Any Holy Spirit Revival leading multitudes to Sabbath observance?

clefty · Oct 8, 2020

BobRyan said:
I like the optimism in that site.. it says
"The best answers are voted up and rise to the top"

wouldn't that be nice!!

LOL...remnant bro...this ain't for everyone...and by that I mean not all accept the Sabbath is made for man...not just Jews...

the Way is narrow for a reason...they ain't real men? LOL

the irony as many men who reject the gift of Sabbath ALSO reject the other gift made for man...women...lol

with the same reasoning too..."OT IS NOT FOR ME"...

Bob S · Oct 12, 2020

After reading some of the posts on this thread I see some bragging done by SDAs, I see some new revelations on when to observe Sabbath. The thing I have not seen is an explanation as to why the Holy Spirit has not been prodding man to observe a day. SDAs spend millions trying to convince people the need to keep the day they keep (my bobservation of "keep" is a misnomer) and the results are really dismal except in 3rd world countries. And, if it were not for the 3rd world countries the membership would also be dismal. Wouldn't you think here in the USA, Australia, Europe and other nations of well educated people the Holy Spirit would give them the incentive to accept the invitation to join the churches that keep all of the ten commandments? Why, after bringing people into those Sabbath keeping churches doesn't the Holy Spirit persuade them to remain? What we find is that many of those who join are going out the back door and the reason the number of members look so impressive is because they don't request that their names be taken off the books.

Even the threat issued in the writings of the SDA prophet, Ellen White, that if one doesn't keep the Sabbath they will not inherit eternal life, wouldn't you think that the Holy Spirit would be working overtime trying to get all mankind churched in Sabbath "keeping" churches?

SabbathBlessings · Oct 12, 2020

Quoting scriptures is not the same as bragging. In the end everyone is going to have to choose who do you obey. God? And if its not God then default is Satan. There is a spiritual war going on that even seeps through on these posts. Everyone is free to make their choice. I want to follow what is written in the Bible, not what a man says or a denomination says if it doesn't match up to what the Bible teaches.

God saves us by Grace but Jesus said if you love me keep my commandments John 14:15 and Mathew 7:21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

Pray on these things and let God lead your way.

clefty · Oct 12, 2020

Bob S said:
After reading some of the posts on this thread I see some bragging done by SDAs,

don't be sore...

No need to be so passive aggressive...feel free to address a poster...might NOT be SDA...but doubt your care to specify but cast shade on all Sabbath keepers in general yes?

I see some new revelations on when to observe Sabbath.

indeed...stick around...more and more light is being revealed as the Spirit leads HalleluYah...

The thing I have not seen is an explanation as to why the Holy Spirit has not been prodding man to observe a day.

pricking of the Spirit only happens so long? To individual NOT reprobate or shut off completely? NOT lamenting crying out SHOW ME THY WAY?

It is true Pharisees thought they had it all too...

SDAs spend millions trying to convince people the need to keep the day they keep (my bobservation of "keep" is a misnomer)

LOL...bobservation I see what ya dun did there...nice...wonder if you observe they also don't have it all together either...Sabbath is just ONE commandment after all...there is the 1 and 2 and 3 etc...
SDA were known as cult because founding pioneers were non trinitarian...they also accepted the dietary laws but reject the other sabbaths of Yah's calendar while still celebrating Gregory's with its ChristMass and Easter and Hallow's eve...so they were learning about the sanctuary but alas rejecting its showtimes...oh yes and the name thingy...they wish to come out of Babylon yet continue to name our Savior by a Babylonian name...the irony...

and the results are really dismal except in 3rd world countries. And, if it were not for the 3rd world countries the membership would also be dismal. Wouldn't you think here in the USA, Australia, Europe and other nations of well educated people the Holy Spirit would give them the incentive to accept the invitation to join the churches that keep all of the ten commandments?

nawww...educated and indoctrinated individuals have a hard time with UNLEARNING man's traditions...there is great comfort in tradition and peer pressure acceptance and "might makes right"...I mean who wants to be an extremist and zealot annoying Romans with customs not lawful for Romans to receive or observe? LOL

Why, after bringing people into those Sabbath keeping churches doesn't the Holy Spirit persuade them to remain?

you would judge the people leaving the Titanic as deserting ship because some bad fish on the menu...LOL

What we find is that many of those who join are going out the back door and the reason the number of members look so impressive is because they don't request that their names be taken off the books.

yup...padding the pews and uping the numbers is all part of the tradtions...happily He still has those with minority views and dissent the status quo willing NOT to get along to go along the ecumenical laodicean way...

Even the threat issued in the writings of the SDA prophet, Ellen White, that if one doesn't keep the Sabbath they will not inherit eternal life, wouldn't you think that the Holy Spirit would be working overtime trying to get all mankind churched in Sabbath "keeping" churches?

this is NOT the fault of Holy Spirit but if people insisted in breaking ANY of the commandments NOT just the Sabbath...and returning to their former ways like dogs to vomit well...better indeed would it have been for them NOT to have heard the holy commandment...

there is a reason the Way is narrow...His are a remnant and not a popularity contest or universal kingdom...that's for the other team...who claims His ways "NOT FOR ME"

all types of soil out here...same Seed...NOT producing differing fruit...or the most popular...and certainly NOT all the time...

I mean look at what happened to the last One who did...

not a good selling point...but will be the fate for those that follow Him...

the world having HATED Him first...

TruthSeek3r · Oct 14, 2020

Hi, I'm back after multiple days busy with PhD related stuff. I'm taking a little break now to resume my replying to your posts @LoveGodsWord. However, you will probably see me disappear for another bunch of days again as I'm not done yet with all my academic duties.

The following is my reply to your post #32 (which in turn was your reply to my post #26).

LoveGodsWord said:
Of course yes! Keep in mind though God's Spirit is the Spirit of the Word of God and works through the Word not outside of it as we believe and follow Gods Word...
JOHN 6:63 It is the spirit that quickens; the flesh profits nothing: THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK UNTO YOU THEY ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE.
JOHN 17:17 Sanctify them through the truth, thy Word is truth.

Awesome, we are starting right away with fallacious arguments.

Your claim: "God's Spirit [...] works through the Word not outside of it".

Your (alleged) evidence:

1) John 6:63: this passages never says that the Holy Spirit cannot work outside of someone reading the Bible. This passage only says that the words of Jesus (God) "are spirit and are life", which seems to support the idea that when someone hears the Gospel being preached, the Gospel message can "spiritually revive" someone who is "spiritually dead", and I certainly agree that the Holy Spirit is involved in the process. BUT, you can't go from that and put God in a box and claim that the Holy Spirit cannot move in other contexts. This passage never says that.

2) John 17:17: this passages never says that the Holy Spirit cannot work outside of someone reading the Bible. This passage only says that the word of God is truth and that it can sanctify people. Again, this passage never says that you can put God in a box and claim that the Holy Spirit cannot move in the other contexts. This passage never says that.

Moreover, there is plenty of scriptural evidence showing exactly the opposite: that the Holy Spirit can indeed operate in contexts where no one is reading the Bible. For example:

In creation (there was no Bible at the time, let alone someone around to read it).

Genesis 1:1-2:
1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

Over Samson when he tore a lion apart. I think you would agree that Samson didn't pull out a Pentateuch in order to read it when he had to face the lion, don't you?

Judges 14:6
6 And the Spirit of the Lord came mightily upon him, and he tore the lion apart as one would have torn apart a young goat, though he had nothing in his hand. But he did not tell his father or his mother what he had done.

Through David. This is an example of the Holy Spirit using someone to speak through, rather than someone reading a text.

2 Samuel 23:2
2 “The Spirit of the Lord spoke by me, And His word was on my tongue.

Speaking to Ezekiel. Ezekiel provides an example of how the Holy Spirit can speak in audible voice to someone (rather than someone reading a text):

Ezekiel 2:2
2 Then the Spirit entered me when He spoke to me, and set me on my feet; and I heard Him who spoke to me.

And again, in the OP I already provided multiple examples of how the Holy Spirit can manifest supernaturally outside of "reading the Scriptures". Let me copy paste a few of them to save you some time:

The Holy Spirit supernaturally teleporting Philip to Azotus:

Acts 8:38-40
38 And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water and Philip baptized him. 39 When they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord suddenly took Philip away, and the eunuch did not see him again, but went on his way rejoicing. 40 Philip, however, appeared at Azotus and traveled about, preaching the gospel in all the towns until he reached Caesarea.

The Holy Spirit speaking in audible voice to Peter:

Acts 10:19-20
While Peter was reflecting on the vision, the Spirit said to him, “Behold, three men are looking for you. But get up, go downstairs and accompany them without misgivings, for I have sent them Myself.”

Cornelius and his household (all Gentiles) getting baptized in the Holy Spirit:

Acts of the Apostles 10:44-48
44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit fell upon all those who heard the word. 45 And those of the circumcision who believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out on the Gentiles also. 46 For they heard them speak with tongues and magnify God. Then Peter answered, 47 “Can anyone forbid water, that these should not be baptized who have received the Holy Spirit just as we have?” 48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then they asked him to stay a few days.

The Apostle Paul himself stresses the ability of the Holy Spirit to perform supernatural signs and wonders, beyond the mere hearing of intellectual arguments (words):

1 Corinthians 2:4-5
4 My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on human wisdom, but on God’s power.

CONCLUSION: No, you can't put God in a box. There is plenty of evidence in Scripture showing that the Holy Spirit can manifest without someone reading the Bible, since Genesis (when there were no Bibles around to read) and all the way till the Book of Acts, and certainly till today. Again, Don't put God in a box.

LoveGodsWord said:
Of course yes! Keep in mind though God's Spirit is the Spirit of the Word of God and works through the Word not outside of it as we believe and follow Gods' Word... (see previous section John 6:63; John 17:17)

Again, the Holy Spirit can move in multiple contexts. It is not restricted to "hearing the Bible being read" context only. Don't put God in a box.

Then I asked:

TruthSeek3r" said:
5) Do you agree with me that the Holy Spirit is the one who leads the Christian to live a holy life? (Yes/no?)

TruthSeek3r" said:
6) Do you agree with me that the Holy Spirit empowers Christians to be witnesses of Jesus Christ? (Yes/no?)

And you replied (twice):

LoveGodsWord said:
Yeps as we believe and follow God's Word. *John 3:16-19

Wrong verses? Please read what John 3:16-19 says:

16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth on him should not perish, but have eternal life. 17 For God sent not the Son into the world to judge the world; but that the world should be saved through him. 18 He that believeth on him is not judged: he that believeth not hath been judged already, because he hath not believed on the name of the only begotten Son of God. 19 And this is the judgment, that the light is come into the world, and men loved the darkness rather than the light; for their works were evil.

This passage is talking about salvation through faith in Jesus. This passage never mentions neither the Holy Spirit nor the Scriptures. I asked questions about the role of the Holy Spirit 1) sanctifying and 2) empowering believers, and you respond with "yes, through the Bible" and provide a passage that neither mentions the Holy Spirit nor the Bible. Are you even paying attention to what is being asked? ... Anyways, I already provided evidence that the Holy Spirit can manifest outside "reading the Scriptures", so I won't waste any more time on this point.

LoveGodsWord said:
No dear friend, as I have said and believe no such thing. As posted earlier what I believe is that if we need to be born again in the Spirit *John 3:3-7; 1 John 3:6-9 and receive a new heart *Ezekiel 36:25:27 to love God, we will keep his commandments. This is what the scriptures teach and what the new covenant is about *Hebrews 8:10-12

Sure, I agree. No problem with those verses. However, notice what Ezekiel 36:25-27 that you cited says:

25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your impurities and from all your idols. 26 I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit in you; I will remove from you your heart of stone and give you a heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my Spirit in you and move you to follow my decrees and be careful to keep my laws.

Notice two things:

1) This passage promises that the Holy Spirit will have a proactive role changing the believer's heart and moving them to obedience to God's commandments. Taking this passage as premise, and if we assume (as you claim) that the Sabbath must be kept by the Gentiles, then you should logically conclude and expect that the Holy Spirit will move evangelized Gentiles to keep the Sabbath. You should expect that, because the passage is clearly saying that the Holy Spirit will move people to obey God's commandments. HOWEVER, we don't see any of that happening in most revivals throughout history. We don't see people getting led by the Holy Spirit to keep the Sabbath in most revivals. Again, please refer to all the revivals listed in the OP. Or if you want me to recommend you a specific revival, take a look at Uganda's revival (which occurred relatively recently in the 1980s and 1990s).

2) The passages never mention the 10 commandments. Again, let me remind you that in the Old Covenant we find 613 commandments, and 1050 in the New Covenant: 1,050 New Testament Commands | Christian Assemblies International.

LoveGodsWord said:
God's Sabbath is only one of God's 10 commandments [...]

Correction, it is only one of 613 + 1050 = 1663 commandments.

LoveGodsWord said:
[...] where love is expressed as our duty of love to God Matthew 22:36-40 (from Deuteronomy 6:5; Leviticus 19:18).

Surely we are commanded to love God and our neighbor, but it is funny that you mention that because to support this you have to resort to two commandments outside the decalogue, all the while stubbornly claiming that there are only 10 commandments. The two most important commandments that you just cited are from outside the decalogue, they are part of the other 603 commandments from the Old Testament that you keep dismissing (and that's not including the 1050 commandments we find in the New Testament).

TruthSeek3r · Oct 14, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Follow these scriptures through [...]

No problem, let's do it ...

LoveGodsWord said:
*John 14:15;

No problem, but again, which of 613 + 1050 commandments?

LoveGodsWord said:
Matthew 22:36-40;

No problem. But notice this passage talks about the two greatest commandments, which, as we already saw, are outside the decalogue.

LoveGodsWord said:
Romans 13:8-10;

No problem. But this passage talks about loving your neighbor, and never mentions the Sabbath.

LoveGodsWord said:
James 2:8-12;

No problem here either. But just as before, this passage talks about loving your neighbors. No mention of the Sabbath here either.

LoveGodsWord said:
1 John 5:3;

No problem, but again, which of 613 + 1050 commandments?

LoveGodsWord said:
1 John 4:7;

Again, this passage talks about loving one another. No mention of the Sabbath.

LoveGodsWord said:
1 John 5:4;

This passage talks about overcoming the world. No mention of the Sabbath.

LoveGodsWord said:
1 John 3:6-9;

This passage is confirming Ezekiel 36:25-27 in the sense that born-again believers are endowed with a new nature, by the Holy Spirit, that naturally leads them away from sin. But again, no mention of Sabbath here.

LoveGodsWord said:
1 John 2:3-4.

Sure. But again, which of 613 + 1050 commandments?

LoveGodsWord said:
God does not hold anyone accountable for sin untill he has given them a knowledge of the truth of his Word *Acts of the Apostles 17:30-31.

To be more precise, this passage is referring to God's call for repentance from sin (the Gospel), but yeah. However, the Sabbath is never mentioned here either.

LoveGodsWord said:
Once we have been given a knowledge of the truth of God's Word and we reject it by hardening our hearts to hearing his Word *Hebrews 3:8; Hebrews 3:15 in order to continue to practice sin we are held accountable for sin *James 4:17 as it is written in Hebrews 10:26-31.

Agreed. But again, no mention of Sabbath in these passages either.

LoveGodsWord said:
The bible does not teach everone will be saved like the faithful Bareans *Acts of the Apostles 17:11.

The context of Acts 17:11 is Paul preaching the Gospel's salvation message to Jews. He obviously pointed them to the scriptures that proved the authenticity of Jesus as the Messiah. Neither the text nor its context even suggest that what he convinced them about was "keeping the Sabbath".

LoveGodsWord said:
God's Word teaches that the many will heap themselves together teachers having itching ears *2 Timothy 4:3-4 [...]

Agreed. But the passage never addresses the Sabbath.

LoveGodsWord said:
and will be lost *Matthew 7:21-23.

Agreed. But again, this passage never mentions the Sabbath either.

LoveGodsWord said:
The many, close their eyes and ears to hearing the truth of God's Word and will reject it and harden their hearts to the Spirits calling as spoken by Isaiah, Jesus and Paul *Isaiah 6:9-10; Matthew 13:15-16 and Acts of the Apostles 28:26-27.

These passages are talking about salvation through Jesus Christ, not the Sabbath. As an example, check the broader context in Acts 28:

23 They arranged to meet Paul on a certain day, and came in even larger numbers to the place where he was staying. He witnessed to them from morning till evening, explaining about the kingdom of God, and from the Law of Moses and from the Prophets he tried to persuade them about Jesus. 24 Some were convinced by what he said, but others would not believe. 25 They disagreed among themselves and began to leave after Paul had made this final statement: “The Holy Spirit spoke the truth to your ancestors when he said through Isaiah the prophet:

26 “‘Go to this people and say,
“You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.”
27 For this people’s heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.’[a]

28 “Therefore I want you to know that God’s salvation has been sent to the Gentiles, and they will listen!”

LoveGodsWord said:
The scriptures teach JESUS is standing at the foor of the heart knocking and if any man hear my Voice (the Word), and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me *Revelation 3:20.

Sure. But no mention of Sabbath here either.

LoveGodsWord said:
The question we must all ask ourselves is are we opening the door of our hearts to JESUS when he is calling us through his Word?

I mean, sure, but I don't understand why you keep restricting God to the Bible only, when there are other means He can use as well. For example, Jesus promoted the use of signs and wonders:

John 10:19-21; John 10:31-33; John 10:37-38

19 The Jews who heard these words were again divided. 20 Many of them said, “He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?” 21 But others said, “These are not the sayings of a man possessed by a demon. Can a demon open the eyes of the blind?”
[...]
31 Again his Jewish opponents picked up stones to stone him, 32 but Jesus said to them, “I have shown you many good works from the Father. For which of these do you stone me?” 33 “We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God.”
[...]
37 Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. 38 But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”

Matthew 11:2-6

2 When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3 to ask him, “Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?” 4 Jesus replied, “Go back and report to John what you hear and see: 5 The blind receive sight, the lame walk, those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor. 6 Blessed is anyone who does not stumble on account of me.”

Mark 16:15-18

15 He said to them, “Go into all the world and preach the gospel to all creation. 16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned. 17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues; 18 they will pick up snakes with their hands; and when they drink deadly poison, it will not hurt them at all; they will place their hands on sick people, and they will get well.”

Which is seconded by Paul himself:

1 Corinthians 2:4-5
4 My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on human wisdom, but on God’s power.

LoveGodsWord said:
Can we hear his knocking? Or will we harden our hearts to his calling (the Word).

I'm pretty sure the calling is about the good news of Salvation, not Sabbath keeping.

LoveGodsWord said:
Time for a prayerful search of the scriptures don't you think dear friend?

I mean, we should always be praying when digging the Scriptures for any subject matter, so sure.

sparow · Oct 14, 2020

TruthSeek3r said:
The Bible makes very clear how important the Holy Spirit is in the life of the Christian. We have the example of Jesus himself in passages such as:

Matthew 3:15-17

15 Jesus replied, “Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness.” Then John consented. 16 As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and alighting on him. 17 And a voice from heaven said, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”

Matthew 4:1-3

Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. 2 After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry. 3 The tempter came to him and said, “If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread.”

Luke 4:13-15

13 When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time. 14 Jesus returned to Galilee in the power of the Spirit, and news about him spread through the whole countryside. 15 He was teaching in their synagogues, and everyone praised him.

We observe the same power of the Holy Spirit being promised to the disciples:

Acts 1:6-8

6 Then they gathered around him and asked him, “Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them: “It is not for you to know the times or dates the Father has set by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.”

And in fact, the whole book of Acts is full of accounts of how the Holy Spirit manifested powerfully through the apostles and disciples, including the Gentiles:

Acts 10:44-48

44 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who heard the message. 45 The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on Gentiles. 46 For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God. Then Peter said, 47 “Surely no one can stand in the way of their being baptized with water. They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have.” 48 So he ordered that they be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ. Then they asked Peter to stay with them for a few days.

There are many passages in the New Testament stressing the importance of living a Spirit-filled and Spirit-led life and receiving power through the Spirit for witnessing:

1 Corinthians 2:1-5

And so it was with me, brothers and sisters. When I came to you, I did not come with eloquence or human wisdom as I proclaimed to you the testimony about God. 2 For I resolved to know nothing while I was with you except Jesus Christ and him crucified. 3 I came to you in weakness with great fear and trembling. 4 My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power, 5 so that your faith might not rest on human wisdom, but on God’s power.

Romans 8:4-14

4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6 The mind governed by the flesh is death, but the mind governed by the Spirit is life and peace. 7 The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God. 9 You, however, are not in the realm of the flesh but are in the realm of the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God lives in you. And if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, they do not belong to Christ. 10 But if Christ is in you, then even though your body is subject to death because of sin, the Spirit gives life because of righteousness. 11 And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies because of his Spirit who lives in you. 12 Therefore, brothers and sisters, we have an obligation—but it is not to the flesh, to live according to it. 13 For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live. 14 For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.

Galatians 5:22-25

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit.

Ephesians 5:15-20

15 Be very careful, then, how you live—not as unwise but as wise, 16 making the most of every opportunity, because the days are evil. 17 Therefore do not be foolish, but understand what the Lord’s will is. 18 Do not get drunk on wine, which leads to debauchery. Instead, be filled with the Spirit, 19 speaking to one another with psalms, hymns, and songs from the Spirit. Sing and make music from your heart to the Lord, 20 always giving thanks to God the Father for everything, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.
_________________________________________

We can also see examples of the Holy Spirit leading and giving instructions to the apostles and disciples:

Acts 8:29

Then the Spirit said to Philip, “Go up and join this chariot.”

Acts 8:38-40

38 And he gave orders to stop the chariot. Then both Philip and the eunuch went down into the water and Philip baptized him. 39 When they came up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord suddenly took Philip away, and the eunuch did not see him again, but went on his way rejoicing. 40 Philip, however, appeared at Azotus and traveled about, preaching the gospel in all the towns until he reached Caesarea. (** teleportation by the Spirit )

Acts 10:19-20

While Peter was reflecting on the vision, the Spirit said to him, “Behold, three men are looking for you. But get up, go downstairs and accompany them without misgivings, for I have sent them Myself.”

Acts 11:12

The Spirit told me to go with them without misgivings. These six brethren also went with me and we entered the man’s house.

Acts 13:2

While they were ministering to the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, “Set apart for Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.”

Acts 13:4

So, being sent out by the Holy Spirit, they went down to Seleucia and from there they sailed to Cyprus.

Acts 15:28

“For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay upon you no greater burden than these essentials:

Acts 16:6

They passed through the Phrygian and Galatian region, having been forbidden by the Holy Spirit to speak the word in Asia;

Acts 16:7

and after they came to Mysia, they were trying to go into Bithynia, and the Spirit of Jesus did not permit them;

Acts 20:22

And now, behold, bound by the Spirit, I am on my way to Jerusalem, not knowing what will happen to me there,

__________________________________________________

I hope that by now it should be quite clear how important it is for a Christian to walk guided and empowered by the Holy Spirit.

Now, back to the Sabbath. If not observing the Sabbath is as immoral as raping, killing, stealing or fornication, then we should expect the Holy Spirit to quickly lead people to keep the Sabbath. In particular, during a Holy Spirit revival, where the Holy Spirit moves touching many people's hearts and leading them into repentance and salvation (take Acts 2 as an example), one should expect to see a widespread adoption of Sabbath observance by multitudes (just like you would expect to see multitudes abandoning other sins and embracing holiness).

It turns out that there are many recorded cases of revivals throughout history. However, in all of these cases we fail to see a widespread adoption of Sabbath observance (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday). Below you can find multiple examples of revivals illustrating the point:

Uganda's Revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

The First Great Awakening: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

The Second Great Awakening: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

The Third Great Awakening: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

1904–1905 Welsh revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Azusa Street Revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Pyongyang Revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Watchman Nee's revivalist ministry: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Brownsville Revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

1949 Argentina Revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

1954 Argentina Revival: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Argentine Revival with Carlos Annacondia: no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Argentine Revival with Claudio Freidzon (check out this book also): no widespread Sabbath (sunset Friday to sunset Saturday) observance.

Etc.

How come that in so many revivals throughout history we do not see the Holy Spirit leading people toward the widespread observance of the Sabbath (from Friday evening to Saturday evening)?

The question I would ask is "revival of what", the revival of Sunday Protestantism; those who rejected the seventh day at the Council of Trent; even so the Holy Spirit has lead some to the Sabbath; regarding myself, how and when did the Holy Spirit lead me to the Sabbath; it had nothing to do with a revival.

sparow · Oct 15, 2020

TruthSeek3r said:
I provided the reasons for my skepticism, but you haven't addressed any of them. Also, this question might be of interest: How do seventh day Sabbatarians explain the lack of Sabbath observing following Spirit led revivals?. Feel free to join the community and post an answer.

It seems to be an assumption that the Holy spirit lead the revivals and eve if He did the Sabbath would not be His objective; the keeping of the Sabbath is a consequence of having the Law written on the Forehead and on the mind.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 15, 2020

TruthSeek3r said:
Hi, I'm back after multiple days busy with PhD related stuff. I'm taking a little break now to resume my replying to your posts @LoveGodsWord. However, you will probably see me disappear for another bunch of days again as I'm not done yet with all my academic duties.The following is my reply to your post #32 (which in turn was your reply to my post #26).

Hello TruthSeeker.

I like the name of your account you have made, but I must ask the question I must ask myself and that is are you really seeking God's truth? If so how do you know that it is not being provided to you and your not rejecting God's truth when it is shared with you? Will you find God's truth through your academic pursuits? It was the academics in the days of JESUS and the apostles that crucified him and put to death the Apostles. Keep in mind it was the humble fisherman that God taught and not the Scribes and Pharisees that professed to know the scriptures. Something to pray about I guess.

Even Paul who was a Pharisee a learned teacher of the scriptures and law of God was one of the most active in persecuting God’s Word and his people. If it was not for divine intervention and a direct revelation by JESUS, I wonder if Paul the Pharisee would have known the truth of Gods’ Word. This begs the question who does God teach his Word?

How do you know God is not telling you his truth but you are refusing not to hear? Something we should all consider and can talk about latter perhaps. For now as your posts are too long to respond to here and no one else may bother to read them and your busy in other pursuits, I may limit my responses to smaller posts that you can respond to as you have time. I will go through your posts in detail section by section and evaluate your claims and compare what is being said with what has already been said evaluate the scripture.

For me I prayerfully seek God’s Spirit in order to know his Word and claim his promises. I am no one. Only a fisherman seeking to know God’s Word and it is here that I will rest. My prayer is that you will do the same as well.

May God bless you as you seek him through his Word.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 15, 2020

TruthSeek3r said:
Awesome, we are starting right away with fallacious arguments.

Ok let's look at the detail of your claims and see if there is any truth to what your saying.

TruthSeek3r said:
Your claim: "God's Spirit [...] works through the Word not outside of it". Your (alleged) evidence: 1) John 6:63: this passages never says that the Holy Spirit cannot work outside of someone reading the Bible. This passage only says that the words of Jesus (God) "are spirit and are life", which seems to support the idea that when someone hears the Gospel being preached, the Gospel message can "spiritually revive" someone who is "spiritually dead", and I certainly agree that the Holy Spirit is involved in the process. BUT, you can't go from that and put God in a box and claim that the Holy Spirit cannot move in other contexts. This passage never says that. 2) John 17:17: this passages never says that the Holy Spirit cannot work outside of someone reading the Bible. This passage only says that the word of God is truth and that it can sanctify people. Again, this passage never says that you can put God in a box and claim that the Holy Spirit cannot move in the other contexts. This passage never says that

I am sorry dear friend but I respectfully disagree with you but let me explain why from the scriptures so there is no misunderstandings between us. Your making straw-man arguments no one has made to try and address the scripture content of my claims. Let's add all the context of our discussion back before proceeding as it would be remiss of us to not look at exactly what was being said in our conversation and what I was responding to. Your post I was responding to was...

TruthSeek3r said: ↑ First of all, let's make sure that we agree in a few points: 1) Do you agree with me that the Holy Spirit is the one who convicts people of sin? (Yes/no?)

To which I responded...

LoveGodsWord said: ↑ Of course yes! Keep in mind though God's Spirit is the Spirit of the Word of God and works through the Word not outside of it as we believe and follow Gods Word...JOHN 6:63 It is the spirit that quickens; the flesh profits nothing: THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK UNTO YOU THEY ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE. JOHN 17:17 Sanctify them through the truth, thy Word is truth.

I quoted you scripture in support of my claims that God's Spirit convicts us of sin by the Word of God. God's Word not mine links his Spirit to His Word in John 6:63. Here, it is JESUS, (not me) that says, "THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK UNTO YOU THEY ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE”. I do not think you can get anymore clearer than that can you dear friend? Then we have what JESUS is sharing in John 17:17 when he says that our very sanctification come by the truth of His Word. So notice what the scriptures say; GOD’s WORD IS GOD’S SPIRIT (John 6:63); and we are sanctified by God's Word (John 17:17) of course as we believe them *John 3:15-18. This supports the claim I made that God's Spirit works through God's Word because God's Spirit is the Spirit of truth and God's Word is truth. God’s Spirit is not separate from Gods’ Word it is the Spirit of truth and works through the Word of God not in isolation or separate to it.

Now lets add all the context back that perhaps you have forgotten here. My answer provided above was to your question where you state...

TruthSeek3r said: ↑ Do you agree with me that the Holy Spirit is the one who convicts people of sin? (Yes/no?)

So as shown through the scriptures provided above I was never making an argument as you are trying to make now that I was saying that God's Spirit never works outside of God's Word in the context of reading and knowing the scriptures of God’s Word. My argument is that regardless of if someone reads Gods Word or does not read Gods ‘Word, or knows God’s Word or does not know Gods’ Word. God’s Spirit is the Spirit of the truth of Gods Word and does not work outside of the truth of God’s Word.

For example, Gods Word tells us not to kill (murder) *Exodus 20:13. If a Spirit you believe is from God, comes up to you but you do not know Gods’ Word or have never read Gods Word and this “Spirit” you think is from God, tells you to go on a mass shooting spree telling you to go and kill everyone in a shopping center, then is that Gods’ Spirit? Well of course not but how do you know it is not God’s Spirit? Because God’s Spirit is the Spirit of the truth of God’s Word *John 6:63 and John 17:17 and does not go and tell people to do the opposite of what is written in God’s Word regardless if people know Gods’ Word or do not know God’s Word.

So how do you know if a Spirit is from God or not from God? It must agree with Gods’ Word and the scriptures. Therefore the scriptures provided you are true. Gods’ Spirit works through God’s Word. God’s Spirit does not disagree with the scriptures or leads people away from them. God’s Spirit leads people to Gods’ Word and to God not away from Gods Word and away from God.

Therefore the argument your making is an argument no one is making. I have never argued that God’s Spirit does not work “OUTSIDE” of God’s Word for those who do not know Gods’ Word. I am arguing God’s Spirit works “THROUGH” Gods’ Word and in harmony with God's Word. If the Spirit teaches against God’s Word it is not from God and is not God’s Spirit. Now if I am not arguing what you are arguing about, then your making a straw-man argument no one is talking about and your whole post has fallen down because we are not talking about the same thing.

My answer dear friend was to your original question and that was does the Holy Spirit convict people of sin? To which I simply responded YES because it is through Gods Word we have a knowledge of what sin is which is further demonstrated in previous conversations with you in Romans 3:20, Romans 7:7 and 1 John 3:4. Sorry dear friend the fallacious argument is the one your making as demonstrated above.

This single post pretty much addresses everything else you have posted. I am not talking about anything in the rest of the posts you have made which is a straw-man argument no one is talking about so does not need to be addressed. If you believe there is something specifically you would like me to address please let me know and by Gods Grace and Spirit I will prayerfully share with you what I know. All praise to him who loves is and washed us with his own blood that whosoever believes on him should not perish but have everlasting life.

……………..

CONCLUSION: You did not understand what was being shared with you and have made strawman arguments no one was talking about and posting subject matter not relevant to the conversation as proven and clarified above. Only God’s Word has been shared with you. May you receive it and be blessed. Ignoring it does not make it disappear.

Hope this is helpful.

LoveGodsWord · Oct 15, 2020

TruthSeek3r said: Surely we are commanded to love God and our neighbor, but it is funny that you mention that because to support this you have to resort to two commandments outside the decalogue, all the while stubbornly claiming that there are only 10 commandments. The two most important commandments that you just cited are from outside the decalogue, they are part of the other 603 commandments from the Old Testament that you keep dismissing (and that's not including the 1050 commandments we find in the New Testament).

No one loves God or their neigbore by breaking God’s commandments *John 14:15; John 15:10. Those who break God’s commandments have not seen or know God *1 John 2:3-4 and need to be born again into God’s new covenant promise of love *John 3:3-7; 1 John 3:6-9; Hebrews 8:10-12. How many commandments are there in God's 10 commandments? Are there 9; 10 or 613 or 1050? The answer is not as complex as you make it seem. The answer is provided here *Exodus 34:28; Deuteronomy 4:13; Deuteronomy 10:4. As God's people we are to live by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God *Matthew 4:4 but if you do not have love what can you do? That should do for now. You have a bit of catching up to do.

Hope this helps.

clefty · Oct 15, 2020

sparow said:
The question I would ask is "revival of what", the revival of Sunday Protestantism; those who rejected the seventh day at the Council of Trent; even so the Holy Spirit has lead some to the Sabbath; regarding myself, how and when did the Holy Spirit lead me to the Sabbath; it had nothing to do with a revival.

"It is worthy of notice that at least one of the reformers of considerable prominence—Carlstadt—was a Sabbatarian. It is impossible to read the records of the Reformation without the conviction that Carlstadt was desirous of a more thorough work of reformation than was Luther; and that while Luther was disposed to tolerate certain abuses lest the Reformation should be endangered, Carlstadt was, at all hazards, for a complete return to the Holy Scriptures."

http://www.sabbath.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Library.sr/CT/BOOK/k/965

Indeed there has always been a minority view...

HalleluYah...

semper reformanda...until we are as we were when made in His Image...on earth as it is in heaven...His will be done...not ours...

sparow · Oct 15, 2020

clefty said:
"It is worthy of notice that at least one of the reformers of considerable prominence—Carlstadt—was a Sabbatarian. It is impossible to read the records of the Reformation without the conviction that Carlstadt was desirous of a more thorough work of reformation than was Luther; and that while Luther was disposed to tolerate certain abuses lest the Reformation should be endangered, Carlstadt was, at all hazards, for a complete return to the Holy Scriptures."

http://www.sabbath.org/index.cfm/fuseaction/Library.sr/CT/BOOK/k/965

Indeed there has always been a minority view...

HalleluYah...

semper reformanda...until we are as we were when made in His Image...on earth as it is in heaven...His will be done...not ours...

I have not heard of him before but there have been many Sabbatarians, individuals and Groups; but whether these were true disciples I am not able to judge; the Pharisees were Sabbatarians and it didn't do them any good.

There is always a benefit or profit in keeping the Law, but unless this is blended in with a personal relationship with God, called entering into the covenant, the Law cannot achieve it's full purpose

clefty · Oct 16, 2020

sparow said:
I have not heard of him before

glad to share...worth looking up one who was more a champion then Luther who continued much of Rome’s traditions...Carlstadt even went further with iconoclasm and music in the worship hour removing the organ he felt too distracting and meant for the circus...

imagine had Protestants embraced the Sabbath 500 years ago...

but there have been many Sabbatarians, individuals and Groups; but whether these were true disciples I am not able to judge;

we are all judged by our fruit and according to light received...

the Pharisees were Sabbatarians and it didn't do them any good.

because keeping the Law is NOT for justification...a righteousness by works...duh

There is always a benefit or profit in keeping the Law,

right...do this and live...now IN HIM abundantly and in the next life...

but unless this is blended in with a personal relationship with God, called entering into the covenant, the Law cannot achieve it's full purpose

Right...best illustrated when He hated their Sabbath keeping then in the OT...

Odd response to being reminded there were Sabbatarians before...even at Trent:

“Finally, after a long and intensive mental strain, the Archbishop of Reggio came into the council with substantially the following argument to the party who held for Scripture alone: "The Protestants claim to stand upon the written word only. They profess to hold the Scripture alone as the standard of faith. They justify their revolt by the plea that the Church has apostatized from the written word and follows tradition. Now the Protestants' claim, that they stand upon the written word only, is not true. Their profession of holding the Scripture alone as the standard of faith, is false.

PROOF: The written word explicitly enjoins the observance of the seventh day as the Sabbath. They do not observe the seventh day, but reject it. If they do truly hold the Scripture alone as their standard, they would be observing the seventh day as is enjoined in the Scripture throughout. Yet they not only reject the observance of the Sabbath enjoined in the written word, but they have adopted and do practice the observance of Sunday, for which they have only the tradition of the Church. Consequently the claim of 'Scripture alone as the standard,' fails; and the doctrine of 'Scripture and tradition' as essential, is fully established, the Protestants themselves being judges."

There was no getting around this, for the Protestants' own statement of faith -- the Augsburg Confession, 1530 -- had clearly admitted that "the observation of the Lord's day" had been appointed by "the Church" only.”

The Council of Trent | Sabbath Truth

Any Holy Spirit Revival leading multitudes to Sabbath observance?

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