What period of time are we presently living in?

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5thKingdom

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Please finish the description of these beasts, who you think they are in this format. Just copy and paste - and finish the description. Please keep it simple.

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....

3. The scarlet colored beast in Revelation 17:3 represents.....

4. The beast in Revelation 17:8a represents......

5. The beast in Revelation 17:8b represents.....

6. The beast in Revelation 17:11 represents....

7. The beast in Revelation 19:20 represents....


Doug, I am doing this from memory... without bothering
to look up the passages... so I hope I have not made any
mistakes. But I have forgotten more abut the end-times
than most people on earth will ever know. So here goes:

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....
The Beast of the First Woe and the Fifth Trumpet
and the 7th "head"

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....
The Beast of the Second Woe and the Sixth Trumpet
and the 8th "head"

3. The scarlet colored beast in Revelation 17:3 represents.....
The Kingdom of Satan throughout time... during the
(1st) Pre-Flood "Kingdom of Heaven" and during the
(2nd) Jewish "Kingdom of Heaven" and during the
(3rd) Christian "Kingdom of Heaven" (when "bound") and
(4th) Great Tribulation "Kingdom of Heaven"

4. The beast in Revelation 17:8a represents......
5. The beast in Revelation 17:8b represents.....
I have already written (several times) about the fulfillment
of the Beast that "was" and "is not" and "yet is" and
shall go into perdition... I suspect you have already
read those posts because I posted them several times.
If you NEED me to post them again I will.. but essentially
the beast that "was" occurred during the first two Kingdoms
(Pre-Flood and Jewish) the beast that "is not" represents
Satan being "bound" during the Great Commission. The beast
that yet is represent Satan's Kingdom exists and the beast that
goes into perdition is the SECOND Relation Beast during the
2nd Woe or Sixth Trumpet or 8th "head"... that is the Beast
that is destroyed at the END of the Great Tribulation just
before the END of the 2nd Woe [Rev 11:14]]

6. The beast in Revelation 17:11 represents....
The Second Beast during the 2nd Woe or the eighth "head"
this is the Beast that goes into perdition.

7. The beast in Revelation 19:20 represents....[/QUOTE]
Same as #6


Jim

'
 
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Douggg

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Doug, I am doing this from memory... without bothering
to look up the passages... so I hope I have not made any
mistakes. But I have forgotten more abut the end-times
than most people on earth will ever know. So here goes:

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....
The Beast of the First Woe and the Fifth Trumpet
and the 7th "head"

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....
The Beast of the Second Woe and the Sixth Trumpet
and the 8th "head"
Jim, could you redo those two without being in terms of woes and trumpets and heads? Like is it Satan? Or a kingdom? Or the false prophet? Or like the Papacy? Or like the Pope? Or a King?

Something that is direct, that doesn't take other interpretations to understand what you mean.
 
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5thKingdom

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Even though I haven't read the proposed books, I have read things here and there by Gary Demar and Kim Riddlebarger. Unless the proposed books are free, in general I'm not into any books that are trying to make a profit off the word of God, to begin with, even if the authors were promoting Premil. My Bible says, freely you have received, freely give. And I would think that should also apply to any insight from the Bible one feels they can share with others. But that's me, that's how I look at it and have always looked at it. For the ones who might disagree, to each his own I guess.

First.... the books you mentioned are useless.
Second... I did not suggest you buy any books. I gave you
a link to a website that contains the preaching of the Last Saints.
I suggested you read chapter 1 first - because the link goes to
chapter 2. I suggested you read chapter 8 because it explains
the historical fulfillment of Daniel's "Abomination" using about
TWO DOZEN related verses. It is, by far, the best explanation
that you will ever see. And, of course, the website is free.

Here is the link I already gave you. Please remember that
I already warned you that (a) literally HUNDREDS of some of
the beast theologians teaching at some of the most prestigious
seminaries in America have already TESTED the information on
this website and NONE of them were able to find ONE VERSE
in the Bible to refute anything said. And you can see a
partial list of these theologians on the "Recipients Page" and
(b) the Bible PROMISES that only the Last Saints "shall
understand
" this information (preached as the Seventh
Trumpet "begins to sound") so I do not expect anyone
to understand or agree with the information... only that
NOBODY can find even ONE VERSE in the Bible that
contradicts anything on the site... I invite you and your
church members and you pastor/elders to try to do
better than the theologians I already referenced.

https://www.5thkingdomofheaven.com/

Jim
.
 
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DavidPT

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First.... the books you mentioned are useless.
Second... I did not suggest you buy any books. I gave you
a link to a website that contains the preaching of the Last Saints.
I suggested you read chapter 1 first - because the link goes to
chapter 2. I suggested you read chapter 8 because it explains
the historical fulfillment of Daniel's "Abomination" using about
TWO DOZEN related verses. It is, by far, the best explanation
that you will ever see. And, of course, the website is free.

Here is the link I already gave you. Please remember that
I already warned you that (a) literally HUNDREDS of some of
the beast theologians teaching at some of the most prestigious
seminaries in America have already TESTED the information on
this website and NONE of them were able to find ONE VERSE
in the Bible to refute anything said. And you can see a
partial list of these theologians on the "Recipients Page" and
(b) the Bible PROMISES that only the Last Saints "shall
understand
" this information (preached as the Seventh
Trumpet "begins to sound") so I do not expect anyone
to understand or agree with the information... only that
NOBODY can find even ONE VERSE in the Bible that
contradicts anything on the site... I invite you and your
church members and you pastor/elders to try to do
better than the theologians I already referenced.

https://www.5thkingdomofheaven.com/

Jim
.


There is misunderstanding, then. What I was referring to in that post of mine you were addressing, is in regards to the proposed books the poster, not you though, thought I should read, and none of it involved whether I should visit your website or not. Actually I have visited your website and even have it bookmarked from awhile back when you first brought up the link in another thread. As to websites like yours, I have no issues with them. So wasn't including anyone such as you when I indicated, if one has freely received, one should freely give, and that this should include any insight from the Bible one feels they should share with others, thus shouldn't be trying to profit from books.

That's fine just as long as the proposed insight is free of charge. Assuming the insight is beneficial to others, God didn't charge them for access to this insight, so neither should others charge others for access to this same insight, such as writing a book then charging others money because they have to buy the book in order to even benefit from the proposed insight. As far as I know, I don't have one single book in my home written by Christian authors, where the books cost money.
 
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5thKingdom

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Jim, could you redo those two without being in terms of woes and trumpets and heads? Like is it Satan? Or a kingdom? Or the false prophet? Or like the Papacy? Or like the Pope? Or a King?

Something that is direct, that doesn't take other interpretations to understand what you mean.

Dougggg...
The Anti-Christ of the Great Tribulation Kingdom and/or
the Revelation Beast(s) is the same person called the
"Little Horn" in Daniel and the "False Prophet" in Rev.
and the "Man of Sin" in 2nd Thess. He is Satan's
chief emissary on earth during the "Little Season".
Satan is a spirit and needs a MAN to "overcome"
the Last Saints and lead them.

Notice the two verses below are NOT talking about
Satan... they are talking about the MAN who receives
his power and seat [rule] and authority from Satan:

Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard,

and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the
mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power,
and his seat, and great authority.

2Th 2:9-10
Even him [the Man of Sin], whose coming is after the

working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
perish; because they received not the love of the truth,
that they might be saved
.


1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....
The Beast of the First Woe and the Fifth Trumpet
and the 7th "head"

This is the Anti-Christ as he leads the Last Saints
(and some tares) into the Great Tribulation
"Kingdom of Heaven" as they teach the first
Gospel of the Anti-Christ... this is shown here:


Mat 25:1-3
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins,
which took their lamps, [Gospels] and went forth to meet the
bridegroom.[Jesus] And five of them were wise, [saved] and
five were foolish. [unsaved] They that were foolish took their
lamps, and took no oil [Holy Spirit] with them: But the wise
took oil in their vessels [being "indwelt] with their lamps.

Notice there is a period of silence after the END of the
First Beast... when the Lord did not return as their
Gospel had predicted:


Mat 25:5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all
slumbered and slept.


2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....
The Beast of the Second Woe and the Sixth Trumpet
and the 8th "head"

This is the Anti-Christ and the "foolish virgins" (but NOT
any of the "wise virgins" (because they separated from
the Beast at the END of the 1st Woe) as they went forth
teaching the second Gospel of the Anti-Christ. This event
is shown here... and ENDS with the Final Harvest.

Mat 25:6
And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom
cometh; go ye out to meet him. Then all those virgins arose,
and trimmed their lamps [adjusted their Gospels]. And the foolish
said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough
for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for
yourselves. [Notice this EVENT could never have occurred during
the Great Commission of the Christian "Kingdom of Heaven" since
NT Saints NEVER refused to preach or sent people to some other
unnamed group for their salvation... this PROVES the prophecy
was about the Great Tribulation Kingdom and NOT about the
Christian Kingdom]
And while they [foolish virgins] went to buy,
the bridegroom came; and they that were ready [wise virgins]
went in with him to the marriage: [during the Final harvest]
and the door was shut.

.
 
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5thKingdom

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There is misunderstanding, then. What I was referring to in that post of mine you were addressing, is in regards to the proposed books the poster, not you though, thought I should read, and none of it involved whether I should visit your website or not. Actually I have visited your website and even have it bookmarked from awhile back when you first brought up the link in another thread. As to websites like yours, I have no issues with them. So wasn't including anyone such as you when I indicated, if one has freely received, one should freely give, and that this should include any insight from the Bible one feels they should share with others, thus shouldn't be trying to profit from books.

That's fine just as long as the proposed insight is free of charge. Assuming the insight is beneficial to others, God didn't charge them for access to this insight, so neither should others charge others for access to this same insight, such as writing a book then charging others money because they have to buy the book in order to even benefit from the proposed insight. As far as I know, I don't have one single book in my home written by Christian authors, where the books cost money.


David, I agree with you about giving freely what was received
freely. It has always been a pet peeve with me that "teachers"
charge for their teachings. And, of course the worst of them
end up with mega-churches are immense popularity... they
not only give Christians a bad name (as many are found to
have done immoral things... or live a lavish lifestyle) but
they are going to be judge most harshly in the end.

I guess it has always been like this, with roaming
evangelists "healing" people in tent rallies. But today
it is out of control with some of these preachers filling
huge auditoriums or even stadiums with lost sheeple.

.
 
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Douggg

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Dougggg...
The Anti-Christ of the Great Tribulation Kingdom and/or
the Revelation Beast(s) is the same person called the
"Little Horn" in Daniel and the "False Prophet" in Rev.
and the "Man of Sin" in 2nd Thess. He is Satan's
chief emissary on earth during the "Little Season".
Satan is a spirit and needs a MAN to "overcome"
the Last Saints and lead them.

Notice the two verses below are NOT talking about
Satan... they are talking about the MAN who receives
his power and seat [rule] and authority from Satan:

Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard,

and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the
mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power,
and his seat, and great authority.

2Th 2:9-10

Even him [the Man of Sin], whose coming is after the
working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,
And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that
perish; because they received not the love of the truth,
that they might be saved.


1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....
The Beast of the First Woe and the Fifth Trumpet
and the 7th "head"

This is the Anti-Christ as he leads the Last Saints
(and some tares) into the Great Tribulation
"Kingdom of Heaven" as they teach the first
Gospel of the Anti-Christ... this is shown here:


Mat 25:1-3
Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins,
which took their lamps, [Gospels] and went forth to meet the
bridegroom.[Jesus] And five of them were wise, [saved] and
five were foolish. [unsaved] They that were foolish took their
lamps, and took no oil [Holy Spirit] with them: But the wise
took oil in their vessels [being "indwelt] with their lamps.

Notice there is a period of silence after the END of the
First Beast... when the Lord did not return as their
Gospel had predicted:


Mat 25:5 While the bridegroom tarried, they all
slumbered and slept.


2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....
The Beast of the Second Woe and the Sixth Trumpet
and the 8th "head"

This is the Anti-Christ and the "foolish virgins" (but NOT
any of the "wise virgins" (because they separated from
the Beast at the END of the 1st Woe) as they went forth
teaching the second Gospel of the Anti-Christ. This event
is shown here... and ENDS with the Final Harvest.

Mat 25:6
And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom
cometh; go ye out to meet him. Then all those virgins arose,
and trimmed their lamps [adjusted their Gospels]. And the foolish
said unto the wise, Give us of your oil; for our lamps are gone out.
But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough
for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for
yourselves. [Notice this EVENT could never have occurred during
the Great Commission of the Christian "Kingdom of Heaven" since
NT Saints NEVER refused to preach or sent people to some other
unnamed group for their salvation... this PROVES the prophecy
was about the Great Tribulation Kingdom and NOT about the
Christian Kingdom]
And while they [foolish virgins] went to buy,
the bridegroom came; and they that were ready [wise virgins]
went in with him to the marriage: [during the Final harvest]
and the door was shut.

.
Jim, pardon me for streamlining some of what you wrote.

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....the Anti-Christ

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents .... the Anti-Christ

The Anti-Christ is the same person called the "Little Horn" in Daniel and the "False Prophet" in Rev. and the "Man of Sin" in 2nd Thess.

Jim, as I understand your view, the first and second beast is the Anti-Christ. Not two different individuals?


Is it that the first beast Anti-Christ, or the second beast Anti-Christ who is the the False prophet ?
 
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Could you each please finish the description of these beasts, who you think they are in this format. Just copy and paste - and finish the description.

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....

3. The scarlet colored beast in Revelation 17:3 represents.....

4. The beast in Revelation 17:8a represents......

5. The beast in Revelation 17:8b represents.....

6. The beast in Revelation 17:11 represents....

7. The beast in Revelation 19:20 represents....

Douggg, I’m going to admit I don’t completely understand what each beast represents.

What I do see is that Revelation 12:3 describes the red dragon as having seven heads and ten horns. Revelation 12:9 equates the dragon, that old serpent, the Devil, and Satan as the same entity. The beast in Revelation 17:3 has seven heads and ten horns. Revelation 20:2 states the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan are bound for 1,000 years. Back to Revelation 17:8 the beast was, is not and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit.

When I combine all these verses it makes a very strong case that Satan was bound when John wrote Revelation.
 
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DavidPT

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Could you each please finish the description of these beasts, who you think they are in this format. Just copy and paste - and finish the description.

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents ....

3. The scarlet colored beast in Revelation 17:3 represents.....

4. The beast in Revelation 17:8a represents......

5. The beast in Revelation 17:8b represents.....

6. The beast in Revelation 17:11 represents....

7. The beast in Revelation 19:20 represents....


Douggg, I did type up a response to what you asked here, but I am not yet satisfied with what I typed up. I may have to start over. Typically I open NotePad and formulate my thoughts in it first, then paste into a post thereafter. One reason I do that, I can't count how many times over the years where I only typed up a response in a window such as I'm using for this post, to then submit it and it getting lost in the process. Maybe not so much on this board, but other boards it has happened numerous times, so eventually I went to formulating my thoughts in NotePad first, and if something goes wrong during the send, I still have a backup that I can resend without worrying about starting all over again. I'm not ignoring your request then, in case that were to cross your mind at some point, thought I should let you know.
 
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5thKingdom

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Jim, pardon me for streamlining some of what you wrote.

1. The first beast in Revelation 13:1 represents....the Anti-Christ

2. The second beast in Revelation 13:11 represents .... the Anti-Christ

The Anti-Christ is the same person called the "Little Horn" in Daniel and the "False Prophet" in Rev. and the "Man of Sin" in 2nd Thess.

Jim, as I understand your view, the first and second beast is the Anti-Christ. Not two different individuals?


Is it that the first beast Anti-Christ, or the second beast Anti-Christ who is the the False prophet ?


Dougg,

I use the term "Anti-Christ" as that has been the common
term used (since at least the Reformation) for the MAN
called the "Little Horn" [Dan] or the "False Prophet" [Rev].

Since we know there are TWO Beasts in Revelation and
we know the 8th "head" is the SAME PERSON as the
7th "head" I did not think using the term "Anti-Christ"
for both the First Beast and Second Beast would be
confusing to you (if it was?)

Now HERE is the problem:
In Revelation, the Bible uses the term "Beast" to describe
the Anti-Christ/False Prophet AND it uses the term "Beast"
to describe the FOLLOWERS of that man (his "kingdom").
We must understand the context of the passage to be
able to discern whether the "Beast" represents the MAN
or the FOLLOWERS of that man (his "kingdom") and it
can often become quite confusing.

On the other hand there are passages that clearly show
the "Beast" (followers of the man) is separate from the
MAN (Anti-Christ/False Prophet/Little Horn/Man of Sin)

Rev 19:20
And the beast [followers or kingdom] was taken, and with him
the false prophet [Anti-Christ or Little Horn] that wrought miracles
before him [the Beast], with which he [the Anti-Christ/False Prophet]
deceived them [followers] that had received the mark of the beast,
and them [followers] that worshipped his image [Gospel].
These both [False Prophet and followers/Beast] were cast
alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Rev 20:10
And the devil [Satan] that deceived them [nations of the world]
was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast
[followers of the Anti-Christ/False Prophet/Little Horn/Man of Sin]
and the false prophet [Anti-Christ/Little Horn] are,
and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Jim
.
 
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Douggg

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In Revelation, the Bible uses the term "Beast" to describe the Anti-Christ/False Prophet
Which of those two beasts in Revelation 13, is the Anti-Christ/False Prophet?

The first beast Anti-Christ? or the second beast Anti-Christ ?
 
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Douggg

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Rev 19:20
And the beast [followers or kingdom] was taken, and with him
the false prophet [Anti-Christ or Little Horn] that wrought miracles
before him [the Beast], with which he [the Anti-Christ/False Prophet]
deceived them [followers] that had received the mark of the beast,
and them [followers] that worshipped his image [Gospel].
These both [False Prophet and followers/Beast] were cast
alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
Are all of the followers of the beast, there in and around Jerusalem the Day that Jesus returns? Or are they all around the world ?
 
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5thKingdom

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Are all of the followers of the beast, there in and around Jerusalem the Day that Jesus returns? Or are they all around the world ?


Good question.
The CONTEXT of the Great Tribulation "Kingdom of Heaven"
[Mat 25:1] is EXCLUSIVE to the "ten virgins" that "went forth"
from the Christian "Kingdom of Heaven"


We see this again in Rev 17. The CONTEXT of the Reveltion
Beast are:


Rev 17:12-13
And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have
received no kingdom as yet [during the Great Commission]; but
receive power as kings one hour with the beast. These have one
mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.


Rev 17:17
For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree,
and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God
shall be fulfilled.


We see this again in Daniel 7. The CONTEXT of the Daniel's
Fourth Beast EXCLUSIVE to the "ten horns/kings" that arise
during the Fourth Kingdom... and the "Little Horn" (Anti-Christ)
that arises AFTER those ten "kings/horns/virgins".


While the unsaved world is looking for a political leader to
rule the world... the Bible shows the Anti-Christ is a spiritual
leader who rules those who "went forth" from the Third Beast
(the Christian Kingdom) into the Fourth Beast (Great Tribulation)


Again, the reason this was not known previously is that Daniel's
prophecies were "closed-up" and "sealed" to all previous Saints
until the Last Saints of the Fourth Beast/Kingdom were "overcome"
by the Anti-Christ.


I mean (from a human perspective) this only makes sense.
If God had revealed the Truth about Daniel's prophecies to the
Saints living at 100AD or 500AD or 1000AD or 1500AD then
the Saints would have known WHEN and WHERE to look for
this "Little Horn" that was able to understand "dark sentences"
and "enter peacefully" and "obtain the Kingdom with flatteries".


This information could not be revealed until AFTER the Anti-Christ
had already "overcome" the Last Saints. Once again the context:


Rev 17:17
For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree,
and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God
shall be fulfilled.


.
 
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Which of those two beasts in Revelation 13, is the Anti-Christ/False Prophet?

The first beast Anti-Christ? or the second beast Anti-Christ ?


The "head" of the First Beast is the same person as
the "head" of the Second Beast.

Remember... the 8th "head" is "of the seventh"...

Rev 17:11
And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth,
and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

The "head" of the First Beast received what appeared to be
a fatal wound at the end of the First Woe. But then he arose
as the "head" of the Second Beast. It is the Second Beast that
goes into perdition when destroyed and "cast alive into the Lake"

.
 
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The "head" of the First Beast is the same person as
the "head" of the Second Beast.

Remember... the 8th "head" is "of the seventh"...

Rev 17:11
And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth,
and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.

The "head" of the First Beast received what appeared to be
a fatal wound at the end of the First Woe. But then he arose
as the "head" of the Second Beast. It is the Second Beast that
goes into perdition when destroyed and "cast alive into the Lake"

.
Jim, I don't think you are going to answer my questions with straight answers or are ever going to answer my questions with straight answers. I am putting you on my ignore list, to avoid the stress, and amount of energy I am having to expend for nothing good coming out it.
 
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5thKingdom

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Jim, I don't think you are going to answer my questions with straight answers or are ever going to answer my questions with straight answers. I am putting your on my ignore list, to avoid the stress, and amount of energy I am having to expend for nothing good coming out it.


Wow... I answered ALL your questions directly.
I am sorry if you did not LIKE the answer or if you
could not understand the answer.

.
 
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Timtofly

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We are at seal 3.

Satan only has one man, the first beast, a false prophet.

Satan is the second beast.

The image is the beast that was, is not, and yet was.

People are astonished for one, things did not turn out like they were taught for the last 200 years. That this image is able to do what it will do. They are deceived by Satan now, they will be astonished and forget who God is at that moment.

The rapture is mocked because it is the escape clause. In truth, it is the mercy and grace clause. It will prevent most people from living through, all this false teaching they have taught and been taught.

No one knows, nor can pin down when the Lamb is coming to collect the remainder of the church, and burn up all the tares. But it has not even started yet. When it does start, all will know the truth.
 
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Josheb

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I'm not closeminded to your pov, but you are clearly closedminded to mine, though. I have been familiar with Amil since at least 2009, I think. I have had many a discussions over the years with Amils since then.
And I have admitted numerous times, that in some regards Amil makes far more sense than Premil. My biggest problem is that I can't get Amil to fit with the timeline of events. In order for Amil to even work, the 42 month reign of the beast has to follow the thousand years. Revelation 20:4 is already proving it doesn't and can't, yet some Amils still insist it can and does.
Your own post contradicts you.

You explicitly stated, "Unless the proposed books are free, in general I'm not into any books that are trying to make a profit off the word of God." That is not openmindedness.

You explicitly stated, "My Bible says, freely you have received, freely give," but the Bible also states the workman is worth his wages and we are to give them their due. So, once again, that's not openness; that's a selective, close-minded use of scripture.

You explicitly stated, "...to each his own I guess," which isn't just gross relativism but an assumption you and every other individual is the measure of all things, not the right handling of scripture. That's not openmindedness.

Lastly, an active resistance to what has been well-established precedent is closemindedness.
I can't get Amil to fit with the timeline of events.
Then you should read Riddlebarger's book. Your entire world view is dependent upon something you've just admitted you "can't get." Do you think all the amils living over the last 20 centuries built their understanding on something that couldn't be understood or an irrationally irreconcilable view of the 42 weeks? That's not openmindedness!
I can't get Amil to fit with the timeline of events.
This exchange between you and I began because you claimed preterism precluded an amil view of the 42 weeks. That's not factually correct but...

...you then went on to say you're not interested in reading otherwise unless it's free.

You are closeminded.

So closeminded you cannot or will not see it.

Let's test this, okay? Your profile says you live in Texas. I will send you a copy of Riddlebarger's book on your pledge to read it from cover to cover. I'll send it general delivery to a post office you choose, so nothing more than your first initial, last name and the zip code of the post office will be needed. Message me if you're interested.
 
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Zao is life

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This makes the point I'm trying to make. If that is the period of time we are still in, which means the beast hasn't even ascended out of this pit yet, this alone would prove Amils are wrong to claim that there are already martyrs reigning a thousand years in heaven with Christ, who have been martyred for refusing to worship the beast. Even though you and I don't agree with the Amil pov, obviously Amils do agree with it, and that some reading these threads, who haven't made up their minds one way or the other yet, could maybe find Amils' arguments more convincing, even though their arguments are not even logical when examining them in light of the texts involved.
The Amil understanding is that all is spiritual and nothing in this physical universe that exists now will ever matter because when Jesus comes back, the earth and universe will burn up and be replaced by an entirely new heavens and new earth. The only reason why that has not yet happened (in the A-mill understanding) is because of the great commission.

There is one verse + one passage of scripture which ensures the A-mills keep the kingdom of Christ spiritual only, and this present creation, completely corrupt and waiting only for complete destruction by fire:

Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world. If My kingdom were of this world, then My servants would fight so that I might not be delivered to the Jews. But now My kingdom is not from here. (John 18:36).

The Lord is not slow concerning His promise, as some count slowness, but is long-suffering toward us, not willing that any of us should perish, but that all of us should come to repentance.
But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a rushing noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat. And the earth and the works in it will be burned up.

Then, all these things being about to be dissolved, what sort ought you to be in holy behavior and godliness,
looking for and rushing the coming of the Day of God, on account of which the heavens, being on fire, will melt away, and the elements will melt, burning with heat?
But according to His promise, we look for new heavens and a new earth in which righteousness dwells.
(2 Pet 3:9-13).

Every other passage of scripture both in the Old and the New Testament must be interpreted in the light of the above (in the A-mill understanding). Thus you will never, never get a real, physical kingdom of Christ, or reign of Christ over the kingdoms of this world in a very real and literal way that is not merely spiritual, following His destruction of the beast and before the earth and all its works are burned up.

Therefore there has not only been a divorce between God and the genetic seed of Abraham who reject Christ, but there has also been a divorce between God and this current creation, according to this over-emphasis on certain scriptures and total ignoring of (more than de-emphasis of) everything else.

This is why A-mills will never, never consider the possibility of a literal, physical thousand year reign of Christ (which is not spiritual only, but both spiritual and physical). To them the idea contradicts the rest of the New Testament.

The sixth seal pretty much describes what Peter is describing in 2 Pet 3:9-13, but A-mills will not be able to see Peter as referring to anything short of a complete dissolving of the current universe and earth and the appearance of a complete new creation.
 
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