Pre-Trib Only My New End Times Chronology

keras · Jul 31, 2020

ItIsFinished! said:
Those left behind however are not hence the Tribulation. The Church Age/ Age of Grace ends when the Church is removed .

This is all unscriptural guesswork.
God's holy people, namely His faithful Church, are present on earth during the Great Tribulation of the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns. Proved by Daniel 7:25 and Revelation 13:7
They are divided into two groups, as Daniel 11:32 and Revelation 12:14-17 say.

Choose Wisely · Jul 31, 2020

Douggg said:
7th seal - entry into the 7 years.
7th trumpet - just after the midpoint.
7th vial - at the very end of the 7 years.

7th seal......................End of the tribulation.
7th trumpet................End of God's wrath.
7th vial.......................Ditto

ItIsFinished! · Jul 31, 2020

keras said:
This is all unscriptural guesswork.
God's holy people, namely His faithful Church, are present on earth during the Great Tribulation of the final 3 1/2 years before Jesus Returns. Proved by Daniel 7:25 and Revelation 13:7
They are divided into two groups, as Daniel 11:32 and Revelation 12:14-17 say.

The Church is not here during the Tribulation except to come back with Christ at the end of the Tribulation .
Completely Scriptural and no guessing.
The Church IS NOT appointed to the wrath of God.
The verses you provided speak of Israel NOT the Church.

Douggg · Jul 31, 2020

iamlamad said:
Amazing: we are very close!

I fixed the 7th seal as entry into the middle of the 7 years.

Douggg · Jul 31, 2020

Choose Wisely said:
7th seal......................End of the tribulation.
7th trumpet................End of God's wrath.
7th vial.......................Ditto

I fixed the seventh seal in my view as entry into the middle of the 7 years.

Douggg · Jul 31, 2020

keras said:
Please explain why you place the Sixth Seal at Jesus Return? On your 'charts'.
After, or at the Seventh Vial.

In Matthew 24:29, at the end of the tribulation of those days. It is the at, near, the end of the great tribulation - but not quiet (by 45 days). That's when the sixth seal event happens. The sign of the Son of Man in heaven in Matthew 24:30a. Right before Matthew 24:30b coming down to earth in great power and glory, with the armies of heaven.

tribulation of those days - 1290 day long.
great tribulation = the tribulation of those days (1290 days) +45 days to gather at Armageddon = 1335 days.

The kings of the earth have to have a reason to gather their armies to make war on Jesus, in Revelation 16. They have to be threaten. The threat will be the sign of the Son of Man in heaven, in the sixth seal event, prepared to take vengeance on behalf of them martyred in the fifth seal.

The kings of the earth assemble their armies at Armageddon, march down surround Jerusalem, and packed around the temple mount, where the beast, false prophet, and the great statue image incarnated by Satan will be, the focal point - across from where Jesus will descend to the mount of Olives. Their strategy will be to take half the Jews there in Jerusalem as hostages.

As the last great vial of God's wrath, the 7th vial is poured out on the world, right before Jesus comes with his armies of heaven to earth; His return focused on Jerusalem, the temple mount, and the Mt. of Olives.

Timtofly · Jul 31, 2020

Just a reminder this is a pre-trib thread. Argument against is not allowed. Mid trib is iffy, so putting too much emphasis on mid-trib instead of before, is also questionable.

For those who teach the seals or any of Revelation has been fulfilled are not pre-trib views. This world cannot go on like it is any more. There have been nonstop tribulation of the church from day 1, so "after those days" has always been in effect. If no one accepts that this year has been a wake up call, not sure they have been watching any news. If some are looking for World War 3 to be tribulation, they will be disappointed. If some are waiting for an Antichrist, they will be disappointed. The return is supposed to take the world by surprise, not after obvious sought out signs.

keras · Jul 31, 2020

Douggg said:
In Matthew 24:29, at the end of the tribulation of those days. It is the at, near, the end of the great tribulation - but not quiet (by 45 days). That's when the sixth seal event happens. The sign of the Son of Man in heaven in Matthew 24:30a. Right before Matthew 24:30b coming down to earth in great power and glory, with the armies of heaven.

The Prophesies do not support your belief. You violate the Book of Revelation by placing the Sixth Seal anywhere else than where John placed it.

Douggg · Jul 31, 2020

Timtofly said:
Just a reminder this is a pre-trib thread. Argument against is not allowed. Mid trib is iffy, so putting too much emphasis on mid-trib instead of before, is also questionable.
.

Okay, I will drop out because I am anytime rapture view. Although I think the rapture could happen pre-trib (pre-70th week).

Timtofly · Jul 31, 2020

Douggg said:
Okay, I will drop out because I am anytime rapture view. Although I think the rapture could happen pre-trib (pre-70th week).

There are not many pre-trib who stick around for long here. But not many who can identify any trib whatsoever either. If no one agrees on the trib, no one agrees there is a rapture, the church is pretty much toast.

Marilyn C · Aug 1, 2020

Timtofly said:
There are not many pre-trib who stick around for long here. But not many who can identify any trib whatsoever either. If no one agrees on the trib, no one agrees there is a rapture, the church is pretty much toast.

Hi Tim,

This topic is one of the last great truths to be clarified. We all know the main truths of the good news of Christ, yet there is still the great truth of His purpose for the Body of Christ and when that will be fulfilled.

I believe the Head, the Lord Jesus Christ will come and connect with His body and take it to His own throne in the highest realm. There we will celebrate His glorious visible enthronement as He is given all praise and honour and glory. Then the Father gives His Son His inheritance of the nations which He will then proceed to judge. (Ps. 2: 6 - 9)

Choose Wisely · Aug 1, 2020

Timtofly said:
There are not many pre-trib who stick around for long here. But not many who can identify any trib whatsoever either. If no one agrees on the trib, no one agrees there is a rapture, the church is pretty much toast.

Yes, and as time goes on there will be less and less that will know the truth. Probably be best to watch and be ready as we were told.

ItIsFinished! · Aug 1, 2020

Paul CLEARLY teaches a Pre-trib Rapture of the Church BEFORE the coming Tribulation.
The early church fathers taught this as well.
This shouldn't be as difficult as many make it to be.
The Church will not suffer God's wrath.
God is not the author author of confusion, but Satan is the father of lies.

ItIsFinished! · Aug 1, 2020

Timtofly said:
There are not many pre-trib who stick around for long here. But not many who can identify any trib whatsoever either. If no one agrees on the trib, no one agrees there is a rapture, the church is pretty much toast.

ItIsFinished! · Aug 1, 2020

The Church is far from toast.
The Church is the Body/Bride of Christ regardless of what others think and teach.
Pre-Tribbers don't stay here long due to the vitriol hostilities from other "Christians".
It is why I and many others left.
I just stick my head in here every now and then.
I'm reminded why I left.

Choose Wisely · Aug 2, 2020

ItIsFinished! said:
Pre-Tribbers don't stay here long due to the vitriol hostilities from other "Christians".
It is why I and many others left.
I just stick my head in here every now and then.
I'm reminded why I left.

Yeah, and the use of deception, seems to be a common occurrence. No regard for truth.

Davy · Aug 2, 2020

ItIsFinished! said:
Paul CLEARLY teaches a Pre-trib Rapture of the Church BEFORE the coming Tribulation.
The early church fathers taught this as well.
This shouldn't be as difficult as many make it to be.
The Church will not suffer God's wrath.
God is not the author author of confusion, but Satan is the father of lies.

That just is not so. Why are you pushing a false doctrine of men when it's clear you have not really studied the Scriptures for yourself?

The events Jesus proclaimed in Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 align with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4 about Christ's coming to gather His Church. In the Matthew 24 example, it is about the gathering of the 'asleep' saints from the heavenly. In the Mark 13 version it's about the saints still alive on earth being gathered on the day of Christ's return. In BOTH versions Jesus showed that event will happen AFTER the tribulation.

In 2 Thessalonians 2:1-9, Apostle Paul showed that 2 events must happen prior to Jesus' coming and gathering of His Church. A great falling away AND the 'man of sin' (Antichrist) must be revealed sitting in a new temple in Jerusalem. That means the Antichrist must come first, and that means the great tribulation must occur first. Paul even showed there about Jesus' coming to destroy that false one.

In Matthew 24:23-26, Jesus warned of a singular pseudo-Christ coming that will work great signs and wonders so powerful in deception, that IF it were possible, would deceive even His very elect. The context of those verses is singular, not plural like the KJV translators has it. It is about the coming Antichrist to Jerusalem that will play GOD, and work miracles to show it.

Revelation 13:4-8 shows that the whole world will worship the "dragon" (another title for Satan per Rev.12:9), and be under his power for 42 months. Only those whose names were written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will not worship him.

Timtofly · Aug 2, 2020

Davy said:
That just is not so. Why are you pushing a false doctrine of men when it's clear you have not really studied the Scriptures for yourself?

The events Jesus proclaimed in Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 align with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4 about Christ's coming to gather His Church. In the Matthew 24 example, it is about the gathering of the 'asleep' saints from the heavenly. In the Mark 13 version it's about the saints still alive on earth being gathered on the day of Christ's return. In BOTH versions Jesus showed that event will happen AFTER the tribulation.

In 2 Thessalonians 2:1-9, Apostle Paul showed that 2 events must happen prior to Jesus' coming and gathering of His Church. A great falling away AND the 'man of sin' (Antichrist) must be revealed sitting in a new temple in Jerusalem. That means the Antichrist must come first, and that means the great tribulation must occur first. Paul even showed there about Jesus' coming to destroy that false one.

In Matthew 24:23-26, Jesus warned of a singular pseudo-Christ coming that will work great signs and wonders so powerful in deception, that IF it were possible, would deceive even His very elect. The context of those verses is singular, not plural like the KJV translators has it. It is about the coming Antichrist to Jerusalem that will play GOD, and work miracles to show it.

Revelation 13:4-8 shows that the whole world will worship the "dragon" (another title for Satan per Rev.12:9), and be under his power for 42 months. Only those whose names were written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will not worship him.

Revelation 13 happened after the Second Coming.

ItIsFinished! · Aug 2, 2020

Davy said:
That just is not so. Why are you pushing a false doctrine of men when it's clear you have not really studied the Scriptures for yourself?

The events Jesus proclaimed in Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 align with what Apostle Paul taught in 1 Thessalonians 4 about Christ's coming to gather His Church. In the Matthew 24 example, it is about the gathering of the 'asleep' saints from the heavenly. In the Mark 13 version it's about the saints still alive on earth being gathered on the day of Christ's return. In BOTH versions Jesus showed that event will happen AFTER the tribulation.

In 2 Thessalonians 2:1-9, Apostle Paul showed that 2 events must happen prior to Jesus' coming and gathering of His Church. A great falling away AND the 'man of sin' (Antichrist) must be revealed sitting in a new temple in Jerusalem. That means the Antichrist must come first, and that means the great tribulation must occur first. Paul even showed there about Jesus' coming to destroy that false one.

In Matthew 24:23-26, Jesus warned of a singular pseudo-Christ coming that will work great signs and wonders so powerful in deception, that IF it were possible, would deceive even His very elect. The context of those verses is singular, not plural like the KJV translators has it. It is about the coming Antichrist to Jerusalem that will play GOD, and work miracles to show it.

Revelation 13:4-8 shows that the whole world will worship the "dragon" (another title for Satan per Rev.12:9), and be under his power for 42 months. Only those whose names were written in the book of life from the foundation of the world will not worship him.

You seem rather hostile. And it would be wise for you not to falsely accuse one of the brethren.
Regardless if you strategically place a question mark at the end.
Anyone who studies the Scriptures knows Paul taught a Pre-trib removal of the Church before the Tribulation. This Bible 101 friend.
No Scriptural gymnastics here friend, unlike your theory.
The truth is clear and cut.
Oh, the Anti-Christ isn't revealed until after the pre-trib Rapture. Once again Bible 101.
You are intertwining the Rapture and The Second Coming of Christ. Two seperate and distinct events.
Not intertwined.

keras · Aug 2, 2020

ItIsFinished! said:
Anyone who studies the Scriptures knows Paul taught a Pre-trib removal of the Church before the Tribulation. This Bible 101 friend.

I study the scriptures and nowhere do I see Paul or anyone teaching a rapture to heaven of the Church, pre, mid or post Jesus Returning.
The issue of a 'rapture to heaven' for the Church is far from being accepted by many people who seriously study this belief. So believers in that idea cannot just assume that a rapture will happen.

They say; We Christians are not appointed to wrath. And this is a true statement, but it doesn't in any way mean that God intends to remove His people to heaven, to avoid any hardships and testing to come.
I have a list of 25 scriptures that say how the Lord will protect His people during His wrath.

What people should consider, is what does God want of us Christians? What is our destiny?
Jesus gave us a Commission; to spread the Gospel, Matthew 28:19-20
Will He say: Nah, don't need to bother any more, come up here and do harp practice! Let the ungodly stew in their own juice.

NO; we are His witnesses, Isaiah 43:8-13, John 15:27 and His Light to the nations, Isaiah 49:8, Matthew 5:14-16, also Ezekiel 39:27
THAT is our task, our destiny and our great privilege.

Pre-Trib Only My New End Times Chronology

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Forgiven

Jesus Christ is our only hope.

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Well-Known Member

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

Well-Known Member

Pre-tribulation.

Forgiven

Jesus Christ is our only hope.

Jesus Christ is our only hope.

Jesus Christ is our only hope.

Forgiven

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Jesus Christ is our only hope.

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

Similar threads