Keeping Sabbath not in effect

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Bob S said:

Why do you continue to put words that are not in my posts in your posts? I have to give your posting skills a big -0-.

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Bob S said:

The fact is that without the blood of Jesus covering our sins we could never achieve your set goals

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Would you mind explaining -exactly- what it was that you meant by this sentence?

Especially the "set goals" part which seemed to be a direct reference to this?:

RexColin said:

I serve a God that teaches me how to walk in his ways and not to keep falling. I certain I am going to stick to learning to walk in his ways, rather than learning to keep falling and getting picked up then.

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Because if you meant that even with the blood of Jesus covering our sins we still could never achieve these set goals, then what's the point of making such a statement?

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Rom 13:9-10
9 For the commandments,
“You shall not commit adultery,”
“You shall not murder,”
“You shall not steal,”
“You shall not bear false witness,”
“You shall not covet,”
and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfillment of the law.

same as they had in Matt 19 before the cross (According to Christ)

Matt 19
17 So He said to him, “Why do you call Me good? No one is good but One, that is, God. But if you want to enter into life, keep the commandments.”
18 He said to Him, “Which ones?”
Jesus said, “
‘You shall not murder,’
‘You shall not commit adultery,’
‘You shall not steal,’
‘You shall not bear false witness,’
19 ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and,
‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ ” (Lev 19:18

And of course the entire Ten are pulled in with Eph 6:2 showing that the 5th commandment is the first commandment in that list of Ten "with a promise".

Bob S said:

The significance is that 10 is never mentioned with commandments.

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Seriously??

Ex 34
And the Lord said to Moses, “Cut two tablets of stone like the first ones, and I will write on these tablets the words that were on the first tablets which you broke.
28 So he was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.
29 Now it was so, when Moses came down from Mount Sinai (and the two tablets of the Testimony were in Moses’ hand when he came down from the mountain)

The “TERM” TEN COMMANDMENTs applies ONLY to those words written on stone. A distinct unit – a distinct “name”. They are not called the “613 Commandments” and they are not downsized to something called “The NINE commandments” by NT authors or OT authors – “no not in all of scripture”!

Deut 5
22 ""These words the LORD spoke to all your assembly at the mountain from the midst of the fire, of the cloud and of the thick gloom, with a great voice, and He added no more. He wrote them on two tablets of stone and gave them to me.

Deuteronomy 4:13
"So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, that is, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

Deuteronomy 10:4
"He wrote on the tablets, like the former writing, the Ten Commandments which the LORD had spoken to you on the mountain from the midst of the fire on the day of the assembly; and the LORD gave them to me.

friend of said:

The 4th commandment (3rd in Catholicism) is no longer in effect in the same way it was during OT times. We are no longer to slavishly observe Sunday or Saturday or any other day designated by church authority, for Christ is all and in all. Each day is Holy gift of God and should be lived as such, as we await the coming day of His glorious Revelation. Demanding people observe a certain day (as is the case of SDA) are in error.

Romans 14:5-6
Galatians 4:8-12
Colossians 2:16-17

Christ is our Sabbath rest and all we need.

Hebrews 4:17-34

Discuss this controversial subject.

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All of God's righteous laws are eternal (Psalms 119:160), so all of them will always be in effect.

Paul was not an enemy of God, so you shouldn't interpret as teaching us to rebel against what God has commanded. Even if that was what he was doing, Paul did not have the authority to countermand God or to tell anyone not to obey any of His laws. The bottom line is that we must obey God rather than man, so we should be quicker to disregard everything that Paul has said than to disregard anything that God has commanded, however the reality is that Paul never taught us to rebel against God.

In Romans 14:1-5, Paul was speaking in regard to how to handle disputable matters of opinion, not in regard to whether followers of God should follow God, so nothing in the chapter should be interpreted as speaking against obeying God. The Sabbath isn't even mentioned in Romans 14 primarily because it had nothing to do with what Paul was speaking about. In Romans 14:5-6, it is speaking about those who esteems certain days for fasting as a matter of opinion, not saying that God's commands are optional.

In Galatians 4:8-12, Paul addressed those verses to those who formerly did not know God, also known as former pagans. As such, they were not formerly keeping God's holy days and therefore Paul could not have been criticizing them for returning to them, so whatever Paul was speaking about in these verses was in the context of paganism, not God's holy days.

In Colossians 2:16-17, Paul described the people who were judging them as teaching human traditions and precepts, self-made religion, asceticism, and severity to the body, so again he was describing pagans. As such, the Colossians were keeping God's holy days in obedience to His commands in accordance with the example that Jesus set for us to follow and Paul was encouraging them not to let any man judge them and keep them from obeying God. You should be more careful not to mistake something that was only said against obeying man's opinions as being against obeying God.

friend of said:

The 4th commandment (3rd in Catholicism) is no longer in effect in the same way it was during OT times. We are no longer to slavishly observe Sunday or Saturday or any other day designated by church authority, for Christ is all and in all. Each day is Holy gift of God and should be lived as such, as we await the coming day of His glorious Revelation. Demanding people observe a certain day (as is the case of SDA) are in error.

Romans 14:5-6
Galatians 4:8-12
Colossians 2:16-17

Christ is our Sabbath rest and all we need.

Hebrews 4:17-34

Discuss this controversial subject.

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Gentiles were never under the law and were never required to keep the Sabbath.

Unless you can find an instruction from an apostle that Gentiles need to be circumcised and obey the law.

friend of said:

@Soyeong If a person misses Church during the week, would you consider that sin? Just wondering. Thank you for your response.

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Sin is defined as the transgression of God's Law (1 John 3:4) and God's Law says to keep the Sabbath holy (Exodus 20:8-11), so it is therefore a sin to break the Sabbath. Part of keeping the Sabbath holy involves having a holy convocation.

friend of said:

So that's a yes? If a person has a work schedule that has them working on the Sabbath they are breaking God's law then?

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Generally speaking, yes.

friend of said:

The 4th commandment (3rd in Catholicism) is no longer in effect in the same way it was during OT times. We are no longer to slavishly observe Sunday or Saturday or any other day designated by church authority, for Christ is all and in all. Each day is Holy gift of God and should be lived as such, as we await the coming day of His glorious Revelation. Demanding people observe a certain day (as is the case of SDA) are in error.

Romans 14:5-6
Galatians 4:8-12
Colossians 2:16-17

Christ is our Sabbath rest and all we need.

Hebrews 4:17-34

Discuss this controversial subject.

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Great post!

Hebrews 4:17-34 ... does not exist

Malihah said:

Great post!

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post of friend of said: ↑

has errors in it

Soyeong said:

Generally speaking, yes.

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If someone is not circumcised, then they are effectively a lawless person. For sin is defined as transgression of the law. Break any law whatsoever and your not obeying the law, your sinning.

Kidnap someone and you are transgressing the law.

Afflict a widow and your transgressing the law.

Ignore circumcision and your transgressing the law.

Eat shellfish and your transgressing the law.

Your either obedient to the law or you are transgressing the law. There is no difference within the law, between transgression of one law in comparison to transgression of any other law.

Sin is transgression of any law within the law of Mt Sinai.

The law also condemns our good deeds which most Christians don't realize. The law demands a perfect and unselfish motive in everything we do and unfortunately sinners cannot meet this demand. The best we can do is realize our inability and look outside of ourselves to Christ and not inside ourselves to the will power gospel.

Malihah said:

The law also condemns our good deeds which most Christians don't realize. The law demands a perfect and unselfish motive in everything we do and unfortunately sinners cannot meet this demand. The best we can do is realize our inability and look outside of ourselves to Christ and not inside ourselves to the will power gospel.

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Romans 2

9There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil, first for the Jew, then for the Greek; 10but glory, honor, and peace for everyone who does good, first for the Jew, then for the Greek.

11For God does not show favoritism.12All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but it is the doers of the law who will be declared righteous.

14Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts either accusing or defending them. 16This will come to pass on that day when God will judge men’s secrets through Christ Jesus, as proclaimed by my gospel.

eleos1954 said:

Romans 2

9There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil, first for the Jew, then for the Greek; 10but glory, honor, and peace for everyone who does good, first for the Jew, then for the Greek.

11For God does not show favoritism.12All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law. 13For it is not the hearers of the law who are righteous before God, but it is the doers of the law who will be declared righteous.

14Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature what the law requires, they are a law to themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15since they show that the work of the law is written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts either accusing or defending them. 16This will come to pass on that day when God will judge men’s secrets through Christ Jesus, as proclaimed by my gospel.

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So the Gentiles who never kept the Sabbath one day in their whole lives are able to keep the law according to Paul. Thank you for showing us this. Amen

klutedavid said:

If someone is not circumcised, then they are effectively a lawless person. For sin is defined as transgression of the law. Break any law whatsoever and your not obeying the law, your sinning.

Kidnap someone and you are transgressing the law.

Afflict a widow and your transgressing the law.

Ignore circumcision and your transgressing the law.

Eat shellfish and your transgressing the law.

Your either obedient to the law or you are transgressing the law. There is no difference within the law, between transgression of one law in comparison to transgression of any other law.

Sin is transgression of any law within the law of Mt Sinai.

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A number of God's laws appear to conflict with each other, such as what happened when someone wanted to circumcise their baby on the 8th day and it happened to fall on the Sabbath. However, it was not the case that they were forced to sin by breaking one of the two commandments no matter what they choose to do, but that one of the commandments was never intended to prevent the other from being obeyed. This is why priests were held innocent for performing their duties on the Sabbath, why David and his men were held innocent for eating the bread of the Presence, and why Jesus defended the innocence of his disciples (Matthew 12:3-7).

So the group of Pharisees had reasoned that work is unlawful on the Sabbath and that healing was work, therefore it was unlawful to heal on the Sabbath. However, we are also commanded to love our neighbor and it would not be loving our neighbor to refuse to heal them. No command was intended to be used as an excuse to avoid obeying the greatest two commandments, which is why Jesus ruled that it was lawful to heal on the Sabbath.

Hi Soyeong, Is there an exemption for stealing, adultery, or any hurtful act to God or man?

There were all kinds of exemptions for Sabbath. No exemptions for acts concerning morality laws, but for Sabbath there is. One more reason we know that Sabbath was a ceremonial or ritual law.

Soyeong said:

Sin is defined as the transgression of God's Law (1 John 3:4) and God's Law says to keep the Sabbath holy (Exodus 20:8-11), so it is therefore a sin to break the Sabbath. Part of keeping the Sabbath holy involves having a holy convocation.

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If you notice God gave the Sabbath to only one nation (that nation is now defunct). It was a law contained in the Sinai covenant. That covenant was broken, no covenant, no laws. Jesus didn't leave His sheep lawless, He gave us the Royal law of Love to live by.