Is this kind of "Christian" feminism ok or am i in error?

Junia · May 25, 2020

Thir7ySev3n said:
Because marriage is by its nature symbolism; symbolism of Christ and the church (Ephesians 5:22-33). So marriage must convey the "story" accurately or it is a failure. Since Christ saves us by faith and will abandon us for no sin but unbelief (which just is to not have faith and is idolatry and so can not save), the husband must so love his wife and abandon her for no cause except adultery (which is the fleshly equivalent to idolatry, or leaving Christ for an alternative false spirituality). And since the bride of Christ must remain faithful to Him, even in tribulation (Matthew 13:21), so the representative of Christ's bride must remain faithful to her husband through all tribulation but abandonment.

Once you just let the Bible speak for itself and add nothing, nor take anything away, everything makes sense. The Bible says marriage is symbolic. The reason Jesus spoke in parables is because the creation is symbolic. A pregnant wife symbolizes new life coming into the world after a period of travail, and also symbolizes Christian's who minister the gospel and conceive children for God, etc. etc.

So because Christ and the church are not to be separated, but have a union of unfailing faithfulness through all sin and tribulation, so must the husband and the wife be to convey this glory of God. It is worth the price to receive such a noble task.

But the husband is mean tto love like Jesus. Jesus is gentle, not violent or hasrsh. a bruised reed He will not break. so if a husband is being cruel in any way to his wife then He i snot being christlike. He is painting a false picture of abrutal, tough love, red pill kind of Jesus......so isn't that kind of violating the marriage covenant? to show Jesus as a rough, violent sort?

Junia · May 25, 2020

God isnt a harsh taskmaster. a new covenant God, a new testament Jesus was not harsh but came to give us freedom. He would not approve of a husband forbidding his wife her bank account, career, friends and family but some abusive husbands do that??? so surely a wife can say "this is infidelity. my husband isnr behaving like Jesus?"

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
But the husband is mean tto love like Jesus. Jesus is gentle, not violent or hasrsh. a bruised reed He will not break. so if a husband is being cruel in any way to his wife then He i snot being christlike. He is painting a false picture of abrutal, tough love, red pill kind of Jesus......so isn't that kind of violating the marriage covenant? to show Jesus as a rough, violent sort?

This is part of what makes marriage such a high calling, that the husband is tasked with being exactly like Christ, despite his wife's failures to be a perfect "church", and the wife must submit to her husband even when he fails to represent Christ (1 Peter 3:1-6). Performing your role, despite massive imperfections, is a great suffering but also a great joy; sometimes here, sometimes only in incomparable glory later (Romans 8:18). But it is such a privilege to be called to tell the story of God and be able to love this way. I don't see it as a burden, even though it is a weariness of the flesh sometimes.

It is important to note too, though, that there is 100% verifiable evidence that every woman ever would not become perfect women if only their husband was the perfect man, and that is Christ Himself. If anyone has even sinned once (nevermind hundreds or thousands of times) since they placed their faith in Christ, despite the fact that He is a perfect Lord, this claim can not be true. Everyone knows that Christ being perfect introduces its own set of difficulties, because His callings are so high (like "hating" everyone compared to Him, taking up our crosses daily, suffering many things light and horrible for His sake by His example, etc.).

Junia · May 25, 2020

Thir7ySev3n said:
This is part of what makes marriage such a high calling, that the husband is tasked with being exactly like Christ, despite his wife's failures to be a perfect "church", and the wife must submit to her husband even when he fails to represent Christ (1 Peter 3:1-6). Performing your role, despite massive imperfections, is a great suffering but also a great joy; sometimes here, sometimes only in incomparable glory later (Romans 8:18). But it is such a privilege to be called to tell the story of God and be able to love this way. I don't see it as a burden, even though it is a weariness of the flesh sometimes.

It is important to note too, though, that there is 100% verifiable evidence that every woman ever would not become perfect women if only their husband was the perfect man, and that is Christ Himself. If anyone has even sinned once (nevermind hundreds or thousands of times) since they placed their faith in Christ, despite the fact that He is a perfect Lord, this claim can not be true. Everyone knows that Christ being perfect introduces its own set of difficulties, because His callings are so high (like "hating" everyone compared to Him, taking up our crosses daily, suffering many things light and horrible for His sake by His example, etc.).

no one is perfect though. i dont believe anyone i sperfect until they get to heaven.....

but if it is ok to leave a husbnad hwo is sexually molesting his kids, is that not the same thing if a husband is verbally or physicaly abusive???? I mean, as a child i was jealous of those who were sexually abused by their parents bceasue in our church it meant their mums coul dleave and take them with them? why cant children who are being secually abused just endure it? if a woife is expected ot endure phsyical or verbal abuse???? i just dont get why God protecs kids and not wives???? are we not all equal in Gods eyes?

Junia · May 25, 2020

i mean if my dad had raped me, i would have been safe because my mum could have left him and divorced him..... but because it eas physical and verbal abuse she wasnt allowed ot leave, no wi have PTSD and other issues. so why does god care about tape victims but no those who suffer domestic violemce even thought the scars are the same?

Junia · May 25, 2020

rape, not tape. it jsut shows me God onky cares about certain people He deems worthy of caring about. but surely the real Jesus cares about everyone? He doesnt place some people of more importance than others?

i just cant believe my parents church let me suffer from my father because i went through the "wrong" kind of abuse; the church has issues with paedophilia but not with beating a child or woman? even though that i swrong and Jesus hates it

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
no one is perfect though. i dont believe anyone i sperfect until they get to heaven.....

but if it is ok to leave a husbnad hwo is sexually molesting his kids, is that not the same thing if a husband is verbally or physicaly abusive???? I mean, as a child i was jealous of those who were sexually abused by their parents bceasue in our church it meant their mums coul dleave and take them with them? why cant children who are being secually abused just endure it? if a woife is expected ot endure phsyical or verbal abuse???? i just dont get why God protecs kids and not wives???? are we not all equal in Gods eyes?

All these bizarre and fringe circumstances one can find themselves in have remedies that don't include divorce and remarriage (calling authorities, separation, etc.). Besides that though, I think one has to not fully trust in the presence, justice and intervention of God when an authority behaves wickedly this way. To be completely honest, from what I have seen in the Scripture and my own experience (the former taking precedence in importance), I am more afraid for an utterly wicked spouse of one who prays to God day and night than of one who takes the retaliation in their own hands.

Jesus said: "And he spake a parable unto them to this end, that men ought always to pray, and not to faint; Saying, There was in a city a judge, which feared not God, neither regarded man: And there was a widow in that city; and she came unto him, saying, Avenge me of mine adversary. And he would not for a while: but afterward he said within himself, Though I fear not God, nor regard man; Yet because this widow troubleth me, I will avenge her, lest by her continual coming she weary me. And the Lord said, Hear what the unjust judge saith. And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them? I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?" (Luke 18:1-8)

And in my own experience this is true. Instead of returning evil for evil, when my wife would sin against me, being violent, abandoning the home and committing adultery, I would just pray to God continually to avenge me against her wickedness. I would give Him no rest until He did. And speedily, He would fulfill my requests exactly as I asked them of Him, every detail. Not only once, but many times He would do this throughout our marriage. But as God says:

"Fret not thyself because of evildoers, neither be thou envious against the workers of iniquity. For they shall soon be cut down like the grass, and wither as the green herb. Trust in the LORD, and do good; so shalt thou dwell in the land, and verily thou shalt be fed. Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart. Commit thy way unto the LORD; trust also in him; and he shall bring it to pass. And he shall bring forth thy righteousness as the light, and thy judgment as the noonday. Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for him: fret not thyself because of him who prospereth in his way, because of the man who bringeth wicked devices to pass. Cease from anger, and forsake wrath: fret not thyself in any wise to do evil. For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.." (Psalms 37:1-10)

Does that sound like the faithful who hope in God have to fear, or the wicked?

Junia · May 25, 2020

Thir7ySev3n said:
All these bizarre and fringe circumstances one can find themselves in have remedies that don't include divorce and remarriage (calling authorities, separation, etc.). Besides that though, I think one has to not fully trust in the presence, justice and intervention of God when an authority behaves wickedly this way. To be completely honest, from what I have seen in the Scripture and my own experience (the former taking precedence in importance), I am more afraid for an utterly wicked spouse of one who prays to God day and night than of one who takes the retaliation in their own hands.

Jesus said: "And he spake a parable unto them to this end, that men ought always to pray, and not to faint; Saying, There was in a city a judge, which feared not God, neither regarded man: And there was a widow in that city; and she came unto him, saying, Avenge me of mine adversary. And he would not for a while: but afterward he said within himself, Though I fear not God, nor regard man; Yet because this widow troubleth me, I will avenge her, lest by her continual coming she weary me. And the Lord said, Hear what the unjust judge saith. And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them? I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?" (Luke 18:1-8)

And in my own experience this is true. Instead of returning evil for evil, when my wife would sin against me, being violent, abandoning the home and committing adultery, I would just pray to God continually to avenge me against her wickedness. I would give Him no rest until He did. And speedily, He would fulfill my requests exactly as I asked them of Him, every detail. Not only once, but many times He would do this throughout our marriage. But as God says:

"Fret not thyself because of evildoers, neither be thou envious against the workers of iniquity. For they shall soon be cut down like the grass, and wither as the green herb. Trust in the LORD, and do good; so shalt thou dwell in the land, and verily thou shalt be fed. Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of thine heart. Commit thy way unto the LORD; trust also in him; and he shall bring it to pass. And he shall bring forth thy righteousness as the light, and thy judgment as the noonday. Rest in the LORD, and wait patiently for him: fret not thyself because of him who prospereth in his way, because of the man who bringeth wicked devices to pass. Cease from anger, and forsake wrath: fret not thyself in any wise to do evil. For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth. For yet a little while, and the wicked shall not be: yea, thou shalt diligently consider his place, and it shall not be.." (Psalms 37:1-10)

Does that sound like the faithful who hope in God have to fear, or the wicked?

God dint keep me or my mum safe or my sister when my dad hurt us..... so no, i believe authorities should have been called.

hang on, you saying seperating is ok???? earlier on you said wrong to separate??? i am confused now.

so my mum wrong to seperate for physical andverbal abuse which nearly ended in the death of us 3, but a kid who is being otuched innapropriatley, it ok to separate then???? seriously???? so one sort of abuse is ok to separate nut the other kind is not???

you saying these are bizarre and fringe exceptions but they aren't. they were my life and the life of many other women and children i know.

Junia · May 25, 2020

i was so angry when i read about the Duggar family and how their son molested his siters in their sleep and then some people were saying "the parents should have shopped him to police? " but he touched his sidters in their sleep and they didnt even know about it until they confessed?

what my father did was way worse than any of that- he actualy raped my mum more than once but church told my mum she was sinning if she left?? so God ok with children being recued but not a wife??? why do kids need protection and an adult woman doesn'[t???

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
God dint keep me or my mum safe or my sister when my dad hurt us..... so no, i believe authorities should have been called.

hang on, you saying seperating is ok???? earlier on you said wrong to separate??? i am confused now.

so my mum wrong to seperate for physical andverbal abuse which nearly ended in the death of us 3, but a kid who is being otuched innapropriatley, it ok to separate then???? seriously???? so one sort of abuse is ok to separate nut the other kind is not???

you saying these are bizarre and fringe exceptions but they aren't. they were my life and the life of many other women and children i know.

When I say separation, I do NOT mean divorce. But give me a few minutes to get back to you, I need to take a break to eat.

Junia · May 25, 2020

ok no worries

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
i was so angry when i read about the Duggar family and how their son molested his siters in their sleep and then some people were saying "the parents should have shopped him to police? " but he touched his sidters in their sleep and they didnt even know about it until they confessed?

what my father did was way worse than any of that- he actualy raped my mum more than once but church told my mum she was sinning if she left?? so God ok with children being recued but not a wife??? why do kids need protection and an adult woman doesn'[t???

No matter what the Bible says about these issues, first world comforts have changed what Christians will presently have the threshold to bear in terms of what God allows to happen. Whether God allows avoidance or not, whatever happens to you that can't be avoided was allowed by God. It's impossible for that not to be true, because it happened, and was not stopped though God could have stopped it. We are missing out on the lessons about the dreadfulness of sin, and obeying and trusting God through it all.

Before anyone can talk about cruel fates, they must consider both the past and our inevitable future. In the past, God did not rescue 11 of His 12 disciples from being martyred, some more horribly than others. Jesus told Peter his ultimate fate of being martyred and did not alter it (John 21:18-19). The Bible says that Jesus said this to Peter to indicate to Him the death he would die to glorify God. Let that sink in:

God can know a horrible event that is going to happen to you, even unto death, and it can glorify Him that you suffer it for His sake AND HE WILL NOT PREVENT IT (in cases He ordains), but can even lead you into it. His own Son did not escape the human condition of this world, but rather "it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand." (Isaiah 53:10)

Our salvation came through suffering and death. We must go through suffering and inevitably die. Christians were fed to lions and burned in the streets of Rome as lamps in the night. Our future is to go through tribulation the likes of which the world has never known, and God will give His people over to it for 3 and a half years (Revelation 13:4-9).

Here's the ultimate lesson: All things are in the hand of God and proceed from that hand (James 1:17); life and breath and everything else (Acts 17:25). Nothing is sure in life except suffering in this world (John 16:33, Ecclesiastes 9:11) and glorification in the world to come for those who's faith is in Jesus Christ (Romans 8:19-28). Through it all, if your faith is in Christ to remove you from adversity, you will fall away because He won't stop it all or allow all of it to be stopped (Matthew 13:20-21). If your faith is in Christ for eternal life, then you've understood the hope, and He will ask: "Will ye also go away?" And you will say: "Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life. And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God." (John 6:67-69)

Junia · May 25, 2020

i still say you can separate and not divorce. because the Bible does not forbid separation, only divorce. if we say separation wrong we addin gto what the Bible says

also what has being first world, 2nd world, 3rd world got to d with it oi think you will find divorce is rampant all over the world because human nature is the same everywhere

Junia · May 25, 2020

what if i decide i already have sufferefd enough and i dont want to return to that situation again? i am livign a comfortbale life for the first time ever! and i like it! God has blessed me in reward for what i went through and He is a good good father. i bet his heart broeaks every time on eof his precious children endures cruelty.

God has no favourites we are ll His children if we been saved. nice chatting to you have a nice day my friend

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
i still say you can separate and not divorce. because the Bible does not forbid separation, only divorce. if we say separation wrong we addin gto what the Bible says

also what has being first world, 2nd world, 3rd world got to d with it oi think you will find divorce is rampant all over the world because human nature is the same everywhere

It has everything to do with it. The levels of comfort you're accustomed to will set a standard in your mind of what you will naturally tolerate (without further training by suffering). It's a concept told throughout our entire being, from emotional tenacity to the callouses that grow on hands, and the pain more easily caused to them when they are soft and inexperienced with friction.

And yes, you could biblically separate without divorce and remarriage/extra-marital sexual relations.

Junia · May 25, 2020

anywa it is all academic for me. i have put that past behind me. my fathe ri sold now and it is too late to go back to him- he wil be dead soon. as long as i fdo my best to enjoy and serve God wholeheartedly in the life i have now is al that matters really. God has forgiven my past- i confessed it to him and now it has been erased; when we confess a sin he chooses ot forget it. i have nothing left to do but receive that forgiveness. same as if one divorces and remarries, it is too late for them to unmarry their current partner and go back top the first one- God just expects sincere confession. we cant change the past. if we were a thief before we got saved we cant change what we did but we can stop stealing, same with lying, drunkneness etc we are just called to repent and then move on, put it behind us and learn from it

Junia · May 25, 2020

Thir7ySev3n said:
It has everything to do with it. The levels of comfort you're accustomed to will set a standard in your mind of what you will naturally tolerate (without further training by suffering). It's a concept told throughout our entire being, from emotional tenacity to the callouses that grow on hands, and the pain more easily caused to them when they are soft and inexperienced with friction.

And yes, you could biblically separate without divorce and remarriage/extra-marital sexual relations.

well i cant comment on the experiences of peopl ewho have only known comfort- i do not know what that is like. i dont know much about that culture only my own one where women were tresated like objects... so i have known hardship from birth......so am not sure your theory applies> i would say teh Duggar children had very easy lives- they were abused in their sleep sp never experinecnec any afect from it. they have a nice life very fun loving parents. i dp no tknow w hat that is like

living in war zone is very different. am glad i live in peaceful land now

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
what if i decide i already have sufferefd enough and i dont want to return to that situation again? i am livign a comfortbale life for the first time ever! and i like it! God has blessed me in reward for what i went through and He is a good good father. i bet his heart broeaks every time on eof his precious children endures cruelty.

God has no favourites we are ll His children if we been saved. nice chatting to you have a nice day my friend

Let's summarize it this way:

When you can literally be the Son of God and still be crucified, there is not a hope in the world that we'll escape suffering of all kinds, including some more severe. We need to be thankful in the good times, and continue to praise God in the bad (Psalms 34:1).

"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man. For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil." (Ecclesiates 12:13-14)

Junia · May 25, 2020

But i am thnkful that God pulled me away from my parents. He told me to be an independent woman in my own home which i am. it means i have a house where i can help people in need come to stay an di can come them traditional food. Most British people love learning about the food traditions of my previous homeland and i liek to make them feel welcome

Thir7ySev3n · May 25, 2020

WrappedUpinHisLove3 said:
well i cant comment on the experiences of peopl ewho have only known comfort- i do not know what that is like. i dont know much about that culture only my own one where women were tresated like objects... so i have known hardship from birth......so am not sure your theory applies> i would say teh Duggar children had very easy lives- they were abused in their sleep sp never experinecnec any afect from it. they have a nice life very fun loving parents. i dp no tknow w hat that is like

living in war zone is very different. am glad i live in peaceful land now

Well I am glad to hear things are better for you now. It is a story that goes both directions until Christ redeems it all: The good times will eventually turn to trouble, but the troubled nights will eventually end in a new day. Just abide in Christ through it all, and remember both are from the hand of God and will make their circuit til Kingdom come.

Is this kind of "Christian" feminism ok or am i in error?

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