20 major reasons to reject the Premillennial doctrine

Marilyn C · May 23, 2020

sovereigngrace said:
The Holy Spirit within the believer in both Testaments produces righteousness. Ephesians 2:8-9 teaches: “For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.”

Some people do not read the next verse, Ephesians 2:10 tells us: “For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.”

Yes, it is the Holy Spirit that produces righteousness.

And then there is the wondrous realisation that even MORE than righteous, we, the Body of Christ are partakers of the Divine nature of Christ. And that was ONLY possible since the Lord ascended and sent His Holy Spirit to impart that into His Body.

Oh the wonder of God`s grace, mercy and eternal purposes through Christ Jesus.

jgr · May 23, 2020

Marilyn C said:
The Spirit says `WE.` Not `they` the OT saints. They are not IN CHRIST, but are made righteous because of or through Him.

Marilyn C said:
That was NOT possible before Jesus lived and died and rose again.

You missed this Scripture, so here it is again:

1 Corinthians 15
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

How do the OT saints not qualify as part of all?

Was not Christ alive when the OT saints were alive?

Indeed He was, and an eternity before.

John 8
56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

jgr · May 23, 2020

Marilyn C said:
Yes earthly Jerusalem is undergoing chastisement, however God does NOT forget His promises to Abraham, that His descendants will be numerous and important -

1. As the sand of the sea - Predominant nation (ruler) on the earth.
2. As the stars of the heavens - Prominent nation in the heavenlies, (OT saints in the New Jerusalem).

And note the Predominant group in the highest realm, is the Body of Christ, with the Lord on His throne on Mount Zion. (Ps. 2: 6)

`(Father) I have set my King on my holy hill of Zion.` (Ps. 2: 6)

Paul identifies those descendants precisely and unmistakably:

Galatians 3
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

They are Abraham's spiritual seed.

Marilyn C · May 23, 2020

jgr said:
You missed this Scripture, so here it is again:

1 Corinthians 15
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

How do the OT saints not qualify as part of all?

Was not Christ alive when the OT saints were alive?

Indeed He was, and an eternity before.

John 8
56 Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
57 Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
58 Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.

Jesus all will be made alive, however NOT all receive the similar glorified body of Jesus made for the highest realm.

Marilyn C · May 23, 2020

jgr said:
Paul identifies those descendants precisely and unmistakably:

Galatians 3
16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.
29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

They are Abraham's spiritual seed.

And Abraham`s seed, IS CHRIST. And the promise there is of the Holy Spirit. (Gal.3: 14)

`That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ, that we might receive the promise f the Spirit through faith.` (Gal. 3: 14)

sovereigngrace · May 23, 2020

Marilyn C said:
Yes, it is the Holy Spirit that produces righteousness.

And then there is the wondrous realisation that even MORE than righteous, we, the Body of Christ are partakers of the Divine nature of Christ. And that was ONLY possible since the Lord ascended and sent His Holy Spirit to impart that into His Body.

Oh the wonder of God`s grace, mercy and eternal purposes through Christ Jesus.

Dispensationalists are loud and bold in their opinion that the Old Testament saints were not born of the Spirit as we are or that they possess the constant ongoing presence of the Spirit of God dwelling inside them. But does anyone seriously think that fallen man before the cross had any ability to save himself, be redeemed and be enlightened outside of the enabling power of the Holy Spirit? Did he possess any innate natural tendencies toward God? Of course not! 1 Corinthians 2:14 outlines an important truth about man, that transcends the eons of time: “the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.”

No objective Bible student could surely seriously argue that the Old Testament saints had some innate ability to come to God without the enlightening and enabling power of the Spirit of God. We have seen, what debilitates man in the New Testament, also ruined him in the Old Testament. Outside of the work of the Holy Spirit, man is a spiritual mess – regardless of his birthday.

If the old covenant saints were not indwelt by the Spirit, how were they capable of exercising saving faith and living faithful lives? Scripture shows that the absence of the Holy Spirit is tantamount to being an unbeliever.

The reality is: Dispensationalists attribute spiritual abilities to Old Testament saints that New Testament believers were completely devoid of – namely, the capability to believe and please God without the internal presence and power of the Holy Spirit. We are talking about believers overcoming the flesh for thousands of years by fleshly means. We are talking about holy living without the aid of the Holy Spirit. What is more, if God’s people in the Old Testament did not have the indwelling of the Holy Ghost how were they sanctified? Moreover, without the power of the Spirit of God, how could a child of God believe, repent, and obey? This is all biblically impossible!

If one is to deny the existence of the regenerating work of the Holy Spirit that accompanies salvation and also the indwelling presence of the Spirit that enables a believer to satisfactorily respond to God, please Him and live a holy lifestyle, in the old covenant era, then you surely put a question mark over the gravity and veracity of the depravity of the saints in the old economy. You are basically saying that the Old Testament saints were not as depraved as the New Testament saints are. As a result, you attribute qualities and abilities to the Old Testament believers that Scriptures knows nothing about.

Job 25:4 asks a very pertinent question: “How then can man be justified with God? or how can he be clean that is born of a woman?”

Thankfully, man was not left without hope. Right from the beginning, the story of history has been God in His infinite grace reaching down to rescue man from his wretched state. Sinful man is totally dependent upon divine intervention and spiritual enablement in order to change and be acceptable before a thrice-holy God. This comes in the form of spiritual renewal. Whilst there was a murkiness that surrounded revealed truth in the Old Testament, when we get into the New Testament there is distinct clarity. What was previously dark and obscure has now become crystal clear.

The only means of hope for man is by faith in the finished work of Christ on the cross. 1 Corinthians 15:22 declares, “For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.” This is showing us that our common birthright – from Adam – or our group ethnicity is destructive and worthless; it is our new birth in Christ that renders us as God’s chosen people. Those “in Adam” have only one birth; those “in Christ” have two. All “in Adam” belong to the devil and are filled with themselves; all “in Christ” belong to God and possess the Spirit of Christ. Simple! Those “in Adam” are born “of the flesh”; those “in Christ” are “born of the Spirit” and are redeemed. When we consider man from the beginning to now we should view them like God views them – not split into Jews and Gentiles but saved and lost.

Jesus Christ is the difference between life and death, heaven and hell, favor with God and condemnation with God. Scripture breaks all mankind down into one of two groups – those that are saved and those lost, those that are “in Adam” and then those that are “in Christ.” Whilst there may be many ethnic subgroups within these two overall groups, in God’s eyes, there are only truly two groups.

Those that reject Christ (the anointed One), irrespective of nationality, are shown to reject salvation. Those that reject Christ, reject the Father. Those that reject Christ, are shown to be children of the devil. This is seen throughout the inspired New Testament account. This truth does not just relate to the New Testament era. It goes right back to Adam. All mankind from the beginning is either found to be in one of two camps – saved or lost. There is no other company. There has never been any other salvation apart from that which is found “in Christ.” Those that reject Him are found “in Adam.”

Scripture makes it abundantly clear that there are only two types of people on planet earth – saved and lost. There are not three types of people in this world – saved, lost and then Israel, as Dispensationalists argue. For that to be true, there would have to be three federal heads. But Scripture makes it clear that there are only two – those “in Adam” and those “in Christ.” Nowhere does it say that there are three, namely, all those “in Adam,” all those “in Moses” and then all those “in Christ” as Dispensationalists would have us believe.

1 Corinthians 15:45-48 tells us: “And so it is written: The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.”

And continues, “Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual. The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven. As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.”

Please note: the “natural” ‘soulish’ man came first; the “spiritual … heavenly” man came second. This is played out throughout the Word. We see this in the whole contrast between Adam and Christ. We see it in our own salvation. We experience a natural birth first and then a spiritual birth. We see this in God’s working with natural Israel and the New Testament Church. We see this in the movement from the old covenant to the new covenant. We see this laid out in prominent Old Testament families in Scripture, when it came to receiving the inheritance, like Cain and Abel, Esau and Jacob and Ishmael and Isaac.

Romans 5:18-19 says, “as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life. For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.”

Race cannot be advanced in any way as a means of justification before God – even if we were looking a (supposed) law-keeping Jew. Faith alone is the key that opens the door for salvation to the Jew and Gentile in this New Testament economy. Faith is the key that opened (past tense) the door of salvation to the Jew and Gentile in the Old Testament economy. Salvation for the Jew in our current age (the only age before the new heavens and a new earth) must therefore come by grace alone through faith alone “in Christ” alone.

Both Adam and Christ stand as representative heads of humanity. The first Adam was the federal head of man through natural birth; Christ (the last Adam) is the federal head of all those who have entered into salvation via a spiritual birth. Adam represented the way of death and Christ represented the living way. These are two diverse companies of people. These two groups cover the whole remit of humankind.

If men aren’t represented in Christ then they are represented in Adam. If they are found in Christ then Christ has borne their sin and endowed them with His robes of righteousness. They are accounted acceptable before God, through the life, death and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ. He entered into a covenant to redeem a lost people. In that eternal covenant our sins where imputed to Christ and His righteousness was imputed to us. All our legal or covenant responsibilities where rested upon Christ, and all His legal or covenant merits were attributed to us. This work is the eternal basis of our justification by faith. Spiritual life can only be found in Christ alone. Those that are outside of Christ are destined to a lost eternity.

Men of faith are found throughout the Old Testament. Hebrews 11 attests to this in a very powerful and detailed way. If men are born in sin, and if faith is the product of the regenerating power of the Holy Spirit, then the Old Testament saints must have supernaturally been birthed of the Spirit. Faith is the wonderful fruit of the regenerating work of the Spirit of God. Of course, old covenant saints looked forward “by faith” to their promised coming Messiah who would redeem His people (Hebrews 11:13). But it seems evident that the Spirit performs the same transformative functions in Old Testament times as He does in the New Testament economy.

We see all the same fruit of the Spirit that was attributed to the New Testament saints manifested in the Old Testament believers. Without the inner workings of the Spirit of God they would have had no ability to produce such fruit. Can an Old Testament sinner, whose heart is contrary to God, produce holy fruit without the enabling power of the Holy Spirit? No! It is impossible!

Marilyn C · May 24, 2020

sovereigngrace said:
Dispensationalists are loud and bold in their opinion that the Old Testament saints were not born of the Spirit as we are or that they possess the constant ongoing presence of the Spirit of God dwelling inside them.

Men of faith are found throughout the Old Testament. Hebrews 11 attests to this in a very powerful and detailed way. If men are born in sin, and if faith is the product of the regenerating power of the Holy Spirit, then the Old Testament saints must have supernaturally been birthed of the Spirit. Faith is the wonderful fruit of the regenerating work of the Spirit of God. Of course, old covenant saints looked forward “by faith” to their promised coming Messiah who would redeem His people (Hebrews 11:13). But it seems evident that the Spirit performs the same transformative functions in Old Testament times as He does in the New Testament economy......

We see all the same fruit of the Spirit that was attributed to the New Testament saints manifested in the Old Testament believers. Without the inner workings of the Spirit of God they would have had no ability to produce such fruit. Can an Old Testament sinner, whose heart is contrary to God, produce holy fruit without the enabling power of the Holy Spirit? No! It is impossible!

I did say -Yes, it is the Holy Spirit that produces righteousness.

However you are not understanding what the Apostle Peter is saying -

`Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, as His Divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by His own glory and virtue, by which has been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped corruption that is in the world through lust.` (2 Peter 1: 2 - 4)

This was NOT possible before Jesus was manifest in the flesh, lived, died, rose and ascended to the Father. This is the Holy Spirit producing actual sons like Christ. Previously OT saints had the empowerment of the Holy Spirit, but NOT the Divine nature from the ascended Lord. They had the Holy Spirit to enable them to do great works in relation to earthly nations - subdued kingdoms, quenched violence of fire, turned to flight the armies of the aliens... (Heb. 11: 33 & 34)

The Body of Christ does no such exploits for we fight not against flesh and blood but principalities and powers. Thus we `fight` with standing for the truth, and pull down strongholds of the enemy, his arguments and every high thing that exalts its self against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ. (2 Cor. 10: 4 & 5)

Big difference there.

jgr · May 24, 2020

Marilyn C said:
Jesus all will be made alive, however NOT all receive the similar glorified body of Jesus made for the highest realm.

Scripture?

Marilyn C · May 24, 2020

jgr said:
Scripture?

Hi jgr,

Yes it is important to establish the scripture for such a claim.

`Beloved, now we are children of God: it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.` (1 John 3: 2)

`For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the first-born among many brethren.` (Rom. 8: 29)

Utterly amazing, excitingly wonderful, everlastingly humbling!

jgr · May 24, 2020

Marilyn C said:
Hi jgr,

Yes it is important to establish the scripture for such a claim.

`Beloved, now we are children of God: it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is.` (1 John 3: 2)

`For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the first-born among many brethren.` (Rom. 8: 29)

Utterly amazing, excitingly wonderful, everlastingly humbling!

Hi Marilyn,

True.

Romans 11:2
God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew.

That is a reference to the remnant of elect faithful obedient believing OT saints (Romans 11:5). They were his foreknown people.

And as you've cited:

Romans 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Thus, the OT saints are also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son.

BABerean2 · May 24, 2020

Marilyn C said:
Yes earthly Jerusalem is undergoing chastisement, however God does NOT forget His promises to Abraham, that His descendants will be numerous and important -

Based on Galatians 3:16-29, Christ is the one seed which fulfills the promise made to Abraham, and I am Abraham's seed and inheritor of the promise, through faith in Christ.

This passage must be ignored by those promoting more than one people of God.

All forms of Dual Covenant Theology based on race, are a corruption of scripture.

See what Matthew said about genealogy in Matthew 1:1, and what Paul said about genealogies in Titus 3:9.

.

sovereigngrace · May 24, 2020

BABerean2 said:
Based on Galatians 3:16-29, Christ is the one seed which fulfills the promise made to Abraham, and I am Abraham's seed and inheritor of the promise, through faith in Christ.

This passage must be ignored by those promoting more than one people of God.

All forms of Dual Covenant Theology based on race, are a corruption of scripture.

See what Matthew said about genealogy in Matthew 1:1, and what Paul said about genealogies in Titus 3:9.

.

This is so true!

sovereigngrace · May 24, 2020

Marilyn C said:
I did say -Yes, it is the Holy Spirit that produces righteousness.

However you are not understanding what the Apostle Peter is saying -

`Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, as His Divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by His own glory and virtue, by which has been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped corruption that is in the world through lust.` (2 Peter 1: 2 - 4)

This was NOT possible before Jesus was manifest in the flesh, lived, died, rose and ascended to the Father. This is the Holy Spirit producing actual sons like Christ. Previously OT saints had the empowerment of the Holy Spirit, but NOT the Divine nature from the ascended Lord. They had the Holy Spirit to enable them to do great works in relation to earthly nations - subdued kingdoms, quenched violence of fire, turned to flight the armies of the aliens... (Heb. 11: 33 & 34)

The Body of Christ does no such exploits for we fight not against flesh and blood but principalities and powers. Thus we `fight` with standing for the truth, and pull down strongholds of the enemy, his arguments and every high thing that exalts its self against the knowledge of God, bringing every thought into captivity to the obedience of Christ. (2 Cor. 10: 4 & 5)

Big difference there.

A spiritual new birth is taught throughout Holy Writ. Even though the phrases “new birth,” “born again” or “born of God” are not found in the Old Testament pages, the whole concept and reality are. We see many truths and doctrines present in the Old Testament, albeit in an embryo and undeveloped form. The more the inspired revelation progresses the greater clarity that is brought to all divine truth. This disclosure sees its apex in the New Testament pages in the teaching of Christ, and the God breathed illumination of the New Testament writers. Any vagueness that is found in the Old Testament revelation is dispelled by the New Testament light.

One of the most powerful biblical analogies of the miracle and nature of the new birth is that of the potter and the clay. We find it in both the Old Testament and the New Testament. The Bible depicts God as the potter and us as the clay. Isaiah 64:8 declares: “O LORD, thou art our father; we are the clay, and thou our potter; and we all are the work of thy hand.” God uses the analogy of the potter and the clay to show us that He determines who and what we are. This reveals the sovereignty of God in salvation. God, being God, has the right and power to mold us as the potter does the clay. What is produced is indeed the work of His hand.

The whole symbolism surrounds the transformation of the clay from something which is unacceptable to the potter to something that is pleasing unto Him. This is a powerful picture of the regenerating power of God.

Jeremiah 18:4: “the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.” God takes what is flawed and makes a new creation out of it. In salvation, it is God that calls the shots. He does the molding and making. The New Testament passage of Romans 9:21 support the new birth analogy: “Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?”

What comes forth is a spiritual vessel that is fit for the Master’s use. The vessel of honor is set apart for a holy purpose. That can only come about by the quickening power of the Spirit. William D. Barrick asserts: “To speak of doctrine in the OT as though it must be taught in forms similar to those in the NT is misleading. Yet it could be that the doctrinal teachings of the OT are couched in the terms of history and parable—more like the teachings of Jesus Himself” (Living a New Life: Old Testament Teaching About Conversion).

The whole idea of the new birth and regeneration in the Old Testament is supported by Galatians 4:22-31. Looking back to the book of Genesis, and particularly the physical offspring of Abraham, Ishmael is presented as an example of a natural man – one who is “born after the flesh.” Isaac on the other hand is presented as a spiritual man – one who is “born after the Spirit.” He is identified as being of “the children of promise.” Whatever angle you look at it, whichever testament you analyze, God splits men into two camps: those who are lost and those who are saved, those who are after the flesh and those who are after the Spirit.

The whole thrust of the teaching is distinguishing between two types of human being. How each respond to the workings of the Spirit defines who they are and where they end up. The lost have one birth, rebel against the promptings of the Spirit, and go to hell. The redeemed have two births, they have yielded to the work of the Spirit in salvation, and go to heaven. As Lewis Sperry Chafer wrote in his Systematic Theology, “Whatever salvation was wrought in Old Testament times was wrought by the Holy Spirit.”

The Holy Spirit was very active in bringing men to salvation throughout the duration of the Old Testament. The Westminster Confession Chapter 7.5 makes clear: “under the law it [God’s covenant of grace with mankind] was administered by promises, prophecies, sacrifices, circumcision, the paschal lamb, and other types and ordinances delivered to the people of the Jews, all foresignifying Christ to come; which were, for that time, sufficient and efficacious, through the operation of the Spirit, to instruct and build up the elect in faith in the promised Messiah, by whom they had full remission of sins, and eternal salvation; and is called the Old Testament.”

The relevance and contrast between the natural man and the spiritual man in both testaments is seen in the words of Galatians 4:29: “as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.” Basically, the same rule applies in both economies! The same two diverse companies exist!

For those who would want to play theological word games with the phrases “after the Spirit” and “born of the Spirit.” The New Testament Scriptures demonstrate them to be equivalent. The term “after the Spirit” describes the born again believer in Romans 8:1. It declares: “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” Those “in Christ” that live “after the Spirit” are all those who have been born anew of the Spirit of God. Romans 8:4 describes the redeemed as “us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” The objective Bible student will quickly see that those who are born “after the flesh” refer to the unsaved, whereas, those who are born “after the Spirit” are those who are born of God. Paul concludes: “For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit” (Romans 8:5).

Right back in the book of Genesis we see a division outlined that still exists today. You have sinners that have been wonderfully transformed by the renewing power of the Spirit and experience a spiritual new birth. You have sinners that are untouched by the workings of the Spirit and remain dead in their sin. It is very clear that these unique phrases simply distinguish between God’s true spiritual people and the lost. They divide between the unregenerate man and the regenerate man.

Having said all this, no one could surely deny, there was a seismic change that came with the new covenant. First, God’s long-awaited Messiah (or anointed One) had finally arrived. Second, the whole focus went from the national, physical, earthly and provisional, to the international, spiritual, heavenly and eternal. Thirdly, every enemy of man and impediment to His eternal liberation has been robustly overcome. Fourthly, the veil that curtailed the Old Testament saints from seeing clear was removed through the anointed ministry of the Messiah. Fifthly, the Spirit has been poured out on an unprecedented scale at Pentecost to empower the people of God to fulfil the great commission (Matthew 3:11 Luke 24:49, Acts 1:4-5, 1:8, 2:38-39). Sixthly, the scope of the work of the Spirit has broadened out to embrace the darkened heathen nations today (Joel 2:28 & Acts 2:17).

Whilst there is much that is unique about the Church after Pentecost, there is also an unquestionable continuity and progressiveness in the workings of God. There is also a fulfilment of faithful Israel’s assigning to reach the nations with the truth.

We must acknowledge, the baptism of the Holy Spirit did not occur until Pentecost (Acts 2:1-13). This experience was previously unknown to God’s elect. This reality followed salvation. After all, the disciples were fully saved before Pentecost. This new experience not only empowered believers to operate in supernatural strength, but it also increased their revelation of Christ and His truth. God’s provision and program for redemption was fully understood. Their knowledge of Christ was no longer veiled in mystery. Ra McLaughlin writes in a short article Old Testament Holy Spirit: “What was different was not the way in which the Holy Spirit was manifested, but the power and scope of the manifestation.”

Prior to Pentecost, believers were regenerated by the Spirit of God but were not baptized in the Spirit. After Pentecost, believers experienced both. When the Holy Spirit was poured out at Pentecost, he was poured out on believers that were already indwelt by the Spirit.

There is not a more familiar passage in the New Testament for evangelicals than John chapter 3. In it, “a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews” came searching for spiritual guidance to Jesus. Now, we should note, this man couldn’t have had better natural or religious credentials in the light of the Dispensationalist position. Not only was he of Israeli stock, but he also was a leader of the Pharisees. Jesus told him in John 3:5-11, “Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.”

Why did Nicodemus need to be born again, if, according to Dispensationalist writers, he was automatically a chosen child of God through natural birth? The Lord was showing Nicodemus (and us) that favor with God did not (or does not) come through one’s religious standing, an accident of birth or through fulfilling a religious A-Z but rather through a spiritual birth. It involves a spiritual encounter with Christ! Racial status or biological pedigree means nothing with God today.

Whilst Nicodemus had all the natural and religious qualifications a man could ever want, Jesus showed him that that was not enough. The Lord showed him that he needed a spiritual conversion in order to make it to heaven. He showed Nicodemus that his first birth – his natural birth (that of water), was insufficient to inherit the kingdom of God. His physical birth, like the rest of fallen man, was contaminated by the awful blight of sin. John Piper contends: “We believe that the new birth is a miraculous creation of God that enables a formerly dead person to receive Christ and so to be saved” (What We Believe About the Five Points of Calvinism).

Please note: Nicodemus (an old covenant saint) was rebuked by Christ for not knowing this truth about the new birth. In fact, his religious position (being a learned man of the Law), is presented as a reason why he should have been fully acquainted with it. Basically, He was saying: ‘you being a leader in Israel, should know exactly what I am talking about’. This proves that the new birth was not a New Testament innovation; it has rather been around on earth since the beginning. The whole concept of regeneration (or spiritual birth) therefore occurred before the cross.

BABerean2 · May 24, 2020

sovereigngrace said:
Please note: Nicodemus (an old covenant saint) was rebuked by Christ for not knowing this truth about the new birth. In fact, his religious position (being a learned man of the Law), is presented as a reason why he should have been fully acquainted with it. Basically, He was saying: ‘you being a leader in Israel, should know exactly what I am talking about’. This proves that the new birth was not a New Testament innovation; it has rather been around on earth since the beginning. The whole concept of regeneration (or spiritual birth) therefore occurred before the cross.

The verse below from the Old Testament, and the parents of John the Baptist provide evidence of this fact. It was something Nicodemus should have known, based on Isaiah 63:11.

Isa 63:11 Then he remembered the days of old, Moses and his people, saying: "Where is He who brought them up out of the sea With the shepherd of His flock? Where is He who put His Holy Spirit within them,

Luk 1:41 And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.

Luk 1:67 Now his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Spirit, and prophesied, saying:

.

keras · May 24, 2020

sovereigngrace said:
Jeremiah 18:4: “the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.” God takes what is flawed and makes a new creation out of it. In salvation, it is God that calls the shots. He does the molding and making. The New Testament passage of Romans 9:21 support the new birth analogy: “Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?”

This passage in Jeremiah refers to the 10 tribes of Israel in exile. We Christians are those people today, remade into vessels that God can use.
Judah is the vessel that God will smash beyond repair. Jeremiah 19:10-11
Those who respond to the Gospel, are the true Israelites:

The people who hear the voice of Jesus and do what Jesus says: are my people of Israel, My Overcomers, the Victorious ones, literally the Israelites of God. Revelation 3:20-21 Not ethnic Jewish Israel, but the genuine Christian Israel of God. Galatians 6:14-16

Jesus sent His Disciples-Apostles to the Gentiles; non-Jews, where the House of Israel was; scattered around the world. Not to Judah, as He preached to Judah and was rejected. Their mission was amazingly successful, resulting in the millions of Christians worldwide.

They didn’t disobey Jesus’ Command, by going to who the Jews referred to as Gentiles, because the people who heard the Gospel and who accepted it, plainly were Israelites, the ‘dispersion’, as John 7:35 informs us.

The prophecy of Caiaphas, John 11:50-52, was that; Jesus would die for the nation, in order to gather together the scattered children of God.

Jesus calls us His sheep, because we hear Him. John 10:16 Just as Noah heard God, and just as Abraham heard God. God says that no other people have heard Him but those with the faith of Abraham. He tells us that these are the people He chose... because they heard Him. Deuteronomy 7:6-10

Ephesians 1:4-5 Before the foundation of the world, He chose those who would accept Christ to be His people, to be without blemish in His sight and full of love of Him and their fellow men. It was His good will and pleasure that we Christians are predestined to be adopted as God’s children through Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior.

What else can it mean, but that every person who has understanding and who accepts the Gospel of Jesus, belongs to the true Israel? Grafted into the one Seed, Jesus; but an originally chosen, natural born Christian Israelite. John 15:16, 1 Peter 2:9-10

Since every nation in the world has been completely genetically mixed, the sheep who hear Jesus' voice are from all the tribes, races, nations and languages. Revelation 7:9
It IS the way to know that we ARE the true Israel, because we DO hear Jesus and as faithful Christians, worship and obey Him.

John 10:1-18 tells us in very specific terms, the nature of the sheep and the shepherd. If we truly match that definition, mind and soul, we have the faith of Abraham in our being.

Isaiah 51:1-2 Listen to Me, all you who follow after righteousness, all who seek the Lord. Consider the Rock from which you are descended. Consider Abraham, your father and Sarah, your mother, when I called him, he was but one; I Blessed him and he is now many.

This is a direct reference to Christians, the true Israelite sons of God. Romans 9:24-26

The other aspect to this doctrine; is how some people are made for different purposes. Call it predestination, or God the Potter making some ‘vessels’ to be kept and some to be discarded:

Romans 9:21-22 Surely the Potter can do what He likes with the clay? Is He not free to make two vessels out of the same lump, one to be treasured and one for common use?
But if it is indeed God’s purpose to display His retribution and to make His power known, it is that with great patience, He has tolerated vessels that are made for destruction?

These are Bible truths, therefore it is beholden for us, who have had heard the ‘call of the Lord’ in our hearts, to be very sure to stand strong in our faith at all times and look forward to the great Day when Jesus comes, bringing our rewards with Him. Matthew 16:27

sovereigngrace · May 24, 2020

BABerean2 said:
The verse below from the Old Testament, and the parents of John the Baptist provide evidence of this fact. It was something Nicodemus should have known, based on Isaiah 63:11.

Isa 63:11 Then he remembered the days of old, Moses and his people, saying: "Where is He who brought them up out of the sea With the shepherd of His flock? Where is He who put His Holy Spirit within them,

Luk 1:41 And it happened, when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, that the babe leaped in her womb; and Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit.

Luk 1:67 Now his father Zacharias was filled with the Holy Spirit, and prophesied, saying:

.

Yes! There is plenty of OT proof. Dispensationalists argue that the old covenant saints could only experience the Spirit of God “upon” them, not “in” them. But Scripture repeatedly contradicts this contention. In the book of Genesis, we see Pharaoh recognize the Spirit of God residing within Joseph. He acknowledged in Genesis 41:37: “Can we find such a one as this is, a man in whom the Spirit of God is?”

Isaiah 63:11 speaks of Moses, “Where is he [God] that put his Holy Spirit within him [Moses]?” In Exodus 28:3, we see God instructing Moses: “thou shalt speak unto all that are wise hearted, whom I have filled with the spirit of wisdom.” The saints are here described as those who possess the Spirit of God. In Exodus 31:3, the LORD informs Moses regarding Bezaleel, “I have filled him with the spirit of God.” This is repeated in Exodus 31:31. In Exodus 35:21, a company of the children of Israel are set apart for service “every one whose heart stirred him up, and every one whom his spirit made willing.” Here the internal function of the Holy Spirit is seen to be actively at work.

These are explicit statements that challenge the Dispensationalist position. These texts do not merely describe a proximate work of the Holy Spirit but an active internal presence of the Spirit within God’s servants.

Of all that complained in the wilderness, only 2 Israelis over the age of 20 made it into the Promised Land – Joshua and Caleb. Numbers 27:18 tells us, “And the LORD said unto Moses, Take thee Joshua the son of Nun, a man in whom is the spirit, and lay thine hand upon him.” Deuteronomy 34:9 correlates, “Joshua the son of Nun was full of the spirit of wisdom.” Numbers 14:24 records: “my servant Caleb … had another spirit with him.”

It was the inward dwelling presence of the Spirit of God under the old covenant that set godly men apart from the religious professors around them. It was the Spirit who enlightened men and it was He who enabled men. Without Him, man was ignorant of God, His truth and His will. Without Him, man was unable to accomplish the purpose of God.

In Job 32:8 we see the reason why the Old Testament saints needed the Holy Spirit. It is the exact same reason why the New Testament saint need Him: “there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.” Job 33:4 adds: “The spirit of God has made me; the breath of the Almighty gives me life.” We need to see that it the Spirit of God that gives life – both natural and spiritual. Without Him we are deceived, lost and forsaken. It was the Spirit of God that allowed the Old Testament saints to understand and undertake the high and holy things of God.

The Old Testament emphasizes the need of the Spirit of God, just as the New Testament. The reason being: man’s hopeless predicament outside of the Spirit was as pitiful in that era as ours. Did the angel of the Lord not pronounce those famous words in Zechariah 4:6: “Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts”? Pleasing God in any way under the old covenant did not come through ethnic heritage, natural ability, or human striving. It totally came through the enabling power of the Spirit. The Holy Ghost was the necessary help that all men needed to make him alive unto God and pleasing unto Him. That is why Psalm 104:30 tells us: “When you send your Spirit, they are created, and you renew the face of the earth.”

David cried unto God in Psalm 51:10-12, “Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me. Cast me not away from thy presence; and take not thy holy spirit from me. Restore unto me the joy of thy salvation; and uphold me with thy free spirit.” David, like us, was dependent upon the Spirit to strengthen and help in in godly matters.

Psalm 143:10 asks God: “Teach me to do your will, for you are my God; may your good Spirit lead me on level ground.”

2 Corinthians 4:13 records: “We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak.” This is a direct quote from David in Psalm 116:102. 2 Corinthians 4:13 suggests that the very same “spirit of faith” that operated in David in the Old Testament functions in us now. This is further compelling evidence that the Old Testament were as dependent upon the internal workings of the Spirit as we are.

Ezekiel 2:2 personally testified, “the spirit entered into me.” See also Ezekiel 3:24. Micah 3:8 testified, “I am full of power by the spirit of the LORD, and of judgment, and of might, to declare unto Jacob his transgression, and to Israel his sin.” The Spirit of God gave the prophet of God the necessary strength in order to operate as a believer and a seer. Daniel 6:3 says of God’s Old Testament servant Daniel, “this Daniel was preferred above the presidents and princes, because an excellent spirit was in him” (see also 4:8, 9,18, 5:11, 14).

Nehemiah testified of God’s help for Israel in bygone days in Nehemiah 9:20: “You gave your good Spirit to instruct them. You did not withhold your manna from their mouths, and you gave them water for their thirst.” Nehemiah 9:30 also talks about, “thy spirit in thy prophets.” 1 Peter 1:7-12 repeats this great truth, speaking about the common salvation shared by the New and Old Testament saints: “Of which salvation the prophets have inquired and searched diligently, who prophesied of the grace that should come unto you: Searching what, or what manner of time the spirit of Christ which was in [Gr. en] them did signify, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow.”

The Greek word en here is overwhelmingly interpreted “in” throughout the New Testament. In fact, there are 1,902 instances of such. The Old Testament saints plainly possessed the same Spirit of Christ as the New Testament believers, although, they obviously looked forward, by faith to the promised Redeemer, whereas the New Testament Church now looks back. The Old and New Testament saints, Jew and Gentile alike, have now been graciously merged together into the one harmonious spiritual Israel of God – the Church. This body recognizes no dispensational or ethnic separation at all.

Jesus uses the same Greek word that Peter does to describe the Spirit within believers in the New Testament era. John 14:17 is an example of that. Jesus said: “the Spirit of truth … dwelleth with you, and shall be in [Gr. en] you.” Another similar passage is be found in Romans 8:9: “ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in [Gr. en] you.” The same Spirit that dwelt “in” (en) the Old Testament saints dwells in us today.

God’s elect that existed within Israel when Jesus came were few. But Scripture shows that they indwelt by the Spirit. An angel prophesied unto Zacharias in Luke 1:13-17 that his son-to-be John “shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.” Luke 1:41 records of John’s mother, “Elisabeth was filled with the Holy Ghost.” Luke 1:67 records of John’s father, “Zacharias was filled with the Holy Ghost.” This was all within the old covenant. This was before the cross. This preceded Pentecost.

One cannot avoid the conclusion presented by Paul that there is a solid unitary connection between God’s people in both testaments. The Bible is manifestly one single combined book telling one consistent story to one interconnected people about one central character: Jesus Christ, who came to save one collective elect people. The Old Testament prepared the way for Christ and pointed the ancient believers in the direction of His impending ministry. The New Testament on the other hand shows the arrival, realization and revelation of the Messiah. Both were unified with the quickening power of the Spirit of God.

Hebrews 11:23-26 tells us, “By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter; Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season; esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.”

Moses refused to run with the crowd. He renounced earthly treasures and worldly privilege of eternal riches and heavenly privilege. He refused to take the easy road. He is shown to be identified with Christ, even back deep in the old covenant period. His salvation came alone through the finished work of Christ on the cross. He simply saw it afar off, but believed by faith.

Old Testament believers are depicted as having faith in the coming Messiah. By faith they are shown to have experienced Christ. It was only in Him that they could have experienced eternal life. There was no other Savior and no other salvation. The Bible is one single book telling one single story about one central character: Jesus Christ. The Old Testament prepares the way for Christ and points the ancient believers in the direction of Christ. The New Testament on the other hand is the realization, arrival and revelation of the Messiah.

The Old Testament saints were saved in the exact same way as we were – by grace, through faith. The Old Testament saints looked forward to the cross by faith; we New Testament saints look back by faith. Sam A. Smith succinctly says, “There is only one means of eternal salvation in history: salvation by grace, through faith in Christ” (Regeneration and Indwelling in the Old Testament).

Romans 4:3 tells us: “For what saith the scripture? Abraham believed God, and it was counted unto him for righteousness.” Galatians 3:6 reiterates: “Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” James 2:23 agrees, saying, “Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.”

The same Holy Spirit that enlightens sinner today and brings them into a saving knowledge of truth, did the same in the Old Testament epoch. Without God’s supernatural intervention upon a stubborn sinful heart, man had no way of moving from death unto life. After all, by regeneration the soul is quickened from death into life (Ephesians 2:1-4). Men’s response to God’s voice and men’s response to the quickening power of Spirit determined whether their ears and eyes would be opened. Those who rejected the illuminating and regenerating work of the Spirit were lost.

Stephen made a very telling comment to the Jews after Pentecost supporting this standpoint, in Acts 7:51-52: “Ye stiffnecked and uncircumcised in heart and ears, ye do always resist the Holy Ghost: as your fathers did, so do ye. Which of the prophets have not your fathers persecuted? and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers.”

Stephen likens the resistance he saw in his day to the quickening power of the Spirit to that of unbelieving Israel back in Old Testament times. When the disciples spoke of “the fathers” they were referring to their Old Testament forefathers. When they spoke of “the prophets” they were talking about the Old Testament men of God that spoke the truth of God. This tells us that the same Spirit operating in the same way was never appreciated by hardened religious Israelis, irrespective of whether it was before or after the cross.

Marilyn C · May 24, 2020

jgr said:
Hi Marilyn,

True.

Romans 11:2
God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew.

That is a reference to the remnant of elect faithful obedient believing OT saints (Romans 11:5). They were his foreknown people.

And as you've cited:

Romans 8:29
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Thus, the OT saints are also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son.

Interesting post there bro. Yes I do believe that the OT saints will be like the Lord in some degree. Yet there are differences between them and the Body of Christ though.

The Body of Christ has a `greater dominion` inheritance, (third heaven) and also will be functioning as KingPriests, whereas the OT saints will be servants reigning under the authority of the Lord in the city. (Rev. 22: 3 - 5)

Marilyn C · May 24, 2020

BABerean2 said:
Based on Galatians 3:16-29, Christ is the one seed which fulfills the promise made to Abraham, and I am Abraham's seed and inheritor of the promise, through faith in Christ.

This passage must be ignored by those promoting more than one people of God.

All forms of Dual Covenant Theology based on race, are a corruption of scripture.

See what Matthew said about genealogy in Matthew 1:1, and what Paul said about genealogies in Titus 3:9.

.

Nothing to do with `race,` and all to do with God`s purposes through Christ. God the Father desires that all come under Christ`s rule in every realm. God made each realm in His great kingdom and He has people`s that will rule with Him in each of those realms.

So who are those -

1. Who will rule with Christ on His own throne. (Rev. 3: 21)
2. Who are those that rule in the city which comes down from that realm? (Rev. 22: 5)
3. Who are the nations of the saved on the New earth? (Rev. 21: 24)

sovereigngrace · May 24, 2020

Marilyn C said:
Nothing to do with `race,` and all to do with God`s purposes through Christ. God the Father desires that all come under Christ`s rule in every realm. God made each realm in His great kingdom and He has people`s that will rule with Him in each of those realms.

So who are those -

1. Who will rule with Christ on His own throne. (Rev. 3: 21)
2. Who are those that rule in the city which comes down from that realm? (Rev. 22: 5)
3. Who are the nations of the saved on the New earth? (Rev. 21: 24)

God's elect.
God's elect.
God's elect.

Marilyn C · May 24, 2020

sovereigngrace said:
A spiritual new birth is taught throughout Holy Writ. Even though the phrases “new birth,” “born again” or “born of God” are not found in the Old Testament pages, the whole concept and reality are. We see many truths and doctrines present in the Old Testament, albeit in an embryo and undeveloped form. The more the inspired revelation progresses the greater clarity that is brought to all divine truth. This disclosure sees its apex in the New Testament pages in the teaching of Christ, and the God breathed illumination of the New Testament writers. Any vagueness that is found in the Old Testament revelation is dispelled by the New Testament light.

One of the most powerful biblical analogies of the miracle and nature of the new birth is that of the potter and the clay. We find it in both the Old Testament and the New Testament. The Bible depicts God as the potter and us as the clay. Isaiah 64:8 declares: “O LORD, thou art our father; we are the clay, and thou our potter; and we all are the work of thy hand.” God uses the analogy of the potter and the clay to show us that He determines who and what we are. This reveals the sovereignty of God in salvation. God, being God, has the right and power to mold us as the potter does the clay. What is produced is indeed the work of His hand.

The whole symbolism surrounds the transformation of the clay from something which is unacceptable to the potter to something that is pleasing unto Him. This is a powerful picture of the regenerating power of God.

Jeremiah 18:4: “the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it.” God takes what is flawed and makes a new creation out of it. In salvation, it is God that calls the shots. He does the molding and making. The New Testament passage of Romans 9:21 support the new birth analogy: “Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour?”

What comes forth is a spiritual vessel that is fit for the Master’s use. The vessel of honor is set apart for a holy purpose. That can only come about by the quickening power of the Spirit. William D. Barrick asserts: “To speak of doctrine in the OT as though it must be taught in forms similar to those in the NT is misleading. Yet it could be that the doctrinal teachings of the OT are couched in the terms of history and parable—more like the teachings of Jesus Himself” (Living a New Life: Old Testament Teaching About Conversion).

The whole idea of the new birth and regeneration in the Old Testament is supported by Galatians 4:22-31. Looking back to the book of Genesis, and particularly the physical offspring of Abraham, Ishmael is presented as an example of a natural man – one who is “born after the flesh.” Isaac on the other hand is presented as a spiritual man – one who is “born after the Spirit.” He is identified as being of “the children of promise.” Whatever angle you look at it, whichever testament you analyze, God splits men into two camps: those who are lost and those who are saved, those who are after the flesh and those who are after the Spirit.

The whole thrust of the teaching is distinguishing between two types of human being. How each respond to the workings of the Spirit defines who they are and where they end up. The lost have one birth, rebel against the promptings of the Spirit, and go to hell. The redeemed have two births, they have yielded to the work of the Spirit in salvation, and go to heaven. As Lewis Sperry Chafer wrote in his Systematic Theology, “Whatever salvation was wrought in Old Testament times was wrought by the Holy Spirit.”

The Holy Spirit was very active in bringing men to salvation throughout the duration of the Old Testament. The Westminster Confession Chapter 7.5 makes clear: “under the law it [God’s covenant of grace with mankind] was administered by promises, prophecies, sacrifices, circumcision, the paschal lamb, and other types and ordinances delivered to the people of the Jews, all foresignifying Christ to come; which were, for that time, sufficient and efficacious, through the operation of the Spirit, to instruct and build up the elect in faith in the promised Messiah, by whom they had full remission of sins, and eternal salvation; and is called the Old Testament.”

The relevance and contrast between the natural man and the spiritual man in both testaments is seen in the words of Galatians 4:29: “as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.” Basically, the same rule applies in both economies! The same two diverse companies exist!

For those who would want to play theological word games with the phrases “after the Spirit” and “born of the Spirit.” The New Testament Scriptures demonstrate them to be equivalent. The term “after the Spirit” describes the born again believer in Romans 8:1. It declares: “There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” Those “in Christ” that live “after the Spirit” are all those who have been born anew of the Spirit of God. Romans 8:4 describes the redeemed as “us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” The objective Bible student will quickly see that those who are born “after the flesh” refer to the unsaved, whereas, those who are born “after the Spirit” are those who are born of God. Paul concludes: “For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit” (Romans 8:5).

Right back in the book of Genesis we see a division outlined that still exists today. You have sinners that have been wonderfully transformed by the renewing power of the Spirit and experience a spiritual new birth. You have sinners that are untouched by the workings of the Spirit and remain dead in their sin. It is very clear that these unique phrases simply distinguish between God’s true spiritual people and the lost. They divide between the unregenerate man and the regenerate man.

Having said all this, no one could surely deny, there was a seismic change that came with the new covenant. First, God’s long-awaited Messiah (or anointed One) had finally arrived. Second, the whole focus went from the national, physical, earthly and provisional, to the international, spiritual, heavenly and eternal. Thirdly, every enemy of man and impediment to His eternal liberation has been robustly overcome. Fourthly, the veil that curtailed the Old Testament saints from seeing clear was removed through the anointed ministry of the Messiah. Fifthly, the Spirit has been poured out on an unprecedented scale at Pentecost to empower the people of God to fulfil the great commission (Matthew 3:11 Luke 24:49, Acts 1:4-5, 1:8, 2:38-39). Sixthly, the scope of the work of the Spirit has broadened out to embrace the darkened heathen nations today (Joel 2:28 & Acts 2:17).

Whilst there is much that is unique about the Church after Pentecost, there is also an unquestionable continuity and progressiveness in the workings of God. There is also a fulfilment of faithful Israel’s assigning to reach the nations with the truth.

We must acknowledge, the baptism of the Holy Spirit did not occur until Pentecost (Acts 2:1-13). This experience was previously unknown to God’s elect. This reality followed salvation. After all, the disciples were fully saved before Pentecost. This new experience not only empowered believers to operate in supernatural strength, but it also increased their revelation of Christ and His truth. God’s provision and program for redemption was fully understood. Their knowledge of Christ was no longer veiled in mystery. Ra McLaughlin writes in a short article Old Testament Holy Spirit: “What was different was not the way in which the Holy Spirit was manifested, but the power and scope of the manifestation.”

Prior to Pentecost, believers were regenerated by the Spirit of God but were not baptized in the Spirit. After Pentecost, believers experienced both. When the Holy Spirit was poured out at Pentecost, he was poured out on believers that were already indwelt by the Spirit.

There is not a more familiar passage in the New Testament for evangelicals than John chapter 3. In it, “a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews” came searching for spiritual guidance to Jesus. Now, we should note, this man couldn’t have had better natural or religious credentials in the light of the Dispensationalist position. Not only was he of Israeli stock, but he also was a leader of the Pharisees. Jesus told him in John 3:5-11, “Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. Nicodemus answered and said unto him, How can these things be? Jesus answered and said unto him, Art thou a master of Israel, and knowest not these things? Verily, verily, I say unto thee, We speak that we do know, and testify that we have seen; and ye receive not our witness.”

Why did Nicodemus need to be born again, if, according to Dispensationalist writers, he was automatically a chosen child of God through natural birth? The Lord was showing Nicodemus (and us) that favor with God did not (or does not) come through one’s religious standing, an accident of birth or through fulfilling a religious A-Z but rather through a spiritual birth. It involves a spiritual encounter with Christ! Racial status or biological pedigree means nothing with God today.

Whilst Nicodemus had all the natural and religious qualifications a man could ever want, Jesus showed him that that was not enough. The Lord showed him that he needed a spiritual conversion in order to make it to heaven. He showed Nicodemus that his first birth – his natural birth (that of water), was insufficient to inherit the kingdom of God. His physical birth, like the rest of fallen man, was contaminated by the awful blight of sin. John Piper contends: “We believe that the new birth is a miraculous creation of God that enables a formerly dead person to receive Christ and so to be saved” (What We Believe About the Five Points of Calvinism).

Please note: Nicodemus (an old covenant saint) was rebuked by Christ for not knowing this truth about the new birth. In fact, his religious position (being a learned man of the Law), is presented as a reason why he should have been fully acquainted with it. Basically, He was saying: ‘you being a leader in Israel, should know exactly what I am talking about’. This proves that the new birth was not a New Testament innovation; it has rather been around on earth since the beginning. The whole concept of regeneration (or spiritual birth) therefore occurred before the cross.

Although rather long, I did appreciate your comments. Yes, I agree that it is by the Holy Spirit that anyone can be `born again.`

However you have not addressed the difference I noted in my response as to the OT saints who worked righteousness, (Heb. 11:33) against nations, whereas the Body of Christ`s warfare is spiritual. (2 Cor. 10: 3 -6)

Care to comment on that point?

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