections.

I appreciate your last statement, but it seems more based in hope than reality.

durangodawood said:

There's some tiny amount of fraud every election.

What we're seeing now is just a massive effort to de-legitimize this election. Basically people are burning American democracy on the altar of Trump. We will all pay a price for this.

Click to expand...

We've been paying a price for the division for longer than this session. And what the blue party has been doing to de-legitimize the prior red election has also been stoking the fire that has just been burning more slowly.

GDL said:

The wheels move way too slowly & are greatly compromised & prejudicial.

How many major accusations have ended up in condemnations? This has all become entertainment with no ending to the stories. Politics is now 24/7 with no calm between elections.

I appreciate your last statement, but it seems more based in hope than reality.

Click to expand...

That's a great point. We need to remember Who comes First, and Last: Our Lord Jesus Christ.

(and in the middle too. All the time, He is Lord, and no one else ever)

And all of His Words, which we will listen to well, according to if we believe.

He said:
Luke 6:37 Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

It's needed to carefully judge actions, but never people (as persons). It's ideas, things, actions, policies and so on that we an can carefully judge -- John 7:24
But not people as persons -- Matthew 7:1-2

I love Trump. I really wish he was my neighbor on this block, and I could invite him over for backyard cookouts.

Really, I do. I don't think he's well suited to be president (though I like many of his policies (but not every one)).

But I really, honestly wish Trump lived next door, or very close, and I could invite him to my backyard cookouts, over and over, and make him a friend, and help him know he is loved, in spite of his flaws and insecurities.

Major news, I just got a phone call about. I'll post it. (Biden won, and others already posted, so I responded to one of those)

Arc F1 said:

So there was fraud? I have to say that you are the first one on the left I've seen that admits it. What other fraud have you seen during this election?

Click to expand...

There is some amount of fraud in every election. With tens upon tens of millions of ballots cast there is bound to be some discrepancies here or there but there is no evidence of the kind of widespread conspiratorial fraud the president is alleging to have turned the election against him. Just like last time. He made the same exact claims and never backed them up.

I'm beginning to think that the end result of this might be that vote fraud will have been proven, but that Biden still had enough Electoral Votes to be inaugurated the next president.

Both sides should find that to be an outcome that they could live with. I do not know if the haters will let it go at that, but perhaps they will begin to be seen as less interesting and relevant to the media and the average voter than has been the case until now.

A lot will depend on Biden himself, however. He can talk all he wants about being a uniter, but that won't be demonstrated simply by talking with Republican Senators but not giving an inch afterwards. And it won't be demonstrated by him appointing to his cabinet some "NeverTrump" former Republican Senators or members of Bush Jr's administration. This has been suggested as something he would do, but it isn't worth much of anything, and that's how it will come across to Republican voters.

We'll see, and hopefully, Biden will not make things worse by continuing to pretend to be the president before he is inaugurated (if he is).

I also think Biden's going to be pretty well over 300 electoral votes.

And that will be verified and proven by ballot Audits in many key states.

Wait and you'll see. The votes in many states will be carefully audited to prove they are valid.

Arc F1 said:

Won't be long and sides will change. We will all either be supporting everything Biden does or bashing him. I've been through many elections. What does bother me is the violence. People feel the need to act out instead of just voicing what they feel. That's a big change from the past.

Click to expand...

Agree with you re: the support vs. bashing. Some will even be in-between.

Agree with you on the violence and this is one of the reasons we're supposed to pray for leadership:

NKJ 1 Timothy 2:1-2 Therefore I exhort first of all that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men, 2 for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and reverence.

The problem with some of the violence is how it is directed at free speech and how there is too much support for this trend of changing language to suit some very ungodly & bizarre mindset of how people will somehow come to be less divided if we do so. Give sin an inch & we're soon at a few miles. The slope is indeed slippery even though this is decried as an absurdity by those who start us onto it.

Arc F1 said:

Idk. What I'm seeing is widespread.

Click to expand...

That's right.

I heard non stop about Trump cheating when he won.

Click to expand...

That's also true.

There's always another election right around the corner.

Click to expand...

That may not be true. Oh yes, there will be other presidential elections. Russia conducts them. Iran conducts them. It doesn't mean anything when the rules that are in force prevent the opposition parties from having a chance of victory.

It's all window dressing, and that's what we are facing here in the USA. The election rules changes that made for Biden's apparent victory (and made cheating easy) will certainly not be repealed hereafter. The political party that benefitted from them in 2020 and applauded them all along are never going to give that up.

Albion said:

I'm beginning to think that the end result of this might be that vote fraud will have been proven, but that Biden still had enough Electoral Votes to be inaugurated the next president.

Both sides should find that an outcome that they could live with. I do not know if the haters will let it go at that, but perhaps also, they will seem less interesting or relevant or both to the media and the average voter than has been the case until now.

Click to expand...

Probably correct.

One of the comments I heard made was an opinion that a big mistake made by the Trump camp was to take such a stand against mail-in voting and bring about the red wave on election day. Firstly, the mail-in issue is not well understood by many. Secondly, how many ended up not voting due to lines, pandemic, whatever???

A lot of opinions. Some interesting. Many not.

What's a hater? Jesus loves righteousness & hates lawlessness (sin). No Christian should let lawlessness go, but strive to bring about Faith-Obedience (Rom1:5; 16:26) among all the nations, proclaiming Christ the King and teaching all He commands.

Christians have been "let[ting] it go" for way too long in some misguided concept of what His Commission is. And in the US they've been doing this in a Constitutional Republic that has degenerated into a mob-rule democracy, while still having a voting right. The theory is that the vote will soon be pretty much meaningless. Makes sense, but I guess we'll see.

VirOptimus said:

No, I dont watch conspiracy nutcases.

Click to expand...

Watching from 3:00 for about 1 minute might be worth it. (There is ~3 min. of pre-ramble.) The first "steal" is a complete failure to understand how votes are counted. It "examines" the cumulative vote plots for Mich. & Wisc. Once the narrator claimed that the "big vertical jump" for Biden was "statistically impossible".

This comes from a massive failure to understand how votes are counted in this country.

The traditional vote reporting comes 1 full precinct at a time. If you were to look on the county or state website showing every precincts during the counting process (e.g., Tuesday night) you would see many precincts with "0" votes for all candidates and others with values listed for each. Once reported the numbers don't change (unless there was a reporting error) that night. Because there are so many precincts to report the curve *looks* smooth, but each precinct is a discrete event with a few hundred to a few thousand votes reported.

Centralized early voting has changed some of this. Some places distribute early votes (and mail votes) to the precincts, so their reporting looks similar to the past. Other places gather all early votes to a central location for the city or county. This means that when these locations report there are large jumps, potential to both candidates.

The early Wed. morning jump seen in the Wisconsin numbers come from the reporting of all early (mail) votes for the City of Milwaukee at one time. The number of those votes was large and even in normal times Milwaukee, like many large cities, strongly favors the Democratic party candidate.

The thing that is a bit unusual (and it's likely been happening for a few cycles) is the reporting of partial batches of centrally processed mail/early paper ballots that we have been seeing for the last couple days from Georgia, Pennsylvania, Nevada, and Arizona. (And likely in other states that no one is paying national attention to.)

GDL said:

Probably correct.

One of the comments I heard made was an opinion that a big mistake made by the Trump camp was to take such a stand against mail-in voting and bring about the red wave on election day.

Click to expand...

You are thinking that the surge in absentee ballots benefitted Trump?

Arc F1 said:

cow451 said:

List one fact pertinent to the claim.

Click to expand...

Voter fraud. Fact.

Click to expand...

You will have to be a little more specific, like what was done exactly, who did it, what state/county/town, how massive was it etc.
How was it discovered? Has there been charges filed? etc.
Just saying "voter fraud. Fact" won't make it.

Albion said:

You are thinking that the surge in absentee ballots benefitted Trump?

Click to expand...

Absentee or mail-in? Not the same thing although both use the mail.

This issue was well-clarified by Barr going after Blitzer yesterday (?) in an in-person interview.

Also, to throw another issue into the matter: One of the problems in our system, which I heard discussed, is how things are done at the district levels and how open this is to corruption, more-so than it would be at the state level according to some opinions being presented.

All-in-all, now that there is such an aggressive divide & more widespread lawlessness, something needs to change again or we're where you said here (which I think we are or will be):

Albion said:

It's all window dressing, and that's what we are facing here in the USA. The election rules changes that made for Biden's apparent victory (and made cheating easy) will certainly not be repealed hereafter. The political party that benefitted from them in 2020 and applauded them all along are never going to give that up.

Click to expand...

Arc F1 said:

This guy did a really good job of putting together what's going on this election. It's a half hour well spent watching.

Myself, personally, I feel like the republicans let us down. They should have fell in line and supported the will of the people and threw their support behind Trump these last four years. We had plenty of time time to address these issues and straighten out the censorship problems. The president should have left Twitter and taken millions of people with him. His pride has added to the problems.

Click to expand...

The failure falls entirely on Trump. As an incumbent he couldn't even beat what he called the WORST candidate ever, a "loser". That's how bad and hated Trump is, that he couldn't win a layup.

Hillary was once the worst candidate ever but now Trump has taken over that title, losing as an incumbent, only one of 3 presidents to lose as an incumbent.

History will remember Trump as the biggest failure of all the American presidents. You're even admitting his failure in your post without realizing it.