Was the birth of Israel in 1948 a fulfilment of Biblical prophesy?

Chris V++ · Sep 7, 2020

Akita Suggagaki said:
Absolutely. And if the holocaust was not prophesied, why not?

It was the impetus for the creation of the Jewish state so sure it seems self-evident.

Chris V++ · Sep 7, 2020

Dave L said:
So what do you think this proves?

Maybe the NT doesn't reinterpret the OT in the exact way you proclaim, but that's just speculation since the only thing you've really said is that I '...think as the Pharisees do.'

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 7, 2020

Chris V++ said:
It was the impetus for the creation of the Jewish state so sure it seems self-evident.

Self evident? The holocaust?

Chris V++ · Sep 7, 2020

Akita Suggagaki said:
Self evident? The holocaust?

no sorry, I meant that the holocaust would fit into prophecy like you suggested.

Dave L · Sep 7, 2020

Chris V++ said:
Maybe the NT doesn't reinterpret the OT in the exact way you proclaim, but that's just speculation since the only thing you've really said is that I '...think as the Pharisees do.'

You can read it as Jesus and the disciples did, or as the Pharisees do. But you reject Christ and the gospel of the kingdom when you follow the Pharisees.

Akita Suggagaki · Sep 7, 2020

Chris V++ said:
no sorry, I meant that the holocaust would fit into prophecy like you suggested.

I wonder of Nostradamus saw it coming.

Chris V++ · Sep 7, 2020

Dave L said:
You can read it as Jesus and the disciples did, or as the Pharisees do. But you reject Christ and the gospel of the kingdom when you follow the Pharisees.

I reject Christ and the gospel because of a belief that Israel still factors? Christians who support Israel (and who hope unbelieving Jews will come to recognize Jesus as the Messiah) are pharisees? I don't know what point you are trying to make so I guess Ill bow out.
So how should a true Christian regard Jews and the Israeli state? Should we let Iran wipe them off the map for their collective persistence in unbelief?

ViaCrucis · Sep 7, 2020

Carl Emerson said:
Hi there,

Just wondering how folks view this unlikely event.

There's nothing prophetic about modern Israel. The modern state of Israel is nothing more than just another country in the geopolitical landscape. One which, quite frankly, does some pretty horrible things such as its constant persecution of Palestinians.

That doesn't justify Palestinian terrorism against Israel.

Israelis have right to have their own nation. But so do the Palestinians.

Which is why as Christians we should pray for peace, pray for an end to violence in the region. And we should speak loudly against false doctrines of those who want to see more violence because they think Israel is somehow central to their apocalyptic fantasies.

-CryptoLutheran

Dave L · Sep 8, 2020

Chris V++ said:
I reject Christ and the gospel because of a belief that Israel still factors? Christians who support Israel (and who hope unbelieving Jews will come to recognize Jesus as the Messiah) are pharisees? I don't know what point you are trying to make so I guess Ill bow out.
So how should a true Christian regard Jews and the Israeli state? Should we let Iran wipe them off the map for their collective persistence in unbelief?

Here's what you need to do in order to understand Israel. 1) answer the question from the bible on what makes one a Jew or physical member of Israel. (Answer) Circumcision. When Christ abolished circumcision on the cross, the generation Paul and the others preached to was the last. All of those are now gentiles calling themselves Jews and Israel.

2) How are any of these reattached to Israel (The Church)? (Answer) Only by faith in Christ.

3) Jesus taught his kingdom is spiritual and only the born-again can see it now. The Pharisees preached a different "Millennial Jesus" and a different physical "millennial kingdom". And rejected Jesus and his kingdom. Can you side with the Pharisees and still follow the true Christ?

Daniel Marsh · Sep 10, 2020

Melody Suttles said:
By all means, yes! As a thorough study of Daniel's 70 weeks prophecy will prove. It is an amazing study.

Daniel 9
24 “God has allowed 70 weeks[e] for your people and your holy city, Daniel. The 70 weeks are ordered for these reasons: to stop doing bad things, to stop sinning, to make people pure, to bring the goodness that continues forever, to put a seal on visions and prophets, and to dedicate a very holy place.

25 “Learn and understand these things, Daniel. From the time that the message went out to go back and rebuild Jerusalem until the time for the chosen king[f] to come will be seven weeks. Then Jerusalem will be rebuilt. There will again be places for people to meet together in Jerusalem, and there will be a ditch around the city to protect it. Jerusalem will be built for 62 weeks, but there will be many troubles during that time. 26 After the 62 weeks, the chosen one will be killed.[g] He will be gone.[h] Then the people of the future leader will destroy the city and the holy place. That end will come like a flood. War will continue until the end. God has ordered that place to be completely destroyed.

27 “Then the future ruler will make an agreement with many people. That agreement will continue for one week. The offerings and sacrifices will stop for a half of a week. And a destroyer will come. He will do terrible, destructive things, but God has ordered that destroyer to be completely destroyed.”

Daniel Marsh · Sep 10, 2020

BrotherJJ said:
OP question:
Was the birth of Israel in 1948 a fulfilment of Biblical prophesy?

God established His covenant with Abraham & promises to bless those who bless Israel: (Gen 12:2-3, 13:14, 15:17-18)

God gives the exact boundaries of the promised land in Num 34:1-15 (also: Deut 1:8, Ex 2:24, Ex 6:4, 8 & Ps 105:8-11)

King David "bought" the threshing floor (37 acre Temple Mt area) from Araunah the Jebusite. & built an altar to the Lord so that a “plague may be held back from the people” (2 Sam 24:18, 21 & 1 Chron 21

PAY SPECIAL ATTENTION TO: Num 34:1-15
(NOTE: George Bush tried to give away Israel's land. Barack Obama wanted to give away Israel's land. It's not theirs to give or negotiate away. God gave it to Israel in a "Everlasting Covenant")

God states that the covenant of the Land is based on "His" eternal character, "Not" on Israel's own righteousness. He makes clear that even when they forsake His will, He will "NEVER" forget His covenant (Lev:26:42-45, Jer 31:35-37, Ps 89:30-37

God will restore Israel for the sake of His holy name: (Eze. 37:17-23, 39:25-29, Jer 33:23-26. After 2000 yrs DONE 1948)

God says He will gather the exiles & bring them home to Israel (Isa 11:1-12 & many other scriptures. Began in 1948 & continues today)

The national, physical restoration of Israel In the last days (THATS US NOW) is a necessary and prophesied step towards restoration and ultimate redemption for the entire world: (Ezek 36:24-29, 37:11-14, Jer 3:1:8-10, 31:3134, Amos 9:14-15)

All The Above Are True because GOD Is NOT a man that He should lie. Num 23:19.

That's my long winded answer to the OP - YES!

I had the impression that when Israel become a nation again, every one will be believers in the Messiah.

Carl Emerson · Sep 10, 2020

Some folk believe that the Jews will be expelled from the land and come back from exile a second time in the way you describe.

A notable proponent of this belief was the late messianic Jew Arthur Katz.

Andrewn · Sep 11, 2020

Daniel Marsh said:
27 “Then the future ruler will make an agreement with many people. That agreement will continue for one week. The offerings and sacrifices will stop for a half of a week. And a destroyer will come. He will do terrible, destructive things, but God has ordered that destroyer to be completely destroyed.”

This is a dispensational interpretation rather than a translation. In all formal translations, the first part of the verse is translated as follows:

Dan 9:27 Then he will make a firm covenant with many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put an end to sacrifice and offering.

This refers to Christ, rather than "the future ruler" who is the Antichrist. It is parallel to the first part of the preceding verse:

Dan 9:26 After the sixty-two ‘sevens,’ the Anointed One will be put to death and will have nothing.

The second part of verses 26 & 27 describe Titus, who destroyed Jerusalem.

Was the birth of Israel in 1948 a fulfilment of Biblical prophesy?

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