Was It Appropriate for Thomas to Address Yeshua as "My God"?

HARK! · Jun 26, 2020

Jipsah said:
So lessee. In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth. In the beginning was the Word...All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made....And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us. Gets kinda hard to maintain that distinction, doesn't it?

Not really, if we study the Torah.

Mr. M · Jun 26, 2020

Jipsah said:
So lessee. In the beginning, God created the heaven and the earth. In the beginning was the Word...All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made....And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us. Gets kinda hard to maintain that distinction, doesn't it?

I guess one will know it when they see it, even if they are now unaware.
1 Corinthians 15:
24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.
25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death.
27 For “He has put all things under His feet.” But when He says “all things are put under Him,” it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted.
28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject
to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all, in all.

Aussie Pete · Jun 26, 2020

Minister Monardo said:
Yes, as long as we maintain this distinction.
2 John 1:9. Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God.
He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son.
The distinction between Father and Son must be maintained.
Matthew 7:21. Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven,
but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

John 1
" 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was in the beginning with God. 3All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being. 4In Him was life, and the life was the Light of men. 5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness did not comprehend it."

John 6:29 'Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."'

HARK! · Jun 26, 2020

Minister Monardo said:
I guess one will know it when they see it, even if they are now unaware.
1 Corinthians 15:
24 Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.
25 For He must reign till He has put all enemies under His feet.
26 The last enemy that will be destroyed is death.
27 For “He has put all things under His feet.” But when He says “all things are put under Him,” it is evident that He who put all things under Him is excepted.
28 Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject
to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all, in all.

I brought this verse up in a Bible study. I paraphrased it. First they denied that it existed. I thumbed through my Bible and found it. Then a hush fell over the room.

These folks were not Bible illiterate. That church is deep into the word; and the Pastor sits at those Bible studies. It's a room full of well seasoned Christians.

People just tend to read right over what doesn't fit their preconceived doctrine.

GenemZ · Jun 26, 2020

HARK! said:
You've provided some very interesting speculation.

How do you explain this verse?

(CLV) Ps 82:6
I Myself have said: you are elohim, And sons of the Supreme are all of you.

Look here... it was a few posts before this one..
Was It Appropriate for Thomas to Address Yeshua as "My God"?

Mr. M · Jun 26, 2020

Aussie Pete said:
John 6:29 'Jesus answered, "The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent."'

An excellent verse!
Paul applies the comprehension of this to:
Ephesians 2:20. having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets,
Jesus Christ Himself being the chief cornerstone,
It is particularly interesting in how this played out with the reception/rejection of John the baptist.
Luke 7:
29 And when all the people heard Him, even the tax collectors justified God,
having been baptized with the baptism of John.
30 But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected the will of God for themselves,
not having been baptized by him.
literally, rejected the Will of God within themselves, i.e. as it is described in the OT,
they hardened their heart.

Mr. M · Jun 26, 2020

HARK! said:
I brought this verse up in a Bible study. I paraphrased it. First they denied that it existed. I thumbed through my Bible and found it. Then a hush fell over the room.

These folks were not Bible illiterate. That church is deep into the word; and the Pastor sits at those Bible studies. It's a room full of well seasoned Christians.

People just tend to read right over what doesn't fit their preconceived doctrine.

That is why people need more than just Bible study, they must fellowship IN The Holy Spirit.
The Holy Spirit "opens our comprehension".
See Bible Study or Fellowship in the Holy Spirit?

Blade · Jun 26, 2020

Yep.. I do.. He is. Yet.. I think that was between him and the Lord. They are one..not like me and wife are one.. they are ONE! So I do pray to the Father through the name of JESUS. Seen blind see deaf hear at that name JESUS. He is God.. Again.. I always talk to the Father.. in JESUS name. And its the sweet sweet holy Spirit talk talks to me.

Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

"Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.'

Mr. M · Jun 26, 2020

Blade said:
Yep.. I do.. He is. Yet.. I think that was between him and the Lord

Maybe reacting to the experience of putting his hand into His side?

HARK! · Jun 26, 2020

genez said:
Look here... it was a few posts before this one..
Was It Appropriate for Thomas to Address Yeshua as "My God"?

Look at what I quoted.

Was It Appropriate for Thomas to Address Yeshua as "My God"?

That is the post that I was responding to. The question stands unanswered.

Jipsah · Jun 26, 2020

HARK! said:
Not really, if we study the Torah.

I don't. I study the New Testament. God intervening directly in human history changed everything, IMO.

Dkh587 · Jun 26, 2020

Jipsah said:
I don't. I study the New Testament. God intervening directly in human history changed everything, IMO.

Maybe if you studied the Law & Prophets you would read all kinds of stories of God intervening directly with human history - that’s not exclusive to the NT.

HARK! · Jun 26, 2020

Jipsah said:
I don't. I study the New Testament. God intervening directly in human history changed everything, IMO.

Interesting....I thought the story of Noah was in Genesis.

crossnote · Jun 26, 2020

Jesus never rebuked Thomas for saying what he said regarding 'My Lord and my God'.

Inkfingers · Jun 27, 2020

When we consider the meaning of Elohiym, and how it is applied even to men...

Psalms 82:6

Zao is life · Jun 27, 2020

Bible Highlighter said:
Now, there are two wrong extremes people have made involving the Trinity.

#1. Modalism
(Which is a belief held by United Pentecostals).

This says that there is no distinctive persons within the Godhead. That God the Father just puts on a mask and pretends to be the Son; Others believe it says all three persons are smashed together whereby the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost do not have any kind of distinctiveness anymore. But the Bible makes it clear that the Father sent the Son to die for our sins (And it was not the Son sending the Father) (1 John 4:14). The Bible makes it clear that one cannot be forgiven if they speak a word against the Holy Spirit but yet, this is not the case if one speaks a word against the Son, though (Matthew 12:32).

#2. Tritheism
(Which is a belief held by Mormons).

This says that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost are three separate and distinct gods. This is polytheism or the worship of more than one God. But the Bible makes it clear that the Lord our God is one God (Deuteronomy 6:4).

Then there is the correct view of the Trinity.

The Lord our God exists as one God, but He exists as three distinct persons (i.e. The Father, the Word (Christ), and the Holy Ghost). All three persons co-existed as one God for all eternity. Also, in the Trinity, the Father and the Son and can dwell within one another despite their distinctiveness as persons within the Godhead, too. For Jesus said He dwells in the Father and the Father dwells in Him (John 14:10) (John 17:21).

Yet to us is one God, the Father, of whom are the all things, and we to Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom are the all things, and we through Him (but not in all men is the knowledge, and certain with conscience of the idol, till now, as a thing sacrificed to an idol do eat it, and their conscience, being weak, is defiled). 1 Cor 8:6-7

One Lord Jesus Christ through whom are all things..

By the word (Hebrew: dabar) of the LORD were the heavens made; and all the host of them by the breath (Hebrew ruach: Spirit) of His mouth. Ps 33:6

It is the Spirit that makes alive, the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit and are life. John 6:63

Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever You had formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting You are God. Ps 90:2

The LORD possessed Me in the beginning of His way, before His works of old.
I was anointed from everlasting, from the beginning, before the earth ever was.
When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no springs heavy with water.
Before the mountains were settled, before the hills, I travailed; Ps 8:22-25

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with the LORD (ho he to theos), and the Word was God (theos);
this one was in the beginning with God;
all things through him were caused to be, and without him was not even one thing caused to be that hath been caused to be. In him was life, and the life was the light of men. John 1:1-4

Philip said to Him, Lord, show us the Father, and it is enough for us.
Jesus said to him, Have I been with you such a long time and yet you have not known Me, Philip?
He who has seen Me has seen the Father. And how do you say, Show us the Father?
Do you not believe that I am in the Father and the Father in Me?
The words that I speak to you I do not speak of Myself, but the Father who dwells in Me, He does the works. John 14:8-10

Father, Word (Son), and Holy Spirit throughout God's Revelation of Himself in the Biblical scriptures.

Mr. M · Jun 27, 2020

Blade said:
Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:

Equality between Father and Son based on granted authority.
Matthew 28:18. And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying,
All authority is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
John 5:
19. Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you,
The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do:
for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise.
22. For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:
23. That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father.
He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him.
26. For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;
27. And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man.
30. I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

This Truth is foreshadowed in BeReshiyth.
Genesis 41:
39 Then Pharaoh said to Joseph, Inasmuch as God has shown you all this, there is no one
as discerning and wise as you.
40 You shall be over my house, and all my people shall be ruled according to your word;
only in regard to the throne will I be greater than you.
41 And Pharaoh said to Joseph, See, I have set you over all the land of Egypt.
42 Then Pharaoh took his signet ring off his hand and put it on Joseph’s hand; and he clothed him in garments of fine linen and put a gold chain around his neck.
43 And he had him ride in the second chariot which he had; and they cried out before him, “Bow the knee!” So he set him over all the land of Egypt.
44 Pharaoh also said to Joseph, I am Pharaoh, and without your consent no man may lift his hand or foot in all the land of Egypt.

That all should honour Joseph, even as they honoured Pharaoh.
He that honoured not Joseph honoured not Pharaoh who sent him.

2PhiloVoid · Jun 27, 2020

Minister Monardo said:
While I agree, He still makes a clear distinction.
John 20:17. Jesus said to her, Do not cling to Me, for I have not yet ascended to My Father;
but go to My brethren and say to them, I am ascending to My Father and your Father,
and to My God and your God.

Of course. There's a Trinity implied, the nature of which isn't something that can fully be grasped by the human mind. And so, John seems to echo the structure in this narrative with the rest of the allusions made in the rest of his Gospel (such as the one we see between Jesus and St. Thomas).

Lady Chuza · Jun 27, 2020

Minister Monardo said:
John 20:
24 Now Thomas, called the Twin, one of the twelve, was not with them when Jesus came.
25 The other disciples therefore said to him, “We have seen the Lord.” So he said to them, “Unless I see in His hands the print of the nails, and put my finger into the print of the nails, and put my hand into His side, I will not believe.”
26 And after eight days His disciples were again inside, and Thomas with them. Jesus came, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, “Peace to you!”
27 Then He said to Thomas, “Reach your finger here, and look at My hands; and reach your hand here, and put it into My side. Do not be unbelieving, but believing.”
28 And Thomas answered and said to Him, “My Lord and my God!”
29 Jesus said to him, “Thomas, because you have seen Me, you have believed. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.”

This is a good question.
We know that Jesus is elohim and we know that the Father handed all authority on this earth over to His son. (John 3:35 and John 13:3) So I'd say yes, it was appropriate. Jesus is God the Son. Some might say he is co-regent.

Mr. M · Jun 27, 2020

Lady Chuza said:
This is a good question.
We know that Jesus is elohim and we know that the Father handed all authority on this earth over to His son. (John 3:35 and John 13:3) So I'd say yes, it was appropriate. Jesus is God the Son. Some might say he is co-regent.

Welcome to the Forum Lady Chuza. Interesting choice of words, co-regent. Or as Paul mentions here:
1 Timothy 6:15. Which in his times he will show who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
I just posted something similar to your thoughts here if you scroll up 2 or 3 spots.
Stay in the Blessing!

Was It Appropriate for Thomas to Address Yeshua as "My God"?

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