Suppose we gave you abortion.

driewerf

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I understand the positions to be that with gun control, any control at all is part of a conspiracy to disarm the populace entirely and with global warming that it's nothing but a hoax to allow the imposition of an atheist totalitarian government. So in a way those are yes/no questions as well.
I respectfully disagree.
 
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TLK Valentine

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I think that was the point.

You proposed giving up state-sanctioned murder, which is obviously a moral issue,

How are you defining "murder"?

in return for a choice of political concessions you labelled "Christian issues" as though Christianity were essentially a political movement rather than a religion.

I said there would be no compromise...
 
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hislegacy

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Suppose the Left was willing to give you abortion--no questions asked, you could write any laws about it you wanted. Which of the other "hot button" Christian issues would you be willing to give in return? Gun control? Single-payer health care? Amnesty for Central American refugees? Politics is the art of compromise. What have you got to offer?

FYI refugees from Central America or anywhere else (like my mother and father). Do not need amnesty, only people who broke the law and enter the US Illegally do.

They are illegal aliens, not refugees.

Secondly, I think you have the same chance of the conservatives giving you gun control as you do of the liberals ever backing away from their abortion stance.
 
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CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN

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Suppose the Left was willing to give you abortion--no questions asked, you could write any laws about it you wanted. Which of the other "hot button" Christian issues would you be willing to give in return? Gun control? Single-payer health care? Amnesty for Central American refugees? Politics is the art of compromise. What have you got to offer?
Why should the left deny a woman's right , to have a safe abortion? To please Christians.
 
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TLK Valentine

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FYI refugees from Central America or anywhere else (like my mother and father). Do not need amnesty, only people who broke the law and enter the US Illegally do.

They'll need something if the US illegally denies them the chance to seek asylum.
 
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Aryeh Jay

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Why should the left deny a woman's right , to have a safe abortion? To please Christians.

The funny thing is 5 of the 7 Supreme Court Justices that formed the majority were appointed by Republican Presidents and it took effect during the Nixon Administration.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Why should the left deny a woman's right , to have a safe abortion? To please Christians.

I think it was supposed to be a thought experiment: To see how important banning abortion was to conservative christian voters.

Unfortunately (and perhaps inevitably) it didn't work out well.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Secondly, I think you have the same chance of the conservatives giving you gun control as you do of the liberals ever backing away from their abortion stance.

What counts as "gun control" under your understanding?

Which of these are effectively nonnegotiable:

* Universal background checks
* magazine capacity limits
* concealed-carry licensing
* universal registration and tracking
* mandatory safety training (written and range testing)
* banning of "military style" semi-automatic rifles
* ammo sales restrictions
* felon restrictions
* domestic abuser restrictions
* strong restrictions on non-hunting weapons
* "safe storage" requirements

I'm curious.
 
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stevil

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Why should the left deny a woman's right , to have a safe abortion? To please Christians.
I agree with your sentiment.
The woman's body isn't the domain of politicians to use as a bargaining chip.
But it is an interesting question to pose. What would antiabortionists be willing to give, in a given and take negotionation if (hypothetically) abortion where to be put on the table.
Looking through this thread it seems the antiabortionists aren't willing to give anything.

I would have thought they might give on all or some of the following:
Planned parenthood (in terms of sex education, contraceptives etc)
Free early childhood care (free midwives, free hospital births, free nappies, free formula, free vaccinations, free medical checkups and care)
domestic purpose benefit for families struggling for food, heating and accommodation
free quality schooling
free school lunches
allow gay people to adopt
support gay marriage
Medicare for all
 
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hislegacy

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What counts as "gun control" under your understanding?

Which of these are effectively nonnegotiable:

* Universal background checks
* magazine capacity limits
* concealed-carry licensing
* universal registration and tracking
* mandatory safety training (written and range testing)
* banning of "military style" semi-automatic rifles
* ammo sales restrictions
* felon restrictions
* domestic abuser restrictions
* strong restrictions on non-hunting weapons
* "safe storage" requirements

I'm curious.

Open a thread on the subject and I will jump in. Let’s not derail this one.
 
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Hans Blaster

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Open a thread on the subject and I will jump in. Let’s not derail this one.

I was looking more for a "gauging" of the level of fervor about the 2nd amend. (A lot of people who bring it up are very adamant against nearly any restrictions). I was just curious about what items under the "gun control" umbrella might be exchanged for an abortion ban in the spirt of this thread. (No, I'm not naive enough to think that there would be a swap or that this would some how "settle" things.)
 
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Ana the Ist

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Suppose the Left was willing to give you abortion--no questions asked, you could write any laws about it you wanted. Which of the other "hot button" Christian issues would you be willing to give in return? Gun control? Single-payer health care? Amnesty for Central American refugees? Politics is the art of compromise. What have you got to offer?

I'd be ok with requiring schools include a section of sexual education that includes various religious views on sexual morality, including the Christian beliefs on abstinence.
 
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FireDragon76

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I think that was the point.

You proposed giving up state-sanctioned murder, which is obviously a moral issue, in return for a choice of political concessions you labelled "Christian issues" as though Christianity were essentially a political movement rather than a religion.

It's potentially a moral issue if you agree to religious propositions that a fetus or embryo is a person "made in the image of God". If you don't accept that assumption, then there is alot of other possible considerations.
 
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CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN

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I think it was supposed to be a thought experiment: To see how important banning abortion was to conservative christian voters.

Unfortunately (and perhaps inevitably) it didn't work out well.
Of course it doesn't work well. When Conservative Christians are having multiple abortions. Liberals know about BC. So they're not the big issue.
 
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