Climate Change 'skeptic' chosen to lead NOAA

essentialsaltes said:

....But the evidence shows you're mistaken about what 'all the scientists' were saying....

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ISteveB said:

So far, you haven't actually provided evidence of this....

God has made it demonstrable that the earth has feedback loops which when the ground gets too hot, rain clouds form, and it rains....

As I live in a desert myself, western Nevada (aka, the Great Basin).... we can use it. We haven't withered away yet.

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essentialsaltes said:

I know it is billions of years old.

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Nithavela said:

Heres some evidence for you to ignore:

National Climate Assessment: Great Plains’ Ogallala Aquifer drying out | NOAA Climate.gov

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ISteveB said:

So.....50 years of information, for a planet that is billions of years old is turning the entire world on its head, and supposed to be accepted as fact for the entire world?

have you done the math on that?
50/4,500,000,000.....
what's the percentage for that number?
0.000001111%
Thanks... I'm not buying it.

I'd be far more likely to buy a 6,000 year old earth, because then the percentage would be 0.833%.
Still nowhere near enough time to bother me, but a LOT better than 0.0000011%.

Thanks though.

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ISteveB said:

Well that was easier than I thought it'd be..... Your article states---

But according to the Fourth National Climate Assessment (NCA4), producers are extracting water faster than it is being replenished, which means that parts of the Ogallala Aquifer should be considered a nonrenewable resource.​

This is not a climate change issue--- this is a demand issue. An abuse of resources issue.
We've had this same problem here in Nevada for decades. Our aquifer has been dimished for years.
So.... I see nothing about climate issues here. I see a supply and demand issue.

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Akita Suggagaki said:

What kind of reasoning is that?
The oldest ice cores, from East Antarctica, provide an 800,000-year-old record of Earth’s climate.
Core questions: An introduction to ice cores – Climate Change: Vital Signs of the Planet

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ISteveB said:

2 continents....
Greenland, and Antarctica.... that's nice if I lived on either one of them. But I don't.... neither do you. I live on the north American continent. Out west.

You know what I find astonishing.....
China supposedly has a 5000+ year old civilization.
Most of that time they were an agrarian society.
Do you know what farmers need more than any other resource to grow crops?
water......
Where does water originate? Rivers? where do rivers originate? Mountains? Snowpack? Where does snow pack originate? precipitation....

If the climate has really been stable enough to provide so large a civilization a stable growth, you'd think they'd have records of their rain fall, instabilities, droughts, etc.....

I say this because they were a scientific civilization too. they charted the skies, have their own astrological charts, invented gun powder, and explosives, etc.....
So.... where are their records?
Why does the climate change community not have access to such records?
Why does the European records only go back 150 years?
Where is the African, Soviet, Sub-continent of India, Australia, and other continental records?
Human being went from being hunter-gatherers thousands of years ago to being agrarian.....
As stated above--- agrarian lifestyle requires water. Water requires rain/snow.
The bible actually does a decent job of describing the droughts of the middle east during their eras. Other middle eastern civilizations described in the bible describe extensive record keeping.... where are those records? Why doesn't the climate change community have access to them? Why do we never heard about those records? that's the entire planet/

So.... yeah.... I have a problem with just 2 out of 7 continents being used as the sum total of our records for climate change.

You go ahead though. I don't want you to have to actually think about all this stuff. It might cause cognitive dissonance, and we all know how true believers feel about thinking.

I'm not going to change my life to fit the sky is falling chicken little crowd, when they have only 2 continent's records--- when those records are entirely up to interpretation, without any input from human beings who could tell us what those records actually entailed at the time they did so.

Then.... ever heard about the precessionary change that planet earth experiences, every 25,780 years?
It's similar to what happens with a top when it starts slowing down.

The axis goes around in a circle over that period of time.
Did it ever make you wonder what happened when we were at this position in our precessionary cycle 25,780, 51,560, 77,340, etc.....years ago?
After all, if the planet really is 4.5 billion years old, we've been through this 174,553.92 times now.

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ISteveB said:

2 continents....
Greenland, and Antarctica...

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essentialsaltes said:

Because precision thermometers were only invented 300 years ago.

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Pommer said:

When did Greenland become a continent?

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ISteveB said:

This isn't about thermometers.... this is about keeping records of rainfall-- something like---
204, rain good this year, no drought.
205, rain bad this year, crops had a shortage of 20%.
206, rain flooded this year, crops survived, and gave us 5 years worth of crops.
or,
rainy season normally starts in October, but started in late august.
etc.....
Not everything is about manmade instruments. It's about keeping records!

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lasthero said:

Uuuuuuuuuuh...

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essentialsaltes said:

With five named cyclonic storms simultaneously in the Atlantic (2nd time that's ever been recorded) and a wildfire season for the ages in the West, Trump has put the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, a scientific agency responsible for the National Weather Service and other important operations in the hands of someone who questions the severity of climate change. This, of course, goes hand in hand with Trump's recent statement that science 'doesn't know' about climate.

LINK

NOAA taps David Legates, professor who questions the seriousness and severity of global warming, for top role
Critics fear move could threaten the scientific integrity of one of the country’s foremost climate research agencies.

Legates was formerly Delaware’s state climatologist, a position from which he he stepped down in 2011. He had come under pressure from then-Gov. Ruth Ann Minner (D), because of his fossil fuel industry-funded research casting doubt on the science showing that burning coal, oil and other fossil fuels is the main factor behind heating the planet and would lead to dangerous effects such as sea level rise and extreme weather events.

Legates is affiliated with the Heartland Institute, a free-market think tank funded in part by the fossil fuel industry that supports research arguing that human-caused climate change is not a serious threat.

Legates’s arrival at NOAA comes a year after the agency’s scientific independence took a hit when the agency criticized its own forecasters’ accurate forecast for Hurricane Dorian to satisfy White House concerns that its communications were making the president look bad for having claimed, erroneously, that the storm would threaten Alabama.

Watchdogs such as Gretchen Goldman of the Union of Concerned Scientists, a research and advocacy group, said they fear that Legates’s appointment signals a new level of interference in the agency’s scientific work.

“This is a disappointing move. It is a slap in the face to NOAA scientists who work daily to conduct and communicate climate science to the public and decision makers,” Goldman said in an email. “Until now, NOAA has largely evaded the kind of anti-science political appointees that have devastated the EPA and Interior. With Dr. Legates we risk seeing the same kind of politicization of science and corruption of ethics. At the same time, NOAA has a strong culture of scientific integrity; Dr Legates must be ready to uphold it.”

On Monday, the American Geophysical Union, which is the world’s largest scientific society representing Earth and space sciences, publicly urged that Legates’ appointment be rescinded. “With climate change producing raging wildfires in the western United States and devastating hurricanes in the Atlantic, our nation – and the world – cannot afford to have our federal government undermining the important work of climate scientists,” wrote Randy Fiser, the group’s executive director and CEO.

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lasthero said:

You’re assuming there weren’t records like that. We’ve lost countless documents and records to time.

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ISteveB said:

Ok, it's a really humongous island, that is large enough to be a continent.

how many continents are in the world - Google Search

better still, here's a "true size" website which compares continents to each other.
So... pick a continent or country to compare to the US, China, or India.

Compare Countries With This Simple Tool

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Pommer said:

Cool tool!

View attachment 284825

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ISteveB said:

Ok, it's a really humongous island, that is large enough to be a continent.

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