Can you help me with how this is supposed to work...

Questioning Brother · Sep 18, 2020

God through action (being the direct cause) or inaction (not intervening to prevent) destroys almost everything I care about having.
God does nothing ( again action/inaction) to help me while I beg for help.
God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care.
And somehow this is supposed to make me love and trust him.

can anyone explain how this is supposed to work?

GOD Shines Forth! · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
can anyone explain how this is supposed to work?

Sure.

The righteous shall live by faith.

"Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see."--Hebrews 11:1

Tone · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care.

Can you elaborate here?

Thanks and shalom!

xaris · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
God through action (being the direct cause) or inaction (not intervening to prevent) destroys almost everything I care about having.
God does nothing ( again action/inaction) to help me while I beg for help.
God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care.
And somehow this is supposed to make me love and trust him.

can anyone explain how this is supposed to work?

Maybe you should get it all out of your system and just scream at Him, telling Him how much you hate Him.
IOW, Be honest to Him about your doubts.

Aussie Pete · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
God through action (being the direct cause) or inaction (not intervening to prevent) destroys almost everything I care about having.
God does nothing ( again action/inaction) to help me while I beg for help.
God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care.
And somehow this is supposed to make me love and trust him.

can anyone explain how this is supposed to work?

First thing to do is quit blaming God for everything that you perceive to be wrong in your life. There are spiritual principles, one of which is the law of sowing and reaping. God is not going to do anything against His nature and character. So don't be surprised if He answers your prayers in ways that you do not like. His answers are invariably, "Yes, No or Wait".
"God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care." I don't know what you mean by this. However, we are exhorted to seek God's Kingdom first and foremost.
God is good. He is not unfair or unjust. There is another being who is unfair, unjust and is the Destroyer. I hope you are not attributing Satan's works to God. That is not the way to gain God's blessing and favour.

St_Worm2 · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
God does nothing ( again action/inaction) to help me while I beg for help.
God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care.
And somehow this is supposed to make me love and trust him.
can anyone explain how this is supposed to work?

Hello Questioning Brother, along with @Tone, it may help me give you a better answer if you would elaborate a bit about the "spiritual things" that God continues to pile on you (what you mean/what these "spiritual things" are, etc.).

As for some of the rest, if the GREAT love that God has ~already~ shown you (by sending His Son here as a man to die in your stead on the Cross .. e.g. Romans 5:8-10) is not enough of a reason for you to love Him and trust Him, with your life (on this side of the grave) and with your future (in the age to come), then I'm not certain what else will!

You didn't tell us what God is withholding from you, but I can assure you that, as His child, whatever He is doing in regards to you is for your greatest good .. Romans 8:28, 32, even if it doesn't feel like it is right now. He often withholds things from us that He knows will not be good for us (even though we may fully believe otherwise), or He withholds them for a time, until He knows that we are ready to receive them.

He remains jealous for your love & for your devotion to Him alone, not for His good, but for yours :preach:

So, if you want to learn to trust Him, this is the perfect opportunity for you to do so ("accept and trust" as my signature line graphic says). Delight yourself in the Lord, and surrender to Him whatever this thing is that you want Him to provide you with, knowing that as a Christian, He alone is your portion (trusting that He will give you your heart's desire in His perfect timing .. unless He knows of a blessing that is greater still, greater perhaps than you could have ever imagined .. cf Psalm 37:4.

Trust Him

God bless you!

--David

Melody Suttles · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
God through action (being the direct cause) or inaction (not intervening to prevent) destroys almost everything I care about having.
God does nothing ( again action/inaction) to help me while I beg for help.
God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care.
And somehow this is supposed to make me love and trust him.

can anyone explain how this is supposed to work?

You're troubled, so you pray. You're distressed, so you cry for God to bring you quick relief. But all you hear in reply is silence--a silence so deafening it drowns out every thought but this: God isn't listening.

I have found, both in Scripture and experience, that those who seem to suffer more trials than others in their walk as believers - they are the ones called to do something greater. And the trials are meant as a means of shaping character - of producing a battle-scarred warrior who can take anything thrown at him - If he trusts God and does not lose faith while he goes through the fire - the hurt - the confusion - and the anger - eventually the boot-camp fiery trial will end. The Lord will richly bless this man, and the man will find that he can stand and not fall - and not be moved.

King David experienced distress many many times in his lifetime, and he cried for God to act: Have mercy on me, Lord, for I am faint; heal me, Lord, for my bones are in agony. My soul is in deep anguish. How long, Lord, how long? (Psalm 6:2-3) Will the Lord reject forever? And will He never be favorable again? Has His lovingkindness ceased forever? Has His promise come to an end forever? Has God forgotten to be gracious, or has He in anger withdrawn His compassion (Psalm 77:7-9)? "O God, do not remain quiet; do not be silent and, O God, do not be still (Psalm 83:1)".

More than a thousand years later, Peter understood the joy that comes when a believer has remained steadfast through difficult trials ...

"There is wonderful joy ahead, even though you must endure many trials for a little while. 7 These trials will show that your faith is genuine. It is being tested as fire tests and purifies gold—though your faith is far more precious than mere gold. So when your faith remains strong through many trials, it will bring you much praise and glory and honor on the day when Jesus Christ is revealed to the whole world." (1 Peter 1:6-7)

Paul even included a list of his sufferings - just to make the point that nothing would ever shake his love and faith even when it seemed God was nowhere or just didn't care ....

"I have worked harder, been put in prison more often, been whipped times without number, and faced death again and again. 24 Five different times the Jewish leaders gave me thirty-nine lashes. 25 Three times I was beaten with rods. Once I was stoned. Three times I was shipwrecked. Once I spent a whole night and a day adrift at sea. 26 I have traveled on many long journeys. I have faced danger from rivers and from robbers. I have faced danger from my own people, the Jews, as well as from the Gentiles. I have faced danger in the cities, in the deserts, and on the seas. And I have faced danger from men who claim to be believers but are not. 27 I have worked hard and long, enduring many sleepless nights. I have been hungry and thirsty and have often gone without food. I have shivered in the cold, without enough clothing to keep me warm.
28 Then, besides all this, I have the daily burden of my concern for all the churches. 29 Who is weak without my feeling that weakness? Who is led astray, and I do not burn with anger?
30 If I must boast, I would rather boast about the things that show how weak I am. 31 God, the Father of our Lord Jesus, who is worthy of eternal praise, knows I am not lying."
(1 Cor 11: 26-31)

"I don’t want anyone to give me credit beyond what they can see in my life or hear in my message, 7 even though I have received such wonderful revelations from God. So to keep me from becoming proud, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger from Satan to torment me and keep me from becoming proud.
8 Three different times I begged the Lord to take it away. 9 Each time he said, “My grace is all you need. My power works best in weakness.” So now I am glad to boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ can work through me. 10 That’s why I take pleasure in my weaknesses, and in the insults, hardships, persecutions, and troubles that I suffer for Christ. For when I am weak, then I am strong." (1 Cor 12:6-10)

Questioning Brother · Sep 19, 2020

xaris said:
Maybe you should get it all out of your system and just scream at Him, telling Him how much you hate Him.
IOW, Be honest to Him about your doubts.

Been there done that.

Aussie Pete said:
First thing to do is quit blaming God for everything that you perceive to be wrong in your life. There are spiritual principles, one of which is the law of sowing and reaping. God is not going to do anything against His nature and character. So don't be surprised if He answers your prayers in ways that you do not like. His answers are invariably, "Yes, No or Wait".
"God continues to pile spiritual things on me despite the fact that I don’t care." I don't know what you mean by this. However, we are exhorted to seek God's Kingdom first and foremost.
God is good. He is not unfair or unjust. There is another being who is unfair, unjust and is the Destroyer. I hope you are not attributing Satan's works to God. That is not the way to gain God's blessing and favour.

Hat I mean is I don’t care about any of the spiritual things any more. He can keep all of that.
As for blame, I am not sure if he is the cause, but in any case he has damned sure not prevented the destruction.

St_Worm2 said:
Hello Questioning Brother, along with @Tone, it may help me give you a better answer if you would elaborate a bit about the "spiritual things" that God continues to pile on you (what you mean/what these "spiritual things" are, etc.).

As for some of the rest, if the GREAT love that God has ~already~ shown you (by sending His Son here as a man to die in your stead on the Cross .. e.g. Romans 5:8-10) is not enough of a reason for you to love Him and trust Him, with your life (on this side of the grave) and with your future (in the age to come), then I'm not certain what else will!

You didn't tell us what God is withholding from you, but I can assure you that, as His child, whatever He is doing in regards to you is for your greatest good .. Romans 8:28, 32, even if it doesn't feel like it is right now. He often withholds things from us that He knows will not be good for us (even though we may fully believe otherwise), or He withholds them for a time, until He knows that we are ready to receive them.

He remains jealous for your love & for your devotion to Him alone, not for His good, but for yours

So, if you want to learn to trust Him, this is the perfect opportunity for you to do so ("accept and trust" as my signature line graphic says). Delight yourself in the Lord, and surrender to Him whatever this thing is that you want Him to provide you with, knowing that as a Christian, He alone is your portion (trusting that He will give you your heart's desire in His perfect timing .. unless He knows of a blessing that is greater still, greater perhaps than you could have ever imagined .. cf Psalm 37:4.

Trust Him

God bless you!

--David

Well the main thing being withheld is the healing for my wife(age 51, multiple strokes, slowly declining). I no longer care what his purpose for this is. He has already screwed over my heart’s desire. My heart’s desire was a easy and mostly painless life. I modified it to removal of the painful situations I am currently going through, but He has no interest in that.

Questioning Brother · Sep 19, 2020

Melody Suttles said:
You're troubled, so you pray. You're distressed, so you cry for God to bring you quick relief. But all you hear in reply is silence--a silence so deafening it drowns out every thought but this: God isn't listening.

I have found, both in Scripture and experience, that those who seem to suffer more trials than others in their walk as believers - they are the ones called to do something greater. And the trials are meant as a means of shaping character - of producing a battle-scarred warrior who can take anything thrown at him - If he trusts God and does not lose faith while he goes through the fire - the hurt - the confusion - and the anger - eventually the boot-camp fiery trial will end. The Lord will richly bless this man, and the man will find that he can stand and not fall - and not be moved.

King David experienced distress many many times in his lifetime, and he cried for God to act: Have mercy on me, Lord, for I am faint; heal me, Lord, for my bones are in agony. My soul is in deep anguish. How long, Lord, how long? (Psalm 6:2-3) Will the Lord reject forever? And will He never be favorable again? Has His lovingkindness ceased forever? Has His promise come to an end forever? Has God forgotten to be gracious, or has He in anger withdrawn His compassion (Psalm 77:7-9)? "O God, do not remain quiet; do not be silent and, O God, do not be still (Psalm 83:1)".

More than a thousand years later, Peter understood the joy that comes when a believer has remained steadfast through difficult trials ...

"There is wonderful joy ahead, even though you must endure many trials for a little while. 7 These trials will show that your faith is genuine. It is being tested as fire tests and purifies gold—though your faith is far more precious than mere gold. So when your faith remains strong through many trials, it will bring you much praise and glory and honor on the day when Jesus Christ is revealed to the whole world." (1 Peter 1:6-7)

Paul even included a list of his sufferings - just to make the point that nothing would ever shake his love and faith even when it seemed God was nowhere or just didn't care ....

"I have worked harder, been put in prison more often, been whipped times without number, and faced death again and again. 24 Five different times the Jewish leaders gave me thirty-nine lashes. 25 Three times I was beaten with rods. Once I was stoned. Three times I was shipwrecked. Once I spent a whole night and a day adrift at sea. 26 I have traveled on many long journeys. I have faced danger from rivers and from robbers. I have faced danger from my own people, the Jews, as well as from the Gentiles. I have faced danger in the cities, in the deserts, and on the seas. And I have faced danger from men who claim to be believers but are not. 27 I have worked hard and long, enduring many sleepless nights. I have been hungry and thirsty and have often gone without food. I have shivered in the cold, without enough clothing to keep me warm.
28 Then, besides all this, I have the daily burden of my concern for all the churches. 29 Who is weak without my feeling that weakness? Who is led astray, and I do not burn with anger?
30 If I must boast, I would rather boast about the things that show how weak I am. 31 God, the Father of our Lord Jesus, who is worthy of eternal praise, knows I am not lying."
(1 Cor 11: 26-31)

"I don’t want anyone to give me credit beyond what they can see in my life or hear in my message, 7 even though I have received such wonderful revelations from God. So to keep me from becoming proud, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger from Satan to torment me and keep me from becoming proud.
8 Three different times I begged the Lord to take it away. 9 Each time he said, “My grace is all you need. My power works best in weakness.” So now I am glad to boast about my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ can work through me. 10 That’s why I take pleasure in my weaknesses, and in the insults, hardships, persecutions, and troubles that I suffer for Christ. For when I am weak, then I am strong." (1 Cor 12:6-10)

I am not that warrior nor do I have ANY desire to be. I see a lot about what happens when one endures. I am not David, Paul, or Job. I can’t endure this AND have faith that God cares. I also oppositely echo Paul’s sentiment of the sufferings we go through here not comparing to what awaits us. To me, it is VERY close now to not being near enough to make up for this pain. I continue to seek God’s help for the problems for one reason: there is no possibility of help from another source. If I didn’t know that firmly, I would drop Him and his inaction for the other source in less than a heartbeat.

paul1149 · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
God through action (being the direct cause) or inaction (not intervening to prevent) destroys almost everything I care about having.

God gets blamed for just about everything down here by a lot of people. He didn't cause our problems - He warned Adam not to sin - but why does He allow it? He has created and offered salvation and restoration through Jesus Christ at great Cost, and now it's up to us to come up to a standard of faith. The promises of God are obtained that way - through faith, perseverance, and patience.

God is not a genie who grants our every wish. We are called to be co-laborers with Him, making His will manifest on the earth. Our wishes will be tested in the fires of holiness, and sometimes the path to their realization is not short or straightforward. Indeed, the path seems designed to require the aforementioned faith and patience. See the lives of Joseph and David.

Cry out to God when you feel the need, but there is a time to believe you have been heard and God is working. It's the prayer of faith that saves.

Questioning Brother · Sep 19, 2020

I never wanted to be Joseph. I wanted to be Potiphar when Joseph was arriving him. His entire worry about life was basically what did he want for dinner.

Friedrich Rubinstein · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
He has already screwed over my heart’s desire. My heart’s desire was a easy and mostly painless life.

You will never have an easy, painless life as a Christian. When Corrie ten Boom preached the gospel and people decided to accept Jesus as Lord, she warned them and said "Don't expect life to become any easier, it is going to be much harder than before".
As Christians we are constantly attacked by the evil powers in this world, and only those who love and trust God in the first place will and can endure to the end. Being a Christian won't result in trusting God - trusting God will result in becoming a Christian!

As a Christian you agree to God being your father. He will chasten you, whether you like it or not. The Bible says
"My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline, and do not lose heart when he rebukes you, because the Lord disciplines the one he loves, and he chastens everyone he accepts as his son.
Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as his children. For what children are not disciplined by their father? If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all." - Hebrews 12:5-8

If you are God's child you will be disciplined, and God will teach you enough lessons "to be conformed to the image of his Son" (Romans 8:29).

The purpose of being God's child is to conformed to the image of Jesus Christ, and if you say "I don't care about the spiritual things anymore" then you're trying to resist the whole purpose of being a Christian. In that case you'd be better off without God.
As long as you want to believe in God to "have an easy, painless life", not caring about anything else, God will have no reason to bless you.

Tone · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
Well the main thing being withheld is the healing for my wife(age 51, multiple strokes, slowly declining). I no longer care what his purpose for this is. He has already screwed over my heart’s desire. My heart’s desire was a easy and mostly painless life. I modified it to removal of the painful situations I am currently going through, but He has no interest in that.

These are spiritual things that you don't care about?

Are you saying that you recognize these trials as lessons of some sort, but you don't care to learn them?

Ahermit · Sep 19, 2020

Acceptance is key.
There is no serenity, and clarity of mind (seeing the truth of the matter) without unconditional acceptance.

com7fy8 · Sep 19, 2020

Satan is the one who comes to rob and destroy and steal. Often, when I first wake up, all kinds of horrible things come to mind about how I am not with God and my companion is going to break down and die, and others are not going to obey God and therefore they will reject me.

So, I don't listen to any of it. But I be quiet and wait for God to do whatsoever He pleases with me. And then if anything isn't in His peace, I don't trust that.

And then I do what I can do. But my companion seems like she can just not do things she has been advised to do. Then comes medical trouble and she cries and goes to a doctor, but then does not do what she is told . . . or more or less. So, I trust God to guide her and take care of her however He pleases.

And surely I myself need correction. So, here I am . . . for whatever real correction I need from God.

Or else, how can we be taken care of by God, if we do not obey how He takes care of us?

lolololololololol

Questioning Brother · Sep 19, 2020

Tone said:
These are spiritual things that you don't care about?

Are you saying that you recognize these trials as lessons of some sort, but you don't care to learn them?

No, that was the answer to what was being withheld. And yes if this is a lesson I refuse to participate. The only thing I am learning in this is Gods cannot be trusted and he doesn’t care.

Tone · Sep 19, 2020

Questioning Brother said:
No, that was the answer to what was being withheld. And yes if this is a lesson I refuse to participate. The only thing I am learning in this is Gods cannot be trusted and he doesn’t care.

If He didn't care, there would be no lessons.

If there are no more lessons, we are full-grown.

Why would He want us to be full-grown?

Questioning Brother · Sep 19, 2020

com7fy8 said:
Satan is the one who comes to rob and destroy and steal. Often, when I first wake up, all kinds of horrible things come to mind about how I am not with God and my companion is going to break down and die, and others are not going to obey God and therefore they will reject me.

So, I don't listen to any of it. But I be quiet and wait for God to do whatsoever He pleases with me. And then if anything isn't in His peace, I don't trust that.

And then I do what I can do. But my companion seems like she can just not do things she has been advised to do. Then comes medical trouble and she cries and goes to a doctor, but then does not do what she is told . . . or more or less. So, I trust God to guide her and take care of her however He pleases.

And surely I myself need correction. So, here I am . . . for whatever real correction I need from God.

Or else, how can we be taken care of by God, if we do not obey how He takes care of us? lolololololololol

1) The breakdown is not a thought. It is happening. She is half paralyzed, has to have a feeding tube to eat, and more and more I can see her mind slipping away. I am not praying against some possibility in the future. I am praying and begging Him to help in my present. He is ignoring me. He is doing nothing to help.
2) ok, Satan did the destroying. God didn’t stop it. Doesn’t matter, whoever did the destroying, same effect.

Questioning Brother · Sep 19, 2020

Tone said:
If He didn't care, there would be no lessons.

If there are no more lessons, we are full-grown.

Why would He want us to be full-grown?

The lack of care IS the lesson.

Tone · Sep 19, 2020

Abba Yah please Breathe Your Holy Breath into this Body and raise us up in Yahshua ha Mashiach, that we may be seated in the heavenly places in comfort and rest. Amen.

Can you help me with how this is supposed to work...

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Simul Justus et Peccator

SingPeace

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

that your faith might rest in the power of God

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

"Whenever Thou humblest me, Thou makest me great."

Similar threads