Praying for others.

Tellyontellyon said:

I read in the gospels about the Lord's prayer, but I also see that Christians do also do lots of other prayers and even have an ongoing dialogue or prayerful listening with God.

✝ Firstly, I am wondering about prayers for others... If you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these sinus saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

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I believe it can help. I also believe it's ok to ask for prayers. The Apostle Paul asked people to pray for him in Ephesians for example. I believe the praying for Saints mentioned in Ephesians 6 is referring to Christians who are alive.

Tellyontellyon said:

you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

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We pray for each other because we are told to do so. Does it help? That depends on whose evidence you look at! As far as I'm concerned that does not matter, it is part of our expressing our love for those we pray for.
Is it wrong? How can it be wrong if Jesus prayed for us, we are copying him so if you think it wrong please say why.

Tellyontellyon said:

some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc

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The RCC believe that the saints, nominated individuals have the ability to hear us and intercede for us so they pray to them.
However there is no biblical authority for this.

Tellyontellyon said:

I read in the gospels about the Lord's prayer, but I also see that Christians do also do lots of other prayers and even have an ongoing dialogue or prayerful listening with God.

✝ Firstly, I am wondering about prayers for others... If you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

Click to expand...

Your going to get a lot of difference on opinion on this especially on the second one between Protestants and non-Protestants. But yes, Christians are encouraged to pray for others.


James 5:

The Power of Prayer
13 Are any of you suffering hardships? You should pray. Are any of you happy? You should sing praises. 14 Are any of you sick? You should call for the elders of the church to come and pray over you, anointing you with oil in the name of the Lord. 15 Such a prayer offered in faith will heal the sick, and the Lord will make you well. And if you have committed any sins, you will be forgiven.
16 Confess your sins to each other and pray for each other so that you may be healed. The earnest prayer of a righteous person has great power and produces wonderful results. 17 Elijah was as human as we are, and yet when he prayed earnestly that no rain would fall, none fell for three and a half years! 18 Then, when he prayed again, the sky sent down rain and the earth began to yield its crops.



PS - from a non-Protestant perspective.

1)There are a number of Bible verses that say or imply that the power of death has been largely defeated in the Crucifixion and resurrection of Christ. We still die, but most of the "curse of death" (separation from God) has been done away with for the those who believe and in the final last days even physical death itself shall be dealt with.


2) Besides this there are many verses which speak that the "Body of Christ"/ Church is One. These concepts together with other passages like the quoted passage from James means that yes you can have intercession of the saints. Besides that there are some other passages that state or imply it like the one below.

Revelation 6:

9 And when the Lamb opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the testimony they had upheld. 10 And they cried out in a loud voice, “How long, O Lord, holy and true, until You judge those who live on the earth and avenge our blood?”

Tellyontellyon said:

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

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Seeing there is only One mediator between God and man, I would say it is wrong.

1 Timothy 2:5 (KJV) For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

...besides the fact we are forbidden to practice necromancy.

Praying for others is important since the Lord calls us to love God & neighbor & express this in living examples of charity etc. via the golden rule ( Matthew 7:12 etc.).

From this it seems evident that we are to hope that those around us live by good will, have their basic needs, etc. & ultimately, salvation. Prayer begins & fulfills our living faith.

Further re the prayer of saints & angels. Acceptable accounts of these emerged from highly debated writings like the book of Enoch. Many ancient Christians believed this was scripture ( the Ethiopian Orthodox Bible does include Enoch). Aspects of a writing like Enoch became part of Church tradition.

The prayers of saints & angels are accounted for in Enoch 39:

The Book of Enoch: The First Parable: Chapter XXXIX

One can see the correlation of this to Revelation 4.

Tellyontellyon said:

✝ Firstly, I am wondering about prayers for others... If you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

Click to expand...

I believe it can help sometimes.

Tellyontellyon said:

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

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Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox will say it is similar, but here's where it doesn't make sense to me. If I'm praying, God can hear me. Because God can hear me, and because God is good, and because I am supposed to have a relationship with God, I don't see why I should bother praying to a saint whom I have never met and have no relationship with, when I can just pray to God. When I ask friends or family to pray for me, that is different because we have close relationships that are made closer by praying for each other. We can also interact more readily with each other, so we can have conversations about prayer requests if we both wish to, which can refine the prayers that are offered to God. We also more readily see ourselves as people going to God together, as well.

Tellyontellyon said:

I read in the gospels about the Lord's prayer, but I also see that Christians do also do lots of other prayers and even have an ongoing dialogue or prayerful listening with God.

✝ Firstly, I am wondering about prayers for others... If you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

Click to expand...

The amazing thing about prayer is not that we pray, but God answers our prayer!

The Lords prayer, is actually the disciples prayer.... "This, then, is how you should pray" a template of how to pray.

Prayer is dialogue with God the Father as you would a friend, but also humbly as to the King.

Prayer is an inward act, not a outward show.

We have a lot confidence to pray because of Christ Jesus. Heb 4:16a Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence

Tellyontellyon said:

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

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Pray is only mediated only through the Son of God, Jesus Christ.
2 Corinthians 1:20 For no matter how many promises God has made they are "Yes" in Christ. And so through him the "Amen" is spoken by us to the glory of God.

He is also our high priest...

Hebrews 4:14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. 16 Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need.

Biblically living believers of Christ are the saints. Philippians 4:22 All the saints greet you, especially those of Caesar’s household.
And Mary? John 2:5 His mother said to the servants, “Do whatever he tells you.”

God bless you.

In our tradition we see the saints as examples of those who lived & died ( some martyrs), Enoch & Elijah still live who became the heavenly “cloud of witnesses” who look to “Jesus, author & finisher of our faith” ( see Hebrews 11, Hebrews 12:1-2).


At the transfiguration the Lord revealed Moses & Elijah talking with Him ( Matthew 17:1-13 etc.). Many within the Orthodox & Catholic traditions see the good woman of the apocalypse as the Virgin Mary ( Revelation 12). We believe these are who we participate in with all the living ( earthly & heavenly) in prayer.

Tellyontellyon said:

Does that not also apply to asking a friend or a priest to pray for you.

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We all are priests as believers and have access into His presence.

Ephesians 2:18 KJV
[18] For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

Be careful who you invoke...

Tellyontellyon said:

Like somebody might have a particular affinity with a certain saint or angel. Perhaps it's not strictly necessary, but I'm not convinced the Bible is against it.

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Acts 19:13 Some Jews who went around driving out evil spirits tried to invoke the name of the Lord Jesus over those who were demon-possessed. They would say, “In the name of the Jesus whom Paul preaches, I command you to come out.” 14 Seven sons of Sceva, a Jewish chief priest, were doing this. 15 One day the evil spirit answered them, “Jesus I know, and Paul I know about, but who are you?” 16 Then the man who had the evil spirit jumped on them and overpowered them all. He gave them such a beating that they ran out of the house naked and bleeding.

Tellyontellyon said:

I read in the gospels about the Lord's prayer, but I also see that Christians do also do lots of other prayers and even have an ongoing dialogue or prayerful listening with God.

✝ Firstly, I am wondering about prayers for others... If you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

Click to expand...

Prayers are the only way left generally for Christians to communicate with God through the Holy Spirit. How effective one can communicate with God and to get a "reply" will depend on how close to God is the one saying the prayer. That's the basic establishment under which group prayers and prayers for others are critical. Saul once lost communication with God completely that he has to go through Samuel in order to get to a "reply" from God.

This basically means, we can still get "replies" from God through a group of Christians and prayers from others even under the circumstance that we are temporarily backsliding to a point where we lost contact with God individually. That's another way or practice of how a sinner can stay close to God.

Tellyontellyon said:

I read in the gospels about the Lord's prayer, but I also see that Christians do also do lots of other prayers and even have an ongoing dialogue or prayerful listening with God.

✝ Firstly, I am wondering about prayers for others... If you do a prayer for another person can that help? If another person asks you to pray for them is that ok and helpful, or is it wrong?

Click to expand...

We are encouraged in Scripture to pray for one another, to pray for our neighbors, pray for those in positions of power, etc. It's important to not think that prayer is some kind of "magic" whereby if we say the right words, or invoke God's name that somehow we gain power or can use God like a genie or magic lamp. But what prayer does is it invites us to submit ourselves to God, it invites us to change the way we think, speak, and look at the world by pointing us away from ourselves and to the will of God.

When we pray for another person, we are saying, "These things are in Your hands, Lord; we trust You and Your ways".

Prayer is important, not because through prayer we bend the world to our will; but rather through prayer we ourselves are the ones being changed, we are the ones being shaped by prayer. Prayer changes us. Which is why how we pray has always been an important idea in Christianity, Jesus Himself teaches us that when we pray we should not pray boastfully or as a spectacle to make ourselves look better before others; but teaches us to pray through the Lord's Prayer. And the ancient axiom of the Christian Church has always been Lex orandi, Lex credendi--the law of prayer is the law of belief. What and how we pray (and worship) influences, affects, transforms, and shapes what and how we believe.

✝ Secondly, some Christians make appeals to major saints, to Mary etc. for these saints to intercede with God in their behalf.. Is that the same sort of thing, or is it wrong?

Click to expand...

This depends on who you ask. Generally speaking only Orthodox and Catholic Christians petition the saints in heaven to pray for us, you might find this also among some Anglo-Catholics within the Anglican Church; but generally it's something only Catholics and Orthodox do.

Many Protestants believe it to be deeply wrong, even sinful, to ask the saints to pray for us and their argument for why varies.

For Lutherans, such as myself, the reason we don't petition the saints in heaven to pray for us is because we can't be sure that the saints can hear us. Maybe they can, maybe they can't, we just don't (and can't) know. And so even though asking the saints to pray for us has been a very old practice within the Church, Lutherans have generally avoided the practice because there's no way we can really know or not. However, this does not mean that we don't believe the saints can and do pray for us, indeed, we believe that the saints in heaven pray for us, even as the angels pray for us (indeed, even Scripture itself shows angels praying for God's people).

So I guess the answer is..it depends.

-CryptoLutheran