WHY THE LORD'S DAY IS NOT SUNDAY

Root of Jesse · Oct 19, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Actually not really dear friend. The reformation was a call back to the Word of God and a call not to follow man made teachings and traditions that break the commandments of God. Nothing has changed in the Catholic Church today which still promotes the teachings and traditions of men over the Word of God. The hour is coming and now is according to the scriptures that those who worship God must worship Him in Spirit and in truth. Those who reject God's Word do not hear his voice and cannot follow him. Gods sheep hear his voice. Those who do not hear do not follow. BABYLON has fallen. God is calling us to come out and return to his Word. It is time to trim the lamps and go out and meet the bridegroom.

I guess you don't understand that the Church is required to reformation every day. From the day of Pentecost, when the Church was created, the Church has been in a constant state of reformation. So just because some low-level priest decided it wasn't moving fast enough for him, makes no difference. The Church was already in the process of changing. Luther just wanted it faster. The fact is that God calls us to become a better version of ourselves every day. He loves us the way we are, but loves us too much to make us stay the way we are, and this is true of the institution of the Church as well.
The other fact you misunderstand is that the Magisterial teachings and Sacred Traditions of the Church are not the teachings of man. Yes, they were spoken by men, or enacted by men, but we trust what Jesus said about sending the Holy Spirit to guide the Church in all Truth. We do not reject His Word, as you do. We embrace ALL of His Word, both written and spoken through the Church. We hear His voice, we do not merely read it.
And we are constantly becoming ready. It's not a one time thing-boom and you're there. It's a constant renewal and commitment.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 19, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
I guess you don't understand that the Church is required to reformation every day. From the day of Pentecost, when the Church was created, the Church has been in a constant state of reformation. So just because some low-level priest decided it wasn't moving fast enough for him, makes no difference. The Church was already in the process of changing. Luther just wanted it faster. The fact is that God calls us to become a better version of ourselves every day. He loves us the way we are, but loves us too much to make us stay the way we are, and this is true of the institution of the Church as well.
The other fact you misunderstand is that the Magisterial teachings and Sacred Traditions of the Church are not the teachings of man. Yes, they were spoken by men, or enacted by men, but we trust what Jesus said about sending the Holy Spirit to guide the Church in all Truth. We do not reject His Word, as you do. We embrace ALL of His Word, both written and spoken through the Church. We hear His voice, we do not merely read it.
And we are constantly becoming ready. It's not a one time thing-boom and you're there. It's a constant renewal and commitment.

Not really, it depends on how you define "Church". God's Church according to the scriptures are all those who believe and follow God's Word. God's Church is not those who knowingly do not believe and follow God's Word. This where your post falls down. God's "Church is not the Roman Catholic Church. According to the scriptures it is all those who believe and follow Gods' Word and are living up to all the knowledge of the scriptures that God has revealed to them. This means that God's people are in every Church (including the RCC) who are living up to all the knowledge that God has revealed to them. We are only held accountable for sin when God gives us a knowledge of the truth of His Word and we choose to reject it according to the scriptures. BABYLON (Christianity) has fallen. God is calling his people out from following man-made teachings and traditions back to the pure Word of God as God is a Spirit and those who worship Him must worship Him in Spirit and in truth. This is the hour that has now come. God's Sheep hear His Voice (the Word) and follow him. Those who do not hear do not follow according to the scriptures because they are not His Sheep.

Root of Jesse · Oct 19, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Not really, it depends on how you define "Church". God's Church according to the scriptures are all those who believe and follow God's Word. God's Church is not those who knowingly do not believe and follow God's Word. This where your post falls down.

Jesus defined Church. Jesus told Peter "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church".
You have yet to prove that we 'knowingly do not believe and follow God's Word.' You know how I know you don't follow God's Word? Because you ignore a lot of it. The Bible is not the only Word of God.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 19, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
Jesus defined Church. Jesus told Peter "You are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church".
You have yet to prove that we 'knowingly do not believe and follow God's Word.' You know how I know you don't follow God's Word? Because you ignore a lot of it. The Bible is not the only Word of God.

Not really. As shown in the previous post I believe Gods' Word and do not follow man made teachings and traditions that do not follow God's Word. The Greek word for Peter means Pebble. Jesus as the rock was referring to himself. The rock according to the scriptures represents JESUS *Matthew 16:18; 1 Corinthians 10:4 Matthew 7:24; Psalms 62:7-8; 1 Peter 2:8; Psalms 89:26; Isaiah 8:14; 1 Corinthians 10:4; 1 Corinthians 3:11; Psalms 118:22; 1 Peter 2:6; Romans 9:33; Ephesians 2:20.

Hope this is helpful.

Root of Jesse · Oct 19, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Not really. As shown in the previous post I believe Gods' Word and do not follow man made teachings and traditions that do not follow God's Word. The Greek word for Peter means Pebble. Jesus as the rock was referring to himself. The rock according to the scriptures represents JESUS *Matthew 16:18; 1 Corinthians 10:4 Matthew 7:24; Psalms 62:7-8; 1 Peter 2:8; Psalms 89:26; Isaiah 8:14; 1 Corinthians 10:4; 1 Corinthians 3:11; Psalms 118:22; 1 Peter 2:6; Romans 9:33; Ephesians 2:20.

Hope this is helpful.

It's not, because you are wrong. Kephas Meaning in Bible - New Testament Greek Lexicon - New American Standard See, Jesus didn't speak to Peter in Greek, he spoke to him in Aramaic. Kephas. Meaning rock. Kephas, translates to Greek petra, masculine petros. Jesus was not referring to himself, although He is the foundation.
The petros argument is null and void.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 19, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
It's not, because you are wrong. Kephas Meaning in Bible - New Testament Greek Lexicon - New American Standard See, Jesus didn't speak to Peter in Greek, he spoke to him in Aramaic. Kephas. Meaning rock. Kephas, translates to Greek petra, masculine petros. Jesus was not referring to himself, although He is the foundation.
The petros argument is null and void.

Not really dear friend. The new testament scriptures were written in the Greek dear friend not Aramiac. The scriptures provided above where provided to prove that JESUS is only ever referred to as the "Rock" and never Peter. In Koine Greek petros generally meant "pebble or rock fragment," while petra meant "boulder" or "cliff". Accordingly, taking Peter's name means "pebble" The scripture says "And I tell you that you are Peter (Πέτρος; G4074 Petros a (piece of) rock pebble and on this rock (πέτρα; G4073 petra a (mass of) rock (literally or figuratively): - rock). I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. The Church was not built on Peter but the teachings of Christ and the Word of God that JESUS commissioned his 12 Apostles to give to the world. The gates of Hell did prevail against Peter many times although to his credit he acknowledged his mistakes and repented. The gates of Hell never prevailed against JESUS and all the scriptures of the old and new testament declare JESUS as the "Rock" not Peter (Go read some of those scriptures in the previous post).

Root of Jesse · Oct 19, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Not really dear friend. The new testament scriptures were written in the Greek dear friend not Aramiac. The scriptures provided above where provided to prove that JESUS is only ever referred to as the "Rock" and never Peter. In Koine Greek petros generally meant "pebble or rock fragment," while petra meant "boulder" or "cliff". Accordingly, taking Peter's name means "pebble" The scripture says "And I tell you that you are Peter (Πέτρος; G4074 Petros a (piece of) rock pebble and on this rock (πέτρα; G4073 petra a (mass of) rock (literally or figuratively): - rock). I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. The Church was not built on Peter but the teachings of Christ and the Word of God that JESUS commissioned his 12 Apostles to give to the world. The gates of Hell did prevail against Peter many times although to his credit he acknowledged his mistakes and repented. The gates of Hell never prevailed against JESUS and all the scriptures of the old and new testament declare JESUS as the "Rock" not Peter (Go read some of those scriptures in the previous post).

John and Paul both refer to him as Kephas or Cephas. Matthew used it, as well.
The Church was built on Jesus with Peter carrying on Jesus' teachings after Jesus left this earth. Kephas/Cephas? Many of your protestant bretheren disagree with you. But Peter is the Vicar of Christ, like the Prime Minister in Isaiah 22.
Regarding the gates of Hell, Jesus said that the Gates of hell would not prevail against the Church. Peter, being a man, was sinful. He said so himself. All of the apostles were, so the question is, why would Jesus leave any of them to carry His Church forward? The answer is that he sent the Holy Spirit to guide them, and their successors, to the present day, and forever, until He comes again.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 19, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
John and Paul both refer to him as Kephas or Cephas. Matthew used it, as well.
The Church was built on Jesus with Peter carrying on Jesus' teachings after Jesus left this earth. Kephas/Cephas? Many of your protestant bretheren disagree with you. But Peter is the Vicar of Christ, like the Prime Minister in Isaiah 22.

But that is not true is it. All the Apostles carried on Christs commission and possibly Paul more so than all the Apostles. Do I look like I care if your friends agree with me? I care what is written in the Gods Word and believe and follow it. Many of the religious teachers in the days of JESUS and the Apostles also disagreed with them and called them a cult of the devil. There is nothing new under the sun according to the scriptures.

Root of Jesse · Oct 19, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
But that is not true is it. All the Apostles carried on Christs commission and possibly Paul more so than all the Apostles.

Read the edit I posted. That Peter was the chosen lead of the apostles does not in any way diminish the work of the others.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 19, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
Read the edit I posted. That Peter was the chosen lead of the apostles does not in any way diminish the work of the others.

As posted above that was never the case was it according to the scriptures.

Root of Jesse · Oct 20, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
As posted above that was never the case was it according to the scriptures.

Prove it. In the gospels, Peter is listed first or alone when any group of apostles is mentioned, the vast majority of the time. It says "Peter, James, and John", "Peter and the other apostles", and so on. And when it is shown that Matthew 16:18-20 references Isaiah 22, where Eliakim replaces the Prime Minister by being given the keys ("What he opens, no one can shut, what he shuts, no one can open"), yes, it looks to most like Peter was the head of the apostles, though equal in stature, at least until after Jesus died.

Root of Jesse · Oct 20, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
But that is not true is it. All the Apostles carried on Christs commission and possibly Paul more so than all the Apostles. Do I look like I care if your friends agree with me? I care what is written in the Gods Word and believe and follow it. Many of the religious teachers in the days of JESUS and the Apostles also disagreed with them and called them a cult of the devil. There is nothing new under the sun according to the scriptures.

Of course they do, but they have a leader, even if he is equal in stature.
Also, you can stop being offensive, the people I pointed out are not Catholic, neither are they my friends. Also, these people agree with Catholics that Peter was the leader.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 20, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
Prove it. In the gospels, Peter is listed first or alone when any group of apostles is mentioned, the vast majority of the time. It says "Peter, James, and John", "Peter and the other apostles", and so on. And when it is shown that Matthew 16:18-20 references Isaiah 22, where Eliakim replaces the Prime Minister by being given the keys ("What he opens, no one can shut, what he shuts, no one can open"), yes, it looks to most like Peter was the head of the apostles, though equal in stature, at least until after Jesus died.

It was proven to you earlier. Perhaps you missed it. As posted earlier the new testament scriptures were written in the Greek dear friend not Aramiac. The scriptures provided above where provided to prove that JESUS is only ever referred to as the "Rock" and never Peter. In Koine Greek petros generally meant "pebble or rock fragment," while petra meant "boulder" or "cliff". Accordingly, taking Peter's name means "pebble" The scripture says "And I tell you that you are Peter (Πέτρος; G4074 Petros a (piece of) rock pebble and on this rock (πέτρα; G4073 petra a (mass of) rock (literally or figuratively): - rock). I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. The Church was not built on Peter but the teachings of Christ and the Word of God that JESUS commissioned his 12 Apostles to give to the world. The gates of Hell did prevail against Peter many times although to his credit he acknowledged his mistakes and repented. The gates of Hell never prevailed against JESUS and all the scriptures of the old and new testament declare JESUS as the "Rock" not Peter (Go read some of those scriptures in the previous posts also provided earlier as evidence showing JESUS is the Rock).

Hope this helps

LoveGodsWord · Oct 20, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
Of course they do, but they have a leader, even if he is equal in stature.
Also, you can stop being offensive, the people I pointed out are not Catholic, neither are they my friends. Also, these people agree with Catholics that Peter was the leader.

James was the leader in Jerusalem not Peter. Of course Peter was one of the leaders but not "the" leader of the Apostles according to scripture.

prodromos · Oct 20, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
In Koine Greek petros generally meant "pebble or rock fragment," while petra meant "boulder" or "cliff".

In Ancient Greek that is true, but in Koine Greek the meanings are more general.

Πέτρος | billmounce.com

Gloss:
Peter; this has the designative meaning rock or individual stone, rock, stone
Definition:
a stone;, in NT the Greek rendering of the surname Cephas, given to the Apostle Simon, and having, therefore, the same sense as πέτρα, Peter, Mt. 4:18; 8:14

Root of Jesse · Oct 20, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
It was proven to you earlier. Perhaps you missed it. As posted earlier the new testament scriptures were written in the Greek dear friend not Aramiac. The scriptures provided above where provided to prove that JESUS is only ever referred to as the "Rock" and never Peter. In Koine Greek petros generally meant "pebble or rock fragment," while petra meant "boulder" or "cliff". Accordingly, taking Peter's name means "pebble" The scripture says "And I tell you that you are Peter (Πέτρος; G4074 Petros a (piece of) rock pebble and on this rock (πέτρα; G4073 petra a (mass of) rock (literally or figuratively): - rock). I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. The Church was not built on Peter but the teachings of Christ and the Word of God that JESUS commissioned his 12 Apostles to give to the world. The gates of Hell did prevail against Peter many times although to his credit he acknowledged his mistakes and repented. The gates of Hell never prevailed against JESUS and all the scriptures of the old and new testament declare JESUS as the "Rock" not Peter (Go read some of those scriptures in the previous posts also provided earlier as evidence showing JESUS is the Rock).

Hope this helps

It absolutely says literally nothing. For your information, Matthew did not write in Greek.

Peter's name doesn't mean pebble, and Jesus made him the head of His Church after Jesus rose from the dead, regardless of what you think his name means. But your logic has been proven false, over and over, and over and over again.
The only part that's right is that The Church was built on the teachings of Christ. What's funny is that the Word of God you point to was spoken word, not written. Jesus referenced the OT, but His Word, God's Word made flesh and spoken, was not written for at least 20 years after he died. You also got it right that Peter was a sinful man, but so were all the others. It doesn't matter, though. Jesus knew his apostles were not perfect, and sent the Holy Spirit to guide them. So, because of the guidance of God, the gates of hell have never prevailed against His Church.
I have read all the scriptures you've provided, and my issue has never been with them, but with your interpretation of them.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 20, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
It absolutely says literally nothing. For your information, Matthew did not write in Greek. Peter's name doesn't mean pebble, and Jesus made him the head of His Church after Jesus rose from the dead, regardless of what you think his name means. But your logic has been proven false, over and over, and over and over again.
The only part that's right is that The Church was built on the teachings of Christ. What's funny is that the Word of God you point to was spoken word, not written. Jesus referenced the OT, but His Word, God's Word made flesh and spoken, was not written for at least 20 years after he died. You also got it right that Peter was a sinful man, but so were all the others. It doesn't matter, though. Jesus knew his apostles were not perfect, and sent the Holy Spirit to guide them. So, because of the guidance of God, the gates of hell have never prevailed against His Church.
I have read all the scriptures you've provided, and my issue has never been with them, but with your interpretation of them.

Sure it does. It seems you do not want to believe the scriptures shared with you so we will have to agree to disagree. For me I prefer to believe what the bible says. "The Gospel According to Matthew was composed in Greek, probably sometime after 70 CE, with evident dependence on the earlier Gospel According to Mark." (Encyclopedia Britannica). Your making things up again.

Root of Jesse · Oct 20, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
James was the leader in Jerusalem not Peter. Of course Peter was one of the leaders but not "the" leader of the Apostles according to scripture.

Yes, the leader of the Church in Jerusalem. Peter was in other parts of the Mediterranean. But even at the Council of Jerusalem, the other apostles listened to Peter and agreed with him.
Sorry, Peter was the leader.

Root of Jesse · Oct 20, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Sure it does seems you do not want to believe the scriptures. For me I prefer to believe what the bible says.

What I will not do is take your word for it. I trust my Church's understanding because it stems from what the first believers actually taught, learned from the apostles themselves.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 20, 2020

Root of Jesse said:
Yes, the leader of the Church in Jerusalem. Peter was in other parts of the Mediterranean. But even at the Council of Jerusalem, the other apostles listened to Peter and agreed with him.
Sorry, Peter was the leader.

And this supports your claim to Peter being "the Leader" of the Apostles how? - It doesn't

WHY THE LORD'S DAY IS NOT SUNDAY

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