Thoughts on Extreme forms of Christian music?

Michael Collum said:

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I don't see why that is called "extreme". I think it doesn't need to be called "Christian" as it surely has general appeal? As for visuals it doesn't seem to have lugubrious visuals.

Amittai said:

I don't see why that is called "extreme". I think it doesn't need to be called "Christian" as it surely has general appeal? As for visuals it doesn't seem to have lugubrious visuals.

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So you can't see the message in the song?

Maybe I studied too much.

True Counterphobia said:

I didn't know where else to stick this, but figured this might be the place for it.

I enjoy extreme heavy Christian music. What are people's thoughts on this?

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It's fine. I do not buy the idea that certain music is intrinsically evil (because of its beat) etc. that some people subscribe to. That to me seems a bit like the ancient Manichean heresy that believed that certain forms of matter etc. were evil.

In addition to the above, I notice that people often dogmatize their taste in various things, the beat is evil I believe is a rationalization of that.


I don't see this sort of thing as fitting for church music, even though some do with the Seeker Sensitive / Purpose Driven approach.


In general stuff like this is put in the Christian Ethics section.

True Counterphobia said:

The question that arises is whether a certain vocal style is "prohibited" due to its nature.

I ask as some Metal is sung with "dirty" vocals and some Metal is sang with "clean" vocals.

Here is a Christian song with "clean" vocals only.

[ Theocracy - I am ] 1 ...

Or if a person's persuasion is that "electric guitars" are off limits? Well, if that is the case, then an awful lot of whole church congregations are in danger of losing their salvation because they use electric guitars. 2

So who "decides" what good for the body? ... 3

Who can judge? 4

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1 - As a visual the visual is too lugubrious for me. I actually found the diction and harmonies lugubrious. Why would you not think each individual is supposed to be gifted with their own "radar"?

2 - At churches a huge problem I've found almost everwhere is bad amplifying. Also that most didn't need "bass guitar" on top of everything else. My friend's wife plays beautiful piano. The "amplifying ministry" at their church always ruin it (and all the singing).

3 - I'm not going to serve up my views on some decision taking procedures I've known. Why don't they honour the gift of the member they most look down on? Who might just have the best gift? Peter of the Dyke? "Crippled Hans" in Hamelin?

Why would they want to reduce us to a passive daze? It might give some subculture their "fix" or "buzz" but that is not what "ministers" are supposed to reduce other Christians to when all they wanted to do was go to church.

As for emotions you can appreciate what qualities of what you like, how you like. Likewise what is it supposed to be doing to churchgoers? Neither them nor you, are meant to be figments of any system.

Traditionally, hymns were closely based on Scripture and had an accessible and suited musical idiom - cheerful, sad, etc. At one time, going to church wasn't complicated!

4 - We are all supposed to judge - the sooner we all join in the better. All have gifts. The Pharisees exclude.

True Counterphobia said:

I believe you are someone who is incredibly intelligent. I couldn't guess what your IQ was, but it might be upwards of 140+. I'm smart, but I don't hold a candle to you, sir.

Would you mind critiquing this song? [ ... ]

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It's taken me a lifetime of pain and fear to get this far, same as it takes everyone - plus some joy and zest and verve. Individually, gifted with my kind of coordination, I have to reinvent everything I do each time, that's why I find thinking things out more successful than not doing so.

In some of your previous posts I don't see where you see a delineation between liturgical displays (which don't need a video) and non-liturgical entertainments.

Part of the music is nice, but in between it is just mush, to my auditory processing. The visuals swing between non-lugubrious and lugubrious. The vocal diction is lugubrious way beyond the off-putting (perhaps the producers could have arranged a coach?) The words don't seem to have a continuous rationale. So there are huge mismatches of every kind everywhere.

People I used to be with, used to study Psalms and the rest of Scripture in conjunction with the cross-references (in the middle channel or at the sides or foot).

A workplace coach told me to get back to the spatial thinking of my infancy - since when my life has gradually got on the rails. My brain is a huge Hall of cubby holes for categories and cross-categories of Everything. I'm hugely curious about the world around me and human history, languages, logic, etc and all the cheerful sciences about Nature and the Cosmos we have all always wondered about. But that's just me!

Taste is taste. You did ask about theology. I think the theology here is: have regard for your own bodily constitution / functioning, your insight into Scripture, your sense of personality, and any audience (if applicable).

True Counterphobia said:

I believe you are someone who is incredibly intelligent. I couldn't guess what your IQ was, but it might be upwards of 140+. I'm smart, but I don't hold a candle to you, sir ...

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When I answered the ads they always said I am in the "top two per cent" - which is what they tell everybody because they are after our subscription money!
An ed psych I saw in middle age found I have an "uneven profile" which is how I got advised to play to strengths and support weak functions at the same time. Most people don't get to see how they function at all. They take themselves and others for granted.
A great complement paid to me by a friend at an old church was that I am "clunky".

True Counterphobia said:

Uh... yes? When I first came to realize who it was that was talking to Abraham, I was deeply in awe. I also try and repent every day of my life.

Genesis 18:1 And the LORD appeared to him by the oaks of Mamre, as he sat at the door of his tent in the heat of the day.

The Hebrew word used here for LORD is YHWH, which is to say that God Himself spoke to Abraham. That was quite the experience for me when I contemplated what that actually meant. It was the Son, illuminated in all the Father's glory that talked to Abraham. That is not an everyday occurance!

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Amen that is my screen name on this forum

True Counterphobia said:

Do you know when the prophets of old spoke in the Spirit they did so in a manner that was "ecstatic"? I can see that in some of the music I listen to.

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The Holy Spirit is why we don't need to be "ecstatic". We can just be plain and sensible and listen to Him. Intensity wears us and other people out.

I'm a fan of prog, classical and various more arty types of rock. I think the best Christian music was the most obscure. If you type "Xian Psych" you will see Christian rock was very active in the 1960s. There is a great playlist on my magmasunburst account which should come up first. Sometimes up to $1000 is paid by even non-Christians for Christian artists that just put out one lp on private press labels.

True Counterphobia said:

I didn't know where else to stick this, but figured this might be the place for it.

I enjoy extreme heavy Christian music. What are people's thoughts on this?

Example of a song I like that I would consider in this category. Will post the lyics.

Perversions elevated to the state of religion.
It was, and is and shall be no more.

In ancient days, women on their knees mounted by goats,
the sehirrim of the wastelands, demons of Azazel.

These days we repeat such filth with pride.

Perversions elevated to the state of state-religion,
marching through the gates of every city.

All shall bow like in the days of the mad king.

White light broken up in colours,
distorted under the veil of good.

What was, is and shall not be.

The city is a sewer,
it floods the streets with filth.

Only the promise keeps the flood of Noah at bay.
In ancient days a flood washed all sinners away.

What was, and is and shall yet be.

A cross was risen on a hill in the midst of time and space,
a sacrifice to God, a sacrifice of God, God sacrificed.
In these days a flood of Gods own blood to wash away all sin,
and spare the life of sinners.

Leave the blood filth step in to the white,
step into the light. Goatwhore no more.

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" I never knew you " comes to mind. Be blessed.

True Counterphobia said:

I didn't know where else to stick this, but figured this might be the place for it.

I enjoy extreme heavy Christian music. What are people's thoughts on this?

Example of a song I like that I would consider in this category. Will post the lyics.

Perversions elevated to the state of religion.
It was, and is and shall be no more.

In ancient days, women on their knees mounted by goats,
the sehirrim of the wastelands, demons of Azazel.

These days we repeat such filth with pride.

Perversions elevated to the state of state-religion,
marching through the gates of every city.

All shall bow like in the days of the mad king.

White light broken up in colours,
distorted under the veil of good.

What was, is and shall not be.

The city is a sewer,
it floods the streets with filth.

Only the promise keeps the flood of Noah at bay.
In ancient days a flood washed all sinners away.

What was, and is and shall yet be.

A cross was risen on a hill in the midst of time and space,
a sacrifice to God, a sacrifice of God, God sacrificed.
In these days a flood of Gods own blood to wash away all sin,
and spare the life of sinners.

Leave the blood filth step in to the white,
step into the light. Goatwhore no more.

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Php 4:8 Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

I usually don’t like Christian music because it bland . I’ll listen to these later. I remember a friend who was a Professional jazz drummer whose mother didn’t want him to play certain beats and rhythms and this would interfere with not only his professional life but her busybody rigid behavior interfered with his social life as well. In his 30s he couldn’t talk to certain people. I thought it was ridiculous.

As an aside I’ll listen to any type of music as I feel that it’s a personal expression by the people who made the song and it might not be about anything real. I got finished listening to a song this morning by Apathy whose title I can’t print on CF . When I first heard it years ago my youngest had played as a joke against old fogey mom. I just texted him the song as a return joke

Maria Billingsley said:

" I never knew you " comes to mind. Be blessed.

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Maria Billingsley said:

" I never knew you " comes to mind. Be blessed.

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Why??

Brightmoon said:

I usually don’t like Christian music because it bland . I’ll listen to these later. I remember a friend who was a Professional jazz drummer whose mother didn’t want him to play certain beats and rhythms and this would interfere with not only his professional life but her busybody rigid behavior interfered with his social life as well. In his 30s he couldn’t talk to certain people. I thought it was ridiculous.

As an aside I’ll listen to any type of music as I feel that it’s a personal expression by the people who made the song and it might not be about anything real. I got finished listening to a song this morning by Apathy whose title I can’t print on CF . When I first heard it years ago my youngest had played as a joke against old fogey mom. I just texted him the song as a return joke

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I agree. This kind of attitude that certain beats or chords are evil is just crazy and superstitious. Makes me think of that scripture that talks about.those who go round saying "don't taste! don't touch!"


all good things are.from God.

All.truth is God's truth so if a song is ministering to us in truth it is fine

Maria Billingsley said:

" I never knew you " comes to mind. Be blessed.

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I

Nobody is saved or damned because of a music style. Of course if God doesn't like it we shouldn't listen to it but going to hell? Naaah