Suppose Trump used the emergency powers to postpone the election

Albion

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None of that matters much to this discussion since it is about junking the only system our country has ever used in favor of forcing the electors to vote for the winner of a mythical nationwide popular vote even if their own state voted for the other candidate.

Democratic strategists came up with this so-called National Popular Vote plan in the belief that it would just about insure the election of the Democratic candidate for president.
 
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Speedwell

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None of that matters much to this discussion since it is about junking the only system our country has ever used in favor of forcing the electors to vote for the winner of a mythical nationwide popular vote even if their own state voted for the other candidate.

Democratic strategists came up with this so-called National Popular Vote plan in the belief that it would just about insure the election of the Democratic candidate for president.
You don't think a Republican can win the popular vote?
 
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RocksInMyHead

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Democratic strategists came up with this so-called National Popular Vote plan in the belief that it would just about insure the election of the Democratic candidate for president.
Perhaps that might persuade the Republicans to pick candidates that appeal to more people then.

Also, you still haven't supported your initial claim - that the Democrats picking up the presidency and a few senate seats would force multiple changes to state voting systems and constitutions.
 
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Under One King

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That is quite a non-answer. I'm asking specifically, what will Biden do that will "ruin" America? Not what will he do that you don't care for, but specifically, what things will he do that will cause America's ruin -- which is what you seem to be claiming.

I'm not a fan of claiming that "the other side" winning will "ruin America." I've lived through numerous Presidents, from both parties, and have often disagreed, yet I haven't believed those policies would "ruin" America.

I've been against numerous Trump "policies" -- such as his increasing the national debt in a time of the best economy of the last 50 years. In his first two years of office, Trump basically doubled the deficit spending compared to the last couple of years of Obama, adding about a Trillion Dollars in new debt in each new budget he signed -- again, in the best economy of the last 50 years, when tax revenues are at their highest and we should be, at a minimum, lowering the deficit if not paying down the debt.

Of course, with the pandemic we are no longer in the "best economy" and we will current add $3 trillion in new debt for 2020 alone. Now, I don't believe this will ruin America -- it just will require some hard choices and strong leadership in future years to fix (though I must note, with the current atmosphere and seeming lack of strong leadership in either party, I question how this will happen).

In some ways, I'm reminded of a cartoon I saw after the 1976 election -- I was attending school in a very Republican area and personally voted Ford. The cartoon showed a man loading up his station wagon (back before minivans and then SUVs became popular) with the families important possessions, preparing to quickly move his family, and his wife is in the doorway saying something like, "Carter being elected isn't that bad...." Carter, in MHO, was one of our worst presidents but, as bad as he was, he didn't ruin America.

So, again, exactly what is Biden going to do to ruin America?
I would love to go into detail on this, and perhaps I will eventually, but I don't have the time to explain all that now when it won't change your mind anyway.
 
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Under One King

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I'm beginning to get the feeling that it's you who is not a conservative.
I get the feeling you are reading me wrong via online like most of us probably do. All you know about me is what you've read here. You don't know me or what I believe or stand for.
What comes to your mind at the word conservative? It's possible we are placing slightly different meanings on the word.
 
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Under One King

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Fortunately, it won't come to that. So there's no need for melodrama.
It's hardly melodrama after he had the audacity to say that if I'm a conservative and I want to hold on to those principles I'm going to have become a democrat.
 
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TLK Valentine

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It's hardly melodrama after he had the audacity to say that if I'm a conservative and I want to hold on to those principles I'm going to have become a democrat.

Well, The Republican Party's principles have "readjusted" somewhat over the last 3 1/2 years; "Groveling before Donald" took a sharp rise, and more than a few Conservatives have taken issue with that.

But it is a false dichotomy, I grant you -- depending on whether you're more socially conservative, fiscally conservative, or both, there's bound to be a lesser party out there to your liking.

But there's still no need to die over it. Everyone dies someday; what's the rush?
 
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Pommer

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It's hardly melodrama after he had the audacity to say that if I'm a conservative and I want to hold on to those principles I'm going to have become a democrat.
“Liberal” and “conservative” are both relative terms.
The parties are beginning to switch roles, the Democrats are going to defend the legacies of FDR, JFK/LBJ, BHO by shoring up support for the institutions that were promulgated under these leaders.
They will become the new conservatives.
Conserving the very institutions that President Trump has sought to undermine.
 
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Under One King

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Well, The Republican Party's principles have "readjusted" somewhat over the last 3 1/2 years; "Groveling before Donald" took a sharp rise, and more than a few Conservatives have taken issue with that.

But it is a false dichotomy, I grant you -- depending on whether you're more socially conservative, fiscally conservative, or both, there's bound to be a lesser party out there to your liking.

But there's still no need to die over it. Everyone dies someday; what's the rush?

“Liberal” and “conservative” are both relative terms.
The parties are beginning to switch roles, the Democrats are going to defend the legacies of FDR, JFK/LBJ, BHO by shoring up support for the institutions that were promulgated under these leaders.
They will become the new conservatives.
Conserving the very institutions that President Trump has sought to undermine.
Would you mind posting what you think being a conservative means? Then I will post what I think it means. Maybe there's a better word to describe my position, I don't know. I've always heard my views referred to as conservative.
 
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TLK Valentine

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TLK Valentine

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Would you mind posting what you think being a conservative means? Then I will post what I think it means. Maybe there's a better word to describe my position, I don't know. I've always heard my views referred to as conservative.

Well, these are going to be oversimplifications, but you'll get my general impression:

Well, on the social front, I find conservatives to be, by and large, traditionalists. Customs, mores, institutions, etc... Conservatives are more likely to fight to preserve these things -- sometimes for the sake of preservation (oops).
Liberals tend to be more trendy, looking to tinker, adjust, and in some cases, toss out the old in favor of the new... sometimes without always insuring that "new" means "better" (oops again).

Financially speaking, I assume the position that both conservatives and liberals want America to grow and prosper; their solutions simply work in opposite directions: Conservatives from the top down, liberals from the ground up.
Conservative economics (IMO) tend to favor corporate America on the theory that when they prosper, they create jobs, opportunities, and prosperity for the rest of the country.
Liberal economics (again, IMO) focus more on the poor and the workers, on the theory that they'll work harder and thus be more productive if there's more in it for them.

Just my opinion; take it for what it's worth.
 
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Speedwell

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I get the feeling you are reading me wrong via online like most of us probably do. All you know about me is what you've read here. You don't know me or what I believe or stand for.
What comes to your mind at the word conservative? It's possible we are placing slightly different meanings on the word.
Individual liberty
Free markets
Free trade
Patriotic nationalism
Small federal government
Pro business
Low taxes
Constitutional strict constructionism.
 
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Speedwell

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Would you mind posting what you think being a conservative means? Then I will post what I think it means. Maybe there's a better word to describe my position, I don't know. I've always heard my views referred to as conservative.
Your turn.
 
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Under One King

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Here is what I stand for and have always called conservatism.

Pro-capitalism
Anti-abortion
Pro-gun
Small government and less government control
Lower taxes
States rights
Pro-electoral college
Anti-communist
Free trade
Patriotism
Constitutionalist
Somewhat anti-establishment (I don't think they've done much to help)

That's what I can think of off the top of my head.
 
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Speedwell

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Here is what I stand for and have always called conservatism.

Pro-capitalism
Anti-abortion
Pro-gun
Small government and less government control
Lower taxes
States rights
Pro-electoral college
Anti-communist
Free trade
Patriotism
Constitutionalist
Somewhat anti-establishment (I don't think they've done much to help)

That's what I can think of off the top of my head.
No, we're still missing something. What you posted sounds like John McCain yet you say he wasn't really a conservative.
 
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Under One King

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No, we're still missing something. What you posted sounds like John McCain yet you say he wasn't really a conservative.
Maybe I'm wrong about him. That's just the impression I've always gotten. I'll do more research on him.
 
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RocksInMyHead

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That's just the impression I've always gotten.
Based on what, specifically?

Honestly, the only knock against his conservatism (as it applies to US politics) that I can think of offhand is the fact that he changed positions on his support for LGBT rights after his daughter came out as gay. And that's a pretty minor thing.

He didn't always go along with the far right Tea Party stuff, but that doesn't make him not a conservative any more than someone not embracing everything the far left stands for makes them not a liberal.
 
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Under One King

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Based on what, specifically?

Honestly, the only knock against his conservatism (as it applies to US politics) that I can think of offhand is the fact that he changed positions on his support for LGBT rights after his daughter came out as gay. And that's a pretty minor thing.

He didn't always go along with the far right Tea Party stuff, but that doesn't make him not a conservative any more than someone not embracing everything the far left stands for makes them not a liberal.
I guess it really depends on the definition of conservatism. In many ways he was, but in some ways he wasn't.
He didn't always have a problem with limiting federal authority. His views on taxes seem a bit iffy at times. I don't think he was against global warming. His VP pick in 2008 was originally not going to be Palin, but I think his campaign wanted him to do he would appeal to the far right (from what I understand). I think he wanted Joseph Lieberman.
I would probably call McCain a moderate conservative.
 
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