Will you really go to hell if you commit suicide?

Aussie Pete said:

If the person is born again, they are forgiven and nothing they do can change their standing before God. .

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In Matt 7 Jesus said bad fruit does not come from a good tree... "By their fruits you shall know them" and in Matthew 18 we have "forgiveness revoked" -

So then suicide is not 'safe ground' even for a Christian.

No one can ever answer this. Who here can see the heart? We get sick so...why can't the mind get sick?

JI4M said:

Hi Everyone,

I know this question has been asked a million times so thank you for answering if you do.

So if you commit suicide, will you got hell? And can you point me to passages in the Bible where this is talked about, especially about the hell part?

My daughter's father commited suicide years ago and I would like to know how to answer this when it comes up. I am also curious to know myself. It haunts me to think of him being in hell, however, don't sugar coat it for me. Tell me the truth because I really need to know the truth. Thank you.

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Only God knows the heart of man. Simple answer. Be blessed.

JI4M said:

Hi Everyone,

I know this question has been asked a million times so thank you for answering if you do.

So if you commit suicide, will you got hell? And can you point me to passages in the Bible where this is talked about, especially about the hell part?

My daughter's father commited suicide years ago and I would like to know how to answer this when it comes up. I am also curious to know myself. It haunts me to think of him being in hell, however, don't sugar coat it for me. Tell me the truth because I really need to know the truth. Thank you.

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I am sorry to hear the news about your daughter's father.
Suicide is a very difficult thing to come to terms with and my thoughts and prayers go out to you and your family.
One passage in the Bible I always come back to again and again is Genesis 18:25 "Will the Judge of all the earth do right?". God knows what is in our hearts and will treat all of us fairly and justly.
If I as a human being can feel compassion for someone in your daughter's father's situation, then how much more will God, the One who is gracious and compassionate, slow to anger and rich in love? (Psalms 145:8-9).
I pray that you and your daughter will be able to finally have peace regarding this situation.

JI4M said:

What if your in severe, unbareable, excrutationg physical pain with no end in sight?

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Or the end is in sight, but that end is death, whether by your own devices or letting the cancer run its course and kill you. At what point is living just suffering without relief and you're going to die soon no matter what you do there is no treatment or cure for what you have and every single moment is simply agony and you begging God for relief or death to be in pain no more.

It's a hard question to answer that's for sure. I want to believe that euthanasia in terminal painful illnesses is compassionate, but the bible does not address it so I can't be certain about it.

I'm not terminally ill but I've been in such pain that I could not think of anything but the pain I was experiencing, it's fruitless and serves no purpose it does not glorify God and it's impossible to glorify God when you're in that much pain, and I imagine end stage cancer pain is way worse. I can't pray, or read the bible or witness or do any work for God at all. All I can do thrash around screaming, I can hardly imagine what someone experiences with something like stage 4 liver cancer like my grandmother had. On 2 GRAMS of morphine an hour, more than a lethal dose and completely sedated and sleeping she was still WHIMPERING in pain in her sleep. In that case where there is no euthanasia and the best you can do is sign a DNR/Living Will so when you clock out they don't try to bring you back just to suffer more, and ramp up the pain medication until anyone who knows anything about pharmacology, especially the doctor, knows that that dose of morphine will cause them to stop breathing and they will die from it.

If you were to use strict black and white morality you could claim the oncologist murdered that terminally ill patient, knowing that dose of pain medication was lethal.
But it is not done in malice, it is done 100% out of compassion and not wanting that person to suffer anymore.
Should that be counted as sin on the doctor?
Does God feel compassion at a point when pain is fruitless and black and white morality no longer serves to His glory?

JI4M said:

What if your in severe, unbareable, excrutationg physical pain with no end in sight?

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Then you are like Jesus on the Cross.

chilehed said:

I suggest careful consideration of this quote from the Catechism of the Catholic Church (emphasis added):

Suicide
2280 Everyone is responsible for his life before God who has given it to him. It is God who remains the sovereign Master of life. We are obliged to accept life gratefully and preserve it for his honor and the salvation of our souls. We are stewards, not owners, of the life God has entrusted to us. It is not ours to dispose of.

2281 Suicide contradicts the natural inclination of the human being to preserve and perpetuate his life. It is gravely contrary to the just love of self. It likewise offends love of neighbor because it unjustly breaks the ties of solidarity with family, nation, and other human societies to which we continue to have obligations. Suicide is contrary to love for the living God.

2282 If suicide is committed with the intention of setting an example, especially to the young, it also takes on the gravity of scandal. Voluntary co-operation in suicide is contrary to the moral law.

Grave psychological disturbances, anguish, or grave fear of hardship, suffering, or torture can diminish the responsibility of the one committing suicide.

2283 We should not despair of the eternal salvation of persons who have taken their own lives. By ways known to him alone, God can provide the opportunity for salutary repentance. The Church prays for persons who have taken their own lives.​

You all have my condolances for your loss.

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To build off of this: I believe it was St. Augustine who said, "You don't know what happens between the bridge and the water". If somebody jumps off the bridge to commit suicide, there still is that time between the bridge and the water for them to make repentance. There have been reports of people who had jumped off a bridge that were screaming out, "Oh God, I'm so sorry!". Horrifying to consider hearing these words in such a situation, but the point is that God can still give somebody an opportunity to come back to Him. There is still time between the bullet and the brain for God to offer somebody a chance to repent.

You requested Bible verses, so I looked up Bible verses on suicide, and it really wasn't very helpful. This is a complicated issue that is not directly addressed, although it does happen a few times. As with the Council Jerusalem, deciding a complicated question that wasn't directly addressed in Scripture (a show of church authority that was later recorded in the 15th chapter of Acts), we too should turn to the Church authority of our day, last everybody decide for themselves what Scripture means & divide the Body of Christ.

Peace be with you, and with all who are considering or have already committed suicide.

Most if not ALL suicide is a result of mental illness whether anyone accepts it or not. Suicide happens because the amount of pain an individual is in outweighs their resources for coping with that pain, and their brain short circuits. Mental illness is so insidious that a lot of the time it goes un-diagnosed or there is a comorbidity with chemical abuse/dependency which as we know, is also a form of illness... a very bad one.

I've dealt with suicidal ideation my entire life and wasn't diagnosed as seriously mentally ill until I was 25 and had already made two attempts that I hid behind drug overdoses.

The only way that I can see suicide as being hell-worthy is when it's someone committing suicide out of cowardice (Hitler or others)

so no, I don't believe that most of those poor souls who commit suicide are going to be in hell & I really don't care what my church or anyone's interpretation of the bible has to say about it, because it's just something that I know deep down in my heart of hearts.

We need to be more compassionate with people.

Jamdoc said:

If you were to use strict black and white morality you could claim the oncologist murdered that terminally ill patient, knowing that dose of pain medication was lethal.

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Catholic moral theology holds otherwise.

A morphine infusion is not prescribed to hasten a terminally ill patient's death, but to provide comfort to the patient. There is a distinct difference between the action of prescribing pain medication for a terminally ill patient and prescribing a lethal drug for a terminally ill patient. In the first case, the intent of the prescriber is to relieve pain and the drug of choice would be an opiate such as morphine. In the second case the intent of the prescriber is to purposefully hasten death. While it is true that the terminally ill patient's life may be somewhat shortened as a result of the ingestion of an opiate-that is not the intent of the prescriber.

Catholic moral theology recognizes and accepts this situation-calling it the "rule of double effect. The rule of double effect has a long history of use by bioethicists and philosophers as a means to resolve a particular type of ethical conflict in clinical cases. Basically the rule comes into play when a proposed action (such as administering morphine to a terminally ill patient in pain) has two known outcomes. One outcome is intended and desired (relief of pain). The other outcome is neither desired nor intended (hastening death), although it may be foreseen.

BobRyan said:

In Matt 7 Jesus said bad fruit does not come from a good tree... "By their fruits you shall know them" and in Matthew 18 we have "forgiveness revoked" -

So then suicide is not 'safe ground' even for a Christian.

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If one desires to commit suicide, they probably are already in hell.

JI4M said:

So does that mean, when it says "the dead", that the dead are the people who didn't go to heaven? Or is everyone dead who is dead until Jesus's second coming?

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eleos1954 said:

Yes. Everyone is in fact dead and in the grave. Described as a sleep .... many many many verses about this .... and including Jesus himself describing death as a sleep (ie ..... the Lazarus account) and the apostle Paul as posted before.

When Jesus returns the 1st resurrection of the saved (in the grave) and the saved living at the time and all are taken to heaven.

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The body sleeps but if you'll remember the story of Lazarus, he was conscious and aware in Abraham's bosom, and Paul said in 2 Corinthians 5:1-8 that when we leave this body, we're with the Lord. Not we're asleep until Jesus comes back, but we are with the Lord. Instantaneous.
Luke 23:43

And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise.

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Life is for the living. I have been to 3 funerals that were suicides, and the Pastor didn't bring it up. To comfort those left behind, all the Pastors used
Rom 8:38 For I am sure that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Jamdoc said:

The body sleeps but if you'll remember the story of Lazarus, he was conscious and aware in Abraham's bosom, and Paul said in 2 Corinthians 5:1-8 that when we leave this body, we're with the Lord. Not we're asleep until Jesus comes back, but we are with the Lord. Instantaneous.
Luke 23:43

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Lazarus in Abraham's bosom is a parable ... it is not teaching about what happens when someone dies.

2 Corinthians 5:1-8 - Paul states he would RATHER be absent from his body and present with the Lord .... all of would RATHER .... but that does not mean that is what happens.

Luke 23:43 -

we also know from the book of ACT's that Jesus himself did not ascend into heaven until 40 days later. Acts 1:3 also read verses 6 through 10.

State of the Dead

Psalm 90:3-6

You turn man back into dust And say, "Return, O children of men." For a thousand years in Your sight Are like yesterday when it passes by, Or as a watch in the night. You have swept them away like a flood, they fall asleep; In the morning they are like grass which sprouts anew.

Job 7:21

"Why then do You not pardon my transgression And take away my iniquity? For now I will lie down in the dust; And You will seek me, but I will not be."

Job 14:10-12

"But man dies and lies prostrate Man expires, and where is he? "As water evaporates from the sea, And a river becomes parched and dried up, So man lies down and does not rise. Until the heavens are no longer, He will not awake nor be aroused out of his sleep.

Psalm 13:3

Consider and answer me, O LORD my God; Enlighten my eyes, or I will sleep the sleep of death,

Daniel 12:2

"Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace and everlasting contempt.

Matthew 9:24

He said, "Leave; for the girl has not died, but is asleep." And they began laughing at Him.

Mark 5:39

And entering in, He said to them, "Why make a commotion and weep? The child has not died, but is asleep."

Luke 8:52-53

Now they were all weeping and lamenting for her; but He said, "Stop weeping, for she has not died, but is asleep." And they began laughing at Him, knowing that she had died.

1 Kings 2:10

Then David slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of David.

Deuteronomy 31:16

The LORD said to Moses, "Behold, you are about to lie down with your fathers; and this people will arise and play the harlot with the strange gods of the land, into the midst of which they are going, and will forsake Me and break My covenant which I have made with them.

2 Samuel 7:12

"When your days are complete and you lie down with your fathers, I will raise up your descendant after you, who will come forth from you, and I will establish his kingdom.

1 Kings 11:43

And Solomon slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of his father David, and his son Rehoboam reigned in his place.

1 Kings 14:20

The time that Jeroboam reigned was twenty-two years; and he slept with his fathers, and Nadab his son reigned in his place.

1 Kings 16:6

And Baasha slept with his fathers and was buried in Tirzah, and Elah his son became king in his place.

1 Kings 22:50

And Jehoshaphat slept with his fathers and was buried with his fathers in the city of his father David, and Jehoram his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 14:16

So Jehoash slept with his fathers and was buried in Samaria with the kings of Israel; and Jeroboam his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 15:7

And Azariah slept with his fathers, and they buried him with his fathers in the city of David, and Jotham his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 16:20

So Ahaz slept with his fathers, and was buried with his fathers in the city of David; and his son Hezekiah reigned in his place.

2 Kings 20:21

So Hezekiah slept with his fathers, and Manasseh his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 21:18

And Manasseh slept with his fathers and was buried in the garden of his own house, in the garden of Uzza, and Amon his son became king in his place.

Revelation 14:13

And I heard a voice from heaven, saying, "Write, 'Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on!'" "Yes," says the Spirit, "so that they may rest from their labors, for their deeds follow with them."


John 11:11-14

This He said, and after that He said to them, "Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep; but I go, so that I may awaken him out of sleep." The disciples then said to Him, "Lord, if he has fallen asleep, he will recover." Now Jesus had spoken of his death, but they thought that He was speaking of literal sleep.

Acts 7:60

Then falling on his knees, he cried out with a loud voice, "Lord, do not hold this sin against them!" Having said this, he fell asleep.

1 Corinthians 15:6

After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep;

John 5:28-29

"Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

Job 14:13-15

"Oh that You would hide me in Sheol, That You would conceal me until Your wrath returns to You, That You would set a limit for me and remember me! "If a man dies, will he live again? All the days of my struggle I will wait Until my change comes. "You will call, and I will answer You; You will long for the work of Your hands.

Psalm 17:15

As for me, I shall behold Your face in righteousness; I will be satisfied with Your likeness when I awake.

Isaiah 26:19

Your dead will live; Their corpses will rise You who lie in the dust, awake and shout for joy, For your dew is as the dew of the dawn, And the earth will give birth to the departed spirits.


1 Corinthians 15:20

But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18

But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.

Jeremiah 51:57

"I will make her princes and her wise men drunk, Her governors, her prefects and her mighty men, That they may sleep a perpetual sleep and not wake up," Declares the King, whose name is the LORD of hosts.


Psalm 7:3-5

O LORD my God, if I have done this, If there is injustice in my hands, If I have rewarded evil to my friend, Or have plundered him who without cause was my adversary, Let the enemy pursue my soul and overtake it; And let him trample my life down to the ground And lay my glory in the dust. Selah.

Psalm 76:5

The stouthearted were plundered, They sank into sleep; And none of the warriors could use his hands.

Jeremiah 51:39

"When they become heated up, I will serve them their banquet And make them drunk, that they may become jubilant And may sleep a perpetual sleep And not wake up," declares the LORD.

eleos1954 said:

Lazarus in Abraham's bosom is a parable ... it is not teaching about what happens when someone dies.

2 Corinthians 5:1-8 - Paul states he would RATHER be absent from his body and present with the Lord .... all of would RATHER .... but that does not mean that is what happens.

Luke 23:43 -

we also know from the book of ACT's that Jesus himself did not ascend into heaven until 40 days later. Acts 1:3 also read verses 6 through 10.

State of the Dead

Psalm 90:3-6

You turn man back into dust And say, "Return, O children of men." For a thousand years in Your sight Are like yesterday when it passes by, Or as a watch in the night. You have swept them away like a flood, they fall asleep; In the morning they are like grass which sprouts anew.

Job 7:21

"Why then do You not pardon my transgression And take away my iniquity? For now I will lie down in the dust; And You will seek me, but I will not be."

Job 14:10-12

"But man dies and lies prostrate Man expires, and where is he? "As water evaporates from the sea, And a river becomes parched and dried up, So man lies down and does not rise. Until the heavens are no longer, He will not awake nor be aroused out of his sleep.

Psalm 13:3

Consider and answer me, O LORD my God; Enlighten my eyes, or I will sleep the sleep of death,

Daniel 12:2

"Many of those who sleep in the dust of the ground will awake, these to everlasting life, but the others to disgrace and everlasting contempt.

Matthew 9:24

He said, "Leave; for the girl has not died, but is asleep." And they began laughing at Him.

Mark 5:39

And entering in, He said to them, "Why make a commotion and weep? The child has not died, but is asleep."

Luke 8:52-53

Now they were all weeping and lamenting for her; but He said, "Stop weeping, for she has not died, but is asleep." And they began laughing at Him, knowing that she had died.

1 Kings 2:10

Then David slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of David.

Deuteronomy 31:16

The LORD said to Moses, "Behold, you are about to lie down with your fathers; and this people will arise and play the harlot with the strange gods of the land, into the midst of which they are going, and will forsake Me and break My covenant which I have made with them.

2 Samuel 7:12

"When your days are complete and you lie down with your fathers, I will raise up your descendant after you, who will come forth from you, and I will establish his kingdom.

1 Kings 11:43

And Solomon slept with his fathers and was buried in the city of his father David, and his son Rehoboam reigned in his place.

1 Kings 14:20

The time that Jeroboam reigned was twenty-two years; and he slept with his fathers, and Nadab his son reigned in his place.

1 Kings 16:6

And Baasha slept with his fathers and was buried in Tirzah, and Elah his son became king in his place.

1 Kings 22:50

And Jehoshaphat slept with his fathers and was buried with his fathers in the city of his father David, and Jehoram his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 14:16

So Jehoash slept with his fathers and was buried in Samaria with the kings of Israel; and Jeroboam his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 15:7

And Azariah slept with his fathers, and they buried him with his fathers in the city of David, and Jotham his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 16:20

So Ahaz slept with his fathers, and was buried with his fathers in the city of David; and his son Hezekiah reigned in his place.

2 Kings 20:21

So Hezekiah slept with his fathers, and Manasseh his son became king in his place.

2 Kings 21:18

And Manasseh slept with his fathers and was buried in the garden of his own house, in the garden of Uzza, and Amon his son became king in his place.

Revelation 14:13

And I heard a voice from heaven, saying, "Write, 'Blessed are the dead who die in the Lord from now on!'" "Yes," says the Spirit, "so that they may rest from their labors, for their deeds follow with them."


John 11:11-14

This He said, and after that He said to them, "Our friend Lazarus has fallen asleep; but I go, so that I may awaken him out of sleep." The disciples then said to Him, "Lord, if he has fallen asleep, he will recover." Now Jesus had spoken of his death, but they thought that He was speaking of literal sleep.

Acts 7:60

Then falling on his knees, he cried out with a loud voice, "Lord, do not hold this sin against them!" Having said this, he fell asleep.

1 Corinthians 15:6

After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep;

John 5:28-29

"Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice, and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

Job 14:13-15

"Oh that You would hide me in Sheol, That You would conceal me until Your wrath returns to You, That You would set a limit for me and remember me! "If a man dies, will he live again? All the days of my struggle I will wait Until my change comes. "You will call, and I will answer You; You will long for the work of Your hands.

Psalm 17:15

As for me, I shall behold Your face in righteousness; I will be satisfied with Your likeness when I awake.

Isaiah 26:19

Your dead will live; Their corpses will rise You who lie in the dust, awake and shout for joy, For your dew is as the dew of the dawn, And the earth will give birth to the departed spirits.


1 Corinthians 15:20

But now Christ has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who are asleep.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18

But we do not want you to be uninformed, brethren, about those who are asleep, so that you will not grieve as do the rest who have no hope. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who have fallen asleep in Jesus. For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord, will not precede those who have fallen asleep.

Jeremiah 51:57

"I will make her princes and her wise men drunk, Her governors, her prefects and her mighty men, That they may sleep a perpetual sleep and not wake up," Declares the King, whose name is the LORD of hosts.


Psalm 7:3-5

O LORD my God, if I have done this, If there is injustice in my hands, If I have rewarded evil to my friend, Or have plundered him who without cause was my adversary, Let the enemy pursue my soul and overtake it; And let him trample my life down to the ground And lay my glory in the dust. Selah.

Psalm 76:5

The stouthearted were plundered, They sank into sleep; And none of the warriors could use his hands.

Jeremiah 51:39

"When they become heated up, I will serve them their banquet And make them drunk, that they may become jubilant And may sleep a perpetual sleep And not wake up," declares the LORD.

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To have that belief, is to believe that Jesus lied to the thief.
Obviously He did not.
VERILY he said, it was a true statement.
Now Jesus didn't go to Heaven immediately after He died, no. The Son of Man was in the heart of the earth for 3 days, right? Note that when Lazarus (and Jesus didn't give names in His parables, in this story He DID give a name, His parables were always "a certain man" etc) was in Abraham's bosom being comforted he could SEE the rich man being tormented, and the rich man could see Lazarus with Abraham. So no, neither were in heaven or hell, they were both in "the pit" but on one side of the pit is torment, and on the other side comfort. It's an inference, but the side where there's comfort might be "paradise"
It's basically the only way that Jesus was not lying to the thief in telling him VERILY, that he would be with Him in paradise... is that the consciousness needs to go there immediately after death, not a sleep but something that happened "today", it needs to be where Jesus went, and it needs to be Paradise, somewhere that's not evil and a place of torment. Now when Jesus DID go to heaven and is now at His father's right hand, if you're dying, and you're with the Lord, the Lord is now in Heaven, so that's where you'd have to be. He is preparing a place for us, and He is in heaven, so our place, at least until New Jerusalem comes down on the new earth, is in Heaven, temporarily.

Jamdoc said:

To have that belief, is to believe that Jesus lied to the thief.
Obviously He did not.
VERILY he said, it was a true statement.
Now Jesus didn't go to Heaven immediately after He died, no. The Son of Man was in the heart of the earth for 3 days, right? Note that when Lazarus (and Jesus didn't give names in His parables, in this story He DID give a name, His parables were always "a certain man" etc) was in Abraham's bosom being comforted he could SEE the rich man being tormented, and the rich man could see Lazarus with Abraham. So no, neither were in heaven or hell, they were both in "the pit" but on one side of the pit is torment, and on the other side comfort. It's an inference, but the side where there's comfort might be "paradise"
It's basically the only way that Jesus was not lying to the thief in telling him VERILY, that he would be with Him in paradise... is that the consciousness needs to go there immediately after death, not a sleep but something that happened "today", it needs to be where Jesus went, and it needs to be Paradise, somewhere that's not evil and a place of torment. Now when Jesus DID go to heaven and is now at His father's right hand, if you're dying, and you're with the Lord, the Lord is now in Heaven, so that's where you'd have to be. He is preparing a place for us, and He is in heaven, so our place, at least until New Jerusalem comes down on the new earth, is in Heaven, temporarily.

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you are taking a couple verses and dismissing many many MANY others that plainly state otherwise regarding death .... and also then dismissing the verses in Acts ....
and also there is Mary .... the day after the Sabbath whereas Jesus said ....

John 20:17
King James Version
Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

eleos1954 said:

you are taking a couple verses and dismissing many many MANY others that plainly state otherwise regarding death .... and also then dismissing the verses in Acts ....
and also there is Mary .... the day after the Sabbath whereas Jesus said ....

John 20:17
King James Version
Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

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You didn't read my post.
I just explained, Jesus didn't go to Heaven the same day as He died. We agree on that. He did go to a conscious place though, where the Thief was also, called Paradise.

Jamdoc said:

You didn't read my post.
I just explained, Jesus didn't go to Heaven the same day as He died. We agree on that. He did go to a conscious place though, where the Thief was also, called Paradise.

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The first heaven consists of the earth’s atmosphere, where the clouds float and birds fly. Remember in Genesis, when God created a heaven between the waters? That's the atmosphere. You’ll also remember that in 2 Peter, the apostle writes the “heavens shall dissolve”? It's talking about the first heaven, the atmosphere around the earth, and not where God dwells.

The second heaven, then, is where the sun, moon, stars, and galaxies hang suspended.

The third heaven is the dwelling place of God.

Jesus did not ascend that very day ... He was resurrected and 40 days later he ascended to heaven.

Jesus shows us the pattern

death ---- rest in the grave (tomb)- resurrection - then on to heaven

Agree to disagree but I would encourage you to study it out further .... in a broader context that just a couple verses.

BobRyan said:

In Matt 7 Jesus said bad fruit does not come from a good tree... "By their fruits you shall know them" and in Matthew 18 we have "forgiveness revoked" -

So then suicide is not 'safe ground' even for a Christian.

Click to expand...

Eternal life is eternal life. He who has the Son has the life. So you think that a Christian can have eternal life one minute and lose it the next? That does not fit the definition of eternal. Suicidal people need help, not some kind of religious and dogmatic condemnation that is not biblical.

eleos1954 said:

The first heaven consists of the earth’s atmosphere, where the clouds float and birds fly. Remember in Genesis, when God created a heaven between the waters? That's the atmosphere. You’ll also remember that in 2 Peter, the apostle writes the “heavens shall dissolve”? It's talking about the first heaven, the atmosphere around the earth, and not where God dwells.

The second heaven, then, is where the sun, moon, stars, and galaxies hang suspended.

The third heaven is the dwelling place of God.

Jesus did not ascend that very day ... He was resurrected and 40 days later he ascended to heaven.

Jesus shows us the pattern

death ---- rest in the grave (tomb)- resurrection - then on to heaven

Agree to disagree but I would encourage you to study it out further .... in a broader context that just a couple verses.

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Hey how about you actually read my posts?
I have said now, and repeated, that they went to Paradise, not Heaven.
Paradise is not Heaven. Not in the context Jesus was referring to.
Did Jesus tell him "Verily, I say unto thee, Today shalt thou sleep until the end of the world, and then I'll come back and thee will be with me in Heaven."
No.
He said "Verily, I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise."
If it did not happen Today, then Jesus would have lied. Does Jesus Lie? No. Jesus didn't sin. Lying is a sin. Jesus doesn't lie.

Aussie Pete said:

Eternal life is eternal life. He who has the Son has the life. So you think that a Christian can have eternal life one minute and lose it the next?

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Lucifer lost it.
Adam and Eve lost it and had to have the Gospel to save them.

Matthew 18 teaches the lesson of forgiveness revoked.
Gal 5:1-5 "Severed from Christ... fallen from grace"
Romans 11 "you stand only by your faith ... you should fear for if He did not spare them neither will He spare you".

Matt 7 "you cannot get bad fruit from a good tree"

The bible is filled with warnings to get people away from the idea of do evil and go to heaven anyway.
1 Cor 6 Paul has an entire teaching on it starting with "do not be deceived"

At the point of justification a person is born-again -- "a new creation" -- the "good tree" - but that person can then go on to choose evil and the Bible has all those warnings about our need to not do that.

September 21, 2016 - A day I will never forget. A day that was etched in my memory to this day and a memory I wish I did not have in my life.

I was at work, trying to get the computer charger I left from my Aunt Nancy's house because I had an assignment due this day and my laptop was about to die. She texted me the day before, saying she left it at my parent's for me to pick up. I didn't respond to her text.

When I got home, I was able to get the charger and grabbed my laptop to submit the assignment.

I thought about Aunt Nancy, for some reason. Didn't think of anything particular, but just thought about her. I was going to text her, and then became preoccupied with Facebook and didn't text.

It was a really good day for me. I accomplished everything. I cleaned my place, cooked dinner, and settled into bed.

But, I couldn't sleep. I was wide awake and it was about 10pm. I was surprised as to why I wasn't tired, because I usually go to bed around 8:30 on weekdays.

I thought about Aunt Nancy again. I needed to text her back finally about giving my charger to my parents. I had seen her two days prior, even though she was acting kind of weird with us. Very distant, very quiet.

I grabbed my phone to text her, but instead,my phone lit up with a caller ID.

It was my Mom.

"Why is Mom calling this late? This is unusual for her," I thought.

Then, I got a sinking feeling. Something must be off.

I answered, "Hello?"

"Katie?" my Mom said, in a quiet, but timid voice.

"Yes, Mom. You know this is me," I said, laughing.

Quiet on the other end.

"Why are you up? This is pretty late for you," I said.

"How's your day?" my Mom said.

"Cut to the chase, Mom. You're scaring me and I don't think you're calling to see how my day was,"

All of a sudden, I hear her crying.

"Honey," she said through tears, "I don't know how to tell you this - but Aunt Nancy killed herself today."

I screamed. I started crying. I was just about to text her, I had my phone LITERAlLY in my hand to reach out to her. I don't remember much after that. I remembered staying up all night, talking to my uncle on the phone since he found her hanging in their new house. I remember calling my boyfriend at that time that night, trying to get a hold of him.

To this day, I'm finally processing things. I'm in therapy, trying to come to terms with her note (it was one sentence and written in 3rd person and very eery), trying to come to terms with her being gone.

I did text her. I texted her a week later after her death. To have that closure. I still have it in my phone, 4 years later.

A month goes by, and my uncle decides to turn on her car to make sure it was still working. As soon as he turned it on, K-Love (Christian radio station), was playing. She was playing worship music as she pulled into the driveway to end her life.

You will get answers from different people. You will get different opinions. What I think, personally, is that when you commit suicide, it is forgiven. Murderers, liars, cheaters - they're all forgiven. Suicide, I believe, is a sin that is forgiven.