As believers we have duty to contend for the faith

Saint Steven

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I am puzzled by the verses on sodom being restored...
That's just the beginning.
The Bible says the same thing about the restoration of Ammon and Moab, Elam, Egypt, and Edom. (see below)

The restoration of Sodom and Gomorrah from "eternal" fire

Jude 1:7
In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

Zephaniah 2:9
Therefore, as surely as I live,”
declares the Lord Almighty,
the God of Israel,
“surely Moab will become like Sodom,
the Ammonites like Gomorrah—
a place of weeds and salt pits,
a wasteland forever.
The remnant of my people will plunder them;
the survivors of my nation will inherit their land.”

Ezekiel 16:53
“‘However, I will restore the fortunes of Sodom and her daughters and of Samaria and her daughters, and your fortunes along with them,


The restoration of Ammon and Moab

Zephaniah 2:9
Therefore, as surely as I live,”
declares the Lord Almighty,
the God of Israel,
“surely Moab will become like Sodom,
the Ammonites like Gomorrah—
a place of weeds and salt pits,
a wasteland forever.
The remnant of my people will plunder them;
the survivors of my nation will inherit their land.”

Jeremiah 25:22, 27
21 Edom, Moab and Ammon; ...
27 “Then tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty, the God of Israel, says:
Drink, get drunk and vomit, and fall to rise no more because of the sword I will send among you.’

Jeremiah 49:6
“Yet afterward, I will restore the fortunes of the Ammonites,”
declares the Lord.

Jeremiah 48:4, 47
4 Moab will be broken;
her little ones will cry out.
47 “Yet I will restore the fortunes of Moab
in days to come,”
declares the Lord.
Here ends the judgment on Moab.


The restoration of Elam

Jeremiah 25:25, 27
25 all the kings of Zimri, Elam and Media; ...
27 “Then tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty, the God of Israel, says:
Drink, get drunk and vomit, and fall to rise no more because of the sword I will send among you.’

Jeremiah 49:39
“Yet I will restore the fortunes of Elam
in days to come,”
declares the Lord.


The restoration of Egypt

Jeremiah 25:19, 27
19 Pharaoh king of Egypt, his attendants, his officials and all his people, ...
27 “Then tell them, ‘This is what the Lord Almighty, the God of Israel, says:
Drink, get drunk and vomit, and fall to rise no more because of the sword I will send among you.’

Ezekiel 29:13-14
“‘Yet this is what the Sovereign Lord says: At the end of forty years I will gather the Egyptians from the nations where they were scattered.
14 I will bring them back from captivity and return them to Upper Egypt, the land of their ancestry. There they will be a lowly kingdom.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The restoration of Edom
Edom was an ancient kingdom in Transjordan located between Moab to the northeast, the Arabah to the west and the Arabian Desert to the south and east. Most of its former territory is now divided between Israel and Jordan.

The destruction of Edom uses the same exaggerated language descriptions as hell in the Bible. Yet none of it lasted forever as it clearly says. And you can certainly pass through it today. For this prophecy to be taken literally it would need to be a smoking tar pit with a bypass to get around it.

Isaiah 34:8-11
For the Lord has a day of vengeance,
a year of retribution, to uphold Zion’s cause.
9 Edom’s streams will be turned into pitch,
her dust into burning sulfur;
her land will become blazing pitch!
10 It will not be quenched night or day;
its smoke will rise forever.
From generation to generation it will lie desolate;
no one will ever pass through it again.
11 The desert owl and screech owl will possess it;
the great owl and the raven will nest there.
God will stretch out over Edom
the measuring line of chaos
and the plumb line of desolation.
 
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Saint Steven

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I am puzzled by the verses on sodom being restored but already I think it may mean those of them who would have repented if preached to therefore they did not blaspheme the Holy Spirit. It could refer only to the fact that those nations whom Jerusalem would regard as Sodom for they would think because many of the gentiles were like sodom and the Jews assumed as a nation they were more righteous than sodom having more righteous that God would continue to show mercy to those in Jerusalem who do not repent but Ezekiel was saying Christ would not destroy the whole of Israel He would keep those who repent but as they were not faithful to God would not save them anymore if they keep rejecting Christ he prophesied most of Israel would only be restored in the future when they accept Christ and that is when they recognise that God had accepted the gentiles who they thought He could never accept them because some of them their sins were like sodom before they heard Christ and they thought them not to be chosen forever
These scriptures are interesting as well.
It will be more difficult in the restoration of all things (the day of judgment) for some towns than for Sodom and Gomorrah.

Matthew 10:15
Truly I tell you, it will be more bearable for Sodom and Gomorrah on the day of judgment than for that town.

Matthew 11:24
But I tell you that it will be more bearable for Sodom on the day of judgment than for you.”

Luke 10:12
I tell you, it will be more bearable on that day for Sodom than for that town.
 
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Saint Steven

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The topic title reads: As believers we have duty to contend for the faith
But the attack is on Christian Universalists, as if they are somehow unbelievers.
I think you should choose a REAL enemy of the faith.
 
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mikeforjesus

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Read 2 Peter and you will know God is looking for holy people which there is not such a thing as good and bad if everyone is saved in the end. We are tested here so that those who repent have a reward for their righteousness which God wants to give to all who will repent and God does not want people in heaven who did not choose Him and they also tried to hinder others from having reward so if they don’t repent they deserve hell
 
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Saint Steven

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Read 2 Peter and you will know God is looking for holy people which there is not such a thing as good and bad if everyone is saved in the end. We are tested here so that those who repent have a reward for their righteousness which God wants to give to all who will repent and God does not want people in heaven who did not choose Him and they also tried to hinder others from having reward
Did Jesus die to save us from God?
 
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mikeforjesus

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Did Jesus die to save us from God?

They are not seperate beings so He came to reconcile us to God through His death by providing atonement for our sins that is to put away that which seperates us from God which we could not provide a payment for our sins. He came to bridge the gap by taking away our sins and healing our nature by now being able to unite it to Him as our sins were being removed by taking our sins and making satisfaction for our sins and healing our souls thus providing atonement but one has to choose to repent to allow the healing He offered to apply to one. He did not come to die to allow us to sin but to now allow us to come back to Him when we were separated from Him
 
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Jesus is YHWH

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The topic title reads: As believers we have duty to contend for the faith
But the attack is on Christian Universalists, as if they are somehow unbelievers.
I think you should choose a REAL enemy of the faith.
Well that is a false doctrine which is to be opposed and exposed as heresy.
 
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Jesus is YHWH

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Did Jesus die to save us from God?
No Jesus laid down His life for His Sheep, not goats.

John 10:11
"I am the good shepherd; the good shepherd lays down His life for the sheep.

John 10:15
just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep.


Matthew 25:31-46

The Sheep and the Goats

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
 
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mikeforjesus

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Perhaps it doesn’t mean those who were in the land of sodom will be restored but the captives of sodom those who were from the land of sodom but left it who some of them were still in sins but not fully so not yet judged. They were descended from sodom and they may still have existed at the time of the prophecy they were known to the Jews as from the land of sodom and some of their descendants still sinning thus they are known as daughters of Sodom or it could refer or also to those of them who would return at first coming of Christ and at the end who maybe they will not recognise as from sodom but they know salvation will be offered to all sinners not just Jews so the gentiles would be recognised as the daughters of sodom and some of them would be from sodom . They could be captives because some of them were still in prison of their sins and some will be restored later or those who repent from their sins which is their captivity

Zephaniah 2:9
Therefore, as surely as I live,”
declares the Lord Almighty,
the God of Israel,
“surely Moab will become like Sodom,
the Ammonites like Gomorrah—
a place of weeds and salt pits,
a wasteland forever.
The remnant of my people will plunder them;
the survivors of my nation will inherit their land.”

so it seems the land of sodom perhaps was not given eternal judgement but could be inhabited still if one wanted to

it was the people who were eternally judged
 
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Saint Steven

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They are not seperate beings so He came to reconcile us to God through His death by providing atonement for our sins that is to put away that which seperates us from God which we could not provide a payment for our sins. He came to bridge the gap by taking away our sins and healing our nature by now being able to unite it to Him as our sins were being removed by taking our sins and making satisfaction for our sins and healing our souls thus providing atonement but one has to choose to repent to allow the healing He offered to apply to one. He did not come to die to allow us to sin but to now allow us to come back to Him when we were separated from Him
Are those that are not the elect predestined to hell?
 
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Saint Steven

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Well that is a false doctrine which is to be opposed and exposed as heresy.
I need to remind you that the Controversial Christian Theology area is open for discussion of Universalism. Therefore you should discuss it, not try to shut it down.
 
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Saint Steven

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No Jesus laid down His life for His Sheep, not goats.

John 10:11
"I am the good shepherd; the good shepherd lays down His life for the sheep.

John 10:15
just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep.


Matthew 25:31-46

The Sheep and the Goats

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
What are the requirements for salvation given in the scripture you quoted?
 
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Saint Steven

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none its up to God, not man.

next............
I marked the requirements for salvation given in the scripture you quoted in red for you.

Matthew 25:31-46

The Sheep and the Goats

31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32 All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’

46 “Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.”
 
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mikeforjesus

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Many are called few are chosen

all are called but the chosen ones are chosen because they made the decision to accept Christ it is not of works that makes one favoured but one has to desire the truth just as Jacob desired the blessing no one can come unless it is given by the Father and Jesus said ask that you may receive

Romans 2:7 eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality;

Because they chose Him they are elect that is why they are called elect by forknowledge and this means Christ will keep loving them even if they sin (not on purpose though one can be forgiven of all sins if one repents while he has chance) but big errors by forgiving them and guiding them but I suppose they also have to seek Him for guidance that is also within forknowledge
 
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mikeforjesus

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I am more convinced blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is a sin related to this age because Jesus seems to say already all sins can be forgiven except one so it seems that sin can be commited in this age


Mark 3:28-30
The Unpardonable Sin
(Matt. 12:31, 32; Luke 12:10)
28 “Assuredly, I say to you, all sins will be forgiven the sons of men, and whatever blasphemies they may utter;
29 but he who blasphemes against the Holy Spirit never has forgiveness, but is subject to eternal condemnation”— 30 because they said, “He has an unclean spirit.”

It is the rejection of Christ in this life to not accept His revelation not having any faith in Him to believe He is the truth and fair but one may believe He is the truth and will be fair even if one thinks it is only God who should judge what is fair
 
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