Is commiting your life to Jesus works?

Charlie24 said:

And what does it mean when you sin and will not repent?

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Any believer who commits grievous sin and refuses to confess and forsake such a sin abides in spiritual death, or condemnation, or hellfire. If they repent, then they change their course and can abide in the Lord again and His salvation.

You said:

You are walking in the flesh without God.

This is what Paul was saying, those who commit such sins are not saved.

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Then how can you say that a believer can commit certain mortal sins and still be saved while committing those sins? How is that not teaching others (especially children) that God's grace is a license to sin?

You said:

The letter of Paul to the Galatians is concerning Law creeping into the church. Works of the flesh (Law, any kind of Law) will not inherit the kingdom of God.

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No, that's not what Paul said the works of the flesh are. Again, please go back and read Galatians 5:19. It says that the works of the flesh are adultery, fornication, etc.

Charlie24 said:

In Rom. 6:14 the word "sin" is used by Paul with a definite article. The definite article is "the" meaning "the sin" referring to the sin nature.

In other words, the sin nature will not have dominion over you.

"because you are not under the Law" if you walk in the Spirit you are not under the Law of works and the Holy Spirit can provide unending Grace to the believer.

Paul did not say we will have no sin, he said the sin will not have dominion over us.

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That does not fit the context, though.

Romans 6:16 says, “Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?”

Sin unto death is in reference to committing sin. Obedience unto righteousness is the polar opposite of that. So it appears you are just trying to change the Word of God to fit a belief you find more comforting.

Bible Highlighter said:

Well, the OT verses you quote are in reference to fellow Israelites and not pagan nations. God commanded to destroy the pagan nations and not to love them (i.e. their enemies). This runs contrary to the teachings of Jesus who told us to love our enemies, and to pray for them, and do good towards them. So things are not as you say. You simply don't want to admit the truth that Jesus taught differently than the Old Law. Why on Earth do you think Jesus said, “BUT I SAY UNTO YOU”? He is making a change. In fact, Hebrews 7:12 says that the Law has changed. But you don't like that truth so you either have to ignore it, or change such a truth.

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Heb. 7:12 is referring to the OT priesthood of Aaron performing animal sacrifices, but it had to give way to Jesus Christ the priest who was the real sacrifice for our sins.

The change in the Law is the change of animal sacrifice to faith in Christ now that He was sacrificed.

It has nothing to do with our conversation about Christ changing the Law concerning deeds and such.

Charlie24 said:

Heb. 7:12 is referring to the OT priesthood of Aaron performing animal sacrifices, but it had to give way to Jesus Christ the priest who was the real sacrifice for our sins.

The change in the Law is the change of animal sacrifice to faith in Christ now that He was sacrificed.

It has nothing to do with our conversation about Christ changing the Law concerning deeds and such.

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You are adding to His Word again. Hebrews 7:12 does not say a change of the Laws only pertaining to the priesthood only. It simply refers to the word “law” generically.

Charlie24 said:

Heb. 7:12 is referring to the OT priesthood of Aaron performing animal sacrifices, but it had to give way to Jesus Christ the priest who was the real sacrifice for our sins.

The change in the Law is the change of animal sacrifice to faith in Christ now that He was sacrificed.

It has nothing to do with our conversation about Christ changing the Law concerning deeds and such.

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Jesus referred to oath making in the sermon on the Mount, but Jesus said to not make any oaths at all (obviously referring to any oath besides the marriage covenant).

Charlie24 said:

Heb. 7:12 is referring to the OT priesthood of Aaron performing animal sacrifices, but it had to give way to Jesus Christ the priest who was the real sacrifice for our sins.

The change in the Law is the change of animal sacrifice to faith in Christ now that He was sacrificed.

It has nothing to do with our conversation about Christ changing the Law concerning deeds and such.

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You don't like what Hebrews 7:12 says, so you have to seek to change it to fit your belief. For Hebrews 7:12 says nothing about how this is in reference to the priesthood laws only and not other laws of God.

Bible Highlighter said:

That does not fit the context, though.

Romans 6:16 says, “Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?”

Sin unto death is in reference to committing sin. Obedience unto righteousness is the polar opposite of that. So it appears you are just trying to change the Word of God to fit a belief you find more comforting.

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I'm really growing weary of this BH. You believe whatever you choose. Let God be the Judge.

I really have more important things to do than going around in circles.

Charlie24 signing off!

Bible Highlighter said:

I don't see the two as a problem. Only you see there is a problem. What problem is there?

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How can you lose your salvation without sinning?

Charlie24 said:

I'm really growing weary of this BH. You believe whatever you choose.

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I am only showing you Scripture that refutes your belief.

You said:

Let God be the Judge.

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Indeed God will judge. He will judge us all according to His Word.

You said:

I really have more important things to do than going around in circles.

Charlie24 signing off!

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For me, preaching the Word and contending for the faith is really important to me because the Bible (God's Holy Word) tells me to do these things.

BNR32FAN said:

How can you lose your salvation without sinning?

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It is a loaded question. Of course I believe that a believer can lose salvation by commiting grievous or mortal sin. What's your point?

Bible Highlighter said:

There are several ways I believe that we can read the word “baptism” here in Romans 6. It can either refer to water baptism or Spirit baptism or both. Either way, the act of baptism is symbolic (or a parallel) of being planted in Christ's death (Romans 6:5). We are to know that the old man is crucified with Christ, so that the body of sin might destroyed and herein after we should not serve sin (Romans 6:6).

Romans 6:12 says, “Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.”

Romans 6:14 says, “For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.”

Romans 6:18 says,
“Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”

How can one be a servant to righteousness if they are still tempted to sin?
How can sin no longer have dominion over us if we are still tempted to sin?

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In verse 16 Paul says we are a servant of the one whom we serve.

“Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:16‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Paul is saying that you can be a servant of God one minute and a servant of satan the next. What you are doing determines who you are serving, that is the message here.

Sin no longer has dominion over us because now we have the ability to resist it. Before we could not resist sin but now we can. Hence we are no longer a slave to sin. He can’t possibly be saying that we are incapable of committing sin otherwise he wouldn’t be telling them not to sin. He wouldn’t be warning them if the consequences of sin if they are incapable of doing so.

Charlie24 said:

Heb. 7:12 is referring to the OT priesthood of Aaron performing animal sacrifices, but it had to give way to Jesus Christ the priest who was the real sacrifice for our sins.

The change in the Law is the change of animal sacrifice to faith in Christ now that He was sacrificed.

It has nothing to do with our conversation about Christ changing the Law concerning deeds and such.

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In fact, lets look at the context to show that you are not interpreting Hebrews 7:12 correctly.

Hebrews 7:11-12 KJV
[11] “If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
[12] For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.”

Verse 11 is clearly in reference to the 613 Laws of Moses. There is no mention of priesthood laws only in verse 11 in context. So Hebrews 7:12 is referring to a change of the Law in general here.

BNR32FAN said:

In verse 16 Paul says we are a servant of the one whom we serve.

“Do you not know that when you present yourselves to someone as slaves for obedience, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin resulting in death, or of obedience resulting in righteousness?”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:16‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Paul is saying that you can be a servant of God one minute and a servant of satan the next. What you are doing determines who you are serving, that is the message here.

Sin no longer has dominion over us because now we have the ability to resist it. Before we could not resist sin but now we can. Hence we are no longer a slave to sin. He can’t possibly be saying that we are incapable of committing sin otherwise he wouldn’t be telling them not to sin. He wouldn’t be warning them if the consequences of sin if they are incapable of doing so.

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You misunderstand what I was trying to say. Of course believers can struggle with sin. I am not denying that fact. Paul does refer of the possibility here. But Paul is saying there is a way to overcome mortal sin. It is crucifying the affections and lusts according to Galatians 5:24. It is the one who is dead to self or their old man who is freed from sin (Romans 6:7). How does one do that? By seeking God's help and applying His Holy Word to overcome.

Bible Highlighter said:

It is a loaded question. Of course I believe that a believer can lose salvation by commiting grievous or mortal sin. What's your point?

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It seems your saying that a believer I rendered dead to sin meaning they are incapable of sin but your also saying that a person can lose their salvation as a result of sin. Am I misunderstanding you brother because this seems like a direct contradiction.

BNR32FAN said:

It seems your saying that a believer I rendered dead to sin meaning they are incapable of sin but your also saying that a person can lose their salvation as a result of sin. Am I misunderstanding you brother because this seems like a direct contradiction.

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No. I am saying that a believer must reckon themselves dead to sin and be planted in the likeness of Christ's death in order to overcome mortal sin. They have to be dead to the old man and thus they will be freed from mortal sin. Some believers never do this because they think it is impossible. Other believers will not do this perfectly, but they will in time overcome mortal sin. 1 Peter 4:1-2 says that he that has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin (i.e. in the case of topic of discussion here, this would be mortal sin). Other believers simply fail and give back into sin because they love their sin more than God. Some will overcome, and others will not. It's not a contradiction. We learn in the “Parable of the Sower” that one seed totally rejected the Word, and two fell away, and one brought forth much fruit.

RDKirk said:

Behold, I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and eat with him, and he with me. -- Revelation 3:20

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This verse that people keep trying to making into a salvation verse. Is in verses that are being addressed to believers and is speaking about believers who need or is disciplined by Jesus. If they will repent He will again have fellowship with them.

Bible Highlighter said:

Abortion is murder of an unborn baby.
Murder is clearly condemned in the Bible in the New Testament.

Next?

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Not quite, considering scripture touches on the issue and doesn't call it "murder" or treat it as though it were even the accidental death of a person.

RDKirk said:

Not quite, considering scripture touches on the issue and doesn't call it "murder" or treat it as though it were even the accidental death of a person.

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JESUS CHRIST, A PERSON FROM CONCEPTION
For Christ to represent the human race, he had to come from Adam’s race (Gen. 3:15; John 1:1, 14; Heb. 2:14-17). Mary is treated as Jesus’s mother, not because she was a mere surrogate for the implanted embryo of Christ, but because it was her egg that was fertilized by God miraculously. The same process that you and I went through in embryonic stage onward to birth is the same process Jesus Christ went through. Yet, he was not conceived in iniquity like us because he was conceived sinless by his Father, the first person of the Trinity (2 Cor. 5:21; 1 Pet. 2:22; 1 John 3:5).

Before Jesus was conceived in Mary, her cousin Elizabeth became pregnant with John the Baptist. John was filled with the Holy Spirit from his mother’s womb (Luke 1:15, 41). An angel told Mary she would be pregnant by the Holy Spirit and that Elizabeth, her cousin, was already six months pregnant. Mary then hurried to see Elizabeth. Mary greeted her and John the Baptist jumped in Elizabeth’s womb (Luke 1:26-41).

“And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit, and she exclaimed with a loud cry, ‘Blessed are you among women, and blessed is the fruit of your womb! And why is this granted to me that the mother of my Lord should come to me? For behold, when the sound of your greeting came to my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy. And blessed is she who believed that there would be a fulfillment of what was spoken to her from the Lord’” (Luke 1:42-45).

It had only been a few days or a few weeks since Mary had become pregnant. She was still very early in the first trimester, and it’s even possible that the embryo had not even attached to the uteran wall yet, a process that takes 6-10 days. Based on what Elizabeth said to Mary, Mary was already pregnant when she entered the room. Elizabeth referred to Mary’s embryo as tou kuriou—the Lord.

John the Baptist, filled with the Spirit while in the womb, jumped for joy due to his Lord and Savior entering the room as a divine person united with a human embryo (the God-Man). Remember, natures do not subsist in themselves; they subsist in persons. God the Son had already united with his human nature at conception, for Elizabeth called him “the Lord.” God the Son did not unite with a mere “fetus” or a mere “clump of cells.” That would mean there are two incarnations, God the Son Clump of Cells and God the Son Incarnate, which adds a heretical “nature” to Christ in addition to his full humanity and full deity.

Clumps of cells do not need saviors for they do not and cannot sin; only persons are sinners and only persons sin. Therefore, God the Son united with a human nature, embryo (body) and soul, not an inhuman clump of cells. John the Baptist did not leap over what Mary’s “fetus” would become; he jumped for joy over what her embryo already was—God the Son incarnate.

Jesus Christ’s human nature subsisted in his divine Person from conception. David was also a person in his mother’s womb.

KING DAVID, A PERSON FROM CONCEPTION
In Psalm 139:13-16, David wrote,

“For you formed my inward parts; you knitted me together in my mother’s womb. I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made. Wonderful are your works; my soul knows it very well. My frame was not hidden from you, when I was being made in secret, intricately woven in the depths of the earth. Your eyes saw my unformed substance (golem); in your book were written, every one of them, the days that were formed for me, when as yet there was none of them.”

The Hebrew word golem (translated “unformed substance”) used in verse 16 is probably the only direct reference to a human embryo in all of Scripture. Notice that neither God nor David treats David in the womb as a mere fetus—a clump of cells that may become human one day. David refers to himself in the womb as “Me” and “I” in verses 13, 14, and 15. Even as a human embryo being formed by God, David says he was being fearfully and wonderfully made. The fertilized egg (embryo), is being “fearfully and wonderfully made” as much as the full-term baby before birth. In the words of Voddie Baucham, the only differences between a baby in the womb and a baby outside the womb are age and location.

Again, as referenced earlier, one only needs a body and soul on earth in order to be a human nature subsisting in a human person. David possessed a body and soul from conception onward, and he referred to himself as a person—an “I” or “me.” David, an adult human person wrote that passage and referred to himself in the womb as himself, not as something less than himself, as something less than a human person.

Furthermore, consider what David wrote in Psalm 51:3-6:

“For I know my transgressions, and my sin is ever before me. Against you, you only, have I sinned and done what is evil in your sight, so that you may be justified in your words and blameless in your judgment. Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me. Behold, you delight in truth in the inward being, and you teach me wisdom in the secret heart.”

David was conceived in iniquity. He refers to himself as “me.” Again, the reality is that clumps of cells did not sin, nor are they held accountable for sin. Human persons sin; human persons are sinners and are held accountable for sin. Jesus did not die for clumps of cells; he died for sinners, for human persons.

ABORTION IS MURDER
For the reasons outlined above, we may conclude that human personhood—human life—begins at conception. This means that abortion is the murder of human persons.

Article source:
The Bible is clear: abortion is murder and needs to be stopped — Southern Equip

Bible Highlighter said:

ABORTION IS MURDER
For the reasons outlined above, we may conclude that human personhood—human life—begins at conception. This means that abortion is the murder of human persons.

Article source:
The Bible is clear: abortion is murder and needs to be stopped — Southern Equip

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Sorry, but you are hoisted by your own petard. You said:

Bible Highlighter said:

One can only be condemned by the sins that the Bible mentions as the actual kind of sins that are attached with warnings of hellfire and or spiritual condemnation in the afterlife. If not, then one is adding to God's Holy Word.

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You cannot quote the Bible actually mentioning either that abortion is "the actual kind of sins that are attached with warnings of hellfire and or spiritual condemnation in the afterlife," nor can you quote the Bible actually treating the death of a fetus as either an accidental death or an intentional death.

Instead, you are adding to God's Holy Word by drawing a second-level conclusion that suits your purposes.

The basic error is that your concept of sin is too narrow. Of course, you must make it so narrow in order to believe that you never commit sin.

RDKirk said:

Sorry, but you are hoisted by your own petard. You said:



You cannot quote the Bible actually mentioning either that abortion is "the actual kind of sins that are attached with warnings of hellfire and or spiritual condemnation in the afterlife," nor can you quote the Bible actually treating the death of a fetus as either an accidental death or an intentional death.

Instead, you are adding to God's Holy Word by drawing a second-level conclusion that suits your purposes.

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Not sure how you have my name connected to that comment but i did not make that statement.

So if you could correct this please do.