WHY SOLA SCRIPTURA MAKES SENSE - UPDATED.

Albion · Jul 4, 2020

Tradidi said:
How do you know that?

I'm pretty well informed on what the various branches of the Christian religion teach about the place of Holy Scripture in their particular statements of belief.

thecolorsblend · Jul 4, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Hi all wanted to update this one to show that faith in God's Word alone is the sole source of eternal life.

Those who seek to tear it down do so at their own peril. In it is the light of life and without it there is only darnkess. Those who do not come to the light (the Word) do not come lest their evil deeds are exposed. This is the reason many seek to put out the light. It is a lamp and a light to our path and without it we cannot find our way to JESUS.

Let's share the scriptures...

PSLAMS 27:1 The LORD is my light and my salvation; whom shall I fear? the LORD is the strength of my life; of whom shall I be afraid?

PSLAMS 36:9 For with you is the fountain of life: in your light shall we see light.

PSLAMS 43:3 O send out your light and your truth: let them lead me; let them bring me to your holy hill, and to your tabernacles.

PSLAMS 119:105 YOUR WORD IS A LAMP UNTO MY FEET AND A LIGHT UNTO MY PATH.

PSALMS 119:130 THE ENTRANCE OF YOUR WORDS GIVES LIGHT; IT GIVES UNDERSTANDING TO THE SIMPLE

PROVERBS 6:23 FOR THE COMMANDMENT IS A LAMP AND THE LAW IS LIGHT; and reproofs of instruction are the way of life:

ISAIAH 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is NO LIGHT IN THEM

JOHN 1:1-4; 14 [1], In the beginning was the WORD, and the WORD was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. [2], The same was in the beginning with God. [3], All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. [4], In him was life; and the life was the light of men. [5], And THE LIGHT (Word) SHINES IN DARKNESS; and the darkness comprehended it not.

[14] AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH AND DWELT AMOUNG US and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

JOHN 3:19-21 And this is the condemnation, that LIGHT (the Word) IS COME INTO THE WORLD, and men loved darkness rather than LIGHT (the Word), because their deeds were evil. FOR EVERYONE THAT DOES EVIL HATES THE LIGHT (the Word), neither comes to the LIGHT (the Word), lest his deeds should be reproved. BUT HE THAT DOES TRUTH COMES TO THE LIGHT (the Word), that his deeds may be made manifest, that they are worked in God.

JOHN 8:12 Then spoke Jesus again to them, saying, I AM THE LIGHT OF THE WORLD (The Word see JOHN 1:1-4; 14): he that follows me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

2 TIMOTHY 3:16-17 [16], ALL SCRIPTURE IS GIVEN BY INSPIRATION OF GOD (God breathed) and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. [17], That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished to all good works.

2 TIMOTHY 2:15 STUDY TO SHOW YOURSELF APPROVED TO GOD, a workman that needs not to be ashamed, RIGHTLY DIVIDING THE WORD OF TRUTH.

JOHN 14:26 [26], But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, HE SHALL TEACH YOU ALL THINGS, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatever I HAVE SAID TO YOU.

JOHN 16:13 [13], However, WHEN HE THE SPIRIT OF TRUTH IS COME HE WILL GUIDE YOU INTO ALL TRUTH: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will show you things to come.

JOHN 17:17 SANCTIFY THEM THROUGH THE TRUTH THY WORD IS TRUTH

JOHN 8:31-32 [31], Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, IF YOU CONTINUE IN MY WORD THEN YOU ARE MY DISCIPLES INDEED AND YOU SHALL KNOW THE TRUTH AND THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREE

EPHESIANS 2:8 [8], FOR BY GRAECE ARE YOU SAVED THROUGH FAITH; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God (links to)

ROMANS 10:17 FAITH COMES BY HEARING AND HEARING BY THE WORD OF GOD

..................

According to the scriptures God's salvation only comes by faith in God's WORD. If there is no Word there is no faith and if there is no faith there is no salvation to those who reject God's Words. There is no righteousness without faith as there is no faith without Gods' Word. BEWARE of those who seek to teach you contrary to the scriptures.

What are your thoughts?

ACTS 17:11 [11], These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

FRIENDLY DISCUSSION PLEASE (no flamming and goading)

God bless.

As ever, "sola scriptura" is a vague, nebulous, unhelpful and self-contradictory system.

And no, I'm not just saying that because nobody ever seems to agree on what it even means.

LoveGodsWord · Jul 4, 2020

thecolorsblend said:
As ever, "sola scriptura" is a vague, nebulous, unhelpful and self-contradictory system.

And no, I'm not just saying that because nobody ever seems to agree on what it even means.

Nonsense. "Sola Sciptura" is the only way into God's kingdom through faith in what God says. Your meme is not true. Why? What do you think the gospel is that is to go to the world? Yep the Word of God. The gospel is the good news of Jesus Christ the living Word of God. This is the gospel that is to go to the world. What is the Word of God? - Yep the scriptures. This meme below is probably more accurate reflection of the discussion here....

Hope this helps...

thecolorsblend · Jul 4, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Nonsense. "Sola Sciptura" is the only way into God's kingdom through faith in what God says. Your meme is not true. Why? What do you think the gospel is that is to go to the world? Yep the Word of God. The gospel is the good news of Jesus Christ the living Word of God. This is the gospel that is to go to the world. What is the Word of God? - Yep the scriptures. This meme below is probably more accurate here....

View attachment 280281

Hope this helps...

Golly...

Tradidi · Jul 4, 2020

Albion said:
Well, I was not asking just a rhetorical or theoretical question. If there is something that is the equal in authority to the word of God, we need to know what it is.

Equal in authority to the written Word of God is the spoken Word of God. The spoken Word of God came first and is contained in Tradition. The written Word of God came second (in time) and is contained in the Scriptures. Since both authorities are of Divine origin, and since God can neither deceive nor be deceived, they cannot contradict each other. They never have and they never will.

Equal in authority to the written and spoken Word of God is the authority of the Church He founded. How do we know? Because the spoken and the written Word of God told us so, and no greater authority can possibly override God's word, whether we like it or not, not even the "great" Martin Luther himself! Unfortunately, here is where most protestants will block their ears, like the Jews did when Christ proclaimed His Divinity to them.

Tradidi · Jul 5, 2020

Albion said:
I'm pretty well informed on what the various branches of the Christian religion teach about the place of Holy Scripture in their particular statements of belief.

All good and well, but being informed on different theories is useful in playing trivial pursuit. Being aware of which one is the correct theory is a matter of eternal salvation.

GodsGrace101 · Jul 5, 2020

JAL said:
Exactly. One must prayerfully seek God to illuminate the written Word - one MUST seek Direct Revelation. That's hardly a rebuttal.

Indiscriminately conflating written Word and divine/spoken Word.

Clearly, that was not my premise. I didn't say that the Bible itself was tainted. I said that exegesis is a man-tainted lens that, as such, perceives a man-tainted version of Scripture. Here again, you've had multiple opportunities to rebut my objection but utterly failed to meet the real force of it.

When you claim that a premise is false, you might want to actually comment on the suppositions of that premise, instead of spewing forth a slew of tangential statements that bear no clear relation to the premise.

Indiscriminately conflating written Word and divine/spoken Word.

(1) Where do those verses clearly advocate exegesis - the attempt to understand the Scriptures on the basis of bible-scholarship and seminaries instead of divine illumination?
(2) Why do you continue to indiscriminately conflate written Word and divine/spoken Word?

I just fell upon this post,,,,
sorry I haven't been following along.

What is Direct Revelation?
One must seek direct revelation is your statement.
What is it??

GodsGrace101 · Jul 5, 2020

Tradidi said:
Equal in authority to the written Word of God is the spoken Word of God. The spoken Word of God came first and is contained in Tradition. The written Word of God came second (in time) and is contained in the Scriptures. Since both authorities are of Divine origin, and since God can neither deceive nor be deceived, they cannot contradict each other. They never have and they never will.

Equal in authority to the written and spoken Word of God is the authority of the Church He founded. How do we know? Because the spoken and the written Word of God told us so, and no greater authority can possibly override God's word, whether we like it or not, not even the "great" Martin Luther himself! Unfortunately, here is where most protestants will block their ears, like the Jews did when Christ proclaimed His Divinity to them.

You say Tradition is the spoken word of God?
And that it came BEFORE Jesus?
Could you please give an example ....
or a verse?

I've just never heard of this before and I happen to know Catholic Doctrine.

JAL · Jul 5, 2020

GodsGrace101 said:
I just fell upon this post,,,,
sorry I haven't been following along.

What is Direct Revelation?
One must seek direct revelation is your statement.
What is it??

Direct revelation is a two-faceted delivery of a message from God to men.
(1) He sees to it that a message is conveyed, whether by an angel, a prophet, by His own voice, or even by a written text such as the Bible.
(2) His Spirit convicts (convinces) us that the message is true - He causes us to feel certain about the veracity/authority/authenticity/righteousness of the message.

This imposes upon us a moral obligation to immediately acquiesce (no need to 'check it out with scripture') due to the following compelling maxim:

"If I feel certain that action-A is evil, and B is good, I should opt for B".

LoveGodsWord · Jul 5, 2020

JAL said:
Direct revelation is a two-faceted delivery of a message from God to men.
(1) He sees to it that a message is conveyed, whether by an angel, a prophet, by His own voice, or even by a written text such as the Bible.
(2) His Spirit convicts (convinces) us that the message is true - He causes us to feel certain about the veracity/authority/authenticity/righteousness of the message.

This imposes upon us a moral obligation to immediately acquiesce (no need to 'check it out with scripture') due to the following compelling maxim:

"If I feel certain that action-A is evil, and B is good, I should opt for B".

Yet how can you know what good and evil is if you do not know God's Word when good and evil, truth and error is revlealed through the Word of God? - You cannot as truth is not a feeling God's Word is the very definition of what truth is *John 6:63. It is this very Word of God you deny that teaches that our hearts (thoughts and feelings) without Jesus are deceitful above all things and desperately wicked and we do not even know them *Jeremiah 17:9-10. If this is the case dear friend, how can you know what truth is without God's Word when it is the Word of God that is the very definition of what truth is *John 6:63? Trusting in your feelings while denying God's Word will only lead one away from God and His Word and if we are only saved by God's grace through Faith how can you be saved when you have no Word where faith begins? Only God's Word is true and is the reason why we should believe and follow it *Romans 3:4

JAL · Jul 5, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Yet how can you know what good and evil is if you do not know God's Word when good and evil, truth and error is revlealed through the Word of God? - You cannot as truth is not a feeling God's Word is the very definition of what truth is *John 6:63. It is this very Word of God you deny that teaches that our hearts (thoughts and feelings) without Jesus are deceitful above all things and desperately wicked and we do not even know them *Jeremiah 17:9-10. If this is the case dear friend, how can you know what truth is without God's Word when it is the Word of God that is the very definition of what truth is *John 6:63? Trusting in your feelings while denying God's Word will only lead one away from God and His Word and if we are only saved by God's grace through Faith how can you be saved when you have no Word where faith begins? Only God's Word is true and is the reason why we should believe and follow it *Romans 3:4

Neither you nor anyone else can possibly postulate even one hypothetical scenario that clearly calls for departure from the rule:

"If I feel certain that action-A is evil, and B is good, I should opt for B".

You LIVE by that rule 100% of the time (otherwise you'd be able to specify scenarios in your own life that warranted departure from it). Therefore you can't possibly expect me to take you seriously when you hypocritically protest the rule on this forum. You're just contradicting yourself. Period.

Tradidi · Jul 5, 2020

GodsGrace101 said:
You say Tradition is the spoken word of God?
And that it came BEFORE Jesus?
Could you please give an example ....
or a verse?

I've just never heard of this before and I happen to know Catholic Doctrine.

Who said "Tradition is the spoken Word of God" or "Tradition came before Jesus"?

I said "Tradition contains the spoken Word of God" and "the spoken Word came before the written Word", in other words, "Tradition came before the Scriptures".

Albion · Jul 5, 2020

Tradidi said:
Who said "Tradition is the spoken Word of God" or "Tradition came before Jesus"?

I said "Tradition contains the spoken Word of God" and "the spoken Word came before the written Word", in other words, "Tradition came before the Scriptures".

All right. Let's go with your version as you want it to be.

The propositions made in all of them are incorrect. Tradition is not the spoken word of God, nor does Scripture give any support to that manmade notion.

It's just a theory, except dogma has been built on it and the people told they must believe that dogma.

If we instead say "Tradition came before the Scriptures," that's partially true, but nothing changes. Traditions, customs, legends, folk religion, theological speculation and everything else that goes under that heading is just of human origin.

What's more, most of the "Tradition" you are referring to is not traditional anyway, since there is not an unbroken line of belief throughout the Christian world supporting any of it. Papal Infallibility, for instance. Or the Immaculate Conception.

Tradidi · Jul 5, 2020

Albion said:
Tradition is not the spoken word of God, nor does Scripture give any support to that manmade notion.

Not even two sentences into your reply and you are already twisting my words, right after I pointed it out to some other member. What else can I say?

Albion · Jul 5, 2020

Tradidi said:
Not even two sentences into your reply and you are already twisting my words, right after I pointed it out to some other member. What else can I say?

What I said was that all the statements you referred to--your two and the other two--are incorrect on their face. It doesn't matter which one or two or four we examine, they are all factually incorrect.

"Tradition is the spoken Word of God"

"Tradition came before Jesus"

"Tradition contains the spoken Word of God"

"the spoken Word came before the written Word"

It doesn't matter which one or two or four we examine, they are all factually incorrect.

Tradidi · Jul 5, 2020

Albion said:
What I said was that all the statements you referred to--your two and the other two--are incorrect on their face. It doesn't matter which one or two or four we examine, they are all factually incorrect.

"Tradition is the spoken Word of God"

"Tradition came before Jesus"

"Tradition contains the spoken Word of God"

"the spoken Word came before the written Word"

It doesn't matter which one or two or four we examine, they are all factually incorrect.

I am not interested in defending incorrect statements I did not make.

LoveGodsWord · Jul 5, 2020

JAL said:
Neither you nor anyone else can possibly postulate even one hypothetical scenario that clearly calls for departure from the rule:

"If I feel certain that action-A is evil, and B is good, I should opt for B".

You LIVE by that rule 100% of the time (otherwise you'd be able to specify scenarios in your own life that warranted departure from it). Therefore you can't possibly expect me to take you seriously when you hypocritically protest the rule on this forum. You're just contradicting yourself. Period.

Hello dear friend. Nice to see you again. You avoided answering a single question asked of you here. As posted earlier, how can you know what good and evil is if you do not know God's Word when good and evil, truth and error is defined through the Word of God?

You cannot as truth is not a feeling God's Word is the very definition of what truth is *John 6:63.

It is this very Word of God you deny that teaches that our hearts (thoughts and feelings) without Jesus are deceitful above all things and desperately wicked and we do not even know them *Jeremiah 17:9-10.

If this is the case dear friend, how can you know what truth is without God's Word when it is the Word of God that is the very definition of what truth is *John 6:63?

Trusting in your feelings while denying God's Word will only lead one away from God and His Word and if we are only saved by God's grace through Faith how can you be saved when you have no Word where faith begins? Only God's Word is true and is the reason why we should believe and follow it *Romans 3:4.

Look forward to your reply.

JAL · Jul 5, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Hello dear friend. Nice to see you again. You avoided answering a single question asked of you here. As posted earlier, how can you know what good and evil is if you do not know God's Word when good and evil, truth and error is defined through the Word of God?

You talk as though you yourself know what is good and evil. So I take it you are infallible? No? You don't really know anything for sure, right? Ok so apparently your approach to knowledge (exegesis?) hasn't succeeded for you as yet.

Can you please explain to me what are the impediments - under what circumstances will it allow you to know something for sure?

And it seems you're asking me the same question. Sure, I'll give you my answer. I think the prophets knew stuff (infallibly). And when a prophet claimed to know something, I think part of what he was saying was, "I'm certain of it. I feel certain". After all, it doesn't make sense to say, "I know for certain what I am talking about. I'm just uncertain."

I think I just gave you a pretty straight answer. Care to respond in kind, to the same types of questions?

LoveGodsWord · Jul 5, 2020

JAL said:
You talk as though you yourself know what is good and evil. So I take it you are infallible? No? You don't really know anything for sure, right? Ok so apparently your approach to knowledge (exegesis?) hasn't succeeded for you as yet.

Can you please explain to me what are the impediments - under what circumstances will it allow you to know something for sure?

And it seems you're asking me the same question. Sure, I'll give you my answer. I think the prophets knew stuff (infallibly). And when a prophet claimed to know something, I think part of what he was saying was, "I'm certain of it. I feel certain". After all, it doesn't make sense to say, "I know for certain what I am talking about. I'm just uncertain."

I think I just gave you a pretty straight answer. Care to respond in kind, to the same types of questions?

Indeed I do know what good and evil is as I know it as it is defined in the scriptures. Why are you ignoring the post you are quoting from and why not answer the questions asked of you? The prophets never said anywhere that they feel anything in relation to what Gods' Word means. Your making this up. It is only through the scriptures we know what good and evil, sin and righteousness and truth and error is. If you ignore God's Word as revlealed through the scriptures your ignore the very foundation of which our salvation is based through faith. We are only saved by God's grace as we believe and follow it THROUGH FAITH *Ephesians 2:8-9; John 8:31-32 and faith only comes by hearing and hearing by the Word of God *Romans 10:17 and whatsoever is not of faith is sin *Romans 14:23. Sin will keep all those who knowingly practice it out of God's kingdom *Hebrews 10:26-27.

Do the math...

No Word = No Faith = No Salvation

Hope this helps.

JAL · Jul 5, 2020

LoveGodsWord said:
Indeed I do know what good and evil is as I know it as it is defined in the scriptures. Why are you ignoring the post you are quoting from and why not answer the questions asked of you? The prophets never said anywhere that they feel anything in relation to what Gods' Word means. Your making this up.

Again, pointing out a logical contradiction is not making things up. It is a logical contradiction for a prophet to say, "I know for sure what message the Lord wants me to tell you, but I still don't feel certain that I know". Huh? That's total nonsense.

Since you've decided to embrace irrational nonsense that no one can make any sense of, I don't plan to discuss any further with you.

WHY SOLA SCRIPTURA MAKES SENSE - UPDATED.

Facilitator

If God is your Father, who is your Mother?

Well-Known Member

If God is your Father, who is your Mother?

Active Member

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran

Well-Known Member

Veteran

Active Member

Facilitator

Active Member

Facilitator

Active Member

Well-Known Member

Veteran

Well-Known Member

Veteran

Similar threads