University to Remove WWII Murals Due to "Lack of Diversity"

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Agree that there's no good reason to complain about them, but that's why they are being moved.


Just as the building at Gettysburg, designed by a famous architect, was torn down because of complaints.

Well, they aren't supposed to depict WWII, so who is to blame for using that as an excuse for making the mistake of agreeing to remove them?

Why is removing them a mistake? They are paintings from the 50's. They were not painted by a famous artist.
 
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Albion

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Just as the building at Gettysburg, designed by a famous architect, was torn down because of complaints.
Sure, and we could cite all sorts of similar atrocities.

Why is removing them a mistake? They are paintings from the 50's. They were not painted by a famous artist.

The question should be "what good reason is there FOR removing them?" I already have noted several good reasons for not doing something like this.
 
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Sure, and we could cite all sorts of similar atrocities.

Tearing down the building at Gettysburg was anything but an atrocity. It was, as I described, a modern building that did not belong on the battlefield.

The question should be "what good reason is there FOR removing them?" I already have noted several good reasons for not doing something like this.

The only reason you seem to have in support of your position is that people want the murals removed because they lack diversity. They don't depict the war as was claimed in the OP. The building honors the veterans so that honor will remain since it isn't being removed.
 
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Orthodox_Christian

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That might have a similar effect as having Japanese Animes with all white people when the characters are mostly Japanese.

Painting everyone one color might have the same result as saying "all lives matter" in response to "black lives matter"

With this approach however, many are still "excluded" so the front facing murals and art work may need to be updated every decade at least.
I'd paint over it then. I'd have no people.
 
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Wolseley

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A long, long time ago, there was a very rich, very affluent, very powerful country. They had absorbed a lot of different ethnic and racial groups, and while there was disparity, things managed to function fairly well.

But, as time went on, the minority groups became unhappy; they didn't feel as if they were being fairly treated, getting their fair share of the pie. So they began to demand things. The majority people (who were white) tried to suppress the unrest, which simply led to more unrest, and more demands, until things erupted into riots and violent clashes.

The country eventually became fragmented; this group wanted more recognition, that group were angry that they'd lost what they used to have, crime became rampant, law enforcement became disillusioned and decided to quit in droves, and things more or less just ceased functioning. Nobody cared about the wonderful things the country had done in the past anymore; nobody wanted to work to uphold what the country once stood for; nobody wanted to do anything, really, other than demand that the government give them money and welfare. The government couldn't do it economically, and it went deeper and deeper into debt.

And then one day, it just exploded, and it fell apart. The minorities flooded in and destroyed the cities, they looted everything they could get their hands on and ruined whatever they could carry away, and the majority white people abandoned the cities and evaporated into the countryside. The looters and rioters hung around in the areas they had stripped, but nobody was left to keep supporting them with free goodies, and so the entire society slid into a long, deep, very severe depression, filled with ethnic warfare, famine, anarchy, ignorance, hatred, and darkness.

The End.

Sound familiar? It should. You see it happening right in front of your eyes.

The country I'm talking about, however, isn't the United States. It was the western Roman Empire, and the ethnic minorities were the Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals, Franks, Alans, Burgundians, Thuringians, Frisians, Gepidae, Suevi, Alemanni, Lombards, Heruli, Quadi, Magyars, and Huns. They all rebelled and brought the Roman government down, and in the centuries that followed (known as the Dark Ages), all of the material surplus that they had desired so badly completely disappeared. What they had left were shattered buildings with weeds growing up through the pavement, vast agricultural fields filling up with trees and scrub, and petty gang warfare over little bits of turf that didn't amount to anything. Hundreds of thousands of them died, because they were existing in a societal vacuum. The "good life" they thought they were being denied had become non-existant.

Tighten your belts, America. History always repeats itself; and your worst years are just ahead of you.
 
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Albion

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Tearing down the building at Gettysburg was anything but an atrocity. It was, as I described, a modern building that did not belong on the battlefield.
Apologies. I was not familiar with that incident and misunderstood the point of your mentioning it.

The only reason you seem to have in support of your position is that people want the murals removed because they lack diversity.
Oh no. I also noted that the murals are not meant to depict life during World War II, so the claim that they do is invalid.

I also mentioned that the people shown in the murals are not shown to be of any particular race, so the usual diversity claim is invalid.

I mentioned that moving them will, if past experience with these sorts of things holds, almost certainly be to make them less often viewed. IOW, it's not a neutral shifting of location.

I agreed with the idea that moving them would likely be impossible and pointlessly costly even if it is possible.

And I also made the point that doing what is planned is a dishonorable slap in the face to the artist, a 95 year old veteran (!) and an alumnus of this same university!

The building honors the veterans so that honor will remain since it isn't being removed.
See the latter part of the above. In fact, be sure to see all of it for the answer to this comment.
 
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LizaMarie

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As the Daughter of a WWII vet, I would find it quite offensive to have this removed, if it is a part of the wall and can't be removed without destroying it. Maybe people don't understand today, but the reason we are a free country is precisely due to the sacrifice of these WWII soldiers. We could very well be bowing down to an AXIS Flag, or hailing the Fuhrer,had we lost that war.
Those of us who don't know history are doomed to repeat it.
Now having said that, I'm still not clear if this is part of the wall which was painted on, or is a picture which could be safely removed without destroying it. My solution would not be to destroy the mural but perhaps to put up paintings or pictures also depicting the African American soldiers, and other minority soldiers who fought and played a part in WWII,such as something about the Navajo Code talkers, and Doris Miller, and women who volunteered.
 
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Arcangl86

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As the Daughter of a WWII vet, I would find it quite offensive to have this removed, if it is a part of the wall and can't be removed without destroying it. Maybe people don't understand today, but the reason we are a free country is precisely due to the sacrifice of these WWII soldiers. We could very well be bowing down to an AXIS Flag, or hailing the Fuhrer,had we lost that war.
Those of us who don't know history are doomed to repeat it.
Now having said that, I'm still not clear if this is part of the wall which was painted on, or is a picture which could be safely removed without destroying it. My solution would not be to destroy the mural but perhaps to put up paintings or pictures also depicting the African American soldiers, and other minority soldiers who fought and played a part in WWII,such as something about the Navajo Code talkers, and Doris Miller, and women who volunteered.
Have you looked at the many pictures of the mural in question? It's not a Mural of WWII soldiers. It's a mural that happens to be painted by a WWII vet depicting life on campus in the 50s.
 
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LizaMarie

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Have you looked at the many pictures of the mural in question? It's not a Mural of WWII soldiers. It's a mural that happens to be painted by a WWII vet depicting life on campus in the 50s.
I'm neither an alumni of the University nor do I have children attending there so of course they can do whatever they want! I'm more concerned with the reason given for wanting to remove it, as in let's erase all our history as it does not fit in with where we are today. Erase history, with all it's warts and stains, and we do not learn.
However, It's their call.
 
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Albion

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My solution would not be to destroy the mural but perhaps to put up paintings or pictures also depicting the African American soldiers, and other minority soldiers who fought and played a part in WWII,such as something about the Navajo Code talkers, and Doris Miller, and women who volunteered.

That would be too sensible. ;)
 
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Sparagmos

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I'm neither an alumni of the University nor do I have children attending there so of course they can do whatever they want! I'm more concerned with the reason given for wanting to remove it, as in let's erase all our history as it does not fit in with where we are today. Erase history, with all it's warts and stains, and we do not learn.
However, It's their call.
Why would it be erasing history to take a painting down? Do you never change the art in your house?
 
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Aldebaran

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Why would it be erasing history to take a painting down? Do you never change the art in your house?

Tear down a statue of MLK or some other black guy, and the activists for "equality and fairness" will scream the explanation in your face.
 
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Sparagmos

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Tear down a statue of MLK or some other black guy, and the activists for "equality and fairness" will scream the explanation in your face.
We’re not talking about a statue though. If you have to deflect to statues, you must not have a good argument for never changing the art in a building.
 
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Aldebaran

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We’re not talking about a statue though. If you have to deflect to statues, you must not have a good argument for never changing the art in a building.

Then I guess you can't see any similarity between a statue and artwork, so we'll stick with what you might consider to be "artwork". If people decided to remove the BLM painting that vandals painted on the street in New York, would you have a problem with that? The NYTimes seems to. ‘Black Lives Matter’ Art Outside Trump Tower Is Being Vandalized
 
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We’re not talking about a statue though. If you have to deflect to statues, you must not have a good argument for never changing the art in a building.
I went to middle school in a building that was built in the late 1800s with a 1929 addition. The WPA painted a mural in the building during the depression. In the 90s the building was converted to luxury apartments. During the renovations the mural was covered over. The current guess is that it is still there but no one knows for sure. It may well be gone. If it is still there it would be badly damaged by nail holes. I don’t recall anyone complaining; most people were just happy that the old building was saved.
 
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