George Washington Statue Toppled

Mountainmanbob said:

True, the Republicans saved them.
M

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Except in revisionist history.

In actual history the Democrats and the Republicans basically switched sides in the 1960s.

JackRT said:

In actual history the Democrats and the Republicans basically switched sides in the 1960s.

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In some places. The Democratic party in some places like Minnesota was never particularly racist, nor is the Republican party there particularly racist even now. Might be different in ... oh ... maybe ... Alabama.

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

Our History is stealing land from the Indians, raping and killing Indians. Owning slaves, beating them and raping them. Hanging Black people , because they're black. Cops beating and killing black people. Why would they want any history left. BTW, I prefer no protesting or riots.

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That’s an honest and exceptional response about American history. No whitewashing and not a hint of American Exceptionalism. America was founded on the ideals of white supremacy and the systematic racism against minorities. The U.S. Constitution originally included the Three-Fifths Compromise and slavery was legal in this country until the Thirteenth Amendment finally abolished slavery in 1865.

America was also founded on broken legal treaties with the tribes and forcibly taken tribal lands. The original founding of America (and its history) is drenched to its core in racism against minorities, who were systematically denied equality to white people and were denied civil rights for almost 200 years.

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

Our History is stealing land from the Indians, raping and killing Indians. Owning slaves, beating them and raping them. Hanging Black people , because they're black. Cops beating and killing black people. Why would they want any history left. BTW, I prefer no protesting or riots.

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Are you saying the USA did nothing good?

Where else can a black man or women you're talking about become the president of the most powerful nation in the world?

chevyontheriver said:

In some places. The Democratic party in some places like Minnesota was never particularly racist, nor is the Republican party there particularly racist even now. Might be different in ... oh ... maybe ... Alabama.

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but as we know the protest and reason for the protest has been hi-jacked by Marxist.

Mountainmanbob said:

I'm part Cherokee and do not understand all of the complaining.
Some of us are blessed and happy.

Indian casino next door to us seems to be booming.

M

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I’m part Choctaw and Comanche and I understand the complaints.

I don’t pretend the social and economic issues that still plague the tribes today don’t exist to ease my conscience. I don’t dismiss these social issues so I can pretend that America is a Christian nation or to show unwavering patriotism. I think it’s important to acknowledge the racist history of America.

Nokomis said:

That’s an honest and exceptional response about American history. No whitewashing and not a hint of American Exceptionalism. America was founded on the ideals of white supremacy and the systematic racism against minorities. The U.S. Constitution originally included the Three-Fifths Compromise and slavery was legal in this country until the Thirteenth Amendment finally abolished slavery in 1865.

America was also founded on broken legal treaties with the tribes and forcibly taken tribal lands. The original founding of America (and its history) is drenched to its core in racism against minorities, who were systematically denied equality to white people and were denied civil rights for almost 200 years.

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You only tell one side of the story....why is that?

JackRT said:

In actual history the Democrats and the Republicans basically switched sides in the 1960s.

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And currently the democrats are slipping far left....Adopting Marxism.

-57 said:

You only tell one side of the story....why is that?

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Because she didn’t address that side in her post.

The intent of the statues/monuments is what's actually important...

I was okay with people pushing for the removal of the particular Confederate monuments that were put up in the 1940's-1960's, as they were just cheaply made statues that, of which, the intent was simply southern regions giving a middle finger to the federal government over civil rights legislation that segregationists and racists didn't like.

I was also on board with the idea that a brand new High School, that was built in the mid 1980's and being named after a Confederate General or the President of the confederacy, was basically a showing of reverence to the ideas of the confederacy, and had nothing to do with "history preservation" as some farther-right advocates like to claim.


However, the same isn't true of a lot of the recent statues/monuments that have been targeted. While it may have been true that segregationists in the 1950's were propping up statues of Lee and Davis to "let everyone know where they stand on racial issues", that's certainly not true of statues of Washington, Lincoln, Jefferson, etc... Nobody was putting up a statue of Washington due to his status as a former slaveholder, they were putting it up because of the historical significance of his presidency.


It became evident that it was never really about "erasing someone who was racist", it was about "erasing institutions and westernization we don't like in order to promote Marxism"

The proof of that is that Marx, himself, hasn't been "cancelled" by those groups.

In fact, they use the same reasoning that they claim to hate when right-wing people use it.

Look at the way they spin it on a popular Communism-advocacy website "HistoryIsAWeapon"...a popular site that many Antifa twitter and FB accounts like to cite.



Notice how the moment it's pointed out that their guy used racial slurs, and was "a product of the time period he lived in", it suddenly becomes a valid excuse to say "it was a different time", yet...they don't seem to find that reasoning to be valid when it comes to people like Christopher Columbus, Washington, Jefferson, etc...

Apparently one can be a "product of their time" if they're a prominent advocate of left-wing collectivism...but if they're a capitalist/individualist/libertarian, or in any way involved in any form of colonialism, "Nope, they have to live up to 2020 'woke' standards, otherwise they need to be replaced completely".


Ulysses Grant (who led the fight for the north) marries a woman who's father owned slaves, and despite the fact that he opposed it (as did she), "nope doesn't matter, he's an evil racist by affiliation and needs to be cancelled"

Yet, Marx (from around a similar time period), can toss out the n-word willy nilly, and say things like Jewish people (religiously, not ethnically, I would assume... as he was ethnically Jewish) are "robber barons" "who would sooner throw money down the drain than lend it to a ‘friend’"

...but apparently "it's okay because he was a 19th century European, and that's just how it was back then".

It's not hard to see through the charade...

Apparently "how racist someone's actions and words are" is outweighed by "How much does this person support our ideals of communism".

Had Jefferson been a staunch advocate for wealth redistribution and abolition of private property, he'd probably be given the exact same pass they give Marx.

-57 said:

And currently the democrats are slipping far left....Adopting Marxism.

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Perhaps to the left but not as far as Marxism --- just a little bit closer to authentic Christianity.

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Also, the Choctaw sided with the Confederates during the American Civil War. You know, the side that wanted to keep slavery, and everyone is supposed to condemn...

BigDaddy4 said:

Also, the Choctaw sided with the Confederates during the American Civil War. You know, the side that wanted to keep slavery, and everyone is supposed to condemn...

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And in the American Revolution the Delaware Indians sided with the Revolutionaries against the British. Well, until Revolutionary soldiers burned their homes and killed those who resisted. That is precisely why Delaware Indians now live in Canada.

If you hate the country so much you have to pull down statues of past presidents, you will never be happy here. Just go away already.

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

Our History is stealing land from the Indians, raping and killing Indians. Owning slaves, beating them and raping them. Hanging Black people , because they're black. Cops beating and killing black people. Why would they want any history left. BTW, I prefer no protesting or riots.

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And the opposite also happened. Indians killed and tortured and raped whites just for being there, as they also did to other tribes before whites arrived.
Blacks took other blacks as slaves in africa and still do. They also had whites shipped in for slavery. There's no sacred cows, no one has a perfect history. Get over it. Remember the good things our forefathers did. Our history is not all evil.

Ana the Ist said:

Well let bygones be bygones I say...

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I'm fine with that. My family history has slave owners, as well as a good friend of Thomas Jefferson that helped run his plantation. Nothing I can do about that.

Ana the Ist said:

Of course, the Comanche were notorious slavers and as a splinter group of a larger tribe all their land is basically stolen sooooo....

There's probably some people who think they should have to give it back.

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I think if those who are upset about America's history would look into their own histories, they would see much of the same from their ancestors. Nations, tribes, and civilizations conquering other nations, tribes, and civilizations, wiping out native peoples, owning slaves, etc.

Imagine if everyone demanded the conquering nations of their ancestors give the land back and/or made reparations all the way back to the beginning of mankind?

Nokomis said:

I’m part Choctaw and Comanche and I understand the complaints.

I don’t pretend the social and economic issues that still plague the tribes today don’t exist to ease my conscience. I don’t dismiss these social issues so I can pretend that America is a Christian nation or to show unwavering patriotism. I think it’s important to acknowledge the racist history of America.

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Compared to what Eutopia?

Is earth more or less "slave owning Nazi" because of Patton & Grant?

What was the point of fighting them if only to be stereotyped back in with them ("they're all the same") in the end?

chevyontheriver said:

What WOULD they rename Washington state? For that matter what would they rename Washington DC?

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Trumpington has a nice ring to it.