An allegorical study of Genesis 1...

orbiter · Jul 4, 2020

Hi all,

Peace.

I wanted to do a thread…a Bible study… of Genesis chapter 1 as an allegory of the regeneration of mankind. Jesus mentioned this “regeneration” in Matthew 19 :

Matthew 19:28 KJV
(28) And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

In Titus 3:5, we have the “washing of regeneration” and renewing of the Holy Spirit:

Titus 3:4-6 KJV
(4) But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
(5) Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
(6) Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

Genesis 1:1 is a summary of God creating the literal (all things visible and invisible) heavens and the earth through Jesus who is the Beginning.

Genesis 1:1 KJV (1) In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

There is no definite article (“the”) for “in the beginning”. Instead, it should read “in Beginning….”.

We are told in Revelation 3:14 that Jesus is the Beginning of the creation of God.

Revelation 3:14 KJV
(14) And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

In other words, all things in heaven and earth were created through Jesus (the Beginning):

John 1:3 KJV
(3) All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

And again, by Him (the Beginning) were all things (את, eth: A to Z) were created that are in Heaven and that are in earth, visible and invisible. He is before all things and by Him all things consist.

Colossians 1:15-19 KJV
(15) Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: (16) For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
(17) And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

He is the Beginning.

(18) And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
(19) For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

The invisible things of God (His attributes) are clearly seen by mankind in the things that are made in the visible creation of this world so that mankind is without excuse. We can clearly see His eternal power and wisdom in the visible creation. In Beginning, God created the heavens and the earth.

Romans 1:20-22 KJV
(20) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

But in Genesis 1:2, the earth BECAME (hāyəṯāh) without form (the form of God’s righteousness) and void of God’s knowledge as mankind became vain in his imaginations (discussions, reasoning) and his foolish heart was darkened (the darkness was upon the face of the deep). Mankind did not think to retain what knowledge they had of Him as seen literally by all in the creation.

(21) Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
(22) Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

The will of God now is not being done in the earth as it is done in Heaven. Part of the creation… the earth… BECAME without form and void.

Matthew 6:9-10 KJV
(9) After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.
(10) Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.

The earth BECAME (hāyəṯāh) without form….that is, without the form of God’s righteousness…and void of God’s knowledge as mankind’s foolish heart was darkened.

So now mankind needs to have his mind enlightened with the knowledge of God (the Light) spoken to him so that the earth will be again living according to the rule of Heaven who does the will of God and has never stopped doing His will.

Genesis 1:2 KJV
(2) And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

As the Scriptures says in Jeremiah: His people is foolish….they have not known God…none have understanding….to do good they have no knowledge…

Jeremiah 4:22-23 KJV
(22) For my people is foolish, they have not known me; they are sottish children, and they have none understanding: they are wise to do evil, but to do good they have no knowledge.

….which leads Jeremiah to almost directly quote Genesis 1:2 to parallel the condition of God’s people. As a result of the spiritually impoverished condition of His people, the earth had become without form (no longer doing God’s righteousness) and void of the understanding of God. The heavens had no light as there is not any knowledge of God being preached.

(23) I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light.

Again, the earth became without form and void as there is none that are righteous (without the form of righteousness) and none that understand (void of understanding).

Romans 3:9-18 KJV
(9) What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;
(10) As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
(11) There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

They have all together BECOME unprofitable as none does good. The earth BECAME without form and void.

(12) They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

Again….In Beginning (Jesus who is the Beginning), God created the heavens and the earth so that mankind can clearly understand God’s invisible attributes through the literal presentation of the awe-inspiring, visible universe. Jesus is the express image of God...and so is the visible creation that displays His invisible qualities.

Romans 1: KJV
(20) For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

But people BECAME vain in their imaginations…in their discussions and reasoning…and their foolish heart was darkened. They have no understanding even though they think they do. Professing themselves as wise, they became fools and so mankind is without excuse.

Darkness was upon the face of the deep.... the darkness of the foolish heart of mankind which is like deep waters.

“Counsel” or rather man’s intentions within the heart is like deep water: (Proverbs 20:5 Counsel in the heart of man is like deep water; but a man of understanding will draw it out.)

Darkness was upon the face of the deep as man’s foolish heart was darkened.

Now mankind must hear the knowledge of God via the Spirit of God that moves upon the face of the waters. Holy men of God speak as they are moved by the Holy Spirit:

2 Peter 1:20-21 KJV
(20) Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
(21) For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

The earth became without the form of His righteousness and void of His understanding as we, ourselves, were foolish, disobedient, deceived…..

Titus 3:3-6 KJV
(3) For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

….but after that, the kindness and love of God our Savior appears toward man who became unprofitable as man’s “works of righteousness” do nothing to save him. God saves us from ourselves because He is merciful and loves His creation, mankind. He does this by the “washing of regeneration” and renewin of the Holy Spirit which He sheds on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior.

(4) But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
(5) Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
(6) Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

The first message to mankind who had become without the form of His righteousness and void of His knowledge and his foolish heart was darkened is that “God is Light”. This is the message found in Genesis 1:3....God is light and all that walk with Him in light are to respond to that light with light...with good works.

Genesis 1:3 KJV
(3) And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

God is Light.

What God is really saying in Genesis 1:3 through Jesus (the Beginning) is that He IS (Hebrew: hayah) Light instead of “let there be light”.

God is Light and in Him is no darkness. The “I AM” is light…“I AM” light. I AM what I AM….and that is Light.

This is the first message to the earth that had become without form (without the form of His righteousness) and void of the knowledge of God and the heart of mankind became darkened.

Mankind needs to have the knowledge of God declared unto him as men of God speak as they are moved by the Holy Spirit (and the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters).

Genesis 1 to be continued....

orbiter · Jul 4, 2020

This is the message which we have heard of Him and is declared unto us: that God is light…and this message is found from the beginning in Genesis 1:3. The "message" is the Word or Saying of life.

1 John 1:5 KJV
(5) This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.

That which was from the beginning (God speaking through Jesus who is the Beginning in Genesis 1:3), which we have heard…..the Word of life. This Word or Saying of life is that “God is light” and in Him is no darkness at all. Jesus is the living image of God...the Word of life incarnate so to speak who lives the message that God is light.

1 John 1:1 KJV
(1) That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;

In Beginning (no definite article “the”), was the Word or Saying and the Saying was with (that is, toward.... about) God and the Saying was God.

That “Saying” or Word is about the nature of God: God IS Light.

The Saying came from Jesus who is the Beginning of the creation of God who gives the darkened heart of man that knowledge from Genesis 1. The same was in the Beginning with God.

Yet, the Light shines in the darkness and the darkness does not comprehend it.

John 1:1-5 KJV
(1) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
(2) The same was in the beginning with God.
(3) All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
(4) In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
(5) And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

“And there was light”….we must respond to His Light with light…with good works and not the works of darkness. If we say we have fellowship with Him in the Light but walk in darkness, we lie and do not the truth.

1 John 1:5-7 KJV
(5) This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
(6) If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
(7) But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

Again, he that says he is in the light and yet hates his brother is in darkness even until now. He has no understanding of God.

1 John 2:8-11 KJV
(8) Again, a new commandment I write unto you, which thing is true in him and in you: because the darkness is past, and the true light now shineth.
(9) He that saith he is in the light, and hateth his brother, is in darkness even until now.
(10) He that loveth his brother abideth in the light, and there is none occasion of stumbling in him.

He that hates his brother will not receive what a brother may say in the Spirit of Truth and will speak evil of him. The darkness has blinded his eyes….the eyes of his understanding. He will not be able to enter in to know the knowledge of God because of the works of darkness. envy, strife, wrath, hatred, etc.

(11) But he that hateth his brother is in darkness, and walketh in darkness, and knoweth not whither he goeth, because that darkness hath blinded his eyes.

The light shines within our very own hearts when we hear the voice of Jesus who comes to open up the Scriptures to our ears. It is the witness of God within us about His Son whose voice we are to hear. We shall know that this is His Son whom He is well pleased in. He sends His servants out to speak His words of life and spirit to the churches in the Spirit of truth.

The Light shines in a dark place (the heart). The bright and morning star arises within our hearts when we hear the voice of the Son interpreting the Scriptures…and we must respond to His Light with light (and there was light).

2 Peter 1:19-20 KJV
(19) We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
(20) Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

“And there was light”: we are to become children of light when we have that light within us. While we have the light, we are to believe in the light so that we may be children of light.

John 12:35-36 KJV
(35) Then Jesus said unto them, Yet a little while is the light with you. Walk while ye have the light, lest darkness come upon you: for he that walketh in darkness knoweth not whither he goeth.
(36) While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them.

The Son gives us the light of the knowledge of the glory of God through the speaking of His servants…and the light shines within our very own hearts when we hear His voice. The Spirit of God moved upon the face (in the face of Jesus Christ) of the waters. Men speak as they are moved by the Spirit to do so in order to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

2 Corinthians 4:5-6 KJV
(5) For we preach not ourselves, but Christ Jesus the Lord; and ourselves your servants for Jesus’ sake.
(6) For God, who commanded the light to shine out of darkness, hath shined in our hearts, to give the light of the knowledge of the glory of God in the face of Jesus Christ.

The Son of God comes to mankind whose foolish heart was darkened….who professes himself to be “wise” but having no real knowledge of God. He comes to give us that understanding so that we may know Him who is true as we show we know Him by doing well towards the hearing of His voice. He opens up the Scriptures to understanding giving us the knowledge of God from Heaven via the Holy Spirit that men are moved to speak by.

1 John 5:20 KJV
(20) And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

This dawning light within our own darkened hearts is how we shall know it is truly the Lord speaking to us as He opens up the Scriptures with the knowledge from Heaven and we shall grow in His grace and knowledge until the complete Day (as the light of 7 days) where there will be no more darkness within the heart. We shall know everything.

Isaiah 30:26 KJV
(26) Moreover the light of the moon shall be as the light of the sun, and the light of the sun shall be sevenfold, as the light of seven days, in the day that the LORD bindeth up the breach of his people, and healeth the stroke of their wound.

The path of the just is as the “shining light”…the “lightning”…that shines (as the break of day in the morning) more and more unto the “perfect” or complete Day (as 7 days) where there shall be no more evening within the heart as we shall have His complete knowledge.

Proverbs 4:18-19 KJV
(18) But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.
(19) The way of the wicked is as darkness: they know not at what they stumble.

Matthew 24 speaks of the sign of His coming. What is the sign of His “coming”…or rather, PRESENCE? This is the sign of the Son of man who is in Heaven speaking to us: the bright and morning star…the light… that arises within our once darkened hearts at the hearing of His voice as He interprets the Scriptures in the knowledge that comes from Heaven.

Parousia (Greek: παρουσία) = an ancient Greek word meaning “presence, or arrival”.

It is an official visit of the Lord who comes to give us an understanding of the Scriptures so that we may show we know God who is true by how well (the doing of good) we receive His words that interpret the Scriptures to our hearing ears. We are to do His will especially at the hearing of the voice of His Son speaking to us from Heaven.

Matthew 24:3 KJV
(3) And as he sat upon the mount of Olives, the disciples came unto him privately, saying, Tell us, when shall these things be? and what shall be the sign of thy coming, and of the end of the world?

His presence shall be evident to us by the "lightning" (Greek: astrape which means "bright shining")....that is, the bright shining of the bright and morning star within our hearts. This is the personal sign within us of the Son of man who speaks to us from Heaven. We shall know that it is the Lord as compared to false prophets who only have outward "signs"of supposed inward things and wonders to show us.

His Light comes out of the "east" (the rising of light within our very own hearts) and shines unto the "west" (in the darkness where the sun had gone down the previous evening).

Matthew 24:27 KJV
(27) For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.

The sign of the Son of man in Heaven speaking to us shall "appear".....that is, SHINE...as the "bright and morning star" shall arise within our very own hearts that were once in complete darkness (evening). The "evening and morning" of the heart...and the Light shall progress more and more while the darkness fades away more and more with each passing day.

Matthew 24:30 KJV
(30) And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

Genesis 1 to be continued....

-57 · Jul 4, 2020

I find it strange you don't like the word ...the...from, in the beginning and you removed it...then added BECAME to formless and void.

Oseas · Jul 4, 2020

orbiter said:
Peace.
I wanted to do a thread…a Bible study… of Genesis chapter 1 as an allegory of the regeneration of mankind. Jesus mentioned this “regeneration” in Matthew 19 :
Matthew 19:28 KJV
(28) And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
In Titus 3:5, we have the “washing of regeneration” and renewing of the Holy Spirit:
Titus 3:4-6 KJV
(4) But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared,
(5) Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
(6) Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

I think that the regeneration is linked with the prophecy of restoration as is written in Acts 3:18-26:

18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.

19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.

23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.

24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.

25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.

26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.

orbiter · Jul 5, 2020

Hi -57 and Oseas,

Peace be to you and thanks for reading and your input.

I agree with the regeneration being the prophesied restoration.

The restoration is the earth (mankind) back to God as His will shall be done in this earth as it is being done in Heaven.

Right now, the earth has fallen so to speak away from the kingdom/rule of Heaven. Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule...but this was not the original way the heavens and the earth were created as all should be serving the kingdom/rule of God in Christ.

The "the" (definite article) is not found in the Hebrew in Genesis 1 as "Beginning" is one of the names of the Son of God.

The translators of the Bible put "the" in as they considered the beginning as the beginning of time (as most of us have done) instead of the "Beginning" as the person of Jesus Christ through which all things of the creation were made.

In Beginning (in Jesus), God created all things in the heavens and the earth as Jesus is before all things visible and invisible. I see Jesus in the very first word of the Scriptures.

The "the" is also not found in the Greek in John 1:1.

In Beginning (in Jesus) was the Word or Saying (the saying that "God is Light" in whom is no darkness). The Saying was with or toward God...that is, the Saying is about His nature: that God is Light in whom there is no darkness. The Saying was God...as God is Light.

John 1:1-4 KJV
(1) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

The same was in (no definite article) Beginning (in the person of Jesus) with God.

(2) The same was in the beginning with God.

All things were made "by" or rather, through Him (the Beginning....Jesus). Nothing was made by God without Jesus being the Head (Beginning) of all things.

(3) All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

In Him (the Beginning/Jesus) was life and the life was the light of men. The Word of life as spoken through Jesus/Beginning is that God is Light and in Him is no darkness. If we walk with Him, we shall live.

(4) In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

This Word of life (that God is Light) is in response to the earth becoming without the form of His righteousness and void of the knowledge of God as the heart of mankind became darkened.

Mankind was created in righteousness but went and sought out many schemes (Ecclesiastes 7:29 KJV Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.)

God created all things in Jesus/in Beginning but the earth became (Hebrew: "hayah" can mean "to be, become, come to pass, exist, happen, fall out") without the form of God's righteousness and void of the understanding of God.

The earth had become detached so to speak from the kingdom/rule of Heaven where God's will has and will always be done. Mankind was created upright but became all together unprofitable has no one is righteous and no one understands God.

Genesis 1:1-2 KJV
(1) In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
(2) And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

But God is kind and merciful toward His creation...mankind... as He sends His Son to speak to us the knowledge of God in order to bring mankind back to his Creator. This is the "regeneration" of mankind. The Son speaks what He hears God saying.

The Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters (people, languages, tongues, etc). Men of God speak in the face of God (sight of God) in Christ as they are moved by the Holy Spirit to do.

2 Corinthians 2:17 KJV
(17) For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.

The first message via the Spirit of God moving His servants in Christ to speak to mankind ( that became without the form of His righteousness and is in total darkness) is that "God is Light".

God said that "He is Light"....and not "let there be light".

Genesis 1:3 KJV
(3) And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.

Elohim is saying "He is Light". Hebrew "hayah" = to be, become, come to pass, exist, happen, fall out.

From Interlinear Scripture Analyzer:

Oseas · Jul 6, 2020

orbiter said:
Hi -57 and Oseas,
Peace be to you and thanks for reading and your input.
I agree with the regeneration being the prophesied restoration.

The restoration is the earth (mankind) back to God as His will shall be done in this earth as it is being done in Heaven. Right now, the earth has fallen so to speak away from the kingdom/rule of Heaven. Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule...but this was not the original way the heavens and the earth were created as all should be serving the kingdom/rule of God in Christ.

Yes, as you said, "Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule...but this was not the original way the heavens and the earth were created as all should be serving the kingdom/rule of God in Christ", and I think that it is an interesting point you are bringing unto us that deserves a deep study and meditation, as follows:

If we take a look well, we will see that even the own God made a separation in the beginning, as He revealed to Moses-Genesis 1:v.6-8:

6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. (Heaven?check it out in Ephesians 1:v.3) And the evening and the morning were the second day.

Scriptures reveal that "waters" are peoples, and nations, and multitudes, and tongues -Revelation 17:v.15- and you said that "Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule", so following this reasoning, we can say by the Word of God in Genesis that the people in heaven are those which are above the firmament (heaven), separated and guided by the Spirit of God, and the waters that are under the firmament(heaven) are those which, as you said, are ruled "according to mankind's own rule", I would say ruled by the spirit of Devil. This revelation in Genesis is similar the separation of the wheat from the tares, or separation of the sons of God from the sons of the Devil.

orbiter · Jul 7, 2020

Oseas said:
Yes, as you said, "Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule...but this was not the original way the heavens and the earth were created as all should be serving the kingdom/rule of God in Christ", and I think that it is an interesting point you are bringing unto us that deserves a deep study and meditation, as follows:

If we take a look well, we will see that even the own God made a separation in the beginning, as He revealed to Moses-Genesis 1:v.6-8:

6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. (Heaven?check it out in Ephesians 1:v.3) And the evening and the morning were the second day.

Scriptures reveal that "waters" are peoples, and nations, and multitudes, and tongues -Revelation 17:v.15- and you said that "Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule", so following this reasoning, we can say by the Word of God in Genesis that the people in heaven are those which are above the firmament (heaven), separated and guided by the Spirit of God, and the waters that are under the firmament(heaven) are those which, as you said, are ruled "according to mankind's own rule", I would say ruled by the spirit of Devil. This revelation in Genesis is similar the separation of the wheat from the tares, or separation of the sons of God from the sons of the Devil.

Amen... Oseas...amen.

Absolutely. I was going to go there next. The "waters" are... as you pointed out... defined in Revelation as "peoples, and nations, and multitudes, and tongues.

We can be fellow citizens of Heaven even now in this earth as we live according to the wisdom that is from above....the heavenly wisdom: peace, love, joy, patience, kindness, etc. (and not the earthly wisdom below: envy, strife, wrath, etc.)

Our "conversation"...that is, citizenship...is in Heaven (even now in this earth).

Philippians 3:20-21 KJV
(20) For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
(21) Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Ephesians 2:18-20 KJV
(18) For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
(19) Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
(20) And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

James 3:14-18 KJV
(14) But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
(15) This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
(16) For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.
(17) But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
(18) And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

We are to sit together in heavenly places...that is, above the heaven....in Christ Jesus as we have faith in the hearing of the Word of Truth as spoken from Heaven by Jesus via the Holy Spirit. The "waters" above believe in what they hear while the "waters" below do not believe and act accordingly.

Ephesians 2:5-6 KJV
(5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
(6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

-57 · Jul 7, 2020

Rev 21:1 “Then I saw ‘a new heaven and a new earth,’ for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.”

No seas = no water = no people.

Oseas · Jul 7, 2020

orbiter said:
Amen... Oseas...amen.

Absolutely. I was going to go there next. The "waters" are... as you pointed out... defined in Revelation as "peoples, and nations, and multitudes, and tongues.

We can be fellow citizens of Heaven even now in this earth as we live according to the wisdom that is from above....the heavenly wisdom: peace, love, joy, patience, kindness, etc. (and not the earthly wisdom below: envy, strife, wrath, etc.)

Our "conversation"...that is, citizenship...is in Heaven (even now in this earth).

Philippians 3:20-21 KJV
(20) For our conversation is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ:
(21) Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.

Ephesians 2:18-20 KJV
(18) For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
(19) Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;
(20) And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

Reading your words above, it made me to remember of the prayer of our LORD Jesus Christ where He says: John 17:v.11&21-24
11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be One, as we are.

21 That they all may be One; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be One in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be One, even as we are One:
23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in One; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

continues below

Oseas · Jul 7, 2020

orbiter said:
James 3:14-18 KJV
(14) But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
(15) This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
(16) For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

Yes, John the Baptist, as an angel of our Lord, said: John 3:v.31-34:
31 He that cometh from above is above all: he that is of the earth is earthly, and speaketh of the earth: he that cometh from heaven is above all.
32 And what he hath seen and heard, that he testifieth; and no man receiveth his testimony.
33 He that hath received his testimony hath set to his seal that God is true.
34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

orbiter said:
(17) But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, and easy to be intreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality, and without hypocrisy.
(18) And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

Yes, 1 Cor.2:v.6-11 gives us an important vision about the wisdom that is given by God unto us:
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

orbiter said:
We are to sit together in heavenly places...that is, above the heaven....in Christ Jesus as we have faith in the hearing of the Word of Truth as spoken from Heaven by Jesus via the Holy Spirit. The "waters" above believe in what they hear while the "waters" below do not believe and act accordingly.
Ephesians 2:5-6 KJV
(5) Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved
(6) And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:

I was analyzing and meditating deeply in what you wrote above, mainly "the "waters" above believe in what they hear while the "waters" below do not believe and act accordingly". The Spirit caught me and carried me to the Genesis 1:v. 9-10 that reveal us the follow:
9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto ONE PLACE, and let the DRY LAND appear: and it was so.
10 And God called the DRY LAND land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

In the beginning -in JESUS - God created heavens - by the way, the Word is God - and as you know were created the 1st, and 2nd, and the 3rd heavens, and the heaven of the heavens. The 3rd heaven is the environment of God's Kingdom to where we are going now, whose environment was visited by the Apostle Paul. In Christ we are in heavenly places -Ephesians 1:v.3 and Philippians 3:v.20-21,among others- but in my analize and meditation I asked to myself: in what heaven are we now? Well, once the next is the 3rd heaven, and after comes the heaven of the heavens, then God has already planted here in the Earth through/by JESUS the first two heavens or the first two celestial environments, and the 3rd heaven comes from now on, as JESUS said and is written in Revelation 11:v.15, that says:

15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven(what heaven? the heaven where we are now), saying, The kingdoms of THIS WORLD are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

That said, in continuation of my vision, once the third heaven will be established here from now on, what will happen with the two FIRST heavens or two heavenly places in Christ (the 1st and the 2nd heavens) that were created by the LORD God? Yes, what will happen? Who give us the answer is the Word of God that was said through the Apostle Peter chap.3:v.7&11-14:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now (the 1st and the 2nd heavens-respectively the OT and the NT), by the same Word are kept in store, reserved unto FIRE against the Day of Judgment (Lord's Day) and perdition of ungodly men.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the Day of God-Lord's Day-, wherein the heavens -THE 1ST AND THE 2ND HEAVENS- being on FIRE shall be DISSOLVED, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.

1Peter 4:v.18 - And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

Oseas · Jul 7, 2020

-57 said:
Rev 21:1 “Then I saw ‘a new heaven and a new earth,’ for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea.”

No seas = no water = no people.

In the beginning -in JESUS - God created heavens - by the way, the Word is God - and as you know were created the 1st, and 2nd, and the 3rd heavens, and the heaven of the heavens. The 3rd heaven is the environment of God's Kingdom to where we are going now, whose environment was visited by the Apostle Paul. In Christ we are in heavenly places -Ephesians 1:v.3 and Philippians 3:v.20-21,among others- but in my analize and meditation I asked to myself: in what heaven are we now? Well, once the next is the 3rd heaven, and after comes the heaven of the heavens, then God has already planted here in the Earth through/by JESUS the first two heavens or the first two celestial environments, and the 3rd heaven where was the Apostle Paul it comes from now on, as JESUS said and is written in Revelation 11:v.15, that says:
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven(what heaven? the heaven where we are now), saying, The kingdoms of THIS WORLD are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

Jesus said: Luke 20:v.35-36 -
35 But they which shall be accounted WORTHY to obtain that world (the world to come), and the resurrection from the dead, neither marry, nor are given in marriage:
36 Neither can they die any more: for they are equal unto the angels; and are the children of God, being the children of the resurrection.

1 Corinthians 15:v.24-26 & 50-57
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
55 O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?
56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.
57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
58 Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord.

pescador · Jul 8, 2020

Oseas said:
Yes, as you said, "Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule...but this was not the original way the heavens and the earth were created as all should be serving the kingdom/rule of God in Christ", and I think that it is an interesting point you are bringing unto us that deserves a deep study and meditation, as follows:

If we take a look well, we will see that even the own God made a separation in the beginning, as He revealed to Moses-Genesis 1:v.6-8:

6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters. 7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. And God called the firmament Heaven. (Heaven?check it out in Ephesians 1:v.3) And the evening and the morning were the second day.

Scriptures reveal that "waters" are peoples, and nations, and multitudes, and tongues -Revelation 17:v.15- and you said that "Mankind is not currently living according to the rule of Heaven as people in Heaven do now but according to mankind's own rule", so following this reasoning, we can say by the Word of God in Genesis that the people in heaven are those which are above the firmament (heaven), separated and guided by the Spirit of God, and the waters that are under the firmament(heaven) are those which, as you said, are ruled "according to mankind's own rule", I would say ruled by the spirit of Devil. This revelation in Genesis is similar the separation of the wheat from the tares, or separation of the sons of God from the sons of the Devil.

What?? That is the strangest interpretation of God's Word I have ever read! I can't express how much I disagree with your fantastical interpretation!

orbiter · Jul 8, 2020

Peace.

Sorry for the delay in posting. I don’t have much time during the week to compose my thoughts down in writing…and concisely.

I don’t know much about the plural “heavens”.

Heaven relates to the “heights” of God’s domain where His knowledge is higher than earthly man’s, His ways are higher….higher values (peace, love, joy, etc). We hear His revealed knowledge via the Holy Spirit sent down from Heaven.

This allegorical interpretation of Genesis 1 isn’t certainly for everyone.

The “firmament” or “expanse” is a metaphor about the opening of the hearing ear. Our knowledge shall be expanded if we hear His words.

Again, the “waters” are people. The hearing of the Word of Truth from Heaven via the Spirit divides the believers from the unbelievers. Some will believe in what they hear while others will not and will "rage" as the angry seas against it as they gather against the words of Christ.

Genesis 1:6 KJV
(6) And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

Even the word for “ear” in Hebrew (ozen) means “broadness, to expand”. Example:

Job 36:10 KJV
(10) He openeth also their ear to discipline, and commandeth that they return from iniquity.

God opens up our ears to His knowledge that is sent from Heaven via the Spirit. The “firmament” is called “Heaven” for what we hear is from there. We hear the Heavens that speak His knowledge which is much higher than the earthly, natural man’s understanding.

Jesus said often: he that has an ear, let him hear…

Revelation 3:6 KJV
(6) He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

The good news is reported unto us with the Holy Spirit which is sent down from Heaven…

1 Peter 1:12 KJV
(12) Unto whom it was revealed, that not unto themselves, but unto us they did minister the things, which are now reported unto you by them that have preached the gospel unto you with the Holy Ghost sent down from heaven; which things the angels desire to look into.

Jesus healed the deaf man by looking into Heaven as He opened up his ears. The “firmament” or expanse is the opening up of our ears to God’s knowledge sent from Heaven.

Mark 7:33-34 KJV
(33) And he took him aside from the multitude, and put his fingers into his ears, and he spit, and touched his tongue;
(34) And looking up to heaven, he sighed, and saith unto him, Ephphatha, that is, Be opened.

Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the Word/Saying of God who said “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.” The “waters” above the Heaven believe upon what they hear while those waters under do not believe.

Romans 10:14-17 KJV
(14) How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
(15) And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!
(16) But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report?
(17) So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

God divided the waters (people) which were under the firmament (the unbelievers) from the waters (people) which were above the firmament (the believers). The believers are “above” the expanse as they believe “upon” what they hear….the knowledge from Heaven itself as spoken via the Holy Spirit.

Genesis 1:7 KJV
(7) And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.

Jesus said He was from above while those who did not believe Him were from beneath.

John 8:23-24 KJV
(23) And he said unto them, Ye are from beneath; I am from above: ye are of this world; I am not of this world.
(24) I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.

As God divided the waters, we also must not be unequally yoked together (those who are above with those from under the firmament) with the unbelievers of the Word of Truth that we hear spoken from above. The firmament or expanse is the opening up of our ears to the hearing of the knowledge of God spoken from Heaven.

2 Corinthians 6:14-15 KJV
(14) Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
(15) And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?

The waters were divided as God calls us to come out from among the unbelievers of the Word of Truth and be separate from them. This also aligns with the dividing the darkness from the light. What communion does light have with those of are of the darkness?

2 Corinthians 6:17-18 KJV
(17) Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
(18) And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.

Jesus comes to give us the true and faithful Word of God …which does not align with what the natural man has been preaching in his own private interpretations of the Scriptures. The hearing of the true and sincere preaching of the Word of God divides the unbelievers from the believers in what they hear coming from Heaven.

The “dry” land is the meek and honest heart that will receive what is preached…the true and faithful words of God while the waters “under the heaven” are people who will not believe in what they hear and will “roar” (as the angry seas) against it. They will be gathered together in their unbelief of what they hear coming from Heaven.

Genesis 1:9-10 KJV
(9) And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.

God calls the “dry” land (the heart that is dried up of the waters of strife at the hearing of the true Word of God) “Earth”. The “meek” shall inherit the Earth.

(10) And God called the dry land Earth; and the gathering together of the waters called he Seas: and God saw that it was good.

God made heaven and earth and the sea and all in them.

Acts 4:24-27 KJV
(24) And when they heard that, they lifted up their voice to God with one accord, and said, Lord, thou art God, which hast made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and all that in them is:

The “earth” is David in this case. David was a man after God’s own heart…a good and honest heart. David spoke with the Holy Spirit sent from Heaven the words of God (the “heaven”) as recorded in Psalms.

(25) Who by the mouth of thy servant David hast said, Why did the heathen rage, and the people imagine vain things?

But the people “raged” as the angry seas as people did not want to hear what Jesus had to say. The “waters” under the heaven gathered together against Him as they did not believe. The wicked shall not have peace as they churn up mire as the angry seas of people gathered against the true Word of God spoken by the Son.

(26) The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ.
(27) For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together,

The unbelievers will rage as the waves of the sea foaming out their own shame. The wicked shall not enter in to understand the knowledge that comes from Heaven as the wander in the darkness of not knowing.

Jude 1:13 KJV
(13) Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

The unbelievers are like the waves of the sea driven with the "wind" (as they will not believe in what the Spirit says) and tossed. They "upbraid" or rail against... defame... the wisdom that God gives to men via the Spirit sent from Heaven.

James 1:5-7 KJV
(5) If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
(6) But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
(7) For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.

Oseas · Jul 8, 2020

pescador said:
What?? That is the strangest interpretation of God's Word I have ever read!

I understand, actually you are familiarized with interpretations of those who have received some knowledge of Scriptures, but only LITERALLY, because they know in part, and prophesy in part, and you should know that that which is in part shall be done away or will be annihilated.(1Cor.13:v.9-10) By the way, remember, my LORD Jesus said that "he that hath, to him shall be given: and he that hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he hath". This is the reason why you considered strange the interpretation of mine in Genesis 1.

pescador said:
I can't express how much I disagree with your fantastical interpretation!

It does not surprise me, for the interpretation you have learned is from the spirit of man, and what man knows the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God the natural man knows not them, for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned by the Spirit of God. The Word is God, do you understand? As it is written, Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for them that love Him. But God has revealed them unto us by His Spirit: for the Spirit searches all things, yea, the deep things of God.

On the other hand, if any man build upon the foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; every man's work will be made manifest: for the Day must declare it, because it will be revealed by FIRE; and the FIRE shall try every man's work of what sort it is. ---What Day? The Lord's Day, of course, the Day of the righteous Judgment of God. the Judgment Seat of Christ, and this Day arrived.

See, the everlasting Spirit of God is a devouring FIRE, do you understand?. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring FIRE? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

I work with the Word of God. The Word is God, do you understand?

pescador · Jul 9, 2020

Oseas said:
I understand, actually you are familiarized with interpretations of those who have received some knowledge of Scriptures, but only LITERALLY, because they know in part, and prophesy in part, and you should know that that which is in part shall be done away or will be annihilated.(1Cor.13:v.9-10) By the way, remember, my LORD Jesus said that "he that hath, to him shall be given: and he that hath not, from him shall be taken even that which he hath". This is the reason why you considered strange the interpretation of mine in Genesis 1.

It does not surprise me, for the interpretation you have learned is from the spirit of man, and what man knows the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God the natural man knows not them, for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned by the Spirit of God. The Word is God, do you understand? As it is written, Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for them that love Him. But God has revealed them unto us by His Spirit: for the Spirit searches all things, yea, the deep things of God.

On the other hand, if any man build upon the foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble; every man's work will be made manifest: for the Day must declare it, because it will be revealed by FIRE; and the FIRE shall try every man's work of what sort it is. ---What Day? The Lord's Day, of course, the Day of the righteous Judgment of God. the Judgment Seat of Christ, and this Day arrived.

See, the everlasting Spirit of God is a devouring FIRE, do you understand?. Who among us shall dwell with the devouring FIRE? who among us shall dwell with everlasting burnings?

I work with the Word of God. The Word is God, do you understand?

I think that your interpretation of Scripture is of your own making; it disagrees with what the Bible actually says. You can make up all kinds of strange interpretations of what the Bible means but they have no value. God is not the author of confusion.

I will not read or respond to any further posts of yours; they are meaningless.

Oseas · Jul 10, 2020

pescador said:
I think that your interpretation of Scripture is of your own making; it disagrees with what the Bible actually says.

Friend, what you think signifies nothing before God, do you understand? For me the most important is what the Almighty God(Rev.1:v.8)thinks, I work for Him and by His Word exclusively. He who comes from above is above all. He who is from the earth is from the earth and talks from an earthly point of view; he who comes from heaven is above all, and he testifies about what he has actually seen and heard, yet no one accepts what he says. Whoever does accept what he says puts his seal on the fact that God is true, because the one whom God sent speaks God’s words. For God does not give him the Spirit in limited degree. John chap.3.

The angels that did not keep within their original authority, but abandoned their proper sphere, God has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for the Judgment of this Great Day, the Lord's Day, that is the seventh and last Day or seventh and last millennium.

You are wrong, the interpretation of Scriptures that was made is not human interpretation, and you deny the God's Truth saying that "it desagrees with what the Bible actually says", quite the contrary, it disagrees with what you have learned from the fallen angels of Churches, the apostate teachers having itching ears, which turn away their ears from the Truth-the God's Truth-, and they turned unto fables.

Furthermore, the prophetical message of Scriptures is clear: James 3:v.1 - My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we will receive the greater condemnation.

Ecll.5:v.6 - 6 Suffer not thy mouth to cause thy flesh to sin; neither say thou before the angel, that it was an error: wherefore should God be angry at thy voice, and destroy the work of thine hands?

pescador · Jul 10, 2020

Oseas said:
Friend, what you think signifies nothing before God, do you understand? For me the most important is what the Almighty God(Rev.1:v.8)thinks, I work for Him and by His Word exclusively. He who comes from above is above all. He who is from the earth is from the earth and talks from an earthly point of view; he who comes from heaven is above all, and he testifies about what he has actually seen and heard, yet no one accepts what he says. Whoever does accept what he says puts his seal on the fact that God is true, because the one whom God sent speaks God’s words. For God does not give him the Spirit in limited degree. John chap.3.

The angels that did not keep within their original authority, but abandoned their proper sphere, God has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for the Judgment of this Great Day, the Lord's Day, that is the seventh and last Day or seventh and last millennium.

You are wrong, the interpretation of Scriptures that was made is not human interpretation, and you deny the God's Truth saying that "it desagrees with what the Bible actually says", quite the contrary, it disagrees with what you have learned from the fallen angels of Churches, the apostate teachers having itching ears, which turn away their ears from the Truth-the God's Truth-, and they turned unto fables.

Furthermore, the prophetical message of Scriptures is clear: James 3:v.1 - My brethren, be not many masters, knowing that we will receive the greater condemnation.

Ecll.5:v.6 - 6 Suffer not thy mouth to cause thy flesh to sin; neither say thou before the angel, that it was an error: wherefore should God be angry at thy voice, and destroy the work of thine hands?

He who is from the earth is from the earth and talks from an earthly point of view. That means you!!

orbiter · Jul 11, 2020

pescador said:
I think that your interpretation of Scripture is of your own making; it disagrees with what the Bible actually says. You can make up all kinds of strange interpretations of what the Bible means but they have no value. God is not the author of confusion.

I will not read or respond to any further posts of yours; they are meaningless.

Peace brother.

I definitely understand your concerns and thank you for letting me know and I hope that you could stay and consider it. I know I am a stranger speaking strange things but we must remember to have brotherly love towards one another in our responses even when we disagree.

There is the hidden wisdom of God. God conceals a thing and we are to search it out when we hear His voice.....like the Bereans did.

Proverbs 25:2 KJV
(2) It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.

The Bereans received the Word with all readiness of mind...and did search the Scriptures daily to see if those things were so...the things Paul was preaching.

Acts 17:11 KJV
(11) These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

I'm not saying that I am another Paul or anything but just a man searching out the hidden Truth of the Scriptures with the Spirit.

Peace.

orbiter · Jul 11, 2020

God called the firmament/expanse “Heaven”. The opening up of our ears to the Scripture of Truth is directly from Heaven.

We hear His voice from Heaven as the Son opens up the Scriptures to its heavenly interpretation (in contrast to earthly man’s private interpretations).

He speaks better things than of Abel and we are to hear what He has to say and not be like Cain who refused Abel (meaning “vain, empty”) and did slay him.

We must also not “kill the messengers” of His words of life and spirit but to remember that we are to be our brother’s keeper.

Hebrews 12:24-25 KJV
(24) And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.
(25) See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

Let us not be angry without cause and consider our brothers as “empty” of knowledge….an empty head speaking nonsense.

By labeling others as “raca” (meaning: “o empty one, worthless”) for what they preach is not having brotherly love. "Abel" means "empty, vain" and that is how Cain considered his own brother.

Matthew 5:21-22 KJV
(21) Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
(22) But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire.

The good earth/ground….the honest and good heart…shall hear the Word and keep it and bring forth the fruit of righteousness towards the Son of God’s teaching of the Word of God.

Luke 8:15-16 KJV
(15) But that on the good ground are they, which in an honest and good heart, having heard the word, keep it, and bring forth fruit with patience.

The “dry” land is the meek heart dried up evil speaking. No waters of strife upon the good and honest heart.

If the son of peace is out there, then the "dove" shall rest upon that heart and will return peace with peace (olive leaf). But if not, then that heart has not had the waters of strife abated off of it.

Genesis 8:8-11 KJV
(8) Also he sent forth a dove from him, to see if the waters were abated from off the face of the ground;
(9) But the dove found no rest for the sole of her foot, and she returned unto him into the ark, for the waters were on the face of the whole earth: then he put forth his hand, and took her, and pulled her in unto him into the ark.
(10) And he stayed yet other seven days; and again he sent forth the dove out of the ark;
(11) And the dove came in to him in the evening; and, lo, in her mouth was an olive leaf pluckt off: so Noah knew that the waters were abated from off the earth.

Happy are the “poor in spirit”…that is, poor in breath… as they will be swift to hear His opened mouth teaching and slow to speak….poor in words. They will be “poor” in words and will use “little strength” in how they respond just like the church in Philadelphia (brotherly love).

Matthew 5:2-3 KJV
(2) And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying,
(3) Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

The earth shall bring forth “grass”…that is, peace within the heart. The fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace. They will act in the wisdom that descends from above and not in that earthly, devilish wisdom that is from below the Heaven.

Genesis 1:11 KJV(11) And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so.

James 3:18 KJV
(18) And the fruit of righteousness is sown in peace of them that make peace.

The herb yielding seed is faith. The fruit tree yielding fruit whose seed is in itself is the kingdom of God within us that can grow into a great tree. We are to be His planting of the trees of righteousness...producing the fruit of righteousness.

Luke 13:18-19 KJV
(18) Then said he, Unto what is the kingdom of God like? and whereunto shall I resemble it?
(19) It is like a grain of mustard seed, which a man took, and cast into his garden; and it grew, and waxed a great tree; and the fowls of the air lodged in the branches of it.

The seed is within us and is able to save our souls…giving us His joy…but we must be “dry” …meek…within the heart of all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness.

James 1:21 KJV
(21) Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.

The seed is within itself....the kingdom of God is within us...the engrafted word.. and can save us and can grow up into a tree.

Luke 17:21 KJV
(21) Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

orbiter · Jul 12, 2020

Instead of laughter, we should be turning it into mourning…humbling ourselves in the sight of the Lord so that He lifts us up. We are to humble ourselves….and not be found laughing. Woe unto those who laugh now.

James 4:8-10 KJV
(8) Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.
(9) Be afflicted, and mourn, and weep: let your laughter be turned to mourning, and your joy to heaviness.
(10) Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.

Luke 6:25 KJV
(25) Woe unto you that are full! for ye shall hunger. Woe unto you that laugh now! for ye shall mourn and weep.

The LORD God has compassion on His people and sends His messengers to speak His knowledge from Heaven to His people so that they may hear, understand, and depart from their own thoughts and ways and return to Him.

2 Chronicles 36:15-16 KJV
(15) And the LORD God of their fathers sent to them by his messengers, rising up betimes, and sending; because he had compassion on his people, and on his dwelling place:

But in the past they also mocked His servants and despised His words…..until there was no remedy.

(16) But they mocked the messengers of God, and despised his words, and misused his prophets, until the wrath of the LORD arose against his people, till there was no remedy.

These things are written in the Scriptures so that we may understand today and repent and no longer follow after their evil example.

For if we sin “willfully”….that is, continuing to sin…after we have received the full knowledge (3) of the Truth, there will be no more remedy. There remains no more sacrifice for sins….no remedy. “It is finished” .

Hebrews 10:26-31 KJV
(26) For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

The only thing remaining for such people who will not repent of their continued sinning is a fearful expectation of judgment and fiery indignation. It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

(27) But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
(28) He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:

We are reminded to have brotherly love….the blood of the covenant….and not count it is an “unholy”…that is, a common thing to be broken.

His sacred covenant is to have love for one another as He loved us and gave His life for us and we must keep it with all priority. We must show that we know Him by the doing of His covenant and not just in words but in actions. Faith is active.

(29) Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
(30) For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
(31) It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

We are to hear the voice of the Son of God and awaken to His righteousness…showing forth the evidence of our faith…..having good works (peace, love, kindness, patience, etc). Professed faith without the external evidence of that faith is dead.

This was and is the problem with the church in “Sardis”…meaning “red ones”. They said that they were alive but were dead.

Their works were not God’s righteous works. They professed that they were “alive”….they professed their faith…but they were “dead” in their works. They did not have good works in the presence of His messengers sent out to speak His words of life and spirit to the churches.

They did not hear what the Spirit was saying as they did behave with the works of darkness instead of receiving the complete knowledge of the Son who has the fullness of the Spirit.

Revelation 3: KJV
(1) And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write; These things saith he that hath the seven Spirits of God, and the seven stars; I know thy works, that thou hast a name that thou livest, and art dead.

“Be watchful”….that is, awaken to His righteousness and strengthen the things which remain…putting on Christ…and walk with Him in the Light of God. Putting on the outer garment of Christ is the external doing of good works which is the evidence of our professed faith. It is the righteous acts of the saints of God...the putting on of the white garment....putting on Christ.

(2) Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die: for I have not found thy works perfect before God.
(3) Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.
(4) Thou hast a few names even in Sardis which have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with me in white: for they are worthy.

He that overcomes, the same shall be clothed in white raiment as they will put on Christ (like an outer garment) by the showing forth of the external good works that are evidence of our inward faith.

They will walk with Him in white…..that is, in Light. They will enter in to know all of His knowledge while those who continue to do the works of darkness shall not understand. Outside in the darkness will they be left.

(5) He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

He that has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit is saying unto the churches.

(6) He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Sardis = “red” ones. Adam means “red” also.

The eyes of both Adam and Eve were opened….as they received the knowledge of the Son of God and they knew that they did not have any good works.

They reacted to the knowledge of the Son by sewing fig leaves together and made themselves aprons….that is, they said “Lord, Lord” but did bear forth any fruits of righteousness. They felt secure in their profession of faith. They felt like they did not need anything.

But faith only is dead without the accompanied good works of it.

This is the meaning for us today….to bear the fruit of God’s righteousness (the figs) and not just profess our faith in words only (the “fig leaves” only) especially after the receiving of the full knowledge of the Lord as spoken by the Son.

Genesis 3:7-10 KJV
(7) And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons.

They heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the “cool”…that is, Spirit…of the Day (the Day of Judgment). They are reminded to keep His commandments.

Yet, they hid themselves from the face of the LORD God.

They did not show that they knew Him as they did not keep His commandments.

This is how we show we know Him…by the keeping of His commandments. (1 John 2:3 KJV) And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.) Let us not hide from His face behind words only and found not keeping His commandments when He comes walking in the Light.

They hid among the TREE (singular in Hebrew) of the garden. This “tree” is the Tree of Life.

That is, they hid behind their reputation of being “alive” (hiding in the Tree of Life) but through the lack of good works of that faith (bearing fruit and not just leaves only) were dead as Christ told the church in Sardis (“red”).

They that are still dead in Adam (“red”) who do not show forth that they know God by the keeping of His commandments at the hearing of His voice in the Spirit of the Day of Judgment shall have their names blotted from the book of life.

Again, "trees" is singular in Hebrew as they hid in the Tree of Life...professing themselves "alive" (dressing themselves in leaves only) but had no fruits of righteousness.

(8) And they heard the voice of the LORD God walking in the garden in the cool of the day: and Adam and his wife hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God amongst the trees of the garden.

“Where are you”? Where is your faith….where is the evidence of your faith? He feared...and fear has to do with punishment. But good works completes our faith. The love of God is then completed when we keep His commandments.

(9) And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?
(10) And he said, I heard thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself.

Who told you that you were naked and now are speaking evil in judgment (eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil = speaking evil of a brother in judgment and doing so supposedly in God’s name as “wise” judges) upon a brother?

We must not, with the same mouth, bless God and speak evil of others. We are not blessing God by doing so. Either make the tree good or make it evil.

(11) And he said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?

It is the Son of God who speaks to us and tells us that we are “wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked” in the Day of Judgment (“Loadicea” = “people of the Judgment”). This is for today. Adam and Eve made "aprons"...they felt secure in their own works of supposed "righteousness". They had no need of nothing in their own estimation.

Revelation 3:17-20 KJV
(17) Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

We are counseled to have faith…which is tried in the fire of His rebuke of us…and put on white raiment which is the righteous acts of His saints so that we may be clothed and that the nakedness of our shame (speaking evil of others of what one hears him saying)….and readily receive the Bread of Heaven so that we may “see”…understand.

The word “eyesalve” is kollourion.... made up in the shape of a cake of bread - collyra. It speaks of receiving His knowledge...the Bread of Heaven..which enlightens the eyes of our understanding.

(18) I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
(19) As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
(20) Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.

Love not “sleep”…the behaving in envy, strife, wrath, hatred, etc…but awaken to His righteousness (open your eyes) and receive the Bread of Heaven…the knowledge of God that we are to “eat” something that truly satisfies and it fills us with joy, peace, love, et.

Proverbs 20:13 KJV
(13) Love not sleep, lest thou come to poverty; open thine eyes, and thou shalt be satisfied with bread.

An allegorical study of Genesis 1...

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