Thoughts on Extreme forms of Christian music?

Carl Emerson said:

My daughter is a stage manager - that line is being crossed.

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Opera is dependent upon patronage. The goal is filling seats. Its more expensive than a movie ticket and opera goers are more discriminating. They play to the audience. And they know how far they can go.

If your daughter is seeing lines crossed in her vicinity its not a stretch to suppose the appetite exists. If the stage is debauched the viewer is eating it up. Otherwise, they'd revolt and suspend subscriptions. Which occurs when they don't like the creative direction.

I'm not seeing the same here. I have access to the London season and others and will revisit this comment if appropriate.

Yours in His Service,

~Bella

True Counterphobia said...

How familiar are you with the Psalms?

Me...

Ive read one or two...

Carl Emerson said:

My daughter is a stage manager - that line is being crossed.

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This is true. Many productions have got much raunchier in past decade or so I have noticed. But that doesn't mean all opera is bad. Nothing wrong with enjoying The Marriage of Figaro or Aida . I would not touch The Magic Flute for example as it was written by Mozart as a joke to his fellow Masons and has Masonic themes in it. Subtle but there.

Carl Emerson said:

True Counterphobia said...

How familiar are you with the Psalms?

Me...

Ive read one or two...

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That comment has just won this whole thread

True Counterphobia said:

How familiar are you with the Psalms?

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Psalm 101 is interesting...

Few seem to apply what is God saying through the first few verses...

I have seen new converts immediately destroy record collections without any hesitation as the Holy Spirit brings conviction...

For the record (excuse the pun) there was no coercion.

Carl Emerson said:

Psalm 101 is interesting...

Few seem to apply what is God saying through the first few verses...

I have seen new converts immediately destroy record collections without any hesitation as the Holy Spirit brings conviction...

For the record (excuse the pun) there was no coercion.

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I

I did. A few months after being born again I got rid of some of my pop and rock records that had questionable or very sexy lyrics. I have always tried to obey God when He has convicted me on certain songs. Some.pop.songs are fine others are not.

I also got rid of any that were causing me to feel bad or have negAtive memories of associations. Even some Godly Christian worship songs had to go not becAuse they were bad but because they were cAusing me to feel negAtive or triggered. Songs from past abusive churches or organisations.

Carl Emerson said:

Psalm 101 is interesting...

Few seem to apply what is God saying through the first few verses...

I have seen new converts immediately destroy record collections without any hesitation as the Holy Spirit brings conviction...

For the record (excuse the pun) there was no coercion.

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I think my issue is why would I get rid of all opera or all rock or all jazz etc?? Why get rid of whole genres if some of it is still good? Why not just get rid of the bad songs or tunes Nd leave the rest?

I must admit there 're some genres I will just never touch becAuse I don't enjoy them e.g. I hate most secular rap. Nasty misogynistic lyrics and no decent melodies. I hate drum and bass, trance music etc. Not my thing.

The Beatles for example.are genius musically yet very mixed lyrically. I don't like the hare Krishna kind of stuff they got into but there are some beautiful songs like Blackbird, Eleanor Rigby, etc

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:

I think my issue is why would I get rid of all opera or all rock or all jazz etc?? Why get rid of whole genres if some of it is still good? Why not just get rid of the bad songs or tunes Nd leave the rest?

I must admit there 're some genres I will just never touch becAuse I don't enjoy them e.g. I hate most secular rap. Nasty misogynistic lyrics and no decent melodies. I hate drum and bass, trance music etc. Not my thing.

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Well a soft heart towards Jesus is the key.

I have been told not to drink coffee and tea and I don't. That was a personal word - I guess He knew my metabolism couldn't handle it and He wants me to have a long life.

Avoid legalisms - seek a personal word.

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:

I

Nobody is saved or damned because of a music style. Of course if God doesn't like it we shouldn't listen to it but going to hell? Naaah

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Who said anything about hell? One must remember that the Holy Spirit dwells in the believer. If none of the fruits are present, it is probably because He is not there. Hence, I never knew you.
Be blessed.

Ezekiel 23 is a little more graphic than this song.

And, to be honest, the song does make a good point. Perversion is being openly celebrated in our society.

True Counterphobia said:

I didn't know where else to stick this, but figured this might be the place for it.

I enjoy extreme heavy Christian music. What are people's thoughts on this?

Example of a song I like that I would consider in this category. Will post the lyics.

Perversions elevated to the state of religion.
It was, and is and shall be no more.

In ancient days, women on their knees mounted by goats,
the sehirrim of the wastelands, demons of Azazel.

These days we repeat such filth with pride.

Perversions elevated to the state of state-religion,
marching through the gates of every city.

All shall bow like in the days of the mad king.

White light broken up in colours,
distorted under the veil of good.

What was, is and shall not be.

The city is a sewer,
it floods the streets with filth.

Only the promise keeps the flood of Noah at bay.
In ancient days a flood washed all sinners away.

What was, and is and shall yet be.

A cross was risen on a hill in the midst of time and space,
a sacrifice to God, a sacrifice of God, God sacrificed.
In these days a flood of Gods own blood to wash away all sin,
and spare the life of sinners.

Leave the blood filth step in to the white,
step into the light. Goatwhore no more.

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"Finally, brothers, whatever is true, whatever is honourable, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable— if anything is excellent or praiseworthy— think on these things."

Sorry, I don't see how the lyrics conform to Phillipians 4:8

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:

I

As an anxiety sufferer I do find a lot of heavy metal drains me and makes !e feel anxious. WhiteCross and Petra are fine but that is as heavy metal as I get!

I love music that uplifts my spirit. When I listen to a Bach cantata or Handel oratorio or Brahms beautiful and biblical Ein Deutsches Requiem for example, or Bethel's No Longer Slaves my heart is uplifted and edified... Philippians 4:8 wants us to focus on that which is helpful for us. Certain endorphins are triggered by good music that lifting mood. Christianity is after all, a joyful faith!

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Whitecross are good, quite under-rated. I haven't listed to a lot of them though, sounds a bit like Alice Cooper. Check out Whiteheart also and see what you think - they are have a mixture, some ballads and some quite rocky / heavy.

True Counterphobia said:

I didn't know where else to stick this, but figured this might be the place for it.

I enjoy extreme heavy Christian music. What are people's thoughts on this?

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What floats your boat. It's about the meaning behind the music anyway. Most old christians do cash in anything they dislike as auto-sin, which includes forms of music such as heavy metal. They hate the noise so automatically it's mentally viewed as a sin against God.

While I don't share your taste and practically hate all music of todays generation (including todays Gospel music), if you like it and it's not influencing you negatively then that is all that matters. You'll get comments here about how it's "satan" or something like that, and just ignore it..


BTW: I do like some songs from Flyleaf. There was also a few good christian rappers i heard on youtube some time ago..

True Counterphobia said:

Are you even aware that I am listening to Christian music? Honest question.

I was talking about Psalm 150.

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Ps. 150 is brilliant.

I cant comment on what you are personally doing - that is your business before God.

I am a self taught semi classical guitarist and a trained singer. I came to a point in my christian walk when I dropped all music for 18 months, then made a vow to only perform that which furthers the gospel. But it is an individual walk and what is right for me is just that. What others do is their business. For those serious about their faith, I think that God calls to different sanctification depending on what they are called to do. This call is not always heeded.

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:

I agree. This kind of attitude that certain beats or chords are evil is just crazy and superstitious. Makes me think of that scripture that talks about.those who go round saying "don't taste! don't touch!"


all good things are.from God.

All.truth is God's truth so if a song is ministering to us in truth it is fine

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The neurology of it (which varies from one person to the next) is what ought to concern performers / purveyors.

Acoustic instruments have neglected strength.

Amplified ones can be nice also, provided they don't drown out i the rest of the music ii listeners' functioning. Doesn't God say don't impose?

Whom can you get away with button pushing? With whom isn't it appropriate?

When is the sensory / sensual OK and when isn't it - in terms of who is present?

I'm surprised people (apart from me) haven't figured all this out. It's not difficult to give ourselves sensible - instead of silly - yardsticks.

True Counterphobia said:

I didn't know where ... no more.

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I think the genre you have mainly showcased is essentially a comedy genre.

A lot of ink has got spilled on the Theology Of Comedy.

seeking.IAM said:

I think the best Christian music has a simple melody and lyrics suitable for singing in the shower or car. I can't see myself doing either with this. But different strokes for different folks.

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yes you can't "sing" a Brahms "chamber" piece. But I do fragments of Hungarian Dances and a great Burgmuller Etude vocally! Songs (mostly Scripture based) in one of my old movements were a genuine strength but they keep changing the words on their web site and I didn't keep an old copy.

It's all about who the music is for. Some might be "christian" though that is probably a meaningless term in terms of marketing.

Some children / choirs / adult solo singers used to release CDs of a mixture of sacred and secular songs (including some alleged "rock" ones). I suppose at the time it was assumed these might have fairly wide appeal. Should they have?

I've kept some vocal albums because I appreciate the sentiments, the wording (on subject matter I like well enough) and the aesthetic style, including accompaniment - and that includes some sing - along - able and some to just listen. This parallels and supplements my solely instrumental tastes. Nobody seems to share my tastes because I've hardly had visitors for years upon years. And I don't perform. I used to try to join in a few choruses badly led, at a few churches.

I'm probably a more typical human - and even a more typical Christian - than people who are "into" something. I'm "heavily" into saying what I'm saying by not saying what I'm not saying, and I neither hear nor make "statements", but that's just me.

Has anyone thought of a "Zoom" vocal Eine Kliene Nachtmusik? Arrange beforehand who's going to say "boom boom" and who's going to say "dee dee dee".