- Jul 10, 2016
- 5,459
- 2,197
- Country
- Canada
- Faith
- Non-Denom
- Marital Status
- Private
…..In these 9 verses, Jesus defines “aionios” as “eternal.”
Jesus used the word “aionios” 29 times, He never used “aionios” to refer to something mundane which cannot be eternal.
[1]John 6:58
(58) This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.[αἰώνιος/aionios]
In this verse Jesus contrasts “aionios life” with “death.” If “live aionios” is only a finite period, a finite period is not opposite “death.” Thus “aionios” by definition here means “eternal.”
1) The Greek word there is not aionios, as you state, but aiona meaning age, eon.
2) So your conclusion is, therefore, wrong.
3) Jesus contrasts the bread eaten by those who died with the bread that will make those who eat it live EIS "the age". EIS: to, into.
4) In light of 1) above, "forever" is a misleading, erroneous, deceptive translation.
5) A more literal & less misleading translation is found in a number of more literal Bible versions, such as, for example:
Jn.6:58 This is the Bread which descends out of heaven. Not according as the fathers ate and died; he who is masticating this Bread shall be living for the eon (CLV)
6) Of course an "age", i.e. "eon", can be finite.
7) That doesn't mean believers live only for a finite period. (There is no "only" in the verse).
8) The verse doesn't address the question of how long they live or eternal destinies of anyone. Other Scriptures do that, such as when we are told we will be "immortal", cannot die anymore, will always be with the Lord, all will be saved eventually, each in their own order, etc.
9) You say: "If “live aionios” is only a finite period, a finite period is not opposite “death.” But you err, as life is opposite(antonym) to death: Thesaurus results for DEATH
10) Moreover those who are believers during church age history who obtain "life eonian" in the finite millennial age will also receive immortality, i.e. endless life.
11) So their life will be eternal, but not due to the word "aionion".
[2]John 10:28
(28) I give them eternal [αἰώνιος/aionios] life, and they shall never [ου μη/ou mé] [αἰών/aion] perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand.
See note on ou mé at bottom. In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” and “aion” with “[not] snatch them out of my hand.” If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’” “Aionios life” by definition here means “eternal life.”
1) In this verse once more the word aiona (eon, age) occurs and the translators left it out! They didn't even bother to translate it!
2) Your quoted version is misleading, unlike a number of more literal versions such as:
Jn.10:28 And I am giving them life eonian, and they should by no means be perishing for the eon, and no one shall be snatching them out of My hand." (CLV)
3)"Definition of eonian...variant spelling of aeonian"
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/eonia
"aeonian, from Greek aiṓnios "lasting an age, perpetual" (derivative of aiṓn eon) + 2-an; aeonic from eon + 1-ic"
Definition of AEONIAN
4) Concerning the alleged claim: "If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’”
a) Aion most certainly means an age, e.g.: Strong's Greek: 165. αἰών (aión) -- a space of time, an age
b) Obviously an "age" (eon) can be a finite period.
c) Just because no one shall be "snatching" a believer out of Jesus' hand does not necessarily mean that the believer has "eternal security" or that the believer cannot - jump - out of His hand, i.e. fall away, backslide, & reject Him thereafter.
d) In the larger context of the passage i suggest that Jesus is not addressing final eternal destinies at all, but contrasting destinies in the eon to come.
e) Scripture speaks of multiple eons to come, so arguably the eon to come is finite.
f) "And I am giving them life eonian". As long as they believe in Him till they die "in Christ" or until His return. If they believe only "for a while" (Lk.8:13) then all bets are off, including remaining in His "hand".
g) "they should by no means be perishing for the eon". If they have believed till their death or His return, then they won't perish for the millennial eon. Unlike some others who may (or do) die then (Isa.65:20).
h) They will also have immortality & be always with the Lord.
i) By virtue of having immortality they will have endless life, not because they obtained eonian life, life in the eon to come.
j) So the passage has an alternate interpretation without requiring eonian mean "eternal" as you claim it does there.
5. You state: "If “aion/aionios” means “age(s), a finite period,” that is not the opposite of “[not] snatch them out of my hand’” " Why should they have to be the "opposite" of one another & not instead just separate pieces of info Jesus gives in the verse re blessings to be obtained by those who continue in faith?
[3]John 3:15
(15) That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal [αιωνιον] life.
[4] John 3:16
(16) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting [αιωνιον] life.
In the above two verses Jesus pairs “aionion” with “should not perish.” Believers could eventually perish in a finite period, thus by definition “aionion life” here means eternal or everlasting life.
1) No, there is at least one other explanation that refutes your claim. Namely that believers who are promised aionion(eonian) life - if aionion(eonian) life is in a finite period, such as the millennial eon - could not perish because they will have immortality when Christ returns at the beginning of the millennial eon. Assuming they keep on believing till Christ's return or they died "in Christ" - in which case they will obtain immortality when He returns (1 Cor.15:51-56) - and do not merely believe "for a while" (Lk.8:13).
2) So your argument is not only unsound logically but also unscriptural. Ye do err, not knowing the Scriptures re immortality.
3) A better translation is not "believeth", but "is believing" since the requirement is a continual believing, not a temporary believing just "for a while" (Lk.8:13).
4) Your quoted version is misleading, unlike a number of more literal versions such as:
John3:15 that everyone believing on Him should not be perishing, but may be having life eonian." 16 For thus God loves the world, so that He gives His only-begotten Son, that everyone who is believing in Him should not be perishing, but may be having life eonian." (CLV)
5)"Definition of eonian...variant spelling of aeonian"
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/eonia
"aeonian, from Greek aiṓnios "lasting an age, perpetual" (derivative of aiṓn eon) + 2-an; aeonic from eon + 1-ic" Definition of AEONIAN
6) The next verse states the purpose of Love Omnipotent's - divine will - in sending His Son:
For God did not send His Son into the world that He might judge the world, but that the world would be saved through Him. (Jn.3:17)
The IVA ("that") is used in Jn.3:17 above. BDAG says “In many cases purpose and result cannot be clearly differentiated, and hence ἵνα is used for the result that follows according to the purpose of the subj. or of God. As in Semitic and Gr-Rom. thought, purpose and result are identical in declarations of the *divine will*…” Перевод ἵνα с греческого на все языки
The "result" of God sending His Son into the world will be to save it (Jn.3:17).
[5]John 5:24
(24) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting [αἰώνιος] life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from death unto life.” “Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death.
1) Much of what i've already pointed out above re other verses in John applies here as well.
2) So once again your argument re aionion fails.
3) Re the comment above "unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death." Of course that can happen when any of His followers believe only "for a while" (Lk.8:13) or makes shipwreck of their faith (1 Tim.1:19) or does not continue in faith (Col.1:21-23).
4) A more literal & less misleading translation is found in a number of more literal Bible versions, such as:
John 5:24 Verily, verily, I am saying to you that he who is hearing My word and believing Him Who sends Me, has life eonian and is not coming into judging, but has proceeded out of death into life. (CLV)
6) The "not coming into condemnation" in the verse is conditionally dependent on the "believing". If one eternally believes then one will eternally never come into condemnation.
7) Believing continually also results in eonian life, but that doesn't mean eonian life, life in the coming eon, or the eon itself, is eternal.
8) Although those who obtain life in the coming eon will have immortality, which is eternal life.
9) And as they will be always with the Lord (1 Thess.4:17) & God will be "all in all" (1 Cor.15:28), they will be blessed & never come into condemnation.
10) You state: "In this verse Jesus pairs “aionios” with “shall not come into condemnation” and “passed from death unto life.” " They are in the same verse, but it is continual belief until one has immortality - not aionios - that results in "shall not come into condemnation" & "passed from death unto life".
11. You say: "“Aionios” does not mean “a finite period,” by definition here it means “eternal,” unless Jesus lets His followers come into condemnation and pass into death." That is not necessarily the case. The reason being that not coming into condemnation does not have to be dependent on aionion life meaning eternal life. Something that you appear to assume. Jesus doesn't condemn the person, not because they will attain to eonian life (life in the millenial eon), but because they believe in Him! So your argument fails.
continued in my next post...
Upvote
0