LDS Who did Joseph Smith see in the "Sacred Grove?"

He is the way · Jul 10, 2020

mmksparbud said:
I already told you---Jesus never sinned. I never said He sinned! I said He became sin at the cross for us that He may wash away our sins with His blood. Those who have not sinned, have been translated. It seems that you have obviously made up your mind years ago, because JS said so, and that means what he says supersedes the bible, which is what you all say anyway. Where JS and the bible contradict---JS is correct for the bible has been corrupted and only he has the truth. So why shouldn't I decide that what God says supersedes whatever JS says. God is truth. JS is not. Jesus saves, JS does not. Why should I give up truth for a lie? You are free to do so.

Just as the New Testament adds to the Old Testament, the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, and the Pearl of Great Price adds to the Bible. All are testaments of Jesus Christ and the gospel of LOVE. The Bible does not say all who have not sinned were translated. Many of the things you believe are not found in the Bible.

mmksparbud · Jul 10, 2020

He is the way said:
Just as the New Testament adds to the Old Testament, the Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, and the Pearl of Great Price adds to the Bible. All are testaments of Jesus Christ and the gospel of LOVE. The Bible does not say all who have not sinned were translated. Many of the things you believe are not found in the Bible.

The writings of JS do not add light to what the bible says---it totally changes what the bible says and makes statements that are not even hinted at in the entire bible. The NT is the fulfillment of the OT. The OT points to Jesus. Jesus, in the NT, points to the Father. Prophets amplify what is written, they open the eyes to what is already there, they do not make up stuff that was never hinted at, much less mentioned. We are bible based and every doctrine has been proven from the bible, no outside source needed. Oddly enough, in every thread that has tried to bash an SDA doctrine, we came on and used only scripture to defend the doctrine, it is always others who bring in outside sources and then insist we are the ones that are not biblical!

He is the way · Jul 10, 2020

mmksparbud said:
The writings of JS do not add light to what the bible says---it totally changes what the bible says and makes statements that are not even hinted at in the entire bible. The NT is the fulfillment of the OT. The OT points to Jesus. Jesus, in the NT, points to the Father. Prophets amplify what is written, they open the eyes to what is already there, they do not make up stuff that was never hinted at, much less mentioned. We are bible based and every doctrine has been proven from the bible, no outside source needed. Oddly enough, in every thread that has tried to bash an SDA doctrine, we came on and used only scripture to defend the doctrine, it is always others who bring in outside sources and then insist we are the ones that are not biblical!

There were a lot of things added and changed from the Old Testament to the New Testament. Stuff that wasn't even hinted about such as the sacrament, Baptism, the higher law, etc. The Jews rejected the New Testament. I would be surprised if people did not reject more of God's word.

twin.spin · Jul 12, 2020

Who did Joseph Smith see in the "Sacred Grove?"

Being that official LDS sources which state that grace is an enabling power to save oneself after all one can do (LDS Bible Dictionary, p 696 + 2 Nephi 25:33) ... it is clear who J.S. saw:

"And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works." KJV 2 Cor 11:14-15

If it were not Satan himself and one of his ministers, then it was no great thing for two of Satan's ministers.

He is the way · Jul 12, 2020

twin.spin said:
Who did Joseph Smith see in the "Sacred Grove?"

Being that official LDS sources which state that grace is an enabling power to save oneself after all one can do (LDS Bible Dictionary, p 696 + 2 Nephi 25:33) ... it is clear who J.S. saw:

"And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works." KJV 2 Cor 11:14-15

If it were not Satan himself and one of his ministers, then it was no great thing for two of Satan's ministers.

That is merely a presumption.

Rescued One · Jul 13, 2020

He is the way said:
That is merely a presumption.

It is merely a presumption that Joseph Smith saw what he claimed to have seen, but Christians know he was lying.

He is the way · Jul 13, 2020

Phoebe Ann said:
It is merely a presumption that Joseph Smith saw what he claimed to have seen, but Christians know he was lying.

There were many sworn witnesses to the Book of Mormon plates. We therefore know that he was NOT lying.

Rescued One · Jul 13, 2020

He is the way said:
There were many sworn witnesses to the Book of Mormon plates. We therefore know that he was NOT lying.

He lied. There are many liars in the world. You weren't acquainted with any of his friends.

He is the way · Jul 13, 2020

Phoebe Ann said:
He lied. There are many liars in the world. You weren't acquainted with any of his friends.

You have NO idea who I am acquainted with or what I know. A lot of people can't see the truth when it is right in front of them.

Rescued One · Jul 13, 2020

He is the way said:
You have NO idea who I am acquainted with or what I know. A lot of people can't see the truth when it is right in front of them.

Joseph Smith's friends are dead and gone. Are you into the occult?

drstevej · Jul 14, 2020

He is the way said:
You have NO idea who I am acquainted with or what I know. A lot of people can't see the truth when it is right in front of them.

Can I shake your hand?

He is the way · Jul 14, 2020

Phoebe Ann said:
Joseph Smith's friends are dead and gone. Are you into the occult?

Joseph Smith's legacy continues through those who knew him and his descendants. His devotion to God is well known as is the marvelous Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, and the Pearl of Great Price. We believe in the true God of the Bible and Jesus Christ who He sent.

Rescued One · Jul 14, 2020

He is the way said:
Joseph Smith's legacy continues through those who knew him and his descendants.

Like I said, you didn't know him or his friends.

He is the way said:
His devotion to God is well known as is the marvelous Book of Mormon, the Doctrine and Covenants, and the Pearl of Great Price.

Those books are proof that he wanted te praise of men.

He is the way said:
We believe in the true God of the Bible and Jesus Christ who He sent.

The Mormon religion lies about God:

President Joseph F. Smith taught: “I know that God is a being with body, parts and passions.... Man was born of woman; Christ, the Savior, was born of woman; and God, the Father was born of woman” (Church News, 19 Sept. 1936, p. 2).

President Wilford Woodruff explained: “[God] has had his endowments a great many years ago. He has ascended to his thrones, principalities and powers in the eternities. We are his children.....We are here to fill a probation and receive an education” (Deseret News Weekly, 28 Sept. 1881, p. 546).

How does it help us to know that the basic elements of God’s life in a mortal world were the same as ours? President Brigham Young explained:

“...There never was a time when there were not Gods and worlds and when men were not passing through the same ordeals that we are now passing through....

“It appears ridiculous to the world, under their darkened and erroneous traditions, that God has been a finite being” (Deseret News, 16 Nov. 1859, p. 290).
Search These Commandments, Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, Copyright 1984, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, pp. 152-153

He is the way · Jul 14, 2020

Phoebe Ann said:
Like I said, you didn't know him or his friends.

Those books are proof that he wanted te praise of men.

The Mormon religion lies about God:

President Joseph F. Smith taught: “I know that God is a being with body, parts and passions.... Man was born of woman; Christ, the Savior, was born of woman; and God, the Father was born of woman” (Church News, 19 Sept. 1936, p. 2).

President Wilford Woodruff explained: “[God] has had his endowments a great many years ago. He has ascended to his thrones, principalities and powers in the eternities. We are his children.....We are here to fill a probation and receive an education” (Deseret News Weekly, 28 Sept. 1881, p. 546).

How does it help us to know that the basic elements of God’s life in a mortal world were the same as ours? President Brigham Young explained:

“...There never was a time when there were not Gods and worlds and when men were not passing through the same ordeals that we are now passing through....

“It appears ridiculous to the world, under their darkened and erroneous traditions, that God has been a finite being” (Deseret News, 16 Nov. 1859, p. 290).
Search These Commandments, Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, Copyright 1984, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, pp. 152-153

I know Joseph Smith through my great great grandfather's diaries, and the books written about him by credible witnesses. I also know that the witnesses who seen the plates did not deny what they had seen and held. I also know that calling the truth a lie does not make it a lie. God has a body and He is not finite being.

Rescued One · Jul 18, 2020

He is the way said:
There were a lot of things added and changed from the Old Testament to the New Testament. Stuff that wasn't even hinted about such as the sacrament, Baptism, the higher law, etc. The Jews rejected the New Testament. I would be surprised if people did not reject more of God's word.

The word Sacrament to Mormons means bread and water in remembrance of the body and blood of their Jesus who was capable of sin and had to earn godhood like his father did; false gods that never existed.

Christians know that communion did not take place before Christ instituted it at the Last Supper.

Rescued One · Jul 18, 2020

He is the way said:
I know Joseph Smith through my great great grandfather's diaries, and the books written about him by credible witnesses. I also know that the witnesses who seen the plates did not deny what they had seen and held. I also know that calling the truth a lie does not make it a lie. God has a body and He is not finite being.

You only know what has been written by deceased Mormons that you never knew. Karl Marx was a writer, too.

Brigham Young and other false prophets wrote what they believed.

How does it help us to know that the basic elements of God’s life in a mortal world were the same as ours? President Brigham Young explained:

“He is our Father—the Father of our Spirits—and was once a man in mortal flesh as we are....

“...There never was a time when there were not Gods and worlds and when men were not passing through the same ordeals that we are now passing through....

“It appears ridiculous to the world, under their darkened and erroneous traditions, that God has been a finite being” (Deseret News, 16 Nov. 1859)

President Joseph F. Smith taught: “I know that God is a being with body, parts and passions.... Man was born of woman; Christ, the Savior, was born of woman; and God, the Father was born of woman” (Church News, 19 Sept. 1936, p. 2).
Search These Commandments, Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, Copyright 1984, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, pp. 152-153

He is the way · Jul 18, 2020

Phoebe Ann said:
The word Sacrament to Mormons means bread and water in remembrance of the body and blood of their Jesus who was capable of sin and had to earn godhood like his father did; false gods that never existed.

Christians know that communion did not take place before Christ instituted it at the Last Supper.

Jesus was capable of sin, but He overcame the world and was perfected:

(New Testament | John 16:33)

33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

(New Testament | Luke 13:32 - 33)

32 And he said unto them, Go ye, and tell that fox, Behold, I cast out devils, and I do cures to day and to morrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.
33 Nevertheless I must walk to day, and to morrow, and the day following: for it cannot be that a prophet perish out of Jerusalem.

He is the way · Jul 18, 2020

Phoebe Ann said:
You only know what has been written by deceased Mormons that you never knew. Karl Marx was a writer, too.

Brigham Young and other false prophets wrote what they believed.

How does it help us to know that the basic elements of God’s life in a mortal world were the same as ours? President Brigham Young explained:

“He is our Father—the Father of our Spirits—and was once a man in mortal flesh as we are....

“...There never was a time when there were not Gods and worlds and when men were not passing through the same ordeals that we are now passing through....

“It appears ridiculous to the world, under their darkened and erroneous traditions, that God has been a finite being” (Deseret News, 16 Nov. 1859)

President Joseph F. Smith taught: “I know that God is a being with body, parts and passions.... Man was born of woman; Christ, the Savior, was born of woman; and God, the Father was born of woman” (Church News, 19 Sept. 1936, p. 2).
Search These Commandments, Melchizedek Priesthood Personal Study Guide, Copyright 1984, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, pp. 152-153

How do people know about Jesus Christ? Do they not read and believe?

mmksparbud · Jul 18, 2020

He is the way said:
Jesus was capable of sin, but He overcame the world and was perfected:

(New Testament | John 16:33)

33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

(New Testament | Luke 13:32 - 33)

32 And he said unto them, Go ye, and tell that fox, Behold, I cast out devils, and I do cures to day and to morrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.
33 Nevertheless I must walk to day, and to morrow, and the day following: for it cannot be that a prophet perish out of Jerusalem.

Not exactly---Jesus could have sinned, that is true. However, He never did. He was perfected---means He fulfilled His work, He had reached the end without having known sin, but He became sin at the cross and carried the weight of all those sins on the cross. He was perfectly one with God, which is why He never sinned. With His life, He showed man that he may do as He had done by being one with God and overcoming all sin in ourselves through the Power of God, the Holy Spirit.

He is the way · Jul 18, 2020

mmksparbud said:
Not exactly---Jesus could have sinned, that is true. However, He never did. He was perfected---means He fulfilled His work, He had reached the end without having known sin, but He became sin at the cross and carried the weight of all those sins on the cross. He was perfectly one with God, which is why He never sinned. With His life, He showed man that he may do as He had done by being one with God and overcoming all sin in ourselves through the Power of God, the Holy Spirit.

Jesus did the will of the Father which He also requires of us:

(New Testament | John 6:38)

38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

(New Testament | Matthew 7:21)

21 ¶ Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

LDS Who did Joseph Smith see in the "Sacred Grove?"

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