[moved] Where does God's Wrath begin in Revelation?

DavidPT

Well-Known Member
Sep 26, 2016
8,601
2,106
Texas
✟196,410.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
During the First Woe Satan attacks all the Last Saints on earth
This is during the FIRST Revelation Beast


Where are you seeing any of that in Revelation 9? satan is not attacking any saints in that chapter. The first woe is only 11 verses and I'm not seeing anything like that in the text anywhere.

Revelation 9:4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

Who would not have the seal of God in their foreheads? Saints????
 
Upvote 0

5thKingdom

Newbie
Mar 23, 2015
3,698
219
✟35,230.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Where are you seeing any of that in Revelation 9? satan is not attacking any saints in that chapter. The first woe is only 11 verses and I'm not seeing anything like that in the text anywhere.

Revelation 9:4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.

Who would not have the seal of God in their foreheads? Saints????


No, those without the seal of God in their foreheads are the
unsaved "tares" in the church.

In the beginning of Rev 9 Satan is loosened from the Pit.
The smoke and darkness rising from the Pit is Satan and
his demons being loosened on the church.

The grass and the green things and the trees represent
the saved "wheat" in the church.. BTW, this would be the
Last Saints on earth.

The Locusts that come OUT of the smoke and darkness
are those preaching the Gospel of the Anti-Christ in the
churches. Locusts represent false prophets.

In those days men will seek death (in Christ, i.e., salvation)
by following the Gospel of the Anti-Christ. However, they
cannot be "killed" (saved) and are tormented for a period
of 5 months, which represents the 1st Woe or 5th Trumpet.

BTW... these Locusts/false prophets are also shown in
Rev 11:7-10 as the two prophets that "tormented" the
people (in the church). Those people are happy when they
see these Locusts/Prophets "killed" (silenced) after their
prophecy is proven to be a false prophecy.

BTW... this is also when the Seventh "Head" of the Revelation
Beast suffers what appears to be a fatal wound... again because
his prophecy proved to be false.

The Locusts preach their false gospel throughout the 1st Woe
or 5th Trumpet, tormenting those in the church who do not
have the seal of God in their forehead (the unsaved "tares")

At the END of the 1st Woe and Beginning of the 2nd Woe
these Locusts/false prophets are "killed" at the appointed
year/month/day/hour.

Rev 9:15 And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared
for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the
third part of men.

The third part of men represents the Last Saints... just as the
"third part" in the first four trumpets [Rev 8] represented the
diminished influence of the Saints in the churches at the end
of the Christian "Kingdom of Heaven".

The Locusts/false prophets represent the "ten virgins" of Mat 25,
and the ten "kings/horns" of Daniel 7 AND Revelation 17

Rev 17:12-13
And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have
received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour
with the beast. These have one mind, and shall give their power
and strength unto the beast.

Rev 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree,
and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.

At the end of the First Woe and Beginning of the Second Woe
the "wise virgins" are "killed" (silenced, when they realized they
had been preaching a false Gospel of the Anti-Christ). However,
the foolish virgins continued to follow the Anti-Christ during the
Second Woe/6th Trumpet

Rev 9:20 And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship devils, and idols of gold, and silver, and brass, and stone, and of wood: which neither can see, nor hear, nor walk:
Rev 9:21 Neither repented they of their murders, nor of their sorceries, nor of their fornication, nor of their thefts.

The Second Beast (the False Prophet or "Little Horn" of Dan 7)
and the foolish virgins are destroyed just before the END of the
Second Woe. There is a Final Harvest of the "wise virgins" just
before the Revelation Beast is destroyed... I just posted a thread
entitled "The Final Harvest" in the eschatology section of the site
and it shows five (5) separate places where the Final Harvest is
shown in Scripture.


The Revelation Beast is also shown as the Great Tribulation
"Kingdom of Heaven" [Mat 25:1] and as the experiences of
the "ten virgins". It is also shown as the experiences of the
ten "kings/horns" in Daniel 7 AND Revelation 17 and as the
reign of the Anti-Christ during Satan's "Little Season" and as
the experiences of the ten "Kings" of Daniel 2:44

Anyway, I am beginning to ramble. Let me know if you have
any other questions.

Jim
.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,683
3,404
Non-dispensationalist
✟356,689.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
The third part of men represents the Last Saints... just as the
"third part" in the first four trumpets [Rev 8] represented the
diminished influence of the Saints in the churches at the end
of the Christian "Kingdom of Heaven".
9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.

Jim, to say that your theory and interpretations are outlandish would be a understatement. Where will the abomination of desolation be setup to be worshiped? And what will it be? In your theory.

The beast and the false prophet, who will be cast alive into the lake of fire - are how many persons ?
 
Upvote 0

keras

Writer of studies on Bible prophecy
Feb 7, 2013
13,558
2,480
82
Thames, New Zealand
Visit site
✟290,689.00
Country
New Zealand
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Married
Right... this says all Christians will move to Israel. LOL
You never cease to amaze me with your fantasies
Is Bible truth a fantasy to you?

The Heirs of the Holy Land:
Ephesians 1:11-14 In Christ, indeed, we have been given the heritage, as was decreed in God’s purpose. For it was His will that we who set our hopes in Jesus, should be the ones to make His glory known and praised.

We Christians have the Seal of the Holy Spirit, which is the pledge of the inheritance that will be ours when God has redeemed what is His own.

........cleared and cleansed His possession. Deuteronomy 32:34-43

Romans 8:16-18 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God…..it is the Spirit of adoption, so we can call Him ‘Father’. This affirms that we are God’s children and if children, then heirs, heirs of God’s promises through Christ.

But we must share His suffering, if we are also to share His glory.


Ephesians 3:6 Through the Gospel, Gentiles are joint heirs with the Jews, part of the same body, sharers together in the promises of God through Jesus.


Galatians 3:29 So if you belong to Christ, then you are the issue of Abraham and heirs of God’s promises. [to the Patriarchs]


Colossians 1:12 We give thanks to the Father who has made us fit to share in the heritage of God’s people in the Kingdom of light.


It is quite evident that the vast multitude seen in Jerusalem, Revelation 7:9, soon after the Sixth Seal event that will clear all of the holy Land, is far more that the remnant of the Jewish people. Romans 9:27

Many prophesies make it plain that in the end times there will be a people in God’s holy Land, who will be His people, those who seek the Lord and who know what is right. Isaiah 51:1, Isaiah 35, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Zechariah 8:1-8

Every faithful Christian person.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Are you confessing to all of us that you don't know the difference between every mountain moving and every mountain DISAPPEARING? There is a difference.


There are word differences in Revelation chapter 6, and Revelation chapter 16.

However, because we have Christ coming as a thief at Armageddon in Revelation 16:15-16, we know the book is not in chronological order.
Therefore, it can only be understood through the recapitulation method.

Some people try to pretend the book is in chronological order to get their man-made doctrines to work.

I will confess that we find Christ in both chapter 6, and chapter 16.


Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
Rev 6:17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.


Do you deny that we have a great earthquake in both chapters, and we also have Christ (the Lamb) in both chapters?

.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Is Bible truth a fantasy to you?

The Heirs of the Holy Land:
Ephesians 1:11-14 In Christ, indeed, we have been given the heritage, as was decreed in God’s purpose. For it was His will that we who set our hopes in Jesus, should be the ones to make His glory known and praised.

We Christians have the Seal of the Holy Spirit, which is the pledge of the inheritance that will be ours when God has redeemed what is His own.

........cleared and cleansed His possession. Deuteronomy 32:34-43

Romans 8:16-18 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God…..it is the Spirit of adoption, so we can call Him ‘Father’. This affirms that we are God’s children and if children, then heirs, heirs of God’s promises through Christ.

But we must share His suffering, if we are also to share His glory.


Ephesians 3:6 Through the Gospel, Gentiles are joint heirs with the Jews, part of the same body, sharers together in the promises of God through Jesus.


Galatians 3:29 So if you belong to Christ, then you are the issue of Abraham and heirs of God’s promises. [to the Patriarchs]


Colossians 1:12 We give thanks to the Father who has made us fit to share in the heritage of God’s people in the Kingdom of light.


It is quite evident that the vast multitude seen in Jerusalem, Revelation 7:9, soon after the Sixth Seal event that will clear all of the holy Land, is far more that the remnant of the Jewish people. Romans 9:27

Many prophesies make it plain that in the end times there will be a people in God’s holy Land, who will be His people, those who seek the Lord and who know what is right. Isaiah 51:1, Isaiah 35, Ezekiel 34:11-16, Zechariah 8:1-8

Every faithful Christian person.


Why did Jesus correct the woman at the well when she said earthly Jerusalem was the place to worship?

Why did Paul contrast earthly Jerusalem, to the Jerusalem which is above in Galatians chapter 4? Paul called earthly Jerusalem the city of "bondage".
Which one did Paul say is our "mother"?

What is the promised land in Hebrews 11:15-16, and in Hebrews 12:22-24, and Revelation 3:12?

God's "Holy land" in not now found on this rotten, sin-cursed, earth.
See Revelation 11:8 for the spiritual condition of earthly Jerusalem.


Joh 4:20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship.
Joh 4:21 Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father.
Joh 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
Joh 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.



Gal 4:25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
Gal 4:26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.


.
 
Upvote 0

JacksBratt

Searching for Truth
Supporter
Jul 5, 2014
16,282
6,483
62
✟570,626.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
You did not answer the question.
Is there some reason you are ignoring this verse?


.
I believe that the answer to your question was obvious.. So, I stated what I did...

God's wrath is poured out in the seals and bowls during the tribulation.. Satan also has anger toward those that listen and believe in God and follow Him...

There is a lot of anger there.. and it is not limited to one entity at a time.
 
Upvote 0

BABerean2

Newbie
Supporter
May 21, 2014
20,614
7,484
North Carolina
✟893,665.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
I believe that the answer to your question was obvious.. So, I stated what I did...

God's wrath is poured out in the seals and bowls during the tribulation.. Satan also has anger toward those that listen and believe in God and follow Him...

There is a lot of anger there.. and it is not limited to one entity at a time.

Thank you for acknowledging that all of the "wrath" in the Book of Revelation does not come from God.


.
 
Upvote 0

5thKingdom

Newbie
Mar 23, 2015
3,698
219
✟35,230.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.

Jim, to say that your theory and interpretations are outlandish would be a understatement. Where will the abomination of desolation be setup to be worshiped? And what will it be? In your theory.

The beast and the false prophet, who will be cast alive into the lake of fire - are how many persons ?


Dougg... I assume you already know that the term "Beast"
represents a "Kingdom"? Right?

And that "Kingdom" consists of (wait for it... PEOPLE)

The False Prophet is the same Man called the "Little Horn"
in Daniel 7 and the "Fierce King" in Isaiah and the "Man of Sin"
in 2 Thess and commonly known as THE Anti-Christ who is
Satan's chief emissary on earth during his "Little Season".

Satan is a spirit an needs a MAN to "overcome" and "kill"
the Last Saints during his "Little Season"

The Abomination of Desolation "standing" (ruling) in the
"Holy Place" (Body of Believers of the Fourth Kingdom) is
the same as the "Man of Sin" who is "sitting" (ruling) in the
"Temple" (Body of Believers of the Fourth Kingdom) so the
answer of WHERE this occurs is in the "Body of Believers"
during the Fourth "Kingdom of Heaven" [Mat 25:1]

-----------

Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman,
and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which
keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony
of Jesus Christ
.

So the PEOPLE thrown into the Lake of Fire in Rev 19:20
are the followers of the Anti-Christ.

Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings,
which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings
one hour with the beast. These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast.

Rev 17:17 For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will,
and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the
words of God shall be fulfilled
.

Dan_11:31 And arms [ten horns] shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

Dan_12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days

Mat_24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

--------

BTW... Does it surprise you that the "third part" used in the
First Four Trumpets represents the Saints? Did you actually
take those passages LITERALLY. That is hilarious.

Just like the "third part" killed in Rev 9 represents the Saints
in the Revelation Beast.

Just like the three "horns" that are "plucked up by the roots
is also a picture of the Anit-Christ ("Little Horn") overcoming
the Last Saints during the Fourth Beast

-------------

Before you can even PRETEND to have found truth...
the FIRST thing you need to do is understand that the
Revelation Beast (consisting of PEOPLE called the ten "kings/horns")
is the same events as the Great Tribulation (consisting of PEOPLE
called the "ten virgins") and Daniel's Fourth Beast (consisting of
PEOPLE called ten "Kings/Horns") and the PEOPLE of Daniel 2:44
called the ten "kings".

If you cannot harmonize the experiences of these SAME PEOPLE
then you cannot have a Clue about the fulfillment of these prophecies.


.
 
Upvote 0

JacksBratt

Searching for Truth
Supporter
Jul 5, 2014
16,282
6,483
62
✟570,626.00
Country
Canada
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Married
Thank you for acknowledging that all of the "wrath" in the Book of Revelation does not come from God.


.
Thanks for that.

Will you accept that I believe that we are today, and have been for about 6000 years, been under the wrath of Satan?

I mean this entity absolutely hates us lowly humans that will, in the end, judge his kind, judge the angels...

Satan cannot stand it when some human soul is held in the heart of God when it accepts Christ.

So, ya, there is not only the wrath of God in the tribulation. There is heightened wrath of Satan for those that will not take his mark... even unto death.

However, the Tribulation is God's wrath poured out on the earth.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: keras
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

fwGod

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2005
1,404
532
✟65,262.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Dispensationalism divides history up into blocks called dispensations claiming different ways of how God has dwelt with man.
Those 'blocks' precisely pertain to each previous age. The dispensations use the 6 day creation + the day of rest as the template of the 6 prophetic days of man's dominion on the earth and the 7th prophetic day is the Millennium.

So each day corresponds to an age, such as the age before the Law... and the age of the Law.. and on.. so that we know what age we are in, the church age.

And, since all previous ages were 2000 years each, we know that we are close to the end of the church age.
I don't subscribe to that theory.

I am a futurist, in that I believe the end times prophecies for the most part are still ahead of us.
Yes they are, and we know that because of rightly using the dispensations.

When you use the words "future" and "end times prophecies" that is according to dispensations. You can't know when the church age/dispensation will end and the end times begin without dispensations.

The scripture verse that says "When is the time of your coming and the end of the age?" that is in line with and according to dispensations. When the scripture verse says "and in the ages to come that he would show the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Jesus Christ" that is in line with and according to dispensations.

The scripture verse that says "Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." that is an admonishment to pay attention to the dispensations that divide a difference between one age and another.

Otherwise Christians who engage in predicting the rapture, because they ignore the different ages or dispensations, they will use a verse in Revelation/the Tribulation and wrongly apply it to the time of pre-tribulation rapture.

Or, they (the preterists) say that everything [that's prophetically to happen in future], has already happened in the past.

So because you see things to happen in future, but you say that you aren't using the dispensations, you actually are.
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
77
Home in Tulsa
✟94,263.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
I'm marveling at the fact that you stated that all the seals and such have no Purpose.
As to your view of the other... everyone has their opinion and the right to have it.
It is not that they have "no" purpose. I only state that their MAIN purpose is the prevent the book from being opened to get Satan kicked off his throne UNLESS or until someone can be found worthy to take the book and open the seals.

Do you not see that the devil is involved in some of the seals that is sealing that book? I am convinced that the "book" is the lease document to earth. Satan usurped Adam's lease and took Adam's great authority and dominion. So God was on the outside looking in, so to speak. Satan because the "god" of this world, and has held that position since Adam. Therefore I think Satan certainly had something to do with the seals.

I see Satan's hand in getting this book sealed so that only someone who could rise from the dead to become the redeemer would be worthy. I am convinced That Satan was SURE no man would ever be able to escape from hell!

God wanted to send out the church (seal 1). Satan OF COURSE would not want that. I can guess He said, "if you send out the church, I get the right to STOP the church (or the advance of the gospel) and cause martyrs. GOd then might have said, "You can use wars, famines, pestilences, and wild beasts, but you are limited to only 1/4 of the earth."

God's goal will be to get the book opened:
5:2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book...
3
And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book
4
And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book,

The seals, it seems, were there so that NO ONE - not even God himself - could open the seals: ONLY someone who could prevail over death under or by His own power. Did you notice, once a seal is opened, it is never mentioned again?

OF COURSE God wanted to send out the church to make disciples of all nations. But God did not want wars. It is Satan who starts wars. God is not a murderer. It is Satan to does pestilences. It goes without saying, God does not want martyrs. But Satan is the god of this world.
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
77
Home in Tulsa
✟94,263.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Those 'blocks' precisely pertain to each previous age. The dispensations use the 6 day creation + the day of rest as the template of the 6 prophetic days of man's dominion on the earth and the 7th prophetic day is the Millennium.

So each day corresponds to an age, such as the age before the Law... and the age of the Law.. and on.. so that we know what age we are in, the church age.

And, since all previous ages were 2000 years each, we know that we are close to the end of the church age.
Yes they are, and we know that because of rightly using the dispensations.

When you use the words "future" and "end times prophecies" that is according to dispensations. You can't know when the church age/dispensation will end and the end times begin without dispensations.

The scripture verse that says "When is the time of your coming and the end of the age?" that is in line with and according to dispensations. When the scripture verse says "and in the ages to come that he would show the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Jesus Christ" that is in line with and according to dispensations.

The scripture verse that says "Be diligent to present yourself approved to God, a worker who does not need to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." that is an admonishment to pay attention to the dispensations that divide a difference between one age and another.

Otherwise Christians who engage in predicting the rapture, because they ignore the different ages or dispensations, they will use a verse in Revelation/the Tribulation and wrongly apply it to the time of pre-tribulation rapture.

Or, they (the preterists) say that everything [that's prophetically to happen in future], has already happened in the past.

So because you see things to happen in future, but you say that you aren't using the dispensations, you actually are.
I am convinced, everyone that knocks dispensations are not at this time trying to follow Moses law!
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
77
Home in Tulsa
✟94,263.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Thanks for that.

Will you accept that I believe that we are today, and have been for about 6000 years, been under the wrath of Satan?

I mean this entity absolutely hates us lowly humans that will, in the end, judge his kind, judge the angels...

Satan cannot stand it when some human soul is held in the heart of God when it accepts Christ.

So, ya, there is not only the wrath of God in the tribulation. There is heightened wrath of Satan for those that will not take his mark... even unto death.

However, the Tribulation is God's wrath poured out on the earth.
Well said!
 
Upvote 0

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
77
Home in Tulsa
✟94,263.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
So; you think its OK to add words to Revelation?

God's Throne, all the angels- heaven is where exactly in your belief?
Proof that it all can be seen from the earth if God wills it, is in Ezekiel 1:1 and Acts 7:56.
The vast multitude in Rev 7:9 will see it too, when they; every faithful Christian, goes to live in all of the holy Land, as is well prophesied. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10, Romans 9:24-26

The 'houses' of John 14:1-3 are in heaven now, but we never go there to them, they come to us; AFTER the Millennium. Revelation 21:1-7
I certainly don't think it is OK to teach that Gentile believers will go to the Holy Land rather than heaven! You would be run out of SO MANY evangelical churches if you tried to teach that doctrine.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

iamlamad

Lamad
Jun 8, 2013
9,616
744
77
Home in Tulsa
✟94,263.00
Country
United States
Faith
Word of Faith
Marital Status
Married
Are really that hard of hearing?
I just told you that you don't NEED a chart.
All you NEED is to harmonize ALL RELATED Scriptures.

Does you "chart show that
the PEOPLE in the Revelation Beast are the SAME PEOPLE
in the Great Tribulation and the SAME PEOPLE as the "ten virgins"
and the SAME PEOPLE living in Daniel's Fourth Beast/kingdom
(shown as ten "kings/horns") and the SAME PEOPLE from
Rev 17 (also shown as ten "kings/horns") and the SAME PEOPLE
as the ten "kings" of Dan 2:44

No... your chart does not show any of that.
So much for the "works of man".

.
Douggg loves his charts!
 
Upvote 0

fwGod

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2005
1,404
532
✟65,262.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
I am convinced, everyone that knocks dispensations are not at this time trying to follow Moses law!
All of the church age are under grace, not law.. for law or the letter of it has bondage while grace has liberty in Christ.
 
Upvote 0

Douggg

anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist
May 28, 2009
28,683
3,404
Non-dispensationalist
✟356,689.00
Country
United States
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Private
When you use the words "future" and "end times prophecies" that is according to dispensations. You can't know when the church age/dispensation will end and the end times begin without dispensations.
No it is not according to dispensations (of dispensationalism).

"end times" is an adopted term taken for the many" time of the end" words in Daniel, that do not contain the church concept in it context, but are future events still unfulfilled.

TIME OF THE END IN THE BIBLE

If you are a dispensationalist, that is your prerogative. But to say that I am a one by virtue of being a futurist is not correct. It would be like me saying because you are a Christian, you are a Baptist.
 
Upvote 0

fwGod

Well-Known Member
Dec 19, 2005
1,404
532
✟65,262.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
No it is not according to dispensations (of dispensationalism).

"end times" is an adopted term taken for the many" time of the end" words in Daniel, that do not contain the church concept in it context, but are future events still unfulfilled.

TIME OF THE END IN THE BIBLE

If you are a dispensationalist, that is your prerogative. But to say that I am a one by virtue of being a futurist is not correct. It would be like me saying because you are a Christian, you are a Baptist.
The matter of dispensations is based on the word "ages" which I've mentioned in my post. "Ages to come". That is definitely a future term concerning end times.

You are using dispensation in the same way that any Christian is water baptized yet they say they are not Baptist.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

5thKingdom

Newbie
Mar 23, 2015
3,698
219
✟35,230.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Will you accept that I believe that we are today, and have been for about 6000 years, been under the wrath of Satan?


In fact, "Babylon the Great" represents Satan's wrath upon
the "children of God" through the (1st) Pre-Flood Kingdom
and the (2nd) Jewish "Kingdom of Heaven" [Mat 22:2] and
the (3rd) Christian "Kingdom of Heaven" [Mat 13 in 8 verses]
before he is "loosened" to rule during the Revelation Beast
which is also shown as the (4th) Great Tribulation
"Kingdom of Heaven" [Mat 25:1]

You can see a detailed explanation of "Babylon the Great" here:
https://www.5thkingdomofheaven.com/chapter-7

I promise you there is NEW INFORMATION there you have
never seen before and that information has been TESTED by
(literally) HUNDREDS of the most esteemed theologians teaching
in some of the most prestigious seminaries in America. And
NONE of them could find even ONE VERSE in the Bible to refute
or contradict anything on that page.. you can see a partial list
of these theologians/seminaries on the "Recipients Page".

.
 
Upvote 0