2300 DAY PROPHECY OF DANIEL

Douggg · Oct 5, 2020

klutedavid said:
Don't exclude Luke 21 and only quote from Matthew 24. Otherwise you will overlook that it was a warning for the people of Judea. The desolation of the temple and the sacking of Jerusalem.

Luke 21 has prophecy about the destruction of the temple and city in 70ad.

Then there is the age of the gentiles in Luke 21:24, while the Jews are led away captive into the nations.

Then from Luke 21:25 forward to verse 36 is end times.

_______________________________________________________

The message in Luke 21, for the 70ad prophecy, is the same as the message for the end times in Matthew 24 - albeit for different reasons. Don't stick around, flee into the mountains.

Douggg · Oct 5, 2020

iamlamad said:
Sorry, but you are mistaken: Gabriel retelling the vision and explaining it:

lamad, another reason that your interpretation is wrong is because Antiochus never committed the transgression of desolation.

Antiochus committed the abomination of desolation, in Daniel 11.

Douggg · Oct 5, 2020

Oseas said:
You should study better what your are preaching. If you look well, you will see that does not exist in any place of Scriptures that say a prophet, true or false, is as being a lamb, but a Messiah, of course, as I can prove by / through Scriptures, as follow, but I do not believe Scriptures give you suport to what you are saying.

Here goes what says Scriptures - Lamb as a Messiah

Isaiah 53:v.7- He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth.

John 1:v.29 - The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

John 1:v.36 - And looking upon Jesus as he walked, he saith, Behold the Lamb of God!

1Peter 1:v.19 - But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Revelation 13:v.8 - And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. 9 If any man have an ear, let him hear.

Who will do great wonders so he makes FIRE come down from heaven is the false messiah, he is the own Satan incarnate, in his world there is not any more powerful than him, whoever he is. What Satan will do, having two horns like a lamb, a false lamb, and speak as a Dragon, a false messiah of the Jews(John 5:v.43), of course, yeah, what he will do it is prophetic and will fulfil LITERALLY. Revelation 13:v.11-18 [/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
Oseas, how many horns does the Lamb have in this verse? Two or seven?

Revelation 5:6 And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth.

Jesus was a prophet speaking as God. The false prophet is a anti-prophet speaking on behalf of Satan. An anit-prophet, but not the Anti-christ, Anit-messiah.

iamlamad · Oct 5, 2020

Douggg said:
lamad, another reason that your interpretation is wrong is because Antiochus never committed the transgression of desolation.

Antiochus committed the abomination of desolation, in Daniel 11.

Sorry, but I don't believe that. Antiochus was allowed by God to do what He did because of the sins or transgressions of Israel.

I am right on the 2300 days, as is proven by the 1150 days of two animal sacrifices per day.

"COMPUTING WITH THE GREEK CALENDAR IN USE AT THE TIME OF THE MACCABEES

Using the Greek calendar according to Herodotus and assuming that the years 146 and 148 were intercalary years, we come up with the following calculation: 9-15-145 to 9-25-148, the dates given in Maccabees from the desecration to the cleansing, is three years and ten days. Thus, the math sentence following the Greek calendar which was in use at the time the prophecy was fulfilled would be: (3 X 360) + (2 X 30) + 10. Let's diagram it.

3 x 360 equals ********************1080 days
2 x 30 (2 intercalary months)******* ****60 days
From 15th to 25th equals **************10 days
___________________________________________
Total ****************************1150 days

This is exactly the period which would accomplish exactly 2,300 sacrifices, one in the morning and one in the evening!"
(1-2.htm)

In other words, the 2300 evening and morning sacrifices FIT the dates given in the book of Maccabees.

This, of course, is what I have been saying all along.

iamlamad · Oct 5, 2020

Some people see this 2300 evenings and mornings as 1150 days:

Cambridge Bible
The expression is peculiar; but it seems to have been suggested by the fact that the burnt-offering (Daniel 8:11; Daniel 8:13) was offered morning and evening daily (Exodus 29:38-42); the meaning consequently is that this offering would cease for 2300 times, i.e. during 1150 days (so most commentators)

The expression 'ereh baqer of Dan 8:14 is interpreted in the current literature as a reference to the morning and evening sacrifices offered daily in the Temple. The omission of 2300 such
sacrifices would correspond to 1150 days, the interval of time
during which the services in the Temple were suspended following the profanation of temple and altar by Antiochus Epiphanes.

This interpretation has become practically normative, so that modern scholars seldom take time to examine it critically. Thus, for instance, A. Bentzen states: "2300 'evenings-mornings,' namely 1150 days, this peculiar way of indicating the time being explained by the fact that the total number of tamldsacrifices omitted is given; since every morning and evening of every day a tamid was offered, the omission of 2300 such sacrifices signifies 1150 days."' Bentzen adds the interesting observation that this interpretation dates back to Ephraem Syrus. The same explanation is repeated uncritically by most of the more recent commentator^.^ (S. J. SCHWANTES)

The first question is how long of a period is meant by “2,300 evenings and mornings.” Most Bible scholars take this to be 2,300 days, which is approximately 6 years and 4 months. However, a few understand it to refer to a combined total of 2,300 evenings and mornings, i.e. 1,150 evenings and 1,150 mornings, thus 1,150 days or approximately 3 years and 2 months. Kriss Udd

iamlamad · Oct 5, 2020

Douggg said:
The antecedent of the "their" is the transgressors in the verse itself.

It won't make sense who the transgressor are, without knowledge of Daniel 7 and Revelation 13 and Revelation 17 and 2Thessalonians2:4.

The transgressors are the little horn person and the ten kings that hand their kingdom over to him. And they rule with him that last 42 months of the 7 years.

No, it is not just that. The king of fierce countenance dares to face off against the Prince of Princes - which will happen at the end of the seven years.

And that the king of fierce announce destroys many by peace. Which following Gog/Magog, the little horn enters the middle east with a strong army. He will be perceived by the Jews as the messiah, anointed the king of Israel by the false prophet. And the world will be saying peace and safety, until he goes into the temple, sits, claims to be God - the transgression of desolation.

During the 2300 day vision, at the time of the end.

This is all pretty much myth because you are pulling verses out of their context.

This is the first mentions of "transgression" and it is speaking of the JEWS. It is speaking of the REASON God allowed this all to happen. And it is speaking of the Daily Sacrifices being stopped.

12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

The antecedent of the "their" is the transgressors in the verse itself. This is one of the biggest stretches I have seen in a long time on a verse of scripture! Why not just admit you are mistaken?

20 The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.

21 And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.

22 Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, four kingdoms shall stand up out of the nation, but not in his power.
Gabriel explaining verse 8:
8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.

[Note: "Four stood up for it, four kingdoms" the antecedent for "Their kingdom" or "their rule" or "their reign" or "their kingship." ]
23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up. 24 And his power shall be mighty, but not by his own power: and he shall destroy wonderfully, and shall prosper, and practise, and shall destroy the mighty and the holy people. 25 And through his policy also he shall cause craft to prosper in his hand; and he shall magnify himself in his heart, and by peace shall destroy many: he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes; but he shall be broken without hand.
Gabriel explaining verses 9-12
9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. 10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. 11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of the sanctuary was cast down. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

Note: the vision - Gabriel's explanation
it waxed great - his power shall be mighty
it practised, and prospered. - shall prosper, and practise
it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. - shall destroy the mighty and the holy people.
he magnified himself even to the prince of the host - he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes

Who can doubt that Gabriel is explaining the very same vision that Daniel saw, some almost word for word?

It is a mistake to pull any of these verses or parts of verses out of their context and make they for another time - like our future. The 2300 days, or 2300 "evening and morning" was the time it took from Antiochus' defiling the temple until it was cleansed.

The " then shall the sanctuary be cleansed" is yet another proof the 2300 days or evening mornings is for the temple in Antiochus' days.

iamlamad · Oct 5, 2020

Oseas said:
I am not fighting against the Holy Spirit, I am fighting against the spirit of lie as my LORD Jesus did in John 8:v.43-45.

Revelation 16:v.13-16 is also aplied in your case as a follower.

Here goes what the Word of God says - the Word is God - it is He who refutes you by His own words, not me. I only work with the Word of God, He that is above is above of all. He that is of the earth, is earthly, and speaks of the earth.

~~~~~~~~~~~~THE VISION ~~~~~~~~~~~
verse 13 - Then I heard a holy one speaking, and another holy one said to him, “How long will it take for the VISION to be fulfilled—the VISION concerning the daily sacrifice, the rebellion that causes desolation, the surrender of the sanctuary and the trampling underfoot of the Lord’s people?”

verse 14 - He said to me, “It will take 2,300 evenings and mornings; then the sanctuary will be reconsecrated.”

~~~~~~Here the true interpretation~~~~~~~
The Interpretation of the Vision by Gabriel

(Your interpretation is good for nothing, it is tares, it is chaff, your disguised spirit trys to replace the true interpretation of Gabriel by a devilish interpretation you have learned from demons).

15 While I, Daniel, was watching the vision and trying to understand it, there before me stood one who looked like a man. 16 And I heard a man’s voice from the Ulai calling, “Gabriel, tell this man the meaning of the VISION.” (This is sufficy)

17 As he came near the place where I was standing, I was terrified and fell prostrate. “Son of man,” he said to me, “understand that the VISION concerns the time of the END."

18 While he was speaking to me, I was in a deep sleep, with my face to the ground. Then he touched me and raised me to my feet.

19 He said: “I am going to tell you what will happen later in the time of wrath, because the VISION concerns the appointed time of the END.

The true Christians believe in the interpretation was given by Gabriel, they will never believe in lies like that you have posted.

Through your disguised spirit you try to deny Scriptures, and try to TAKE OUT THE TRUTH from the heart of my brothers who fight by the Truth. You are sowing tares, chaff, and deceiving the brothers in Christ here with your deceiver messages. Your sin is serious before the Most High God.

because the VISION concerns the appointed time of the END.
IN CONTEXT - define "end" here. Since "of the indignation" is part of the same verse, please define that also. Please, keep it IN CONTEXT. (You can use any or all the verses in this chapter.)

Douggg · Oct 5, 2020

iamlamad said:
This is all pretty much myth because you are pulling verses out of their context.

This is the first mentions of "transgression" and it is speaking of the JEWS. It is speaking of the REASON God allowed this all to happen. And it is speaking of the Daily Sacrifices being stopped.

12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered.

"the host given him aginst the daily sacrifice, is implying he has a big army present. Which in Daniel 8:9 he waxes strong from north and west of Israel, from what was once one of the four breakup kingdoms.

The little horn person, leader of the EU, brings his army into the middle east, including Israel, to act as peace keeper in the aftermath of Gog/Magog.

Later on, when he commits the transgression of desolation, nobody in Israel is going to be able to do anything because he will have his army occupying Israel and the middle east at the time.

It will take an outside force, strangers i.e. non Jews, to remove him, killing him, probably by covert action of an assassination. It will be caught on camera. And the entire world will see him killed.

Ezekiel 28:1-10.

1 The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,

2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:

3 Behold, thou art wiser than Daniel; there is no secret that they can hide from thee:

4 With thy wisdom and with thine understanding thou hast gotten thee riches, and hast gotten gold and silver into thy treasures:

5 By thy great wisdom and by thy traffick hast thou increased thy riches, and thine heart is lifted up because of thy riches:

6 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God;

7 Behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.

8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.

9 Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou shalt be a man, and no God, in the hand of him that slayeth thee.

10 Thou shalt die the deaths of the uncircumcised by the hand of strangers: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD.

Marilyn C · Oct 5, 2020

iamlamad said:
Except the 2300 days was for Antiochus's time, not our future.

However the words `end times, appointed times,` etc say differently.

Marilyn C · Oct 5, 2020

iamlamad said:
Sorry, but you are mistaken: Gabriel retelling the vision and explaining it:

22 Now that being broken, whereas four stood up for it, four kingdoms shall stand up out of the nation, but not in his power.
[The "four" was the four generals that divided the kingdom]
23 And in the latter time of their kingdom, when the transgressors are come to the full, a king of fierce countenance, and understanding dark sentences, shall stand up.
[Notice the "their." It must have an antecedent: and that antecedent is "four kingdoms." In other words, verse 23 is tied to verse 22, and verses 22 is tied to verse 21. Of course people pull verse 23 out of its context, but they end up with error. ]

THE END:
17 So he came near where I stood: and when he came, I was afraid, and fell upon my face: but he said unto me, Understand, O son of man: for at the time of the end shall be the vision.
[We MUST watch the context: He will explain what "end." It is the end of the terrible things Antiiochus did.]
19 And he said, Behold, I will make thee know what shall be in the last end of the indignation: for at the time appointed the end shall be. [Now we know what "end" Gabriel was talking about; the very end in the vision where Antiochus did terrible things to the Jews and their religion. Not what Gabriel starts with below: the SAME VISION]

20 The ram which thou sawest having two horns are the kings of Media and Persia.

`....in the latter time of their kingdom .... a king shall arise....` (Dan. 8: 23) Who is that?

klutedavid · Oct 5, 2020

iamlamad said:
Some people see this 2300 evenings and mornings as 1150 days:

Cambridge Bible
The expression is peculiar; but it seems to have been suggested by the fact that the burnt-offering (Daniel 8:11; Daniel 8:13) was offered morning and evening daily (Exodus 29:38-42); the meaning consequently is that this offering would cease for 2300 times, i.e. during 1150 days (so most commentators)

The expression 'ereh baqer of Dan 8:14 is interpreted in the current literature as a reference to the morning and evening sacrifices offered daily in the Temple. The omission of 2300 such
sacrifices would correspond to 1150 days, the interval of time
during which the services in the Temple were suspended following the profanation of temple and altar by Antiochus Epiphanes.

This interpretation has become practically normative, so that modern scholars seldom take time to examine it critically. Thus, for instance, A. Bentzen states: "2300 'evenings-mornings,' namely 1150 days, this peculiar way of indicating the time being explained by the fact that the total number of tamldsacrifices omitted is given; since every morning and evening of every day a tamid was offered, the omission of 2300 such sacrifices signifies 1150 days."' Bentzen adds the interesting observation that this interpretation dates back to Ephraem Syrus. The same explanation is repeated uncritically by most of the more recent commentator^.^ (S. J. SCHWANTES)

The first question is how long of a period is meant by “2,300 evenings and mornings.” Most Bible scholars take this to be 2,300 days, which is approximately 6 years and 4 months. However, a few understand it to refer to a combined total of 2,300 evenings and mornings, i.e. 1,150 evenings and 1,150 mornings, thus 1,150 days or approximately 3 years and 2 months. Kriss Udd

A good post and well worth consideration.

iamlamad · Oct 6, 2020

Douggg said:
"the host given him aginst the daily sacrifice, is implying he has a big army present. Which in Daniel 8:9 he waxes strong from north and west of Israel, from what was once one of the four breakup kingdoms.

The little horn person, leader of the EU, brings his army into the middle east, including Israel, to act as peace keeper in the aftermath of Gog/Magog.

Later on, when he commits the transgression of desolation, nobody in Israel is going to be able to do anything because he will have his army occupying Israel and the middle east at the time.

It will take an outside force, strangers i.e. non Jews, to remove him, killing him, probably by covert action of an assassination. It will be caught on camera. And the entire world will see him killed.

Ezekiel 28:1-10.

1 The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,

2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:

3 Behold, thou art wiser than Daniel; there is no secret that they can hide from thee:

4 With thy wisdom and with thine understanding thou hast gotten thee riches, and hast gotten gold and silver into thy treasures:

5 By thy great wisdom and by thy traffick hast thou increased thy riches, and thine heart is lifted up because of thy riches:

6 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God;

7 Behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.

8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.

9 Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou shalt be a man, and no God, in the hand of him that slayeth thee.

10 Thou shalt die the deaths of the uncircumcised by the hand of strangers: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD.

All this other scripture is of course true, but it has nothing to do with Dan. 8, which was about Antiochus, who became a TYPE of the Beast to come.

iamlamad · Oct 6, 2020

Marilyn C said:
`....in the latter time of their kingdom .... a king shall arise....` (Dan. 8: 23) Who is that?

Of course, Antiochus Epiphanes. The Amplified bible puts his name in the text. He became king near the end of the Diachochi: the Geek kingdom after Alexander died. He was therefore, "in the latter time of their reign" or kingdom.

iamlamad · Oct 6, 2020

Marilyn C said:
However the words `end times, appointed times,` etc say differently.

No, one can pull verses out of context and make them say anything, but in context, one must deal with the word "their" which antecedent is the four Generals and/or their kingdoms. Gabriel did not change subjects or times; he explained the vision that started with the Ram and the Goat, then the four Generals, and then in the latter time of THEIR reign....around 170 BC.

The "end" in question was the end of the "indignation:" mere man stopping the Daily Sacrifices that GOD HIMSELF established. The 2300 "evening and morning" sacrifices - as Gabriel put it, means that for 1150 days, two sacrifices a day were suspended -not allowed to take place - which was an "indignation." Added to that was the temple and the people of God being trampled under foot.

Douggg · Oct 6, 2020

iamlamad said:
All this other scripture is of course true, but it has nothing to do with Dan. 8, which was about Antiochus, who became a TYPE of the Beast to come.

lamad, think about what you are arguing over. How big a point is it for you to be wrong and that it is not Antiochus? It is not that big of point.

It just means that the 2300 days are in the end times. And the little horn person in Daniel 7, who is coming anyway, is the same little horn person in Daniel 8.

iamlamad · Oct 6, 2020

Douggg said:
lamad, think about what you are arguing over. How big a point is it for you to be wrong and that it is not Antiochus? It is not that big of point.

It just means that the 2300 days are in the end times. And the little horn person in Daniel 7, who is coming anyway, is the same little horn person in Daniel 8.

I just can't stand error. And pulling the 2300 days out of context and making them for the future is error. No, sorry, two different "little horns" from two different places. The Daniel 7 little horn is the 11th horn who grew up from ten. The chapter 8 little horn came out from 4 generals of The Greek Empire of Alexander the Great. The Little horn of chapter 7 is future to us, while the little horn of Dan. 8 is history to us. Did you not see my post where the 2300 evening morning sacrifices is actually 1150 days and the timing works out perfected from the date he slew the pig to the time the temple was cleansed? That is just added proof the 2300 fits Antiochus' time, not our future.

You have to ignore FAR TOO Much for your theory to work: destroy the pronoun / antecedent relationship, ignore the cleansing of the temple, ignore that Gabriel was only explaining the original vision of the Ram, the Goat, the Four kingdoms and then the little horn that came out of the four, in the latter time of THEIR reign. .

Douggg · Oct 6, 2020

iamlamad said:
I just can't stand error. And pulling the 2300 days out of context and making them for the future is error. No, sorry, two different "little horns" from two different places. The Daniel 7 little horn is the 11th horn who grew up from ten. The chapter 8 little horn came out from 4 generals of The Greek Empire of Alexander the Great. The Little horn of chapter 7 is future to us, while the little horn of Dan. 8 is history to us. Did you not see my post where the 2300 evening morning sacrifices is actually 1150 days and the timing works out perfected from the date he slew the pig to the time the temple was cleansed? That is just added proof the 2300 fits Antiochus' time, not our future.

You have to ignore FAR TOO Much for your theory to work: destroy the pronoun / antecedent relationship, ignore the cleansing of the temple, ignore that Gabriel was only explaining the original vision of the Ram, the Goat, the Four kingdoms and then the little horn that came out of the four, in the latter time of THEIR reign. .

Do you read "transgression" of desolation in Daniel 11 ?

iamlamad · Oct 6, 2020

Douggg said:
Do you read "transgression" of desolation in Daniel 11 ?

No, and that does not bother me at all.

Douggg · Oct 6, 2020

iamlamad said:
No, and that does not bother me at all.

Does it not make sense that because it s commonly considered that Antiochus was responsible for the abomination of desolation in Daniel 11, that if Daniel 8 were about Antiochus as well, it should have said abomination of desolation, and not transgression of desolation in Daniel 8?

iamlamad · Oct 6, 2020

Douggg said:
Does it not make sense that because it s commonly considered that Antiochus was responsible for the abomination of desolation in Daniel 11, that if Daniel 8 were about Antiochus as well, it should have said abomination of desolation, and not transgression of desolation in Daniel 8?

They are two different aspects of the same event: the transgression (of Israel) is why God allowed the abomination to happen. The abomination itself is what led to the desolation.

2300 DAY PROPHECY OF DANIEL

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