Christmas tree - Good or bad

Bible Highlighter said:

I did not arrive on planet Earth yesterday. I used to celebrate Christmas, and I really enjoyed it.
But my enjoyment and God's enjoyment are two different things. Am I focused on what just makes me happy in this life, or am I concerned with making God happy?

Please research the pagan origins of Christmas on Google, and YouTube. At least know that is pagan. If after you see that is pagan, and you simply do not care, then go right ahead and knock yourself out. I do not want to do anything that my Lord would find offensive.

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NerdGirl123 said:

So, if people here don't agree with you, they're offending God.

Okay.

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This has nothing to do with what I said.
What do you think of building a relationship with the Lord based on only what His Word says?
Should not our walk with the Lord be more about what God wants for our life over what we want?
Jesus tells us to deny ourselves and to pick up our cross.
How do you see this as being applicable to your life?

I see nothing in God's Word about celebrating Christmas, and I am warned not to keep the practices of the heathen (i.e. the Gentiles). Christmas has pagan origins. This is even common knowledge even by worldly channels like the History channel.

Also, I would encourage you to at least see the other side of the debate and check out why certain Christians think Christmas is pagan and why they don't believe in celebrating it. You may not agree with them, but at least you will be informed as to what they believe (even if you don't agree with them).

NerdGirl123 said:

How about speaking for yourself instead of everyone else?

I get excited to observe the miraculous, wondrous, glorious birth of Jesus.

With a Christmas tree.

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I used to have fond memories of Christmas. I used to enjoy this holiday a lot. But as I grew and matured in studying God's Word and in my walk with the Lord, I have discovered that Christmas is not in line with His Word. So my love for my Lord and following Him (His way) is more important than a holiday celebrated by even atheists and Christ haters.

NerdGirl123 said:

Ah, we poor, lost, deluded, immature believers! With our pagan idol trees! WOE TO US!

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I love you in Christ and I only speak the truth in love to follow the Lord and make Him the sole focus of your life. This world and the things within it (that offer pleasure) are fleeting and they will pass away.

Person In Anonymity said:

I have read some of your replies to another thread, specifically about whether games that involve playing as a role are wrong. Fortunately, most people were sensible and agreed that they weren’t, even if for others they could be. I would be willing to respect your beliefs, even if they’re not supported by the Bible when you think that they are. However, you have imposed your personal convictions on others to condemn them for practices that have no moral implications.

You have taken verses out of their given context and applied a meaning to them that was never intended, based on how they were applicable to a different subject. This is something that I have personally done before and even something that I had done to me, which I can now fortunately acknowledge how wrong it is to do that. You have this preconceived notion that if you don’t deny yourself of everything that you believe to be wrong (or for self only) that you’re not actually following God, which is a gross misrepresentation of the verse that I’m referring to. I say everything that I’m saying in love, but you need to seriously rethink your positions on some things.

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We are in the mess that we are in because Adam disobeyed God by breaking one simple command, and it was about a tree. That is why folks are getting so worked up about this topic. They think it is nothing, when our Lord calls us to be holy and separate and to dedicate our life to Him in everything.

I would encourage you to research the pagan origins of Christmas on YouTube, Google, etc.;
If you believe I am taking out of context verses like “deny yourself and pick up your cross” then please show me the context that proves your case. For anyone can say I am taking verses out of context. But without proof of showing how I am doing that makes one statement hollow and or unsubstantiated.

You said:

I want to personally thank you for speaking sensibly. I only created my account to reply to Bible Highlighter, because his/her beliefs are the same type of beliefs that have caused people to renounce their faith.

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Jesus said narrow is the way. The young rich ruler surely was not willing to give up his riches to follow Jesus. I imagine there are many today who are not willing to give up what they want for Jesus. That is what this is really about. What are we not willing to give up for Jesus? What can this world offer us in terms of true lasting love, peace, and joy like God can give? The world and it's pleasures will fade away into the dust. There will be no pagan Christmas celebrations in Heaven.

You said:

They always think that they’re doing something wrong when they never even once thought about the things that are said about them. Case in point, Bible Highlighter is basically condemning others for worshipping a tree (and other things as I mentioned before), when they probably never even thought about worshipping a tree of all things.

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You are putting words into my mouth. I never said that others are worshiping a Christmas tree. I believe the tree is an idol and just having an idol in one's possession is condemned by God. God tells us in His Word to flee idolatry.

You said:

I want to encourage you and others who are intent on denouncing legalism and promoting balance to continue doing so. This will probably be my first and last reply on any thread, as I need to prioritize my mental health and not allow people like Bible Highlighter to worsen my anxiety and depression. We need to allow people to make judgment calls based on God’s guidance for *their lives (the key word is “their”). As someone who has experienced false accusations and family deaths in recent years (one even on my birthday), I have learned the importance of spending time with your family (especially on holidays) and not miss out on opportunities because of someone trying to convince you that a holiday is pagan.

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I am sorry to hear about your situation. I know that all peace, love, and joy come from the Lord. By relying on Him and His ways alone, I believe we can truly find a way to be healed, and to connect with our families in love that we never imagined beyond just calendary holidays. Of course, do not take my word for it, search the New Testament Scriptures for yourself and ask God for the understanding on them (Seeking real truth and not what we want to hear).

You said:

The holidays aren’t pagan. If God created all days, you shouldn’t allow Satan to claim ownership of a day that was given to us by God. May God continue to change the hearts of those who have become hardened. Even due to their own overzealous ness and thinking it to be righteousness. Enjoy the time that you have with your families. God bless everyone before, during, and after the holidays.

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The more I read God's Word, the more I discover about how giving up my life, and my wants and my desires to follow the Lord is a good thing and it does not make my heart hard. I believe sin and selfish desires is what leads to causing a person's heart to be hard.

“But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.” (Hebrews 3:13).

But we can agree to disagree in love and respect (of course).

Please be well.

Peace be unto you in the Lord.

Bible Highlighter said:

idol

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What is your definition of an idol?

Isilwen said:

What is your definition of an idol?

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Idols in the Old Testament were generally regarded as statues that they created as a form of worship. But it can refer to as a tree in Jeremiah 10.

We know that tree worship is something that exists throughout history. The origins of Christmas are pagan. The Christmas tree is pagan. Pat Robertson of the 700 club who is for Christmas will say that is all pagan. He simply does not care. Jeremiah 10 talks about the practice of decorating idol trees. We are told to flee idolatry. So while one may not worship an idol tree that the Bible condemns, just having it in one's home is not good because God tells us to flee idolatry and because Israel was under the condemnation of God because they refused to destroy their idols.

Isilwen said:

What is your definition of an idol?

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Oddly enough, the same chapter that talks about idol trees is the same chapter that says not to learn the way of the heathen. This is what this is about. Not learning the way of the heathen. Christmas is a heathen or wordly holiday. Sure, it mentions Christ, but not all versions of Christ are the same. Paul talks about those who preach another Jesus. I believe the Jesus of Christmas time is another Jesus, and it is not the same Jesus of the Bible. For Jesus would never approve of our keeping idols around and or fighting in department stories in order to exchange gifts with loved ones.

Bible Highlighter said:

Idols in the Old Testament were generally regarded as statues that they created as a form of worship. But it can refer to as a tree in Jeremiah 10.

We know that tree worship is something that exists throughout history. The origins of Christmas are pagan. The Christmas tree is pagan. Pat Robertson of the 700 club who is for Christmas will say that is all pagan. He simply does not care. Jeremiah 10 talks about the practice of decorating idol trees. We are told to flee idolatry. So while one may not worship an idol tree that the Bible condemns, just having it in one's home is not good because God tells us to flee idolatry and because Israel was under the condemnation of God because they refused to destroy their idols.

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You do not see the difference between a Christmas tree to which no one bows down to and the tree in Jeremiah 10?

They are being carved by a craftsman into a God that they worshipped. That's the key. Christians who have a Christmas tree are not treating it as a God or as say an idol.

Bible Highlighter said:

Jeremiah 10 talks about the practice of decorating idol trees.

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Look out how they did so. There may be minute similarities, but just about anything we do or have done, heathens have done as well. Should we stop eating because heathens eat? Should we stop working because heathens work? The list goes on and on.

Bible Highlighter said:

Christmas is a heathen or wordly holiday.

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It's really not. It is truly a Christian holiday. It's the day that while not His actual birth, is the day that was agreed upon to celebrate His birth, to commemorate His birth.

Bible Highlighter said:

For Jesus would never approve of our keeping idols around and or fighting in department stories in order to exchange gifts with loved ones.

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I agree and a Christmas tree isn't an idol to Christians. It's not our God whom we worship. As far as fighting in department stores, just because there are some that do that, don't mean that all do that. I think the last couple of years we shopped online totally for gifts. We gave gifts to our children and my girlfriend and I exchanged gifts. Neither of us went into debt. Matter of fact, the majority of the shopping was done with gift cards that I was able to accumulate through the year as I belong to an online forum where I give my opinion on food products and I am reimbursed with gift cards for Amazon. Beyond that, we used our checking account and didn't spend more than we reasonably could with our thoughts on bills and rent for our apartments.

Bible Highlighter said:

Oddly enough, the same chapter that talks about idol trees is the same chapter that says not to learn the way of the heathen.

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Using computers is the way of the heathen, should we Christians stop using the computer?

You don't do Christmas anymore. Good on ya! Truly! It's a sin in your mind. Maybe for you, it really was sin and God put it on your heart not to do it anymore. However, many of us don't have that same conviction because it is not a sin to us in how we celebrate Christmas. Just as one person's excessive use of the computer can be a sin, but another's moderate use isn't. It is the same principle with Christmas trees. To one it can be sin, but to another, it isn't.

Edit: This is my only reply to you on this. I am growing tired of debating people online anymore.

Bèlla said:

My grandmother's tree has a steel base with metal slats. The tree is divided into four sections. You slide them into the slats and you're done. It takes 10-15 minutes to put up.

I purchased my mother one like you described. The base was wood. I went to a Christmas tree store. The branches were green and white to simulate snowfall. I got it years ago and it was $229 after the holidays. Balsam Hill is your best bet for something good.

Yours in His Service,

~Bella

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I was able to find another place that I'll be ordering from that has hooked branches:

Classic Trees

Isilwen said:

You do not see the difference between a Christmas tree to which no one bows down to and the tree in Jeremiah 10? They are being carved by a craftsman into a God that they worshipped. That's the key.

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Nothing is said that these trees are carved into idol statues of people. Jeremiah just says that they cut down trees and decorated them with gold and silver. Jeremiah also says that this practice is vain (See: Jeremiah 10:3-4). Jeremiah later talks about molten graven images in verse 14 (See: Jeremiah 10:14).

It is also written:

21 Thou shalt not plant thee a grove of any trees near unto the altar of the Lord thy God, which thou shalt make thee.
22 Neither shalt thou set thee up any image; which the Lord thy God hateth."
(Deuteronomy 16:21-22).

You said:

Christians who have a Christmas tree are not treating it as a God or as say an idol.

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We cannot change history. Tree worship can be seen in Jeremiah 10:3-4. Why would we want to flirt with doing something similar? Sure, one may not bow down to these trees, but to decorate them as the pagans did is not good at all. They decorated trees as a part of their worship of these trees. So why would we want to copy them and get close to even what they were doing? Therein lies the problem that I know you will refuse to see (at this point in time).

Look out how they did so. There may be minute similarities, but just about anything we do or have done, heathens have done as well. Should we stop eating because heathens eat? Should we stop working because heathens work? The list goes on and on.

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We need food to live. You are comparing a necessary function of survival with something that is tied with a practice of pagan idolaters. So they are not the same thing.

You said:

It's really not. It is truly a Christian holiday. It's the day that while not His actual birth, is the day that was agreed upon to celebrate His birth, to commemorate His birth.

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Christmas was created by the Catholic church. Hence the name, “Christ-mass.” The Catholic church is full of idol statues and imagery. So it is no wonder that Christmas (Christ-mass) involves similar idolatrous elements. If you are Catholic, or you don't have an issue with Catholicism, then by all means knock yourself out.

You said:

I agree and a Christmas tree isn't an idol to Christians.

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I am sure there are lots of Christians today who do not regard the reality of certain things. That does not change the truth of how things actually are.

You said:

It's not our God whom we worship. As far as fighting in department stores, just because there are some that do that, don't mean that all do that.

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This is just one link in the chain of bad fruit of this holiday (holy day).

You said:

I think the last couple of years we shopped online totally for gifts. We gave gifts to our children and my girlfriend and I exchanged gifts. Neither of us went into debt.

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But many have gone into debt. Just because you have not, does not mean that the bad fruit of Christmas has not manifested in the lives of others.

You said:

Using computers is the way of the heathen, should we Christians stop using the computer?

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Nothing is said in the Bible about using computers as being bad. However, the decorating of trees in Jeremiah 10:3-4 is condemned. Why should we go against what His Word says? Or why should we do even something even remotely close to Jeremiah 10:3-4? What if one is wrong on this point? What if Jeremiah 10:3-4 also condemns even possessing idol trees that are decorated in gold and silver?

You said:

You don't do Christmas anymore. Good on ya! Truly! It's a sin in your mind. Maybe for you, it really was sin and God put it on your heart not to do it anymore. However, many of us don't have that same conviction because it is not a sin to us in how we celebrate Christmas. Just as one person's excessive use of the computer can be a sin, but another's moderate use isn't. It is the same principle with Christmas trees. To one it can be sin, but to another, it isn't.

Edit: This is my only reply to you on this. I am growing tired of debating people online anymore.

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I believe that once a Christian learns about the truth of Christmas, they will no longer celebrate it. It takes time to discover the truth for believers. It is my hope that you will discover the truth on this topic someday. To follow the Lord and not the ways of this world. For the ways of the world cannot satisy, but our Lord and His good ways can.

Not a Christian thing

I put up my First one in the upstairs loft today. After Friday (Black Friday LOL) I will set up two downstairs...the main big one in the main room, and a smaller real one in the living room My son has his up since Nov 1st in his room. There will be a smaller one in the guest room and in the bedroom. So that is a total of 6. I like for my house to have a definite Christmas theme, lights, decorations, and Garlands, Trees, and of course, Christmas music playing .

Bible Highlighter said:

I believe that once a Christian learns about the truth of Christmas, they will no longer celebrate it. It takes time to discover the truth for believers. It is my hope that you will discover the truth on this topic someday. To follow the Lord and not the ways of this world. For the ways of the world cannot satisy, but our Lord and His good ways can.

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Amen.
(if they care about the truth)

Kav said:

So back in 2010/2011 I was seeking God about whether it was okay to have a Christmas tree put up or not. I would see Christmas trees put up in the church that I was attending at the time, so I figured it was okay and didn’t think anything of it, until one day someone said something about it maybe offending people, and that’s what made me wonder.

I was praying one night asking God about it, and as I was ending my prayer, I heard a voice that said, “Idolatry”. (I’ve never told anybody but my husband, mom, and a friend b/c ppl would probably think I’m nuts or not believe that God spoke to me).
I have read in the bible about how they would cut down trees and carve out images/idols and adorn them w/ gold and things to worship. So I have not been putting a Christmas Tree up since God spoke to me that night.

I have now been seeking him about the same thing b/c I have heard/read from different pastors and Christians that it is not wrong to have a Christmas Tree.
So I wanted to know what everyone here thinks about it. (Sorry this was a long one)

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When God spoke to you (as He has to others), in line and harmony with His Word, that is good and accepted.
When men speak to you , opposed to God and contrary to what His Word Says, no need to listen to them, right ?
It would even be a sin to listen to those opposed to what God Says, or to those opposed to what God's Word Says.
Keep Listening to God, verified by His Word .....

-CryptoLutheran

Kav said:

So back in 2010/2011 I was seeking God about whether it was okay to have a Christmas tree put up or not. I would see Christmas trees put up in the church that I was attending at the time, so I figured it was okay and didn’t think anything of it, until one day someone said something about it maybe offending people, and that’s what made me wonder.

I was praying one night asking God about it, and as I was ending my prayer, I heard a voice that said, “Idolatry”. (I’ve never told anybody but my husband, mom, and a friend b/c ppl would probably think I’m nuts or not believe that God spoke to me).
I have read in the bible about how they would cut down trees and carve out images/idols and adorn them w/ gold and things to worship. So I have not been putting a Christmas Tree up since God spoke to me that night.

I have now been seeking him about the same thing b/c I have heard/read from different pastors and Christians that it is not wrong to have a Christmas Tree.
So I wanted to know what everyone here thinks about it. (Sorry this was a long one)

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This is my opinion: People say that Christmas is about Christ, but it is not. What does Santa clause have to do with Christ. It's just like Easter. Another way of the devil corrupting people with idol worship. It came from the catholic church. It's all part of the world deception. When you enter into the body of Christ, everyday is Holy, so there are no days that stand out more than the other. If you want to give, there is no special day to do so. So do it whenever you want too.

I’m going to get my tinsel , my fake tree , my Jingle Bell Rock (my favorite Christmas song) and my decorations and thoroughly enjoy them! I can think of nothing sillier or more superstitious than having a conniption fit over this stuff.

Childofgodharrison said:

This is my opinion: People say that Christmas is about Christ, but it is not. What does Santa clause have to do with Christ. It's just like Easter. Another way of the devil corrupting people with idol worship. It came from the catholic church. It's all part of the world deception. When you enter into the body of Christ, everyday is Holy, so there are no days that stand out more than the other. If you want to give, there is no special day to do so. So do it whenever you want too.

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I agree with everything you said other than all days are holy days. That simply isn't true. The Lord's Day is set apart from other days, that is the one holy day each week where the saints are instructed to come together to worship God in a Biblical manner. That's what makes Xmas and Easter so insidious, they take away from the Lord's Day and God's commands concerning it.

I am going to try putting up my tree this year. Last year I tried and my kittens kept climbing it and knocking ornaments off, so I had to do without.

No, there is nothing wrong with putting up a Christmas tree. Unfortunately my family will probably not be getting together for Christmas dinner this year, but that is because of COVID, not because there is anything wrong with celebrating Christmas.

Childofgodharrison said:

This is my opinion: People say that Christmas is about Christ, but it is not. What does Santa clause have to do with Christ. It's just like Easter. Another way of the devil corrupting people with idol worship. It came from the catholic church. It's all part of the world deception. When you enter into the body of Christ, everyday is Holy, so there are no days that stand out more than the other. If you want to give, there is no special day to do so. So do it whenever you want too.

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All that has to be done to correct what you are concerned about is to stick to the religious meaning and observance bof Christmas (or Easter) and avoid Santa Claus, Mistletoe, etc. etc. which secular societies have exploited for the sake of gift-buying or something else. The problem is solved and "the baby is not thrown out with the bath water."