Matthew 24:31 is about the rapture

dqhall said:

Israel attends synagogue and reads from the Law and the Prophets. They celebrated Rosh Hoshana and gathered in groups for Passover as they did in ancient times.

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and there is desire among many Israeli Jews to rebuild the temple of Solomon.

Douggg said:

John 14:1-3 is scripture.

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Then it is up to the reader to correctly ascertain when what is prophesied will happen.
You do not do that, because the new Jerusalem will come down after the Millennium and only then will those worthy live in it. Revelation 21 to 22

Jamdoc said:

and there is desire among many Israeli Jews to rebuild the temple of Solomon.

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Only a very small minority want a new Temple.
Most Israelis, especially the Haredi Jews, refuse to step onto the Temple Mount as they are scared to walk over the place where the holy of holies was. The rest know very well that to demolish the Dome of the Rock, or even to build alongside it, would start a war.

It will be men from far away who will build the new Temple. Zechariah 6:15
The new inhabitants of all the holy Land, all the faithful Christian peoples. John sees them there soon after the Sixth Seal event has cleared and cleansed that entire area. Revelation 6:12-17, Revelation 7:1-14

jgr said:

You didn't answer the question, so here it is again:

Were Jesus' disciples mostly fishermen?

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I did not answer the question. And am not going to answer that question because it has nothing to do with the verses in the Olivet Discourse.

keras said:

Then it is up to the reader to correctly ascertain when what is prophesied will happen.
You do not do that, because the new Jerusalem will come down after the Millennium and only then will those worthy live in it. Revelation 21 to 22

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That is not what the text of John 14:2-3 says.

2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

Douggg said:

I did not answer the question. And am not going to answer that question because it has nothing to do with the verses in the Olivet Discourse.

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Do the disciples have anything to do with the verses in the Olivet Discourse?

jgr said:

Do the disciples have anything to do with the verses in the Olivet Discourse?

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Go back to my post #64 and #69 in this thread. My reference to the disciples is in those posts.

Douggg said:

Go back to my post #64 and #69 in this thread. My reference to the disciples is in those posts.

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Mine are in 68, 84, 89,93, and 100.

Our readers can determine the involvement of the disciples in the events of the Olivet Discourse.

The testimony and witness of history unambiguously confirm Scripture that their involvement continued after Matthew 24:14.

Douggg said:

That is not what the text of John 14:2-3 says.

2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

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We are told that people will be locked into their false beliefs.
You Douggg, are a prime example.

The text of John 14:1-3 does NOT say people will be taken to heaven.
It says: there is a place in heaven, prepared for His people.
It says: Jesus will come to the earth again.
It says: Then; He will gather His people and they will be with Him.
The place prepared in the New Jerusalem, which comes to the earth AFTER the Millennium. Revelation 21:1

Your so called 'proof text of a rapture to heaven', actually disproves that false theory.
It makes all your fanciful charts into so much wasted space and your arguments futile. 1 Corinthians 3:20

keras said:

The text of John 14:1-3 does NOT say people will be taken to heaven.
It says: there is a place in heaven, prepared for His people.
It says: Jesus will come to the earth again.
It says: Then; He will gather His people and they will be with Him.

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You are repackaging into your own words what it says in the text of the KJV to mean something else, rather than what is written.

2 In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

keras said:

We are told that people will be locked into their false beliefs.
You Douggg, are a prime example.

The text of John 14:1-3 does NOT say people will be taken to heaven.
It says: there is a place in heaven, prepared for His people.
It says: Jesus will come to the earth again.
It says: Then; He will gather His people and they will be with Him.
The place prepared in the New Jerusalem, which comes to the earth AFTER the Millennium. Revelation 21:1

Your so called 'proof text of a rapture to heaven', actually disproves that false theory.
It makes all your fanciful charts into so much wasted space and your arguments futile. 1 Corinthians 3:20

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We do go to heaven, kind of like a layover, you are right that earth is our intended forever home, not heaven, but to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord (2 Corinthians 5:8)
and after the 6th seal, events take place that are like the ones discussed in Matthew 24, and Revelation 7 has a bunch of people who werent in heaven before suddenly there.
So there is a rapture, God does spare us from His wrath, but not from the tribulations caused by men. (1 Thessalonians 5:9).

Douggg said:

You are repackaging into your own words what it says in the text of the KJV to mean something else, rather than what is written.

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The KJV is the ultimate source of all truth?
Just shows how deceived you are. We have far more manuscripts and scrolls now than the translators of the KJV had. Plus modern translations are in much better, more modern English.
Anyway, what I posted does not change the meaning, it is you who reads the text to suit your beliefs. People reading John 14:1-3 without any bias, would not see a 'rapture to heaven' in that scripture.

Jamdoc said:

Revelation 7 has a bunch of people who werent in heaven before suddenly there.

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All of Revelation 7:1-17, is describing earthly scenes. Nowhere is heaven mentioned and verses 15-17 prophesy the new Heavens and new earth, when God will dwell with His people in the New city of Jerusalem, on earth. Revelation 21:1-7...Death will be no more and God will wipe away every tear....

keras said:

The KJV is the ultimate source of all truth?
Just shows how deceived you are. We have far more manuscripts and scrolls now than the translators of the KJV had. Plus modern translations are in much better, more modern English.
Anyway, what I posted does not change the meaning, it is you who reads the text to suit your beliefs. People reading John 14:1-3 without any bias, would not see a 'rapture to heaven' in that scripture.

All of Revelation 7:1-17, is describing earthly scenes. Nowhere is heaven mentioned and verses 15-17 prophesy the new Heavens and new earth, when God will dwell with His people in the New city of Jerusalem, on earth. Revelation 21:1-7...Death will be no more and God will wipe away every tear....

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They're standing before the throne in white robes. It's heaven.

Jamdoc said:

They're standing before the throne in white robes. It's heaven.

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That's is your assumption. The scripture does not say they are in heaven. From all of that chapter, all of Revelation, all of the Bible; earth is where everything happens.
People can have white robes here and Gods Throne can be seen from the earth. Ezekiel 1:1 and Acts 7:56

But when it is understood what God really does plan for His people, then it will be known that the holy Land is our heritage and our destiny. Romans 9:24-26...in the very place...

Jamdoc said:

and there is desire among many Israeli Jews to rebuild the temple of Solomon.

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Some of them would like to start sacrificing goats again, but that is not Christianity.

keras said:

The KJV is the ultimate source of all truth?
Just shows how deceived you are. We have far more manuscripts and scrolls now than the translators of the KJV had. Plus modern translations are in much better, more modern English.
Anyway, what I posted does not change the meaning, it is you who reads the text to suit your beliefs. People reading John 14:1-3 without any bias, would not see a 'rapture to heaven' in that scripture.

All of Revelation 7:1-17, is describing earthly scenes. Nowhere is heaven mentioned and verses 15-17 prophesy the new Heavens and new earth, when God will dwell with His people in the New city of Jerusalem, on earth. Revelation 21:1-7...Death will be no more and God will wipe away every tear....

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Too many errors in your post for me to respond to.

Disagree! The rapture involves the voice of Michael, Matt. 24 involves sending out angels throughout the globe. When the rapture happens, it doesn't say that the tribes mourn, but they will mourn when the sign of Jesus coming occurs.

Rapture is just a catching up into the clouds to meet the Lord! this is a world wide gathering of the elect (which in this case means saved Jews)

nolidad said:

Disagree! The rapture involves the voice of Michael, Matt. 24 involves sending out angels throughout the globe. When the rapture happens, it doesn't say that the tribes mourn, but they will mourn when the sign of Jesus coming occurs.

Rapture is just a catching up into the clouds to meet the Lord! this is a world wide gathering of the elect (which in this case means saved Jews)

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... matthew 24 specifically says it is a gathering of the elect from all around the world, AND it has the tribes of the world mourning, because the wrath of God comes about half an hour later.
Your eschatalogical problem is that you connect Matthew 24 to Revelation 19, rather than Revelation 6. You see the second coming of Christ with Revelation 19, rather than realizing that the events in Matthew 24 describing the second coming are happening in Revelation 6.
There's a 2nd coming in the clouds, and then Jesus comes back again, a third coming, for Armageddon.

Jamdoc said:

... matthew 24 specifically says it is a gathering of the elect from all around the world, AND it has the tribes of the world mourning, because the wrath of God comes about half an hour later.
Your eschatalogical problem is that you connect Matthew 24 to Revelation 19, rather than Revelation 6. You see the second coming of Christ with Revelation 19, rather than realizing that the events in Matthew 24 describing the second coming are happening in Revelation 6.
There's a 2nd coming in the clouds, and then Jesus comes back again, a third coming, for Armageddon.

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The rapture is not a second coming at all! Jesus does not come back to earth! He descends as far as the clouds (up to 65,000 feet above the earth). It is at teh culmination of the war of Armegeddon that jesus 2nd coming happens.

REv. 6 is the realization of the world that the wrath of the Lamb has arrived ands that is right before the trumpets and bowls!

There is simply no arrival of Jesus in REv. chapter 6.

nolidad said:

The rapture is not a second coming at all! Jesus does not come back to earth! He descends as far as the clouds (up to 65,000 feet above the earth). It is at teh culmination of the war of Armegeddon that jesus 2nd coming happens.

REv. 6 is the realization of the world that the wrath of the Lamb has arrived ands that is right before the trumpets and bowls!

There is simply no arrival of Jesus in REv. chapter 6.

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It's also using the exact same events happening as in Revelation 6.
Sun and moon darkening, and stars falling, mourning of the tribes of the earth.
Read Matthew 24 and Revelation 6 side by side and tell me they're not the same event being described.