Reasons to not vote Left or to vote Left

MorkandMindy · Oct 18, 2020

Reasons not to vote Left

This is always the big one in my experience: 'The Soviet Union collapsed in 1989 proving that communism doesn't work.'

It wasn't communist. The aim of the dominant party in the USSR was to transform it into a communist Soviet state, but this aim was never achieved. There were no communist countries in the whole twentieth century though many Socialist ones.

It didn't collapse. The Presidents of the three largest countries in the USSR met and negotiated a separation. The reason I understand was so that each could run their own countries instead of having Gorbachev over them, having already gained a promise from the US that neither NATO nor the US would take advantage of the loss of unity and move into former Warsaw Pact areas.

MorkandMindy · Oct 18, 2020

Reasons to vote Left

A quick look at the chart shows the countries of Western Europe with a large socialist content are more successful economically than two large mostly Right Wing economies, the UK (the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland), and the US.

Sure there's a lot going on there, and countries move around, but the top ones consistently include Germany and Japan, and the two at the bottom have always been the UK and below that the US.

Both of those require a bit of explanation. The economies are big and more based on consuming than producing. The losses are offset by very large petroleum reserves.

MorkandMindy · Oct 18, 2020

And a reason not to vote left - who would you vote for?
I'm open to any suggestions.

oops, the chart: it is of trade balance, making money on trade or losing money on trade, both visibles and invisibles included as the Current Account Balance:

zippy2006 · Oct 18, 2020

Biden can't tell us whether he will try to pack the Supreme Court. Huge red flag in my opinion.

Fantine · Oct 18, 2020

One reason for that is that Americans aren't making enough money to buy things that are made in America.
I live in a city where a number of people are struggling, and there are thrift stores every few blocks. You wouldn't believe how many people buy their clothes in thrift stores. We've done it ourselves--you can find some beautiful items at great prices.
Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market was doing great, but Aldi cut into its business quite a bit. The pricey supermarket had four stores in town. The two in the more afflulent areas stayed with their price model and were even renovated. The two in the less affluent areas became stores where everyone pays the wholesale price plus 10% (added on at the cash register.)
People tend to shop price over service.
No wonder why we have a trade deficit. That's what happens when wages for the top 1% soar while wages for everyone else remain stagnant year after year.
I remember when my husband was forced to get a new job when he was over 50, at a salary about 20% lower than his previous job.
We didn't want to change our habits. We still wanted to go on vacation, go out to dinner, go to concerts, pay for our children's education, etc. And so we learned how we could do almost the same things we used to by shopping aggressively for the lowest price.
It's sad. It's not good for employment. It's not good for local businesses. It's a trap.

Brightmoon · Oct 18, 2020

I’m a neverTrumper! Conservatives seem either want to disrespect me as an adult woman or disrespect me as a POC. No thanks , I’ll stay left of center , thank you very much!

jacks · Oct 18, 2020

If CAB is Current Account Balance and one is worried about the Trade Deficit, then Trump will probably do more to reduce it than the other candidates. The question really is should we be worried about the trade deficit at all? HERE is an interesting take on it.

timothyu · Oct 18, 2020

The choice is arrogant vs obnoxious. What choice do the majority in the middle have?

Brightmoon · Oct 18, 2020

Well not voting for outright stupid would be helpful

MorkandMindy · Oct 18, 2020

jacks said:
If CAB is Current Account Balance and one is worried about the Trade Deficit, then Trump will probably do more to reduce it than the other candidates. The question really is should we be worried about the trade deficit at all? HERE is an interesting take on it.

That take is wrong, but if it will get people to buy their investments they'll be right in the sense that really matters to them.

timothyu · Oct 18, 2020

Brightmoon said:
Well not voting for outright stupid would be helpful

You haven't been given that choice. The smart ones created the system that keeps you divided and no one votes for them.

JackRT · Oct 18, 2020

zippy2006 said:
Biden can't tell us whether he will try to pack the Supreme Court. Huge red flag in my opinion.

Well, we know for a certainty that Trump is doing his level best to pack the SCOTUS. my question is "Why has the SCOTUS become so political? Why are judgeships political at all?" One would think that we should be looking for the best qualified rather than the ones most likely to lean our way.

Brightmoon · Oct 18, 2020

In a choice between 2 evils you go for the lesser of the 2. I’m not fond of Biden but he won’t be as sheerly stupidly destructive as Trump has been

zippy2006 · Oct 18, 2020

JackRT said:
Well, we know for a certainty that Trump is doing his level best to pack the SCOTUS.

No he isn't. Packing the Court involves expanding it.

my question is "Why has the SCOTUS become so political? Why are judgeships political at all?" One would think that we should be looking for the best qualified rather than the ones most likely to lean our way.

The problem of activist judges and a politicized Court truly has a liberal genesis, and conservatives have been more likely to vote unpredictably than liberals. (The most recent example was Gorsuch & Bostock)

JackRT · Oct 18, 2020

zippy2006 said:
No he isn't. Packing the Court involves expanding it.

The problem of activist judges and a politicized Court truly has a liberal genesis, and conservatives have been more likely to vote unpredictably than liberals. (The most recent example was Gorsuch & Bostock)

My question was less about where the problem originated and more about how we can rid ourselves of a politicized judiciary --- at every level.

timothyu · Oct 18, 2020

JackRT said:
My question was less about where the problem originated and more about how we can rid ourselves of a politicized judiciary --- at every level.

Who is suggesting they are politicized if not those who are political. The SC regardless of nation thanks to Napoleon, thrives on the notion of neutrality. You'll notice the statue of the lady with the scales is blindfolded. That is because it is their job to hold to the letter of the law and not bias. There may be no 'justice' but the laws are upheld.

JackRT · Oct 18, 2020

timothyu said:
Who is suggesting they are politicized if not those who are political. The SC regardless of nation thanks to Napoleon, thrives on the notion of neutrality. You'll notice the statue of the lady with the scales is blindfolded. That is because it is their job to hold to the letter of the law and not bias. There may be no 'justice' but the laws are upheld.

Did you just wake up from a very long sleep?

chevyontheriver · Oct 18, 2020

timothyu said:
The choice is arrogant vs obnoxious. What choice do the majority in the middle have?

Read your ballot and notice that there ARE options other than Biden or Trump. But as long as all of you vote for Biden only to stop Trump or vote for Trump only to stop Biden we are guaranteed to get one of these sordid candidates. I wish people were willing to vote for decent candidates.

chevyontheriver · Oct 18, 2020

zippy2006 said:
No he isn't. Packing the Court involves expanding it.

The problem of activist judges and a politicized Court truly has a liberal genesis, and conservatives have been more likely to vote unpredictably than liberals. (The most recent example was Gorsuch & Bostock)

Republicans have tended over history to approve of Democrat's nominees, and Democrats used to also approve of Republican's nominees. But that changed when Biden et al got really hostile to Republican's nominees. It became scorched earth Borking of all Republican's nominees. Amy Barrett will likely have only votes from Republicans, not because she is unfit but simply because Democrats have become virulently hostile. They, the Democrats, broke bipartisanship. Now that it's broken we're in a mess. Best to get rid of the hyper-partisans, all of the Democrats and most of the Republicans, and put others in who aren't so extreme.

Yttrium · Oct 18, 2020

For me, the question of left or not left is irrelevant this time around. I want Trump out, because I consider him too dangerous to stay in office. It has nothing to do with left or right, Republican or Democrat. I'll pick the best option to get him out, which in this case is Biden.

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