Is the thousand years of Revelation chapter 20 symbolic?

sovereigngrace said:

Totally disagree. The day of the Lord is a single day. It is the last (or final) day (singular). Time shall be no more when Christ comes. What is attributed to that day is not a period of time but an event. It is an event that see a general resurrection/judgment. The wrath of God destroys the wicked, all wickedness and corruption. The earth is perfected along with the saints because corruption cannot inherit incorrution. We are then into eternity. There is no room for a future millennium.

Revelation 10:5-7 says of the Second Advent and the concluding last trumpet, “And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, and sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer: but in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.”

There is clearly a major dilemma here for you those who take Revelation to be a literal chronological unfolding of last day events. They must surely concede, if they are going to be consistent with their view that everything after Revelation 11 (which also refers to the seventh trumpet) is in the realm of eternity and the after-life. After all Revelation 10 plainly records that with this particular event “there should be time no longer.” For those who would lightly dismiss this important narrative as anything other than a magnificent picture of the Lord Jesus Christ and His glorious Second Coming, they do foolishly ignore the great wealth of explicit and consistent end-time teaching on this subject and divorce the undoubted harmony of this chapter from the rest of New Testament prophetic teaching.

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It is the end of sin. You do not think Satan will get 42 months?

The time of Adam's punishment is over. Not time itself. The plan of God was that Adam's descendants would only have 6000 years of punishment, sin, and death by sin.

You limit God by saying His Word in Revelation 20 cannot work. God planned on a Lord's Day Sabbath. Peter said do not be ignorant and think it is only a 24 hour day.

sovereigngrace said:

The age to come has no room for "mortals" (Luke 20:34-36, Romans 8:19-23, 1 Corinthians 15:50-55 and Revelation 21-22) or the unregenerate (Psalms 37:9-11, Luke 17:26-30, 1 Corinthians 6:9, I Thessalonians 5:2-3, 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10). This wou

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They are not mentioned in Revelation 20. Are you adding them to the text to prove your man made theology?

Timtofly said:

It is the end of sin. You do not think Satan will get 42 months?

The time of Adam's punishment is over. Not time itself. The plan of God was that Adam's descendants would only have 6000 years of punishment, sin, and death by sin.

You limit God by saying His Word in Revelation 20 cannot work. God planned on a Lord's Day Sabbath. Peter said do not be ignorant and think it is only a 24 hour day.

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Again (as is your form), you totally ignore every point I made. You then change the subject.

The 42 months occurs before the one and only coming of Christ (it correlates with Satan's little season in Revlation 20).

Timtofly said:

They are not mentioned in Revelation 20. Are you adding them to the text to prove your man made theology?

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Your millennium is saturated in wicked mortals who overrun your age as the sand of the sea. It is a massive bust. Please read Rev 20 before you post.

DavidPT said:

which Amil has no reasonable answer for, or no answer for at all.

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The answer is found below in the correlation between Revelation 20 and earlier passages.


Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

Rev 18:23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Rev_18:8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.


Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Judgment Before the Great White Throne.

Rev_19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.


Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.


Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


We do not have to ignore Paul's timing which is found in Revelation 20.

Paul said Christ returns "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God, in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10.
The fire comes at the end of Revelation 20.

Paul said Christ judges both the living and the dead at His appearing, in 2 Timothy 4:1.
The judgment of the dead comes at the end of Revelation 20, and also in Revelation 11:18.

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Timtofly said:

It is the end of sin.

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Satan suffers IN SIN for eternity, in the LoF as do all who go there. Unless you are an annihilationist or Universalist, Sin exists forever. Seems your objection has more to do with the location of Sin and Suffering, than with its eternal existence.

The time of Adam's punishment is over. Not time itself. The plan of God was that Adam's descendants would only have 6000 years of punishment, sin, and death by sin.

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Then what do these scriptures mean?:

1 Chronicles 16:15
Remember His covenant forever, The word which He commanded, for a thousand generations,

Psalm 105:8
He remembers His covenant forever, The word which He commanded, for a thousand generations,

Deuteronomy 7:9
“Therefore know that the Lord your God, He is God, the faithful God who keeps covenant and mercy for a thousand generations with those who love Him and keep His commandments;

You must not be much of a literalist if you don't take the above scriptures literally, and you Limit God by saying 6000 years, when these scriptures testify God's plan of covenant redemption was ordained to last between 40,000 - 120,000 years. (1000 generations)

Timtofly said:

You deny this 42 month period for some strange reason and place Revelation 11:18 after Armageddon.

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1,260 days = 42 months

See Revelation 11:3.


Rev 11:3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
Rev 11:4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
(See Revelation 1:20, and Romans 11 for the identity of the witnesses.)
Rev 11:5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Rev 11:6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.
Rev 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.
Rev 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.
Rev 11:9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and an half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.
Rev 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
Rev 11:11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
Rev 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.


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BABerean2 said:

The answer is found below in the correlation between Revelation 20 and earlier passages.


Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Rev 20:8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

Rev 18:23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived.


Rev 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

Rev_18:8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day, death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.


Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.
Judgment Before the Great White Throne.

Rev_19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.


Rev 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.


Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


We do not have to ignore Paul's timing which is found in Revelation 20.

Paul said Christ returns "in flaming fire" taking vengeance on those who do not know God, in 2 Thessalonians 1:7-10.
The fire comes at the end of Revelation 20.

Paul said Christ judges both the living and the dead at His appearing, in 2 Timothy 4:1.
The judgment of the dead comes at the end of Revelation 20, and also in Revelation 11:18.

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The way Isaiah 24:21-22 reads to me, verse 21 is meaning some of what you bring up in this post, so not meaning everything you bring up, and that this happens in the end of this age, and it eventually leads to the bodily return of Christ. Where that then leads to verse 22. What you have submitted above does not take into account, the first portion of verse 22 in Isaiah 24---And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison---and the fact this is meaning after all of the events you provided, where I agree is meaning in the end of this age. IOW, anything having to do with after the thousand years, I disagree that this is meaning in the end of this age.


Where we are not on the same page is in regards to the timing of this---And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison. You seem to think that is meaning thousands of years before the 2nd coming, or if not that, I'm not certain what you think, regardless that Isaiah 24:21 is involving events having to do with the 2nd coming, and not meaning thousands of years before the 2nd coming instead.

One other major clue that proves this, is this--- the LORD shall punish---the kings of the earth upon the earth(Isaiah 24:21). That's not meaning thousands of years ago. That's meaning in the end of this age, and that it involves the 2nd coming. Verse 22 is meaning during/after verse 21 is fulfilled, since it wouldn't make sense for verse 21 to be involving events in the end of this age, while the first portion of verse 22 is involving events thousand of years earlier. The punishment recorded in verse 21, it starts in the end of this age. None of it involves punishment from a much earlier time. Verse 22 happens because of verse 21.

sovereigngrace said:

Again (as is your form), you totally ignore every point I made. You then change the subject.

The 42 months occurs before the one and only coming of Christ (it correlates with Satan's little season in Revlation 20).

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You claim it is a single day, is Satan loosed for 50 minutes at the end? How does that 42 months fit into a single day? The battle of Armageddon is one hour. Because the kings of the earth at that moment only have one hour of rule, and it is the gathering together for the battle of Armageddon. This battle is at the end of the 42 months and then Revelation 20, Satan is bound. If Satan is already loosed, what hour do you see in the future if the 42 months have already started, or when is this 42 month period? Is it still thousands (indefinite period of time) of years from now?

sovereigngrace said:

The 42 months occurs before the one and only coming of Christ (it correlates with Satan's little season in Revlation 20).

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What you don't have in brackets is 100% correct. What you have in brackets is 100% false. The 42 months correlates with the martyrdom recorded in Revelation 20:4, and that they are martyred during the 42 months, not after satan is loosed, but before he is loosed. Which can only mean one of two things. Either the 42 month reign occurs from start to finish before the thousand years even begin, or it is paralleling the thousand years. I def don't agree with the latter, and I don't know why anyone would, given these are the only two options, since it can't be meaning after the thousand years for certain.

DavidPT said:

The way Isaiah 24:21-22 reads to me, verse 21 is meaning some of what you bring up in this post, so not meaning everything you bring up, and that this happens in the end of this age, and it eventually leads to the bodily return of Christ. Where that then leads to verse 22. What you have submitted above does not take into account, the first portion of verse 22 in Isaiah 24---And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison---and the fact this is meaning after all of the events you provided, where I agree is meaning in the end of this age. IOW, anything having to do with after the thousand years, I disagree that this is meaning in the end of this age.


Where we are not on the same page is in regards to the timing of this---And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison. You seem to think that is meaning thousands of years before the 2nd coming, or if not that, I'm not certain what you think, regardless that Isaiah 24:21 is involving events having to do with the 2nd coming, and not meaning thousands of years before the 2nd coming instead.

One other major clue that proves this, is this--- the LORD shall punish---the kings of the earth upon the earth(Isaiah 24:21). That's not meaning thousands of years ago. That's meaning in the end of this age, and that it involves the 2nd coming. Verse 22 is meaning during/after verse 21 is fulfilled, since it wouldn't make sense for verse 21 to be involving events in the end of this age, while verse 22 is involving events thousand of years earlier. Verse 22 happens because of verse 21.

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If Jesus, and Paul, and John, and Peter, will not agree with the Premillennialists, they go back to the Old Testament and try to find their doctrine there...


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BABerean2 said:

If Jesus, and Paul, and John, and Peter, will not agree with the Premillennialists, they go back to the Old Testament and try to find their doctrine there...


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It's pretty simple then. Whatever Premils propose from the OT that lends support to what they are concluding about the thousand years, Amils need to go to these very same OT texts, then show why these texts don't support what Premils propose they support, then show what they really support instead. It's one thing to claim they don't support what Premils propose they support, it's another thing to show what they support instead.

Let's start here.

Isaiah 24:21 And it shall come to pass in that day, that the LORD shall punish the host of the high ones that are on high, and the kings of the earth upon the earth.
22 And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison, and after many days shall they be visited.

And it shall come to pass in that day----It shall come to pass in what day?


And they shall be gathered together, as prisoners are gathered in the pit, and shall be shut up in the prison---when shall they be shut up in the prison?---- Who shall be shut up in the prison?


and after many days shall they be visited---many days after what?---how can it not be meaning many days after verse 21 initially comes to pass?---how can it not be meaning many days after they are shut up in the prison?

DavidPT said:

What you don't have in brackets is 100% correct. What you have in brackets is 100% false. The 42 months correlates with the martyrdom recorded in Revelation 20:4, and that they are martyred during the 42 months, not after satan is loosed, but before he is loosed. Which can only mean one of two things. Either the 42 month reign occurs from start to finish before the thousand years even begin, or it is paralleling the thousand years. I def don't agree with the latter, and I don't know why anyone would, given these are the only two options, since it can't be meaning after the thousand years for certain.

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I have repeatedly addressed this, and you have already avoided this. You have to do this for your argument to survive. I will try again.

Firstly, the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet's activity are not simply restricted to 42 months before Christ's Coming, as you suggest. I didn't think anyone believed that, although, nothing shocks me in end-time discussion. Moreover, to attribute what you wrongly believe on this to the Amil position is wrong. Amils believe that they continue throughout the intra-Advent period (the millennium time).

Secondly, the beast represents the ongoing reign of Satan on the earth throughout time through the world secular anti-Christ system. It is not an end-time invention as Futurist's imagine.

Thirdly, Revelation is not chronological. It is a number of recaps describing the same intra-Advent period. The end of the millennium and Satan's "little season" corresponds with the end time persecution spoke elsewhere in Revelation and in other Scripture. The millennium does not follow Revelation 17-19 in time, but rather parallels it. Revelation 20 is the last of 7 recapitulations.

Fourthly, martyrdom was/is never limited to 42 months at the end as you claim. Every informed Bible student knows that. Martyrdom has occurred since the stoning of Stephen. Millions have been butchered by the beast system for their faith in the OT and NT, in the early Church, under the jackboot of Romanism, and right up until today. To limit martyrdom to 42 months at the end exposes your theological bias, your ignorance of history and your lack of objectivity.

Fifthly, there is good reason to connect Satan’s little season with the last 3.5 years (42 months/1260 days), found in Scripture. This does not demand a literal meaning in this most symbolic of books. This describes the final conflict between the kingdom of God and the kingdom of darkness. Satan and the beast will be loosed at the end to resist the people of God. That is when the restraint is simply removed. Right at the end, the kingdom of darkness is overthrew.

sovereigngrace said:

Thirdly, Revelation is not chronological. It is a number of recaps describing the same intra-Advent period. The end of the millennium and Satan's "little season" corresponds with the end time persecution spoke elsewhere in Revelation and in other Scripture. The millennium does not follow Revelation 17-19 in time, but rather parallels it. Revelation 20 is the last of 7 recapitulations.

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Sorry, NO backpeddling, no recaps: just straight through chronology

Chapters 4 & 5 show us the TIMING of the first seals: 32 AD


• Jesus not seen at the right hand of the father – still on earth

• Jesus NOT found worthy to take the book – before Jesus prevailed ........................over death
• The Holy Spirit there in the throne room in chapter 4 – before Jesus ascended to send Him down.
• TIME PASSES; Jesus prevails over death
• Jesus found worthy
• Jesus ascends back into throne room
• Jesus sends Holy Spirit down circa 32 AD
• Jesus takes the book Circa 32 AD


Chapter 6 starts the same timing: 32 AD, When Jesus got the book into HIS hands: START of the CHURCH AGE.

Seal 1: church sent out with Gospel

Seals 2-4: Satan’s attempts to stop the advance of the gospel. God has allowed Satan to use wars, famines, pestilences, and wild beasts.

Seal 5 is church age martyrs. They are told judgment won’t start until the full number of martyrs has been killed. The pretrib rapture will end the church age and trigger the start of the Day of the Lrd.

Seal 6 then starts the Day of the Lord when Judgment begins.

hapter 7 is an intermission: God MUST see two things done before He can start the HURT on earth (judgment as in the 70th week)
1: the 144,000 MUST be sealed before the WEEK can begin
2. The church must be seen safely in heaven before WRATH begins when the WEEK begins.

Chapter 8: Seventh Seal, the start of the 70th week, and the start of the HURT on earth. Hurt comes with Wrath. The trumpets start with Wrath. Four trumpets sound in chapter 8

Chapter 9 HURT continues with the trumpets #5 and #6. All trumpets come with Wrath.

Chapter 10: intermission: things have to be done before the abomination that will divide the week and START the days of GT.

Chapter 11: The man of sin moves to Jerusalem with Gentile armies who will trample he city -just days before He will enter the temple..The city will be trampled for the next 42 months.

• The two witnesses suddenly appear in earth, just 3.5 days before the man ............of sin will enter the temple. Will testify for the next 11260 days
• The 7th trumpet sounds AS the man if sin enters the temple and caused ............the abomination Jesus spoke of.
• The first 6000 years are over, Adam's lease ends, A closing takes place: the kingdoms of earth are taken from Satan and given to Jesus.


Chapter 12: God introduces John to the dragon: mentioned 32 times in this chapter:
• The first five verses are a history lesson for John about the days of Jesus birth; how Satan tried to kill Jesus as a child.
• Seconds after the abomination: those in Judea begin to flee – for the next .............1260 days
• War in heaven: Satan has no more legal hold on earth (He had usurped Adam's lease) and is now cast down from the heavenly realms. He loses his wings.
• Satan goes after those who have fled, but discovers God is protecting them, (the next 3.5 times) so he goes after the remnant of those who love Jesus. (Remnant because the main load went out with the pretrib rapture.)

Chapter 13: God introduces John to the Beast and False Prophet - who will CAUSE those days of GT: great PRESSURE upon people

• The man of sin who entered the temple in chapter 11 and declared he is GOD, has now turned BEAST. John sees him arising.
• He is given 42 months of authority. (The NEXT 42 months.)
• The False prophet shows up
• God shows us what they will do: they will cause the days of GT: they will ..............create an image and a mark, and force people to receive it. (they ..............accomplish these things during the next chapters up to chapter 16)

Chapter 14: God must WARN people before they accept the mark: if they do, they will be doomed to the lake of fire. 3 Angels give 3 warnings.


• God also warns people to worship God and FEAR Him. After the warning, ...............the Beast and False prophet being forcing the mark upon people: take the ...............mark or lose their head. These are the days of GT that Jesus spoke of.

Chapter 15: the beheaded (from the days of GT Jesus spoke of) BEGIN to show up in heaven. Time passes as the murder of the saints reaches a frenzy during the days of GT.

Chapter 16: God pours out the vials to SHORTEN those days of GT.
• The two witnesses are killed – 3.5 days before the week ends
• The 7th vial ENDS the 70th week.
• The Old Testament saints are resurrected along with the Two Witness and .............along with those beheaded.

Chapter 17 and 18: information on the total destruction of the great harlot Babylon, the city of Jerusalem while the Beast and false Prophet are there deceiving the world.

Chapter 19: Babylon is destroyed. Israel and Jerusalem are under attack. Evil spirits have caused the leaders of any country with a standing army to send troops. Perhaps 70 nations have sent troops. Jerusalem is taken and many are led away as slaves.

Marriage and supper take place in heaven while the 42 months of authority wind down.

Jesus returns to earth with the armies of heaven just in the nickk of time. Armageddon takes place.

Chapter 20 takes place: the START of the 1000 year reign of Christ. Satan is bound.
OT and NT saints are seen judging. The Beheaded are also resurrected and reign with Him.

The 1000 reign of Christ ends. Satan is turned loose. Gog and Magog war.
Heaven and earth disappear: time for the Great, White throne judgment.

John could not have made his chronology better. NO recaps. Just straight through chronology, but with intermissions and parentheses.

iamlamad said:

Sorry, NO backpeddling, no recaps: just straight through chronology

Chapters 4 & 5 show us the TIMING of the first seals: 32 AD


• Jesus not seen at the right hand of the father – still on earth

• Jesus NOT found worthy to take the book – before Jesus prevailed ........................over death
• The Holy Spirit there in the throne room in chapter 4 – before Jesus ascended to send Him down.
• TIME PASSES; Jesus prevails over death
• Jesus found worthy
• Jesus ascends back into throne room
• Jesus sends Holy Spirit down circa 32 AD
• Jesus takes the book Circa 32 AD


Chapter 6 starts the same timing: 32 AD, When Jesus got the book into HIS hands: START of the CHURCH AGE.

Seal 1: church sent out with Gospel

Seals 2-4: Satan’s attempts to stop the advance of the gospel. God has allowed Satan to use wars, famines, pestilences, and wild beasts.

Seal 5 is church age martyrs. They are told judgment won’t start until the full number of martyrs has been killed. The pretrib rapture will end the church age and trigger the start of the Day of the Lrd.

Seal 6 then starts the Day of the Lord when Judgment begins.

hapter 7 is an intermission: God MUST see two things done before He can start the HURT on earth (judgment as in the 70th week)
1: the 144,000 MUST be sealed before the WEEK can begin
2. The church must be seen safely in heaven before WRATH begins when the WEEK begins.

Chapter 8: Seventh Seal, the start of the 70th week, and the start of the HURT on earth. Hurt comes with Wrath. The trumpets start with Wrath. Four trumpets sound in chapter 8

Chapter 9 HURT continues with the trumpets #5 and #6. All trumpets come with Wrath.

Chapter 10: intermission: things have to be done before the abomination that will divide the week and START the days of GT.

Chapter 11: The man of sin moves to Jerusalem with Gentile armies who will trample he city -just days before He will enter the temple..The city will be trampled for the next 42 months.

• The two witnesses suddenly appear in earth, just 3.5 days before the man ............of sin will enter the temple. Will testify for the next 11260 days
• The 7th trumpet sounds AS the man if sin enters the temple and caused ............the abomination Jesus spoke of.
• The first 6000 years are over, Adam's lease ends, A closing takes place: the kingdoms of earth are taken from Satan and given to Jesus.


Chapter 12: God introduces John to the dragon: mentioned 32 times in this chapter:
• The first five verses are a history lesson for John about the days of Jesus birth; how Satan tried to kill Jesus as a child.
• Seconds after the abomination: those in Judea begin to flee – for the next .............1260 days
• War in heaven: Satan has no more legal hold on earth (He had usurped Adam's lease) and is now cast down from the heavenly realms. He loses his wings.
• Satan goes after those who have fled, but discovers God is protecting them, (the next 3.5 times) so he goes after the remnant of those who love Jesus. (Remnant because the main load went out with the pretrib rapture.)

Chapter 13: God introduces John to the Beast and False Prophet - who will CAUSE those days of GT: great PRESSURE upon people

• The man of sin who entered the temple in chapter 11 and declared he is GOD, has now turned BEAST. John sees him arising.
• He is given 42 months of authority. (The NEXT 42 months.)
• The False prophet shows up
• God shows us what they will do: they will cause the days of GT: they will ..............create an image and a mark, and force people to receive it. (they ..............accomplish these things during the next chapters up to chapter 16)

Chapter 14: God must WARN people before they accept the mark: if they do, they will be doomed to the lake of fire. 3 Angels give 3 warnings.


• God also warns people to worship God and FEAR Him. After the warning, ...............the Beast and False prophet being forcing the mark upon people: take the ...............mark or lose their head. These are the days of GT that Jesus spoke of.

Chapter 15: the beheaded (from the days of GT Jesus spoke of) BEGIN to show up in heaven. Time passes as the murder of the saints reaches a frenzy during the days of GT.

Chapter 16: God pours out the vials to SHORTEN those days of GT.
• The two witnesses are killed – 3.5 days before the week ends
• The 7th vial ENDS the 70th week.
• The Old Testament saints are resurrected along with the Two Witness and .............along with those beheaded.

Chapter 17 and 18: information on the total destruction of the great harlot Babylon, the city of Jerusalem while the Beast and false Prophet are there deceiving the world.

Chapter 19: Babylon is destroyed. Israel and Jerusalem are under attack. Evil spirits have caused the leaders of any country with a standing army to send troops. Perhaps 70 nations have sent troops. Jerusalem is taken and many are led away as slaves.

Marriage and supper take place in heaven while the 42 months of authority wind down.

Jesus returns to earth with the armies of heaven just in the nickk of time. Armageddon takes place.

Chapter 20 takes place: the START of the 1000 year reign of Christ. Satan is bound.
OT and NT saints are seen judging. The Beheaded are also resurrected and reign with Him.

The 1000 reign of Christ ends. Satan is turned loose. Gog and Magog war.
Heaven and earth disappear: time for the Great, White throne judgment.

John could not have made his chronology better. NO recaps. Just straight through chronology, but with intermissions and parentheses.

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This is insane hermeneutics. You must have about 7 second comings, 4 judgment days, 3 destructions of babylon, end of the worlds and time. This is a good reason why Premil should be swiftly rejected as non-corroborative and extra-biblical. This false teaching is forcing a square peg in to a round hole.

iamlamad said:

Chapter 16: God pours out the vials to SHORTEN those days of GT.
• The two witnesses are killed – 3.5 days before the week ends
• The 7th vial ENDS the 70th week.
• The Old Testament saints are resurrected along with the Two Witness and .............along with those beheaded.

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Rev 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
Rev 16:7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
Rev 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
Rev 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,
Rev 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
Rev 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
Rev 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
Rev 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.
Rev 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.



Rev 22:18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
Rev 22:19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.


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sovereigngrace said:

Firstly, the dragon, the beast, and the false prophet's activity are not simply restricted to 42 months before Christ's Coming, as you suggest. I didn't think anyone believed that, although, nothing shocks me in end-time discussion. Moreover, to attribute what you wrongly believe on this to the Amil position is wrong. Amils believe that they continue throughout the intra-Advent period (the millennium time).

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So now 1000 years and 42 months are only symbolic and not literal. 1st century believers were not big on math, I see?

Timtofly said:

So now 1000 years and 42 months are only symbolic and not literal. 1st century believers were not big on math, I see?

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They grasped what modern Premils cannot, that Revelation is a figurative book, consisting of various recaps pertaining to the intra-Advent period.

sovereigngrace said:

They grasped what modern Premils cannot, that Revelation is a figurative book, consisting of various recaps pertaining to the intra-Advent period.

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Show me in the historical record where recap was an early church understanding. Recap is as modern as men on the moon.

Besides, they are dead. I asked you.

Timtofly said:

Show me in the historical record where recap was an early church understanding. Recap is as modern as men on the moon.

Besides, they are dead. I asked you.

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The vast majority of ECFs were Amil. They got there through studying the whole Word. Premils wrongly think Rev is the only book in the Bible.