Is commiting your life to Jesus works?

RDKirk said:

RDKirk said: ↑
I think you must hold an extremely narrow definition of "sin."

Yeah, that's what I figured.

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

I am saying that a Christian can reach a place where this can happen. Why? Well, it's what the Bible says if we believe our Bible in what it says over our own experience. For faith comes by hearing the Word of God. Faith is not what we see but it is in the Word despite our experience, emotions, sight, etc.

Click to expand...

Charlie24 said:

The commandments of Christ are the reinforcement of the Law!

Click to expand...

You said:

Paul is not only referring to the Law of Moses, he is referring to the commandments of Christ, and any other man made law that you can invent.

Law, whatever it may be is of works, period! It is walking in the flesh!

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

I don’t know why your implying that my position is coming from personal observation when I specifically pointed out the warnings in scripture. You have to take into consideration the implications of those warnings.

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

Amen we are given the ability to walk in the Spirit not guaranteed to.

Click to expand...

Charlie24 said:

Yes, I agree! I have found in my walk with the Lord, I have not always yielded myself to His will. Even though my faith in Christ was intact, and I was saved, I failed, but I learned from those mistakes. This is our sanctification process that brings us closer to Christ, we learn from our mistakes.

It's His wonderful Grace that sustains in the moments of failure, thank God He doesn't cast away, but is there all along ready to carry us on to the finish line.

He is a wonderful God, full of Grace and Mercy.

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

Stop and think for a moment. If a person crucified the affections and lusts, then how can they then be tempted by them? They would be crucified and buried. If one is dead and freed from sin according to Romans 6:7 then how can they be tempted if they are dead and freed from sin? It makes no sense if what you believe is true.

Only experience or an outside belief will teach contrary to these truths in Scripture.

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

Stop and think for a moment. If a person crucified the affections and lusts, then how can they then be tempted by them? They would be crucified and buried. If one is dead and freed from sin according to Romans 6:7 then how can they be tempted if they are dead and freed from sin? It makes no sense if what you believe is true.

Only experience or an outside belief will teach contrary to these truths in Scripture.

Click to expand...

Charlie24 said:

Yes, I agree! I have found in my walk with the Lord, I have not always yielded myself to His will. Even though my faith in Christ was intact, and I was saved, I failed, but I learned from those mistakes. This is our sanctification process that brings us closer to Christ, we learn from our mistakes.

It's His wonderful Grace that sustains in the moments of failure, thank God He doesn't cast away, but is there all along ready to carry us on to the finish line.

He is a wonderful God, full of Grace and Mercy.

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

No. Jesus was making changes to the Law (even before the New Covenant went officially into effect with His death). For Jesus was primarily teaching New Covenant teachings and not Old Covenant teachings during His earthly ministry.

How so?

Jesus clearly was making changes to the Law (even before the cross):
(Which means He was not teaching primarily Old Covenant, but New Covenant):

The Old Way says:
"Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth"
(Matthew 5:38 cf. Exodus 21:23-25).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also." (Matthew 5:39).


The Old Way says:
"Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment" (Matthew 5:21 cf. Numbers 35:30-32).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire." (Matthew 5:22).


The Old Way says:
"Again, ye have heard that it hath been said by them of old time, Thou shalt not forswear thyself, but shalt perform unto the Lord thine oaths:" (Matthew 5:34 cf. Numbers 30:1-2, Deuteronomy 23:21).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
34 "But I say unto you, Swear not at all; neither by heaven; for it is God's throne:
35 Nor by the earth; for it is his footstool: neither by Jerusalem; for it is the city of the great King.
36 Neither shalt thou swear by thy head, because thou canst not make one hair white or black.
37 But let your communication be, Yea, yea; Nay, nay: for whatsoever is more than these cometh of evil." (Matthew 5:34-37).


The Old Way says:
"And of thy mercy cut off mine enemies, and destroy all them that afflict my soul: for I am thy servant." (Psalms 143:12).

"And the city shall be accursed, even it, and all that are therein, to the LORD: only Rahab the harlot shall live, she and all that are with her in the house, because she hid the messengers that we sent." (Joshua 6:17).

"And they utterly destroyed all that was in the city, both man and woman, young and old, and ox, and sheep, and ass, with the edge of the sword." (Joshua 6:21).

16 "But of the cities of these people, which the LORD thy God doth give thee for an inheritance, thou shalt save alive nothing that breatheth:
17 But thou shalt utterly destroy them; namely, the Hittites, and the Amorites, the Canaanites, and the Perizzites, the Hivites, and the Jebusites; as the LORD thy God hath commanded thee" (Deuteronomy 20:16-17).

"They did not destroy the nations, concerning whom the LORD commanded them" (Psalms 106:34).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" (Matthew 5:44).

Note: Yes, I am aware that the Old Way (Old Testament) also teaches to love one's enemies (Exodus 23:4-5) (Proverbs 25:21), but this was in context to their own Israelite people, and not pagan nations. Pagan nations were to be destroyed when God commanded the Israelites to destroy them. But Jesus taught a radically different way. Love your enemies, and do good to them that hate you, and to pray for those who persecute you.


The Old Way says:
20 "But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:
21 Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die: because she hath wrought folly in Israel, to play the harlot in her father's house: so shalt thou put evil away from among you.
22 If a man be found lying with a woman married to an husband, then they shall both of them die, both the man that lay with the woman, and the woman: so shalt thou put away evil from Israel." (Deuteronomy 22:20-22).

4 "They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.
5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?" (John 8:4-5).

The New Way (by Jesus) says:
"He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. " (John 8:7).


Even after the cross, there were changes being made:

The Old Covenant says this about circumcision:
"And the uncircumcised man child whose flesh of his foreskin is not circumcised, that soul shall be cut off from his people; he hath broken my covenant." (Genesis 17:14).

Yet, the New Covenant says this about circumcision:
"Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing."
(Galatians 5:2).


The Old Covenant says this about the Sabbath:
32 "And while the children of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man that gathered sticks upon the sabbath day.
33 And they that found him gathering sticks brought him unto Moses and Aaron, and unto all the congregation.
34 And they put him in ward, because it was not declared what should be done to him.
35 And the Lord said unto Moses, The man shall be surely put to death: all the congregation shall stone him with stones without the camp.
36 And all the congregation brought him without the camp, and stoned him with stones, and he died; as the Lord commanded Moses." (Numbers 15:32-36).

Yet, the New Covenant says this about the Sabbath:
"Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:" (Colossians 2:16).

So it appears things have changed.

This makes sense because again, Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed.

"For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law."
(Hebrews 7:12).

“For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.”
(John 1:17).

Jesus said,
"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil." (Matthew 5:17).

Jesus came not to abolish the Law (in the sense of destroying all forms of Law), but Jesus came to fulfill the Law (i.e. to nail to the cross those ordinances that were against us [like the Old Covenant ceremonial laws], and Jesus came to give us a more fulfilled and perfect way of obeying God via the commands that come directly from Him and His followers). For Jesus offered a more perfect way of loving God, and loving our neighbor (Which of course is only possible via if we are first saved by God's grace through faith).



Where is the Biblical proof that Paul was talking about the commandments of Jesus?
You do realize that if Paul did speak against the words of Jesus Christ, then Paul would be condemning himself by his very own words.

Behold, it is written:

“If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness; He is proud, knowing nothing,” (1 Timothy 6:3-4).

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

He won’t cast away those who continue to come to Him. The Greek word translated to “comes or cometh” in John 6:37 is only used in the present and imperfect tense which means He won’t cast out those who presently or continuously come to Him. John 15:2 Jesus says that The Father cuts off every branch that does not bear fruit. Much like Jesus’ message in Luke 13:6-9.

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

The Word of God says otherwise because if we commit such sins that Paul mentions in Galatians 5:19-21, and we do not confess and forsake them, then we will not inherit the kingdom of God. This includes even me. For I am not above God's Word anymore than you are.

The heart of the problem is teaching that one can commit mortal sin and still be saved. The Bible and basic morality does not endorse such a teaching. God is holy, and good and He cannot agree with grievous sin that He Himself condemns.

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

I know for a fact that you don’t subscribe to eternal security so how can you refute eternal security while at the same time say that Christians can’t be tempted to sin?

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

That's great, but you have not disproven what I said with anything in the Bible.

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

“Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life.

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:4, 12‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Click to expand...

RDKirk said:

Abortion is not a sin by your definition.

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

“Therefore we have been buried with Him through baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, so we too might walk in newness of life.

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its lusts,”
‭‭Romans‬ ‭6:4, 12‬ ‭NASB‬‬

Click to expand...

BNR32FAN said:

He won’t cast away those who continue to come to Him. The Greek word translated to “comes or cometh” in John 6:37 is only used in the present and imperfect tense which means He won’t cast out those who presently or continuously come to Him. John 15:2 Jesus says that The Father cuts off every branch that does not bear fruit. Much like Jesus’ message in Luke 13:6-9.

Click to expand...

Charlie24 said:

Let's take your first example, eye for an eye, tooth for a tooth.

Did not God say, "You shall not hate your brother in your heart, you shall in any wise rebuke your neighbor, and not suffer sin upon him.

You shall not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself, I am the Lord." Lev. 19: 17-18.

This sounds to be in complete contradiction to the verses you gave, but it's not.

God said it before Jesus did. This is Jesus clarifying what the Law really meant, the deeper understanding of the Law.

God said, vengeance is mine, I shall repay.

This is the same thing that Jesus taught. There was no changing of the Law, just further understanding given.

I can go on and on with these verses you provided.

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

There are several ways I believe that we can read the word “baptism” here in Romans 6. It can either refer to water baptism or Spirit baptism or both. Either way, the act of baptism is symbolic (or a parallel) of being planted in Christ's death (Romans 6:5). We are to know that the old man is crucified with Christ, so that the body of sin might destroyed and herein after we should not serve sin (Romans 6:6).

Romans 6:12 says, “Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.”

Romans 6:14 says, “For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.”

Romans 6:18 says,
“Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”

How can one be a servant to righteousness if they are still tempted to sin?
How can sin no longer have dominion over us if we are still tempted to sin?

Click to expand...

Bible Highlighter said:

There are several ways I believe that we can read the word “baptism” here in Romans 6. It can either refer to water baptism or Spirit baptism or both. Either way, the act of baptism is symbolic (or a parallel) of being planted in Christ's death (Romans 6:5). We are to know that the old man is crucified with Christ, so that the body of sin might destroyed and herein after we should not serve sin (Romans 6:6).

Romans 6:12 says, “Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof.”

Romans 6:14 says, “For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.”

Romans 6:18 says,
“Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.”

How can one be a servant to righteousness if they are still tempted to sin?
How can sin no longer have dominion over us if we are still tempted to sin?

Click to expand...