- Aug 11, 2017
- 22,593
- 7,366
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Married
The church claims that decision came from the Holy Spirit. It was unanimously agreed upon by the body of Christ.
Upvote
0
We are told to follow Christ but how?
- Thread starter ChristServant
- Start date
The church claims that decision came from the Holy Spirit. It was unanimously agreed upon by the body of Christ.
The Catholic church changed Gods Sabbath to Sunday and also changed Gods laws to their own. The Holy Spirit will never go against God.
The Bible very clearly has this warning about anyone changing anything in the Bible.
Revelations 22 18-19
A Warning
18 For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book; 19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
Colossians 2
Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. 18 Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you. Such a person also goes into great detail about what they have seen; they are puffed up with idle notions by their unspiritual mind. 19 They have lost connection with the head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.
Upvote
0
- Aug 11, 2017
- 22,593
- 7,366
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Married
That’s not a commandment to worship on the Sabbath. That’s a prophecy of what will happen, not a commandment.
holy
qâdash
1. to consecrate, sanctify, prepare, dedicate, be hallowed, be holy, be sanctified, be separate
a. (Qal)
1. to be set apart, be consecrated
2. to be hallowed
3. consecrated, tabooed
b. (Niphal)
1. to show oneself sacred or majestic
2. to be honoured, be treated as sacred
3. to be holy
c. (Piel)
1. to set apart as sacred, consecrate, dedicate
2. to observe as holy, keep sacred
3. to honour as sacred, hallow
4. to consecrate
d. (Pual)
1. to be consecrated
2. consecrated, dedicated
e. (Hiphil)
1. to set apart, devote, consecrate
2. to regard or treat as sacred or hallow
3. to consecrate
f. (Hithpael)
1. to keep oneself apart or separate
2. to cause Himself to be hallowed (of God)
3. to be observed as holy
4. to consecrate oneself
Nothing in the definition of the Hebrew word qâdash (holy) that implies worship.
Upvote
0
Doesn't Colossians 2:14 wipe out the weekly Sabbath? | Sabbath Truth
Let’s first take a look at the apostle Paul's words in Colossians 2:14–17: “Having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. … So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.”
When some read about the sabbath days that were shadows and that passed away at the cross, they think that Paul was referring to the weekly Sabbath, the fourth of the Ten Commandments. Is this accurate? It’s important to get this right, because our interpretation of the apostle’s actual meaning can lead us into deeper truth or into deeper error.
Two Sabbaths
First, there is nothing in the Ten Commandment law about food, drink, festivals, new moons, or sabbath days (plural). All these were actually separate laws that God gave for the physical and spiritual health of His Old Testament people; these were called ceremonial laws.
Second, Paul wrote plainly that he was speaking of “sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come,” and not of the weekly Sabbath, which is a memorial of something that happened in the past, at the creation. The contrast between a shadow and a memorial is quite clear. Indeed, the fourth commandment does not tell us to keep the seventh day as a type of something to come. It says: “Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. ... For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it” (Exodus 20:8, 11).
Moreover, to show that he had something other than the weekly Sabbath in mind, Paul distinctly mentioned “sabbaths,” plural,” which are a shadow of things to come.” (The word “sabbath” in the Greek can be singular or plural according to Strong’s and Greek lexicons.)
Festivals and Shadows
The King James uses the word “holyday,” and some will contend that it refers to the weekly Sabbath, while the expression “sabbath days” refers to yearly sabbaths. The American Standard Version uses “feast day” instead of “holyday,” and this likely a clearer translation. The word translated “holyday” is from the Greek heorte, and in John 5:1, this same word is used to designate one of the yearly festivals of the Jews: “After this there was a feast [heorte] of the Jews; and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.” This is one of the holy days that Paul spoke of as having been nailed to the cross.
The “shadows” Paul mentions pointed to Jesus as a Savior from sin and were observed with that in mind. But the weekly Sabbath was made for man before sin entered into the world, before man would need atonement. The shadows pointing forward to His death as an atonement for sin certainly were not instituted until after sin. Therefore, since the weekly Sabbath was instituted before sin, just as was the marriage institution, it was not a shadow of Christ’s death as a Savior from sin; and His death did not end the Sabbath day any more than it brought marriage to an end. Both the Sabbath and marriage came to us in a perfect world.
Paul’s language shows he was referencing the shadowy ceremonies that pointed forward to and ended at the cross. Notice again, carefully, his words in Colossians 2:14: “Having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross.” Paul mentions that these laws were “against us” and “contrary” to us. Would it be contrary to Christians to refrain from idolatry, using God’s name in vain, dishonoring parents, murder, theft, adultery, lying, and coveting—the sins rebuked by the Ten Commandments? Thus, the apostle must have been talking of another law—a law that enjoined food offerings, drink offerings, the observance of festivals, new moons, and yearly sabbaths.
Why Are These Laws Contrary to Us?
Why would the observance of these ceremonies after the death of Christ be contrary to the Christian faith? The yearly sabbath of the Passover involved killing a lamb that represented Jesus, the Lamb of God. The apostle Paul taught directly, “Indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us" (1 Corinthians 5:7). Thus, to keep offering a sacrificial lamb after His death would be to imply that Jesus had not accomplished atonement. Such an observance would be contrary to the teachings of Christianity.
Many other shadowy requirements of the ceremonial law pointed to the death of Jesus on the cross, as well. All these festivals, food and drink offerings, and sabbaths that were nailed to the cross, Paul declared to be “a shadow of things to come.” Then he adds, "But the substance is of Christ." That is, the substance that cast these shadows was Christ’s body on the cross.
Think of it this way—late in the afternoon when a tall tree casts its shadow eastward, one can begin at the farthest end of the shadow and follow it until he or she gets to the tree that casts the shadow, and there the shadow ceases to be. Likewise, we can go back to the time when “through one man [Adam] sin entered the world, and death through sin,” and there a merciful God promised to send a Redeemer (Genesis 3:15), a Substitute, to die in man’s place. To keep man continually reminded of this fact, and to supply him with a means of expressing his faith in the coming sacrifice, God instituted these ceremonies. All of these were included in the law that was not written on tables of stone.
Follow these shadowy ceremonies all the way from Eden to the time of Moses, and then through the wilderness journey and on for hundreds of years after the settlement in Canaan, and at last to Calvary—and there they cease. So it would be "against us" and "contrary" to our faith to observe these ceremonies after Jesus' death. Not so with the other law. It is just as necessary to refrain from idolatry, using God’s name in vain, dishonoring the Sabbath, murder, adultery, and theft after the cross as before. Indeed, it was the violation of these principles that caused the death of Christ. Could they have been set aside or changed to accommodate the carnal mind, Jesus need not have died.
Now with these truths before us, let us again read Colossians 2:14–17 and see how plainly Paul revealed that he did not mean that the weekly seventh-day Sabbath had been nailed to the cross: "Having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. … So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ."
Upvote
0
- Aug 11, 2017
- 22,593
- 7,366
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Married
Perhaps you are not familiar with Acts 15 my friend. I believe if I’m not mistaken I pointed this out to you the other day and you declined to comment on it. Perhaps you missed that post? God had commanded that any foreigners living among the Jews must be circumcised and the apostles met together and thru the guidance of the Holy Spirit abolished that commandment.
Upvote
0
It's in God's 10 commandments and the 4th Commandment. Maybe you should re-read Exodus 20 again. Are you saying the only commandment we are supposed to forget is the only commandment that starts with the word "Remember" the only one that uses the word "Holy" and the only one that was "blessed"?
How do we follow Christ? We do as He did, which was keeping all commandments including the Sabbath. The sabbath was created from the beginning of time- how could this not be important?
Genesis 2:2-3
And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. 3 Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made.
Upvote
0
1 Corinthians 7:19
19 Circumcision is nothing and uncircumcision is nothing, but keeping the commandments of God is what matters.
Upvote
0
That's easy. You know the story of the woman who reached out and touched his robe? Well, she wasn't actually seeking healing, but was sneaking a gps tracker into the hem...
Okay, more serious answer, the line in scripture is that being born again is when 2 Corinthians 5:17, Romans 6:6, Galatians 2:20, and instead we become vessels for Christ instead (hence 1 Corinthians 6:19). We stop being John Smith and become replaced by Christ.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
Galatians 3
O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.
11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
Are you a Jew ?
Upvote
0
Actually I just found out I am 51% Jewish, but it doesn't matter if one is Jewish or not. God made the sabbath and the commandments for all. He is not coming back to save one race. He is coming to save us all of us that believe in Him, love Him with all our hearts and keep His commandments.
There is the spirit of the law and the letter of the law. God wants us to keep His commandments because we love Him.
John 14:15-16
15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
He gives us the Holy spirit to help us keep His commandments.
Last edited:
Upvote
0
I'm a gentile not under the law- Jesus set me free from the law and the commandments as per Romans , Hebrews and Galatians.
BTW- its rather hypocritical to talk about man and other churches started by man all the while the SDA made by man claims exclusivity. You are trapped within the SDA with its rules and regulations for membership. The church has replaced the freedom in Christ in place of rules and regulations, restrictions regarding worship.
hope this helps !!!
Upvote
0
That's not a risk I am willing to take when the Bible clearly says how important Gods laws are. In fact, its written in the last chapter of the bible:
Revelations 22:14 14 Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city.
Here's some good reading materials that may help:
Christ, in fulfilling the moral law, abolished it. | Sabbath Truth
Matthew 5:17–19:
- "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets" (v. 17). Jesus certainly did not do the very thing that He came not to do!
- "I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill." According to Webster's Dictionary, "fulfill," when applied to a law, means "to answer its demands by obedience." It here means the opposite of "destroy," as in the following scriptures: "And shall not uncircumcision, which is by nature, if it fulfill the law, judge thee, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?" (Romans 2:27) "Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfill the law of Christ" (Galatians 6:2). "If ye fulfill the royal law, according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, ye do well" (James 2:8).
Thus, those who make this argument would have Christ teach that He came not to destroy the law but to destroy the law. That doesn't make sense, does it?
- "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in nowise pass from the law" (Matthew 5:18). Heaven and earth still remain; thus, we can know from Jesus' own lips that the law was not and has not been abolished.
- "Till all is fulfilled" (Matthew 5:18). This passage was originally written in Greek. In the Greek language, words that go together must share certain qualities, such as gender or number. The word "all" is neuter in gender and plural in number. Therefore, it cannot refer directly to “law,” which is masculine in gender and singular in number. “All” refers to all things respecting heaven and earth that are spoken of in the prophets (Old Testament).
The term “fulfilled” in this verse comes from a different Greek word than the word “fulfilled” in the expression, "I did not come to destroy, but to fulfill" (verse 17). Here in verse 18, this word means “to come into existence, be created, exist by creation” (William Greenfield, A Greek-English Lexicon to the New Testament). This word “fulfilled” is translated as “made” in John 1:3: "All things were made by him" (KJV). So, again, “fulfill” actually means the opposite of “destroy.”
- Now comes Christ's own conclusion: "Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least [or, as George Campbell renders it, "shall be of no esteem"] in the kingdom of heaven; but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven" (Matthew 5:19). And to emphasize the poing that the law is not abolished, Christ proceeds to explain certain precepts of the law in question in their most spiritual and comprehensive sense.
- "The law and the prophets were until John" (Luke 16:16). At the time of John the Baptist, there was a change in the law and the prophets, when he began preaching the kingdom of God. The kingdom of God did not do away with the law and the prophets but added to them. Christ confirmed this in the next verse, making the law firmer than the very pillars of heaven and earth: "And it is easier," He said, "for heaven and earth to pass away than for one tittle of the law to fail" (verse 17).
- "Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in nowise pass from the law."
- "Till all be fulfilled" (Matthew 5:18). That is, ; till all those things to be restored are brought into existence by a new creation. This brings us to the new-earth state, in which righteousness shall dwell (2 Peter 3:13; Psalm 119:172; Isaiah 51:6, 7), and the Sabbath shall continue while eternal ages roll (Isaiah 66:22, 23).
As we have seen, the argument that Christ abolished the law is refuted by the Savior’s own words in Matthew chapter 5, by Peter’s prophecy in 2 Peter 3, by the testimony of Old Testament writers in Psalm 119 and Isaiah 51, and by the fact that Christ cannot be the minister of sin.
Upvote
0
Then by all means keep practicing the law thats your choice not mine. Whom the Son sets free is free indeed ! Gal 5:1
Romans 8
Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, 2 because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit who gives life has set you free from the law of sin and death. 3 For what the law was powerless to do because it was weakened by the flesh, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
plain jayne
Active Member
- Aug 11, 2020
- 253
- 366
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Christian
- Marital Status
- Private
If Jesus had had the woman stoned, THEN he would have been breaking the law! He did not break the law as the story is stated.
- The man was required to be stoned along with the woman. Deuteronomy 22:22; Leviticus 20:10 The man was conspicuously absent. Only the woman was brought.
- Two or three witnesses had to be present and give matching testimony. Deuteronomy 19:15 There were no witnesses and no matching testimony given.
- The witnesses were the ones that had to cast the first stone. Deuteronomy 17:7 They were putting that task on Jesus who was NOT a witness.
The teachers of the law [how ironic] and the Pharisees who brought her to Jesus butchered the law by not bring the man, not bringing any witnesses, and by asking Jesus make the decision of stoning.
Had Jesus stoned her or started he stoning or agreed to the stoning, he would have been following along with the violations of the law.
If Jesus had stoned this woman he would THEN be breaking the law.
Upvote
0
Soyeong
Well-Known Member
- Mar 10, 2015
- 12,433
- 4,605
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Single
Christ set a sinless example of how to walk in obedience to the Mosaic Law and did not hypocritically preach something other than what he practiced, so doing what he taught by word and by example is straightforwardly the way to follow him. If God is legalistic for giving the Mosaic Law and Jesus is legalistic for living in sinless obedience to it and for teaching his followers how to obey it by word and by example, then being legalistic would be being in good company, but that is not what legalism refers to. It is not legalistic to think that followers of God should follow His commands just as it is not legalistic to think that citizens of a country to follow the laws of that country. So legalism is not in regard to thinking that one of many laws should be followed, but in regard to the manner in which someone follows a particular law without regard to its intent. For example:
Leviticus 19:12 “‘Do not swear falsely by my name and so profane the name of your God. I am the Lord.
Someone who was focused on obeying the spirit of this law would understand that its intent is for us not to swear falsely, whereas someone who was focused on obeying the letter of this law exactly how it was written would understand that we can swear falsely just as long as we don't do so in God's name, which incidentally is what Jesus was criticizing the Pharisees for doing in Matthew 5:33-37. In Matthew 23:23, Jesus said that justice, mercy, and faithfulness are weightier matters of the Mosaic Law, so it is intended to teach us how to express God's character traits. So obeying the Mosaic Law according to the letter undermines both the intent of what God has commanded His followers to do and why He has commanded us to do it, which therefore leads to death just as assuredly as refusing to submit to it.
Upvote
0
Soyeong
Well-Known Member
- Mar 10, 2015
- 12,433
- 4,605
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Single
Do you really think that Jesus was in disagreement with the Father? Rather, that was an example of Jesus acting in accordance with the law. There was no judge to pronounce a sentence (Deuteronomy 19:17-21), there was no man accused (Leviticus 20:10), he didn't have any witnesses to examine (Numbers 35:30, Deuteronomy 19:15), and he did not have a confession, so if he had condemned her, then he would have acted in violation of the law. Just a few verses later Jesus said that he judged no one (John 8:15) and he also said that he came not to judge (John 12:47), so he did not exercise authority as a magistrate and did not condemn her, but he did recognize her action as sin, and told her to go and sin no more.
Upvote
0
This is a really good sermon for those who really want to understand Romans, Galatians, Colossians. Understanding the New Covenant vs Old Covenant. Understanding statues, ceremonial laws and commandments. Understanding the differences between Moses laws vs Gods laws.
It's about 45 minutes, I highly recommend watching it.
It's about 45 minutes, I highly recommend watching it.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
Soyeong
Well-Known Member
- Mar 10, 2015
- 12,433
- 4,605
- Country
- United States
- Faith
- Messianic
- Marital Status
- Single
In Deuteronomy 4:2, it is a sin to add to or subtract from God's law, so you think that is what the Jerusalem Council was doing in Acts 15, then you should think that they sinned and needed to repent. Likewise, in Deuteronomy 13:4-5, the way that God instructed Hi people to determine that someone was a false prophet who was not speaking for him was if they taught against obeying His law, even if they performed signs and wonders, so God simply did not give His people any room to follow anyone teaching against obeying His law even if they claimed that their decision came from the Holy Spirit. The Spirit is not opposed to the Father, but rather the Spirit has the role of leading us to obey His law (Ezekiel 36:26-27) so someone teaching against against obeying God's law would be the clearest indication that they were not being led by the Spirit and that they should be rejected as being a false prophet.
In Acts 15:1, they were wanting to require all Gentiles to become circumcised in order to become justified, however, that was never the purpose for which God commanded circumcision, so the problem was that circumcision was being used for a man-made purpose that went above and beyond the purpose for which God commanded it. So the Jerusalem Council upheld God's law by correctly ruling against that requirement and a ruling against requiring something that God has never commanded should not be mistaken as being a ruling against obeying what God has commanded as if the Jerusalem Council had the authority to countermand God.
The way to worship God is through submitting to His commands, so obeying His command to rest on the Sabbath is itself an act of worship, though the point of resting from our work is to make time to dedicate to worshiping God.
Upvote
0
Similar threads
